lets get a ABA 16v Parts List/FAQ Thread going

[LouderLowerFaster]

Quote, originally posted by A3dOUde »

if you wanna keep your mk3 accessories, you'll need a modified crank pulley since the t-belt is larger than 8v, the 8v pulley won't fit anymore...

and if i get that i wont need anything else off that list? (besides head and mani) that sounds too easy


Modified by LouderLowerFaster at 11:28 AM 9-28-2004

[ROBHARMER]

Youll still need most of the list but if you want to run your mk3 ac alternator water pump and ps pump youll need that pulley.

[mwebb95jetta]

Who makes one?

[punkindrublic843]

ok im thinking bout buying a complete aba engine, put it into my mk2, run that around till i can get al the 16v parts i need, then start to peice it together. a main concern is the wiring. would i use the obd1 wiring? since im buying a complete aba i woudl liek to use as much of the mk3 accessories as i can. o i would need that special pulley and then what 16v parts?

[all-starr-me]

Are you going turbo or N/A? The 9A pistons will give you an 8.5-9:1 compression ratio, great for turbo, but you still won't gain much from keeping it N/A. If you aren't going for a charger then factor in some good cams, or at the very least a euro intake cam.

If you are OBD 1 you should be able to use the g-60 or auto 16v throttle body, otherwise you will need an adapter plate to fit your aba throttle to the manifold.

You left out a 16v fuel rail, bbm or ross machine racing have them. you will need digi injector cups to make your injectors fit.

If you are staying N/A then get the ABF pistons that I posted on the previous page. The distributor block off plate comes from a 16v engine, the one TT sells is to block off your breather, not your distributor.

Use you A3 accesories, but you will need 6mm shaved from the serpentine pulley. I have seen some people weld or machine the 16v intermediate timing gear to fit on the 8v intermediate shaft, saves having to change the oil pump and intermedait shaft, but leaves you with an extra distributor.

For N/A gains try and get a 50mm euro manifold or an ABF with fuel rail and throttle body. for turbo a short funner will be better.

You could do this swap with 400, but it wouldn't either A.) be turbo and B.) gain you very much if any real power.

[LouderLowerFaster]

Quote, originally posted by all-starr-me »

Are you going turbo or N/A? The 9A pistons will give you an 8.5-9:1 compression ratio, great for turbo, but you still won't gain much from keeping it N/A. If you aren't going for a charger then factor in some good cams, or at the very least a euro intake cam. If you are OBD 1 you should be able to use the g-60 or auto 16v throttle body, otherwise you will need an adapter plate to fit your aba throttle to the manifold. You left out a 16v fuel rail, bbm or ross machine racing have them. you will need digi injector cups to make your injectors fit. If you are staying N/A then get the ABF pistons that I posted on the previous page. The distributor block off plate comes from a 16v engine, the one TT sells is to block off your breather, not your distributor. Use you A3 accesories, but you will need 6mm shaved from the serpentine pulley. I have seen some people weld or machine the 16v intermediate timing gear to fit on the 8v intermediate shaft, saves having to change the oil pump and intermedait shaft, but leaves you with an extra distributor. For N/A gains try and get a 50mm euro manifold or an ABF with fuel rail and throttle body. for turbo a short funner will be better. You could do this swap with 400, but it wouldn't either A.) be turbo and B.) gain you very much if any real power.

aaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh F*ck it. I just bought the TT kit - adj cam, camshaft, valve springs, arp studs, giac 268 chip, and gasket set all for $225 so that will keep me happy until i sell the golf and buy a S13 240sx and turbo it for 240+hp



Modified by LouderLowerFaster at 10:20 PM 9-28-2004

[Chris164935]

Quote, originally posted by Chris164935 »

Also, does anyone make adapters to use the ABA throttle body with the 9A intake manifold? And will the ABA fuel injectors fit in 9A manifold as well?

...?

[all-starr-me]

yes, any machine shop should be able to make an adapter to fit the ABA throttle body on the 16v manifold, Get some gaskets from both to use as templates. The injectors will fit if you put digi injector cups in the manifold.

[A3dOUde]

I know Trac Racing sells a pulley for 1.8T in mk3 conversion pulley that will fit our need

[need_a_VR6]

Guys, I have a full ABA/16v setup ready to be put together:

HERE

Just in case anyone wants the easy way out.

[A3dOUde]

for a bolt on turbo setup... there will still be some missing parts... so imagine in a n/a setup...

but officially, it's a good start at a fair price

[need_a_VR6]

Quote, originally posted by A3dOUde »

for a bolt on turbo setup... there will still be some missing parts... so imagine in a n/a setup... but officially, it's a good start at a fair price

Thanks.

[urspeedracer]

has anyone tried this 16v conversion on a 2002 avh 2.0 engine? can it be done?

[Chris164935]

I was looking into doing that. I used to have a 2003 AVH motor. The thing is that that motor uses coil packs. Not sure if you can go from coil packs to distributor, or vice versa. If you can, I'm pretty sure it won't be cheap.

[all-starr-me]

With the later 2.0 from 99 on (engine code AEG, AVH, etc.) you are better off going with a 20v head as it will need much less work, all the oil passages line up perfect. That will be a whole new beast altogether and I haven't taken an AEG block apart yet so I'm not sure what it needs, besides a 20v head and timing gears. Using an AEB 20v head you can use the internals over from a 16v block, but some later 20v's have a different size timing gear and I'm not sure how they would work. Also that is going to be much costlier to do as the 20v heads are 500+ where i can get a 16v head for 50, have it rebuilt and ported for less than a stock 20v. Personally I like the ABA blocks because of the rod/stroke ratio is so good. the AEG/AVH 2.0's have went back to the shorter 144mm rods like a 9A or 3A block. If you were going to do it cheap I would get an ABA block as they are cheap and build it up to swap in. otherwise start your own thread on how to build a 20/20 and ask lots of people or experiment on your own to find what works.

[German_Muscle]

this may help out with the 20v swap
http://www.race101.com/project_2020.html

[all-starr-me]

up

[LouderLowerFaster]

Ok I need some help guys. I should be coming across around $800, and I want to do a 16v swap. However, Im going to be running it NA. Ive read this thread but its confusing because I never know if people are talking about parts for a FI setup or NA, so could somone give me a complete list of parts within an $800 range that would give me worthy gains while staying naturally aspirated. I offered Paul ("i need a vr6") the $400 for his kit. So with the additional $400, what should I buy, besides the needed belts and gaskets, that would give me better gains? Also, how difficult is it to do this swap? The extent of my vw experience only goes as far as installing my own shocks/struts, replacing my starter and alternator, etc. I also reasembled a smashed 240sx front end.

[Chris164935]

Hmm...Not sure if you'd be able to do it with $400. After getting the head, you'll probably (well, you should, anyway) have to get the head cleaned up, decked, and the valves reseated. That ran me about $300 for parts and labor to do my head (they also installed a cam). And, because the chamber volume on the 16v head is bigger, you'll have a lower compression. So, to do NA, you'll need new high compression pistons (or, if you want, you could use like-new 9a pistons. Without the higher compression pistons, the gains won't be very high (unless you turbo).

Okay, my turn to ask a question: Will a different ECU be needed for this swap or will the stock ECU for ABA motors be okay? Or rather, what would be the best choice (price and performance-wise) without going stand-alone?

[LouderLowerFaster]

[QUOTE=Chris164935]Hmm...Not sure if you'd be able to do it with $400. After getting the head, you'll probably (well, you should, anyway) have to get the head cleaned up, decked, and the valves reseated. That ran me about $300 for parts and labor to do my head (they also installed a cam). And, because the chamber volume on the 16v head is bigger, you'll have a lower compression. So, to do NA, you'll need new high compression pistons (or, if you want, you could use like-new 9a pistons. Without the higher compression pistons, the gains won't be very high (unless you turbo).

[QUOTE]

Yea Im getting 9A pistons included in the $400 kit, and the head is said to be "clean" as it is already. So again I ask, what are some extra parts that would be ideal to get with a $400 budget?

[German_Muscle]

here is the changes you need to make for the following
1) High Boost Forced Induction-----------ABA pistons/ABA Rods
2) Mild Boost Forced Induction-----------9A pistons/ABA Rods
3) NA + Extreme Nitrous------------------See # 1
4) NA + Mild Nitrous-----------------------See # 2
5) High Compression---------------------ABF Pistons/ABA Rods
6) Stroker----------------------------------9A Pistons/TDI Crank
If anyone has a diff setup they had in mind post up and ill tell you what piston/rod combo you need


Modified by German_Muscle at 12:46 PM 11-2-2004

[LouderLowerFaster]

where can I get ABF rods for cheap? and what will the rods and 9A pistons bring my C/R to?

[all-starr-me]

you want ABF pistons, ABA and ABF rods are the same. I posted links in this thread on where to get ABF pistons for $289. Also I would budget in the near future for some cams, autotech or techtonices sport cams, or at the very least a euro intake cam.

[Chris164935]

But what about the ECU? Can this setup be run without a stand-alone?

[all-starr-me]

yes it can be done with the stock ecu, although I would get a 3.5 bar FPR and a custom chip at the least, or a piggy back to adjust it yourself. You will need to drill/tap your manifold for the intake air sensor and use injector cups from a digi setup for the injectors. Part of the reason why to do this swap is the aba bottom end allows you to use the crank trigger wheel built into the block that the stock management uses. standalone may be better and more aggresive but for those saving your pennies, motronic 2.9+ makes good power, gets good milage and is a huge advantage over CIS/Digi.

[German_Muscle]

Quote, originally posted by all-starr-me »

you want ABF pistons, ABA and ABF rods are the same. I posted links in this thread on where to get ABF pistons for $289. Also I would budget in the near future for some cams, autotech or techtonices sport cams, or at the very least a euro intake cam.

My bad, i fixed the post above. I dont think you can use the ABF pistons with the TDI crank can you?


Modified by German_Muscle at 12:58 PM 11-2-2004

[all-starr-me]

Eurospec sports has ABF cast pistons to use with both the 2.0L (92.8mm) and the TDI (95.5mm) cranks and keep a 10:1 CR. I would say the 9A pistons could be used with the TDI crank and would come pretty close to 10:1 if not higher. You can always deck the block or the head for more compression.

[German_Muscle]

Updating the Main list. Check it out. I added the above info and MK3 accessory conversion info to the list.

[Chris164935]

Quote, originally posted by all-starr-me »

yes it can be done with the stock ecu, although I would get a 3.5 bar FPR and a custom chip at the least, or a piggy back to adjust it yourself. You will need to drill/tap your manifold for the intake air sensor and use injector cups from a digi setup for the injectors. Part of the reason why to do this swap is the aba bottom end allows you to use the crank trigger wheel built into the block that the stock management uses. standalone may be better and more aggresive but for those saving your pennies, motronic 2.9+ makes good power, gets good milage and is a huge advantage over CIS/Digi.

Custom chip? Like an Autotech chip (just an example)? One designed for the ABA motor right? ...And just replace the stock unit?

[German_Muscle]

Quote, originally posted by all-starr-me »

yes it can be done with the stock ecu, although I would get a 3.5 bar FPR and a custom chip at the least, or a piggy back to adjust it yourself. You will need to drill/tap your manifold for the intake air sensor and use injector cups from a digi setup for the injectors. Part of the reason why to do this swap is the aba bottom end allows you to use the crank trigger wheel built into the block that the stock management uses. standalone may be better and more aggresive but for those saving your pennies, motronic 2.9+ makes good power, gets good milage and is a huge advantage over CIS/Digi.

The only stock engine management system id use with this setup is Digifant 1 with a completely custom burnt chip, or OBD1 ABA Motronic with a completely custom chip. But for those who are saving pennies, just get Megasquirt N Spark, using stock engine management for such a hybrid engine is most likely going to cost you in the long run. Megasquirt is a extremely good stand alone engine management system for the cost. Megasquirt is the way to go if you have a low budget. so IMHO stand alone is the only way to go with this setup. You can get away with chipped stock systems but stand alones will do the same and much much more. In other words what i am saying is....Dont Cut any Corners, do it the right way! The only way id use a stock management system is if i already had all of the stuff laying around, like if i was doing this to a car that came stock with or was already running ABA Motronic or Digi1 systems.

[Chris164935]

What does an ABA OBDII run (circa 1997)?

[LouderLowerFaster]

Quote, originally posted by Chris164935 »

What does an ABA OBDII run (circa 1997)?

If by run, you mean in the 1/4 mile....mine ran a 17.4 with Neuspeed chip and intake.... . I really shouldnt advertise that

[Chris164935]

I mean fule-injection... Is it Motronic?

[RangeRover]

how do you get around the camsensor when converting to the 16v head.

[bldgengineer]

ok, I'm seriously confused here

I recently dropped a 96 2.0 engine/tranny/ecu/wiring harness/dash etc etc into my 92 jetta and was thinking about putting a 16v head on it later on. I did a search and came across this but I seem to be just getting a headache. I have access to a full passat 16v head, can anyone tell me what I need to put this on? Will 9a pistons give me a c/r of 9:1+/-? can my current 96 obdII ecu handle this change?