VWVortex.com - 16v Digfant II FAQ
Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up


    Page 1 of 25 1234511 ... LastLast
    Results 1 to 25 of 1104

    Thread: 16v Digfant II FAQ

    Hybrid View

    1. Member MBRACKLIFFE's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jan 17th, 2003
      Southern NH
      04' R32 $ 77' Campmobile
      10-08-2004 11:42 PM #1
      Since I have had good luck with my swap except for a few minor bugs I thought I would spend some time and do a writeup on the subject.
      Swap Motor = 2.0 16v Engine Code 9A Passat Motor.

      Older Pic that is missing the new intake pipe but good enough. The pipe on there is the plastic 16v stock pipe cut down.
      8v parts needed from old motor.
      Fuel Injector's
      Fuel Pressure Regulator
      Knock Sensor
      Blue Coolant Sensor ( this is a topic of debate more info below )
      Single Sensor Coolant Flange on side of cylinder head
      8v Throttle Body
      8v Coil
      8v Fan After Run Switch
      Digi2 Airbox
      Vanestyle Air Meter (VAM) (on airbox)
      Airbox to Throttle Body Tube
      Idle Stabilizer Valve (ISV)
      8v Tranny (optional see below)
      8v Lower Radiator Hose
      8v Heater Core Hoses
      All 8v Pulley's
      Digi2 Injector Cups
      Keep all of the 8v hoses and various bits until your done cause they come in handy for custom stuff.

      16v Parts to keep
      16v Motor Complete
      16v Tranny (optional see below)
      16v Alternator
      16v Rubber Throttle Body Elbow
      16v Brake Booster Vac Hose
      16v Throttle Cable (see below)
      16v Distributor
      16v Plug Wires
      16v Upper Radiator Hose
      16v Coolant Pipe
      16v Sensor's (keep them all for now)
      16v Oil Cooler and Filter Flange
      16v Exhaust Manifold and Gasket's
      Keep all of your 16v Hoses and bits for now too cause you never know.

      Things You Have to Buy
      The Bentley Manual (optional but highly recommended)
      Fuel Rail (Ross or BBM or Homemade whichever works for you)
      Fuel Pressure Regulator Mount (usually you can order it with your rail or use an aftermarket regulator)

      Replace all non reusable stretch bolts (refer to Bentley)
      Clutch Pressure Plate Bolts
      Flywheel Bolts
      Crank Pulley Bolt (if removing Pulley)
      CV Joint Bolts
      Cylinder Head Bolts
      Connecting Rod Bolts

      Things I Recommend You Replace or Buy
      Spark Plugs
      Plug Wires
      Dist. Cap and Rotor
      Timing Belt
      Timing Belt Tensioner
      Sensors (see below) Coolant Temp Sensor, Oil Pressure Sensors
      Water Pump
      Vacuum Hoses
      Fuel Filter
      Air Filter
      Oil Filter
      Fuel Hoses
      Injector O-rings
      Motor Mounts (which ones you use depends on which brackets you keep, see below)
      Clutch Disc
      Change Tranny Fluid
      New Ground Wires
      New Power Wires
      O2 Sensor (8v)
      Every shifter bushing
      Air Fuel gauge
      CV Joint Gaskets
      CV Joint Grease
      Front Subframe Bushings
      Steering Rack Bushing
      Copper Exhaust Manifold and Cat. Nuts
      Magnetic Oil Drain Plug
      Oil Drain Plug Seal's
      Oil Pump
      Digifast Chip from VW_Pilot on the tex

      Special Tools
      Clutch Disc Centering Tool
      Shift Gate Alignment Tool (or print out its picture and make a cardboard one.

      8mm 12 Point wrench for CV joints
      12 Point Metric Sockets for clutch pressure plate bolts
      Timing Belt Tensioner Tool (can use snap ring pliers)
      17mm Hex Tool for Tranny Drain Plug
      OK just some basic stuff that I think you should do during this swap.
      Label all of your electrical connections and where they connect to before you unplug them.
      If you do not have the Bentley then draw diagrams of vacuum lines and other hoses.
      Replace EVERY corroded connector with a new one or clean them up shiny.
      Keep your eyes open for other problems and fix them now while the engine bay is empty and easy to work on.
      Shifter bushings replace them all while you can they make a huge difference.
      The Info

      Depending on your situation you can keep the 8 valve tranny or use the 16v tranny but some of the parts are not compatable. If you Notice any leaking gaskets or seals replace them now while it is easy. You may want to consider doing the Throw out bearing, clutch center plate and retaining ring. If you switch to a 16v Hydro tranny the process is beyond the scope of this write up please refer to the tranny forum for more help
      If you are keeping your 8v tranny then you need.
      8v Front Motor Mount Bracket
      8v Starter
      8v Flywheel
      8v Tranny Tin/Shields
      8v Clutch Disc
      16v Pressure Plate

      I recomend an air fuel gauge to keep track of the new motor since Digi2 was never meant to run this motor you wouldn't want to ruin it. A new o2 sensor will decrease the chance of this as well as a Digifast chip from VW_Pilot on the tex.
      You have to get a fuel rail cause the 8v one will not work. Be sure to replace Injector' O-rings and if you can swing it injector's. Sometimes the studs that hold the upper and lower manifold together stick out a little and interfere with fuel rails so you should grind them down.
      Good time to get new fuel lines while you are at it. The BLUE fuel hardline is the return and should go to the FPR.
      I am running the stock fuel pressure regulator and it is fine. Definitly replace your fuel filter cause it is cheap.
      See pic above for fuel rail and lines.

      Pic of the FPR

      Throttle Body
      The idle and wide open throttle switches on the 16v TB do not plug into the 8v harness without modification.
      The 16v throttle body that I had came with the restrictor plate on the butterfly and the vacuum connections were not ideal. There was also no idle adjust screw so I went with the 8v.
      When using the 8v TB however you have to modify the throttle cable by cutting it shorter and using a wire nut on it, also a piece of rubber hose over it will decrease chafing on the throttle lever.
      See the pic below of my intake tube for the wire nut on the throttle cable.

      Vacuum Hoses
      Definitly replace all of your vac hoses no point in not doing it now it will only give you trouble later. On the 8v TB there are 2 small ports on front and one on back. The front right port goes to FPR and splits off to the airbox as well. The front left goes to the EVAP Valve and so does the rear one. Refer to the Bentley for specifics.
      I replaced the 8v Brake booster hose which runs from the intake mani to the booster in favor of the 16v cause it fit better.

      Pic of brake booster vac hose from Passat

      You will have to rig something for your intake tube. You can use the 8v rubber one but the fit is not ideal. I used the 16v rubber elbow and a piece of aluminum tube and a silicon turbo style boot to fabricate my own. The aluminum tube came from a turbo volvo for 5 $ I just cut it at one of the bends to give it the correct shape.
      Depending on how you run your ISV hoses you may need a port on it but I ran my ISV to the large TB port with a piece of old coolant hose.

      Pic of my new intake tube.

      As far as I know the 16v and 8v ISV's are not compatable but you can simply swap one for the other and put the 8v one in the stock 16v location and use the same hoses. If I remember right one the hoses was a little big so I had to tighten the hose clamp really good but nothing major.
      Here is a pic

      This is the hose I used to connect the ISV to the TB, I used the stock 16v plastic pipe and the hose is an old coolant reservoir hose.

      Cold Start Injector
      I removed mine completely and threaded a large bolt into the hole with some sealant. A block off plate would work too or you could even just leave it there unplugged.
      See pic of ISV for the bolt in the cold start injector hole
      I used the 8v lower radiator hose with the 16v upper radiator hose and a Passat 16v coolant reservoir hose cause the 8v and 16v hoses were not long enough. I think the metal coolant pipe from the Passat is slightly different which is why. The rest of the hoses were 16v hoses except for the heater core hoses which were from the 8v however I had to cut the hose that goes into the side of the 16v head cause it was too long so maybe the 16v heater core hoses would have worked better.
      My crank case breather hose I decided to not reconnect to the intake stream cause I didn't want all that carbon build up in my freshly rebuilt motor so I put a minifilter on the end and capped off the vac lines from the manifold. I don't have much blowby in the new motor so oil spatter out the end of the filter is not a problem however I think there are some advantages in horse power when you create a vacuum in the crankcase so I am researching that further.

      You can see the K&N minifilter on my breather hose under the FPR pic above. UPDATE: This etup has proven to be messy even with my windage tray I still get oil vapor. I reccomend either a catch can or piping the crankcase vent hose back into the intake system.

      There has been some debate over whether or not to use the stock Digi2 CTS vs. stock 16v CTS and I have run some tests to see for myself. According to the Bentley they are electrically compatable. I took both sensor's and heated them up in water with a thermometer and took readings off both. They gave the same readings as predicted. However if you wish to use the DIgi2 sensor you will have to use the single sensor coolant flange off the side of the 8v head and put it on the 16v head. Mine fit with no modification but I do not have the 16v thermotime switch installed so the hole is plugged and I had plenty of room for the flange.
      I also have the stock 16v CTS installed and when I take reading off of them while they are both in the car I get slightly different readings from one to the other which I attribute to there locations. The difference is not substantial and they both fall within the Bentley's specs so It is really up to you but they are compatable.
      The Temp sender for the temp gauge on the dash you should use the 16v one and just cut the digi2 connector off and use a spade terminal. The brown wire is ground so connect the other one or test for voltage when the key is on and use that one.
      Replace your oil pressure switches cause they are cheap insurance but I recommend moving the low pressure switch to the back of the cylinder head where the oil temp sender is located and moving the temp sender to the oil filter flange. The head will lose oil pressure earlier which is why I moved it.
      The radiator fan after run switch is located on a bracket on the back of the 8v valve cover just remove it and put it on the 16v vallve cover above the exhaust manifold.

      All the sensor locations including the digi2 single sensor coolant flange.

      Radiator fan after run switch mounted above header or exhaust manifold.

      Ground Wires
      Digi2 is really sensitive to bad grounds so replace all your ground wires and clean up or replace connectors. You should have grounds running from battery to body and then to tranny. I ran one from tranny to cyclinder head as well. There is also a ground from the coil bracket to the valve cover.

      O2 Sensor
      Digi2 is also sensitive to a failing o2 sensor so replace it atleast every 60k miles. Alot of Digi2 problems can be fixed by replacing the o2 sensor.

      Pretty much plug and play, the Digi2 connector plugs right in. I had an issue with a bad Hall sender when I originally did my swap but I think it was just bad so I swapped in the Hall sender from my 8v Dist. . It is possible that this has to be done on all of them cause I have heard other people having to do the same thing but I don't have any hard evidence to back it up.

      Fuel Injector Harness
      The old harness is not long enough to reach around to the front of the 16v so I soldered ina couple short length's of wire to make it reach. Be sure your connections are waterproof and don't bother with butt connector's cause this is not the place for them. If you do not know how to solder you can buy no crimp butt conector's that solder the wires for you with the help of a lighter. NAPA carries them but so do other auto parts stores.
      I chose to keep the plastic loom that covers the injector wires, I split it open and drilled a couple holes through one half of it that would line up with the holes in the bottom of my Ross Fuel Rail and mounted directly to the rail. Looks perfectly factory. Putting the connector's one the injector's can be a real bitch no matter how you do it so be patient.
      Here is a pic of how I mounted the injector harness loom to my Ross rail.

      The 16v and 8v exhaust manifolds are not compatable, the Passat 16v manifold is different from the GTI 16v manifold as well. The dual downpipe from the GTI 16v is the same as the dual downpipe from the GTI 8v however the Passat 16v dual downpipe is not the same.
      According to a few other people here on the tex they have used the Passat manifold and downpipe without any problems.
      Another option of course is to use a header which should be for a GTI 16v.
      Everything else after the Manifold/Downpipe can be reused from the 8v.

      16v and 8v alternator's are not compatable because the mounting brackets are different. Use the 16v one.

      Depending on whether or not you have AC determines which pulley set you use. They are completely different. To correctly remove AC you must change the small pulley on the crank, the waterpump pulley, and the alternator pulley and if I remember correctly the power steering pulley as well. The only one that stays the same is the large crank pulley. It is possible to make things work and many people have done it but since my 16v originally came with no AC I had to change them all in order to add it.

      Motor Mounts
      The motor mounts should all be replaced at this point since the 16v is a more powerful motor any questionable mount from the old 8v will be no good when the 16v starts pulling on it. Which mounts you use depends on the brackets you have. There are hydraulic front and rear mounts or solid mounts and they have different brackets so make sure you order the correct ones.

      Tuning is all done to the Digi2 specs so follow the procedure in the Bentley. The 16v does seem to like a slightly higher idle though.
      I have been experimenting with tuning the VAM spring but small adjustments really don't seem to make a difference. I am not sure how the idle mixture is or whether it should be asdjusted since I do not have access to smog equipment.

      That is all I can think of for the moment but I will be updating pictures soon as I take them.
      http://www.dubbase.2ya.com My Site
      Please add anything I have missed.

      **UPDATE** 9/3/2008
      I am sad to say that I will be moving away from the mkII world. My GTI has reached the end of its life due to rust issues that I simply do not have the time to fix. I have been through a lot with my GTI including a 16v engine build this Digi2 Swap and basically rebuilding the entire car over the course of the last 8 years. I am sad to see it go but I am itching to spend time restoring my 77 Westy that has been in storage for the past 6 years. In order to keep my spirits up during the daily commute I have also purchased myself a little known car called an .:R32 so don't feel too bad for me........
      Pic of the ride at the height of its glory.......

      I will keep up this FAQ and its pictures as long as I can but if any Vortex admin is willing to take over the maintenance of this FAQ please let me know.
      Before I go I just have one last little piece of technical info regarding this swap that I thought would help everyone out in their efforts to better tune their Digi2 swaps....

      I exceeded the 20000 character post limit so follow the link and scroll down to the instructions.

      Modified by MBRACKLIFFE at 8:47 PM 1-1-2009

    2. 10-09-2004 12:36 AM #2
      Dude that pretty much sums it up. At least for a MKII. Great Job!!!
      For a MKI there are a few extra things to add to that. Yes, some MkI's were digi2. Mine for instance. 1993 VW rabbit Cabriolet.
      - Re-use all MKI mounts. They will all work.
      - Must use scirocco 16v manifold and downpipe. Passat or MKII manifold/downpipe will not fit.
      - It is easier to use scirocco upper intake manifold, as the intake hose and air box can remain on the driver side. However, a passat or MKII upper manifold will work, you just need to make some room on the passenger side.

      That is all I can think of that is different for a MKI right now. But I'm going to keep thinking.
      Pics of my digi2 16v MKI swap

      Modified by cdn20VALVE at 12:54 AM 10-9-2004

    3. Member oopseyesharted's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 2nd, 2005
      Cleveland "Westside"
      07' Rabbit & 86' Cabby
      01-18-2008 08:14 PM #3
      I am doing this in the next couple weeks. Lots of great info here. [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]
      Nothing interesting here.

    4. 01-20-2008 10:47 PM #4
      FINALLY started and drove the car today. 4 Years in the making, longest Digi-2 16v Swap evar!
      Last Night:


      Decent pics to follow once I find my camera charger.

    5. Member oopseyesharted's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 2nd, 2005
      Cleveland "Westside"
      07' Rabbit & 86' Cabby
      01-21-2008 07:47 AM #5
      that looks great really good man [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]
      Nothing interesting here.

    6. 01-21-2008 10:46 AM #6
      is that a no ac/ps serp conv?
      '11 Routan SE (black), '01 Jetta GLX VR6 5spd (silver)
      FE ///Motorsports VCDS Hex-Can, if you need help.

    7. 01-24-2008 01:44 PM #7
      Yeah. Bracket, pullies are off of a MK3 Golf CL, VR6 Alternator. Serp tensioner is off of a AAZ turbo diesel (metal back to clear the water outlet on the head).
      Quote, originally posted by rychas1 »
      is that a no ac/ps serp conv?

    8. 06-24-2009 05:01 PM #8
      plz some one help me
      i have a 1.8 16v engine with digi2 system
      i have some problems :
      1: when the car runing For long time and rough drivin at high speeds
      when i turn oFF the car and i wanna start it again .... its start so deFecult unless i wait the car to cold then it will start normaly .
      2: i cant do the timing thing For the engine right ... i keep hear the valves singing at rought drivin
      i cheked all the wires and i made it as u said letraly

    9. Member ohfllifer's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 9th, 2005
      Lake Tapps
      85 diesel jetta, 90 cabby 16v, 2004 jetta wagon
      06-24-2009 07:04 PM #9
      Quote, originally posted by Nart »
      plz some one help me
      1: when the car runing For long time and rough drivin at high speeds
      when i turn oFF the car and i wanna start it again .... its start so deFecult unless i wait the car to cold then it will start normaly .

      I had this problem. I put in a ford starter silenoid as a starter relay and it has worked so for. Its a starter heat soak problem.
      ‘Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not.’

    10. Junior Member
      Join Date
      Nov 9th, 2007
      2x '67 Beetle, 2004 24v GLI
      06-24-2009 07:21 PM #10
      x2 on the heatsoak. Check out this thread:

    11. 06-24-2009 08:21 PM #11
      hope you can follow me in this post:

    12. 06-25-2009 08:46 AM #12
      jettason28 thx dude great work

      but my starter problem not like that:
      Symptom: You turn the key and nothing happens. Nothing. Not even a click. The voltmeter does however show you sucking major current.
      when my car is hot and i wanna start the car .... u can hear the starter
      workin but so weak it cant start the engine and aFter 10 seconds oF weak workin the engine run!

    13. Member ohfllifer's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 9th, 2005
      Lake Tapps
      85 diesel jetta, 90 cabby 16v, 2004 jetta wagon
      06-25-2009 12:43 PM #13
      Quote, originally posted by Nart »
      when my car is hot and i wanna start the car .... u can hear the starter
      workin but so weak it cant start the engine and aFter 10 seconds oF weak workin the engine run!

      It could still be a heat soak problem. Mine did both, some times it would not do a thing and other times it would crank really really slow and strained. Or maybe your starter is just getting old.
      ‘Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not.’

    14. Member daneek155's Avatar
      Join Date
      Apr 22nd, 2008
      2002-a4/92 GTI/95 Dakota
      01-21-2011 07:56 PM #14
      good tread planning on doing this,
      HE HE

    15. 10-10-2004 03:21 PM #15
      some pics from poland , and polish faq

    16. 10-14-2004 08:40 AM #16
      nice swap i have had the same swap completed for about 15,000kms now with no problems, looks and runs mint in an mk2. any questions just ask.

    17. 10-15-2004 06:26 PM #17
      would this swap be similar to swaping an 1.8 16v into and 1986 gti?if no the same what all do i need and if u can help me with anyother info let me know ....my email doesnt work so just post somthing after this...

    18. 10-15-2004 08:53 PM #18
      Ok so now that we have a Digi 2 FAQ. Let's talk modifying.
      My car runs rich low rpm, and lean high rpm. Typical Digi2. So how do I go about fixing this. Other than going standalone.
      I had my car on a 40,000.00$$ diagnostic machine at my tech school yesterday, and the air fuel ratio at idle was perfect at 14.8:1.

    19. 10-15-2004 09:05 PM #19
      the easiest is to use a relay triggered by the WOT that takes the coolant sensor wiring through a resistor - resulting in a richer fuel mixture.

    20. 10-16-2004 12:18 AM #20
      Richer is good, but it's already too rich at low rpm.

    21. 10-16-2004 08:12 AM #21
      what I described is the enrichment device - used ONLY at WOT - at which point the readings stated were lean - it does nothing at idle....

    22. 10-17-2004 11:04 PM #22
      ya ive heard of the BMW MAF, which sounds like a nice mod for us digi 2 guys, what i have done is opened my stock maf up and loosened the spring tension by releasing it 3 clicks makes for better throttle response and runs a little bit richer. but i wanna find a BMW maf setup for increased airflow.

    23. 10-19-2004 06:07 PM #23
      the 16v one works fine but if your 16v one is bad then it is possible to switch in the 8v one, but chances are your 16v one is fine and is compatible, im using it.

    24. Member 16V VW's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 31st, 2004
      Broke Down On Sides Of Roads
      1990 gli Vr6, 91 disel jetta, 1991 gti, 1990 vrt, 2005 600Gsxr, tons of a4's and a chevy truck
      10-25-2004 11:24 PM #24
      Well heres a good story that is good/bad. Today I got home from school and my friend was driving my jetta and i was driving his, anyway, i was outside fixin some crap on it and the cop pulls up and says, IM GOING TO IMPOUND YOUR CAR RIGHT NOW!!! YOUR AN IDIOT, {MIND YOU THIS IS THE 5TH TIME HE HAS PULLED ME "MY FRIEND OVER"} FOR NO REASON!!! then he says, "speeding in a school zone! "it was 4:30 LOL" you were like a bat out of hell "all my friend driving", then says, " your going to have citations in the mail, bla blah bla, then he gets in his car and pulls upto me after i walk over to my friend and says, " just busting your balls, and peels out and drives away."
      Nextime im going to have a box of donuts in my car.
      but i left and went with some girls and other of that good stuff, so ill check the car out tomorrow.
      True story by the way.
      check out my for sale threads!
      Eastwood Fender Roller For Rent in NEPA, give me a call or text (570)332-4564
      90 gli vrt 2.9 JE pistons, Eurospec Rods, SP SRI, atp dp, atp mani, 6765 t4, BVH, peloquin, lm2, lugtronic vems, 840's, and a whole lot of balls

    25. 10-26-2004 11:36 PM #25
      Ok all you digi 2 knowledgable peeps. I have a problem.
      I put my digi2 setup in a while ago and i was running a copper t from the main vaccume on the back of the intake manafold. Now i have been having problems with it trying to compensate and stall out and i figured it was bad vaccume.
      Today i tried to re-route the ISV vaccume more stock ish, where i had a piece of metal blocking the lower intake for the 5th injector i took it off and ran the isv there and form the larger vaccume port on the 8v throttle body.
      When I did this my idle would sit at like 1300rpm so we figured it was a leak somewhere. So i pressureized the system and came up with absolutly nothing .. it was working great. So why is my idle messed up? I then decided to tear out everything and plug all the vaccume ports. i adjusted the idle manually witht he screw and wouldnt you knwo it .. . it works fine. WHAT IS GOING ON? on the 8v if you did that it would crap out in like 3 seconds.
      Also. . my downpipe is sitting on my swap bar making a really bad vibration and noise. should i just rip out the sway bar??? thanks in advance guys

      Modified by veedubinit at 4:41 AM 10-27-2004

    For advertising information click HERE

    Page 1 of 25 1234511 ... LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts