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    Thread: 1.8L 16V PL head, 2.0L 16v 9A block conversion...

    1. 08-09-2005 10:50 PM #26
      ...I KNEW there was a reason i never puchased or suggested anyone purchase Shine Stuff...for the EXACT same reason I no longer purchase or suggest anyone purchase anything from Autotech...
      Customer Service Blows.
      Employee Attitude Blows
      Condecending Attitudes on a Public Web Forum (Kiss the customers ass? No...**** them in the ass so they KEEP coming back for more...mmmm mmm good)
      BRILLIANT


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      08-09-2005 11:03 PM #27
      Damn, what the hell is wrong with Dick Shine... and who the hell named him that, anyway?
      Cruel joke???

    3. Member Thrasher's Avatar
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      08-09-2005 11:13 PM #28
      I <3 everyone.


      Modified by Thrasher at 11:39 PM 8-9-2005
      This axe was made to grind.

    4. 08-09-2005 11:19 PM #29
      I just re-read this quote from Penis Gloss (Dick Shine)-- "The PL only has better cams (cheaper and easier to change) "-- WTF???
      easier to change?
      I want to swap in some easy to change cams next time!! [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]



      Modified by TechSupportGuy at 4:29 AM 8-10-2005

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      08-09-2005 11:40 PM #30
      Man, this got ugly in a hurry. I wonder if Dick Shine will ever show his face in the 16V forum again.

    6. Member dubidoobs's Avatar
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      08-10-2005 02:26 AM #31
      oh, what a tangled web we weave...
      a bad day in a Volkswagen, is better than a good day in a Honda...

      MKII Alpine White GTi 2.0/1 16V (in the works)
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    7. 08-10-2005 08:25 AM #32
      I've got to say what I've got to say before this thing gets locked; Dick, that is your name, Dick, this forum is an enthusiasts forum. If you cannot understand the word enthusiast, go get a dictionary and look it up. We are a group who share a common bond of an attraction towards the 16v engine and VW's in general. We for the most part are not in the business of racing but enjoy a higher performance of the vehicle than a majority of car people. We are a large group who spend much money to enhance that performance. I can understand you not wanting to share your info, that's cool, you paid for it, but this forum is about sharing and perhaps you being out of here is not such a bad thing. Humility goes a long way in sales; condescending attitudes chase off alot of potential customers who want to feel comfortable with a self described expert. I've always consulted Mr. Vittone for expert motor advice, and he won't charge me. As for setting up my ride, Raffi at Eurosport is the man, who has also won many races. He doesn't charge me for advice as well. Life is full of choices, I think this thread has given me a clear idea of what Shine is all about. The name is appropriate.

    8. 08-10-2005 08:29 AM #33
      Powerdubs and 16vforreal, you guys just summed it up beautifully- couldn't have said it better.

    9. 08-10-2005 09:51 AM #34
      And, yes, gotta love TT for thier customer service and advice. Darrel and Randy and great and helpful and knowledgeable. They realize that if the customer likes you and they WILL COME BACK.

    10. Member Rusty Shackelford's Avatar
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      08-10-2005 11:22 AM #35
      wow, yeah... I'm surprised at some of his responses and the fact that he is who he is with a business and all. For sure does NOT impress me and/or make me want to spend money with him if he knows his **** or not. I'll take my chances figuring stuff out on my own.

    11. Member dubidoobs's Avatar
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      08-10-2005 05:38 PM #36
      Quote, originally posted by scirocco16vforreal &raquo;
      I've got to say what I've got to say before this thing gets locked; Dick, that is your name, Dick, this forum is an enthusiasts forum. If you cannot understand the word enthusiast, go get a dictionary and look it up. We are a group who share a common bond of an attraction towards the 16v engine and VW's in general. We for the most part are not in the business of racing but enjoy a higher performance of the vehicle than a majority of car people. We are a large group who spend much money to enhance that performance. I can understand you not wanting to share your info, that's cool, you paid for it, but this forum is about sharing and perhaps you being out of here is not such a bad thing. Humility goes a long way in sales; condescending attitudes chase off alot of potential customers who want to feel comfortable with a self described expert. I've always consulted Mr. Vittone for expert motor advice, and he won't charge me. As for setting up my ride, Raffi at Eurosport is the man, who has also won many races. He doesn't charge me for advice as well. Life is full of choices, I think this thread has given me a clear idea of what Shine is all about. The name is appropriate.


      word. i just started this thread bcoz i had a "spare" 2.0L block sittin on my garage, ready to be used, just wanted to know if i had to swap the internals,and if i did if it will run right...but this makes for good reality show!
      a bad day in a Volkswagen, is better than a good day in a Honda...

      MKII Alpine White GTi 2.0/1 16V (in the works)
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    12. Member dswalterwi's Avatar
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      08-10-2005 05:55 PM #37
      I have some cams from both a PL and a 9A. How do you tell which is which?


      Modified by dswalterwi at 10:57 PM 8-10-2005

    13. 08-10-2005 06:06 PM #38
      Aha! Our first potential guinea pig
      I don't know how exactly, they must have different casting numbers or part numbers on them somewhere? Anyhow, if you can figure it out, do a switcheroo and let us know if there's a difference!

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      08-10-2005 06:23 PM #39
      Quote, originally posted by dubidoobs &raquo;
      this has probably been beat to hell, but i just want some feedback on how much of a difference in performace will the conversion be if i leave the 2.0L block in stock form, ie, no oversized pistons, etc.?

      I've done the 2.0 block under the 1.8 stock head with no mods to either, and i am very happy with the results. I might add that a TT race exhaust and a magnaflow muffler seem to help out as well.
      Storage Editor, PC Perspective | CTNC, USN (Retired)
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    15. Member J. Daniel's Avatar
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      08-10-2005 06:34 PM #40
      Quote, originally posted by SRSVW &raquo;
      The Euro intake is a poor choice as this makes the situation worse!
      YOUR HEAD IS EXHAUST FLOW DEFICIENT,SO ADDING MORE INTAKE MAKES THINGS WORSE,NOT BETTER!

      I totally don't get this! If the exhaust flow is so deficient that adding more intake cam makes things worse then why did VW do exactly that to make more power?
      I'm sure, as usual, the OEMs have some totally effed up reason for doing something like this.
      ETKA lists the same cams for the PL and 9A.
      Make your own choice on which head you think is better. All the data on intake and exhaust flow is out there.
      I've got a PL head on my 9A block and quite frankly it needs more INTAKE cam!

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      08-10-2005 10:14 PM #41
      OK, lets stop comparing dick length(hehe) and get some real numbers. Who has some lift and duration numbers for either set of cams?
      *edit*
      I see from ETKA that they list the same P/N. Anyone have a set of each to confirm that they are indeed the same? VW loves to update things so it may not be as simple as it seems that things are the same.
      Modified by scirocco25 at 7:21 PM 8-10-2005


      Modified by scirocco25 at 7:29 PM 8-10-2005

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      08-10-2005 10:19 PM #42
      I'd like to add that I think Mr. Shine probably has some interesting things to add to this discussion if people werent always giving him crap on here. I dont like the way he presents himself, but would appreciate hearing some of his experience on this topic. Most of us are trying to acheive similar goals in this hobby, its a shame we cant all share in the knowledge.

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      08-10-2005 10:36 PM #43
      I would also like to add that simply because a head has a lower static flow number than another head, on either the intake or exhause side, does not make it worse than a head with higher static flow.
      The flow bench is useful to a point, but doesnt always correlate to making power in the useful range. Again, i'd like to see some dyno numbers from a pl head on a 9a block vs. a stock 9a. I think at least some of the power gains people are seeing with the pl head/cams are from the bump in compression.

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      08-10-2005 10:36 PM #44
      I agree that Dick seems to have a lot of experience and knowledge. It's just that he seems to have the "Gene Berg" (you'd probably know if you are an aircooled performance person) syndrome where the knowledge and experience are presented in a way that leaves a bad taste in many potential customers mouths.
      I'm not saying that he or his products are bad, just that he comes across as a bit coarse and arrogant for the average enthusiast.

    20. Member J. Daniel's Avatar
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      08-11-2005 09:50 AM #45
      Quote, originally posted by scirocco25 &raquo;
      I think at least some of the power gains people are seeing with the pl head/cams are from the bump in compression.

      As far as I know the PL and 9A both had a 10:1 CR.
      Maybe my data's wrong.
      So, where's the bump in compression coming from?

    21. 08-11-2005 10:02 AM #46
      BOth heads have the same size chambers AFAIK, so the difference in compression ratio between PL and 9A is due to the greater cylinder volume and/or piston shape. 9A was rated at either 10.6 or 10.8:1

    22. Member dubidoobs's Avatar
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      08-11-2005 10:14 AM #47
      Quote, originally posted by Allyn &raquo;
      I've done the 2.0 block under the 1.8 stock head with no mods to either, and i am very happy with the results. I might add that a TT race exhaust and a magnaflow muffler seem to help out as well.

      then from ur experience, an exhaust upgrade to your current setup will top it off nicely? coz im running a ss catback TT exhaust w/their hi-flo cat on my stock PL motor now, so mate it with the 9A block, would you say i will have a decent setup? oohhh...im getting excited
      a bad day in a Volkswagen, is better than a good day in a Honda...

      MKII Alpine White GTi 2.0/1 16V (in the works)
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      SLAM-N-EURO'Z

    23. Member dubidoobs's Avatar
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      08-11-2005 10:17 AM #48
      Quote, originally posted by J. Daniel &raquo;
      I totally don't get this! If the exhaust flow is so deficient that adding more intake cam makes things worse then why did VW do exactly that to make more power?
      I'm sure, as usual, the OEMs have some totally effed up reason for doing something like this.
      ETKA lists the same cams for the PL and 9A.
      Make your own choice on which head you think is better. All the data on intake and exhaust flow is out there.
      I've got a PL head on my 9A block and quite frankly it needs more INTAKE cam!

      and thus my theory in swapping to the "euro intake cam" or just basically tweaking the intake on the PL head...i dunno what the "principles" are in NA tuning, but if turbos work off the ehaust part of the engine stroke, then does that mean in NA tuning, you concentrate on the intake part of the cycle? carbs and TB's come into mind while im theorizing this... can someone enlighten me?
      a bad day in a Volkswagen, is better than a good day in a Honda...

      MKII Alpine White GTi 2.0/1 16V (in the works)
      MKVI PGM 2.0L 6MT TDi Wagon (daily driver)

      SLAM-N-EURO'Z

    24. Member dubidoobs's Avatar
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      08-11-2005 10:19 AM #49
      Quote, originally posted by scirocco25 &raquo;
      I'd like to add that I think Mr. Shine probably has some interesting things to add to this discussion if people werent always giving him crap on here. I dont like the way he presents himself, but would appreciate hearing some of his experience on this topic. Most of us are trying to acheive similar goals in this hobby, its a shame we cant all share in the knowledge.

      why cant we all just get along?!?!?!
      a bad day in a Volkswagen, is better than a good day in a Honda...

      MKII Alpine White GTi 2.0/1 16V (in the works)
      MKVI PGM 2.0L 6MT TDi Wagon (daily driver)

      SLAM-N-EURO'Z

    25. Member shellac's Avatar
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      08-11-2005 10:50 AM #50
      Quote, originally posted by Allyn &raquo;
      I've done the 2.0 block under the 1.8 stock head with no mods to either, and i am very happy with the results. I might add that a TT race exhaust and a magnaflow muffler seem to help out as well.

      Did you notice a big difference going from the 2.0 to the 1.8 head? Where did you notice the difference?

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