Canadians: Stupid American wants Syncro very badly

[DHill]

Greetings, northern neighbors...

Over here in the states, I'm sure you know that they didn't put AWD on our VW's until 4Motion, for some silly reason. But I want Syncro. Really bad.

I have a mk3 VR6 so the mk3/a3 Syncro is obviously preferable, but it seems so rare that possibly a Passat Syncro will have to do and then modifications come next.

Since you guys had some Syncro vehicles up there, who wants to go fish a drivetrain out of a junkyard for me, or tell me where I can go to find it? I'm in Ohio, and I wouldn't mind driving for a day or two to grab some AWD for myself.

If any of you would be kind enough to help, I would appreciate it.

Thanks for your time, and thanks for putting up with us when we elect stupid men for the presidency.

pic for views:



Modified by DHill at 1:50 AM 5-30-2004

[Northren vr6]

Far as i know all i ever seen from the B3/A3 vintage is passats n vanagons in the synchro . . rare as hell too . . .read a mag article bout rpi or some company that made a synchro a3 golf, cost a mint to do

[Strupo]

do you have any idea how hard it'll be to find a working junk syncro??????

[jay_vw]

There was one for sale in the Canadian Classified section about a week ago.....

[Lexi]

1992 Passat Syncro Wagon
All Wheel Drive
Charger non-functional
288 000km
Blue/Rust on grey leather.
Fresh VW floormats
New headlights
Windshield approx 1 yr old (excellent shape)
B3 Passat cup holder (bling bling!)
Steel wheels and 205/50/15 Michelin Artic Alpins
Kenwood CD Player

$2500 OBO

http://www.mco.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2874

DHill - I've met this seller before, he's a good guy. Located here in Ottawa which is about 8 hours from Detroit.

[kreuzer]

Quote, originally posted by DHill »

pic for views:

LOL a mk4 rear beam no less.....

bump for you. the shop that did that cadillac northstart V8 swap also has a full syncro system for sale...

http://www.cwstuning.com/CWSused.htmlv top of page. only 120K kms, which is around 75K miles, $3000 CDN funds.

Modified by kreuzer at 9:52 AM 5-30-2004

[DHill]

Thank you for all of the tips so far. Any more info to help me in my search? I found a Syncro VR6 tranny on Ebay.ca (I think) but it's all in German. http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAP...&rd=1

[alo 16v]

i got one want it? i will let it go cheep get bring some rims

[DHill]

Bump for this....

Here is what I've gathered so far

1) G60 and VR6 engines both use the manual 02A, though the gearing may be different.
2) Floor pan and gas tank must be swapped/modified
3) One needs to split the exhaust around the center shaft

New questions:
I take it mk3 rear suspension components aren't compatible with the new setup. What suspension works? Did the true mk3 VR6 Syncro ever come to Canada, or is that a Europe only thing? I keep finding Passats, but it would make it a lot easier if I had a VR6 mk3 driveline to work with.

Thanks for your help so far guys. Many of you have IM'd with helpful hints and sellers; a distinctly different trend than my American brethern.

[lowblackdub]

IM roccocase, he's parting a Passat Syncro as we speak.

[PrupleGTI]

Contact HPA Motorsports they are syncro Guru's they can supply you with all the parts you need like a Syncro Floorpan and Gas tank

[kreuzer]

Quote, originally posted by DHill »

Bump for this.... Here is what I've gathered so far 1) G60 and VR6 engines both use the manual 02A, though the gearing may be different. 2) Floor pan and gas tank must be swapped/modified 3) One needs to split the exhaust around the center shaft New questions: I take it mk3 rear suspension components aren't compatible with the new setup. What suspension works? Did the true mk3 VR6 Syncro ever come to Canada, or is that a Europe only thing? I keep finding Passats, but it would make it a lot easier if I had a VR6 mk3 driveline to work with. Thanks for your help so far guys. Many of you have IM'd with helpful hints and sellers; a distinctly different trend than my American brethern.

the bellhousings on the VR6 and G60 transmissions are different, although the gear casings are the same. The syncro transmission is based on an 02A, but is designated as 02C. No mk3 VR6 syncro cars every came to canada,unless someone imported it. Passats is all you will find. From what I understand, the rear diff on the mk3 VR6's can take more power than the B3 Passat ones.

[Big Dac With Fries]

Quote, originally posted by lowblackdub »

IM roccocase, he's parting a Passat Syncro as we speak.

Are you sure? I spoke to him on Thursday and the Black Syncro is long gone. He does however still have the Red Syncro that's still for sale.

- dac

[MEIN_VW]

I think I am the only Vortex member who was an original owner of Passat G60 syncro. The car above is a 1992 model that I bought in late August of 1991 (I sold it in 1994). Great car, great and simple AWD system. This car handled far better in snow than my mom's 1993 Audi 100CS quattro. It was like a little tank in the snow (and I lived in Ottawa when I had this car so it saw A LOT of snow!)

DHill: In the 1980's, you Americans got the Quantum (B2 Passat) which was never sold in Canada. There was an AWD Quantum syncro sold in the US in sedan and wagon. That car was basically a re-badged Audi 4000.



Modified by MEIN_VW at 8:52 PM 6-1-2004

[DHill]

The more I research this I'm finding out that I need to stick with VR6 parts. Apparently RPI and some places can get things for customers, but I would like to avoid paying their overhead if at all possible.

Keep the info coming, guys. This thread can be helpful for others as well.

[DHill]

Bumptastic.

Important question: I need to know the exact differences between the G60 Syncro drivetrain and the VR6 Syncro drivetrain. (??)

True or False: The viscous coupler in the G60 is identical to the one in the VR6, i.e., they used the same assembly for all Syncros.

True or False: The only difference between the G60 and VR6 Syncro drivetrain is the transmission (besides a possible length difference in driveshaft between b3 and mk3).

True or False: The independent rear suspension on the b3 is identical to the independent rear suspension on the mk3, i.e., I can bolt it directly to my mk3 and drive away happy.

Answers/guesses?

[JustMike]

true/false same viscous coupler for g60 and vr6 = false (according to Etka there are three different parts, each for a more powerful engine, but g60 & vr6 are only 15hp apart)

true/false transmission,= true & false, the bell housing is different, the rest of the tranny's the same

true/false rear suspension =true they are the same, BUT "It will not bolt up, and then you drive away" you must get the syncro floor pan and weld it into your MK3

[SyncroSplitz]

what about the tunnel, i think you have to change it. I know if your doing the conversion into a mk2 its to small, i'm not sure about the mk3. From what i remember they use the tunnel from a corrado.

[David@KK]

I have a syncro sedan you can have.
no engine or charger.
it's basically a shell with tranny and complete driveline.
all this for the low low price of $1200 Cdn.
yep, that's like $70 US.
call me for details.

[MEIN_VW]

Quote, originally posted by DHill »

True or False: The independent rear suspension on the b3 is identical to the independent rear suspension on the mk3, i.e., I can bolt it directly to my mk3 and drive away happy.

What Mk3 models had independent rear suspension? IIRC all North American Mk3 models have torsion beam rear suspension.

The Passat syncro rear suspension is totally different from the FWD B3 Passat. The Passat syncro rear suspension is almost identical to that of the Mk2 Golf Rallye.

I have diagrams of the Passat FWD and syncro rear suspensions that I'll post for you later. The syncro has a totally different rear floor that results in the trunk being about 4 inches shallower than the FWD Passat. Also, size, shape and placement of the fuel tank and the exhaust system on the syncro are totally different from the FWD models.

[MEIN_VW]

As promised, here's a great cutaway of the B3 Passat syncro rear suspension:

Here's the FWD B3 Passat rear suspension:

The close-up is showing the link that gives the twist beam passive rear-wheel-steering.

Here are the specs for the syncro:

Modified by MEIN_VW at 9:41 PM 6-10-2004

[vw_2002_vw@KK]

IM.

[DHill]

Quote, originally posted by MEIN_VW »

As promised, here's a great cutaway of the B3 Passat syncro rear suspension:

Thanks for the awesome pics. My question about the difference between iRS in the b3 and mk3 is regarding the SYNCRO models. The mk3 Syncro in Europe also had "IRS" to accomodate the rear drive components, as you probably know. Thanks again for the pics.