how much would this procedure cost if done in a shop? (labor only)
I forgot to renew my domain registration. Pics should be back online! If not, refresh your DNS settings if you can.
Thanks for getting the photos back up! Quick question, Step 3 you say to turn the 19mm crank bolt at the bottom "counter clockwise" to line up the timing marks on the cam sprocket and valve cover. Is this correct? I thought we should only turn the engine clockwise? When I'm turning the crank is it supposed to get hard to turn? Thanks again.
First post here, but just wanted to say thanks for posting such a comprehensive DIY! With the help of your post, I was able to replace the water pump on my 2003 Jetta, (2.0) in about 5 hours. The kit from ECS tuning was perfect, (although if I had to do it again, i probably would have sprung for the tensioner tool rather than use the bent needle nose).
The only thing I would add, is that the hardest part, by far, was removing/unbolting the part of the motor mount that is attatched to the engine block! As described, there are three bolts;
Bolt 1- can see from under the car. you can unbolt it, but will need to lower the engine down to actually get the bolt out. This is the "easy" bolt.
Bolt 2- can NOT see this bolt, but you can feel it. while under the car, reach straight up past bolt 1 and slide your hand towards the top of the mount, feel for the bolt head, it is slightly recessed.
I took the socket off the driver and placed it on the bolt head. Then I raised the engine until I could see the socket, (If you are standing on the passenger side of the engine compartment looking down, it will be almost against the chasis, under where the coolant resevoir was.)
Once you raise the engine enough to see the socket, you can use a swivel head connection to attach your driver to the socket you placed on the bolt head. take your time and watch your knuckles!
Bolt 3- Leave the engine raised. In the center of the motor mount, there is a circular opening. This is where Bolt 3 is located. you can't really see it, but it is easily reached and removed with a socket wrench.
As far as actually removing the mount, well, that is something I couldn't actually compelety figure out! I jacked the motor up and down a few times and was finally able to get it to a point that it was "out of the way" but I never fully "removed" it from the engine compartment. This proved to be a pain in the A$$ when it came time to adjust the tensioner.
My jetta has 55k miles on it, and the impellor on the water pump was literally in half. Mechanics in my area wanted $675 - $850 to replace so I was more than happy to do it myself!
Thanks again for making this topic! It saved me over $500 bucks!
Vasilov, you recommended a torque wrench. I would like to use one. Which one should I use? or which one do you have?
I think I'm gonna change the timing belt this weekend. Maybe one of the serious/important repairs I'm gonna do myself on this jetta since I bought it.
wish me luck!
stuck in a holding pattern, and i need help. please!
During step #10, the crank rotated a hair and i freaked because the step clearly says "you must block the crankshaft from rotating!"
as a result, I removed the 6mm bit and rotated the crank again to get TDC before re-attempting to remove the qty 4, 6mm allen heads. In the process the cam stopped rotating resulting from busted teeth on the timing belt. hence, the cam and crank are no longer in sync.
I'm assuming at this point that i need to find TDC on the flywheel by way of some mysterious green window. If this is what i need to do, where do i find this window?? any pics?? i can't seem to find it.
once the mark on the flywheel is in alignment and the cam sprocket mark is aligned with the mark on the engine block, am i ok to proceed with the remaining steps?
At this point, my DIY becomes obsolete. The entire idea of the Mark-And-Match principle for replacing the timing belt relies on the notion that the cam and the crank remain in sync while the timing belt is off.
Since you already lost the timing, you have to revert back to the standard procedure described in the Bentley manual. Depending on your transmission (auto, vs manual) you the hole you need to look into is slightly different.
Again, consult with the repair manual.
excellent write up... i remember doing this not too long ago, except i had the engine out for a clutch replacement as well which in turn made the TB job easier seeing as i wasnt working in a tight place.
[IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] for doing your own work!
Thanks for the post. I did this on Saturday in just under 7 hours and the DIY took a lot of guesswork out of the job. I just have one question. The DIY says turn the middle of the tensioner clockwise until the tensioning mark lines up with the fingers. My Chilton says turn the middle of the tensionser counterclockwise, however, if you do this, the tensioning mark doesn't even go in the direction of the fingers. This is how it was when I took it off. I decided to do it the DIY way and go clockwise, but lining up the mark with the fingers didn't seem to produce a lot of tension. I've put close to 400 miles on the car with no problem. Any thoughts?
Quote, originally posted by jmabshir » Looks like the pictures are gone again
Not sure how you get this, but everything loads fine here on my end. The server has not been touched in the past 42 days so it must be something on your end.
I ordered a kit from ECS Tunning and it came with cam shaft seal and OE Front Crankshaft/Oil pump seal.
Can anyone advise on how to replace these?
2014 GLI Autobahn Nav DSG
2009 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, Shrockworks Mid-width Front Bumper with Warn 9.5Ti Winch. 4-wheeled Moab 5 times.
2007 Mercedes Benz SLK280
At what mileage is everybody doing the timing belt/water pump maintenance?
My wife has a 2001 Jetta with 70,000 miles. No noises, no cooling issues yet. Should I go ahead and do this anyway?
I just did mine this past weekend on my 99.5 with 99,000 miles. I'd recommend spending the extra money for the tensioning tool. I tensioned my belt and then stopped work until the next day. I didn't realize the tension changed over night until the engine mount half of the passenger-side engine mount was back on. My home made wood tool wouldn't fit so I had to take the mount back off. I guess it was good though as the second time getting that part of the mount off was not nearly as bad (jack down/up and then get the right side of the mount over the timing belt tensioner and then drop it down and to the rear of the car -- I left it sit there onto of the steering rack while working).
I'll try to post a photo of my wood tool later on. It helps also to have a "wobble" set of extensions especially if you want to torque the rear bolt on the rear of that engine-half of that mount. Without a short wobble bit, I couldn't get my torque wrench into position.
Thanks a lot to the author of the DIY. It took me about 12 hours doing some other maintenance too (not in a rush and I was sick so most will probably be faster).
If you want to DIY a tool here are my photos of mine:
I don't have a welder -- if I did (and knew how to use it), I'd make a thinner one out of metal and tack on a stud or two for the timing belt tensioner holes.
You'll see the wooden tool I made has two nails with the most pointed part of the heads snipped off. Only one nail is actually needed if the hole is not much larger than the 13mm socket you'll need to insert in the hole to tighten the tensioner.
Bad part about this tool is that you'll need all the passenger-side engine mount bracket off to get it in there. Good part is that it's cheap and works just fine.
Hey, I may not have read far enough down the post, but where did you buy both the belt and the coolant pump. I am interested in changing both these myself but was hoping to find if anyone knew where the best place to pick them up would be and how much do you think it would cost.
Just wanted to confirm some stuff.
1) I am Guessing that this would work with the 2.0L AVH engine right?
2) Anyone tried this Kit?
Since the Engine Mount is not in the Set, I would have to order it.
2 x N90596902
2 x N10209606
3) Is there any other Maintenance work which should be done when doing this?
Quote, originally posted by cypaul » Does anyone know if a 12pt 19mm Socket is need for the 19mm Crank Bolt?
Would the 6pt work?
Yes and no!
Quote, originally posted by vasillalov » Yes and no!
Thanks.. for you answer and the DIY.
I finally got my TB Changed. The Engine Mount as a horrible thing to get in and out. Taking out was easier then putting it back in. I took at least 4 hours in total figuring that part out.
19mm 12 pt for Crank.
18mm and 16mm for Mount.
Also you'll need a 13mm and a 10mm.
6mm Hex Bolt and 5mm Hex Bolt.
I had the same problems with the engine mount. After some time I figured out that I have to move the engine up and down vertically so that there is enough room to re-install the engine mount.
Awesome write up, much more informative and easy to follow than my Chilton book, took me 10 hours start to finish with a lot of breaks since it was in the upper 90's for pretty much the whole project, and a run to the parts store, I had to buy the Hex bits to get the harmonic balancer off but they are a must have for this car anyway. I had major difficulties getting that stupid engine mount off, the one thats directly connected to the motor, one arm on it goes to the firewall side of the motor and the other arm goes to the passenger side of the motor in the MIDDLE of the timing belt!! I was terrified that after marking everything nicely and getting it dead on that I was gonna screw it all up banging that stupid mount against everything. One oddity, I had read that the impeller on this pump was replaced with a metal one as part of a redesign, when I picked up my rebuilt coolant pump at the dealer it had a plastic impeller?? Parts were a little high on this Pump was $90, Belt was $60, and the Tensioner was $120 . Still far better than the $1200 the dealer wanted.
... and that's why you order parts from online retailers like ECSTuning. You get the right parts on a good price!
Awesome! Took me 4.5 hours total. Performed work on a 2002 VW Jetta w/ 2.0 AVH. I did have very mechanically inclided help (doesn't hurt that we both have engineering degrees and I run a maintenance department at a manufacturing facility)
It actually took me almost as long to change the thermostat (but that's because I put the new one in backwards ).
Blocking the car about 2 feet up is key, along with using a jack under the engine. (that make the pass. side motor mount my bitch (15 minutes in and out).
One more thing to add. The impeller on the old pump (plastic) looked great for 114K. The bearings in the pump didn't feel so great at all (glad I changed it), I think it didn't have much time left.
The belt didn't look bad at all for 114K, I feel it would have lasted another 25K. Very interesting how different the condition of these parts are....
Modified by smartcardengr at 7:59 PM 8-9-2008
I KNOW I NEED TO ADJUST THE TIMING BELT TENSIONER. HOWEVER YOUR DIRECTIONS DO NOT STATE THAT I SHOULD ADJUST THE SERPANTINE BELT TENSIONER.. DO I NEED TO ADJUST THE SERP BELT TENSIONER OR JUST PUT IT BACK TOGETHER LIKE UR DIRECTIONS SAY? IF SO HOW? THANKS
I have a question. I need to change the timing belt and i'm not trying to take it to the dealer, but the parts dept. told me i couldn't get the parts for my make and model (99 VW golf 2.0 made in mexico ) anywhere else but the dealer is this true? please help .. they said i need the timing belt and hydraulic belt or something like that. please helpp thank you
Quote, originally posted by mspassi0n31 » I have a question. I need to change the timing belt and i'm not trying to take it to the dealer, but the parts dept. told me i couldn't get the parts for my make and model (99 VW golf 2.0 made in mexico ) anywhere else but the dealer is this true? please help .. they said i need the timing belt and hydraulic belt or something like that. please helpp thank you
Mjm or ecs tuning you can get the whole kit and everything.
Quote, originally posted by dtj318 » I KNOW I NEED TO ADJUST THE TIMING BELT TENSIONER. HOWEVER YOUR DIRECTIONS DO NOT STATE THAT I SHOULD ADJUST THE SERPANTINE BELT TENSIONER.. DO I NEED TO ADJUST THE SERP BELT TENSIONER OR JUST PUT IT BACK TOGETHER LIKE UR DIRECTIONS SAY? IF SO HOW? THANKS
Put the tensioner back in without putting the ribbed belt on. then get the ribbed belt in and let tension off the tensioner by using a 15mm opened ended wrench on the square knob on the tensioner. just use the wrench and pull it towards the front of the car.
Thanks for the DIY ,it worked great. The Bentley to my surprise wasn't too thorough and missed a few key steps i feel. The most annoying part was the motor mount of course. and something else that slipped by me was the fact that there's a little nook for the timing belt tensioner fingers I had to turn mine counter-clockwise for it to tense, not clockwise.
I did the timing belt/waterpump (and thermostat, which I understand is covered in another thread). It would undoubtedly take me less time the next time I do it, but it took the better part of 2 days (13 hours working) to do this and the thermostat replacement...I may be slow, and us old guys move more slowly, but honestly almost all of it was "under the car" time.
I've done this job (as 2 different jobs) on my previous 1986 GTI, and it was a LOT easier on the GTI. (except for siezed waterpump bolts on the GTI, which I had no problems with this time. Guess I shouldn't expect it to be as easy, but VW has made serviceability a lot worse than on the 1986. Glad I didn't have to do this on a turbo (TDI or 1.8T). For one thing the location of the motor mounts was much easier on the 1986, primarily not having the passenger side engine mount that goes inbetween the timing belt and the block that needs to be removed to service the belt. Maybe this is so they can use this same block in transverse and longitudinal applications, but it sure is a step backwards in serviceability. Also running the water pump off the timing belt sounds like asking for problems. I wish they had kept the front engine and rear engine mounts like the 1986 had. Interestingly I don't remember having to have the timing belt tensioner tool for my '86, I don't remember what I used to tension the belt.
The sections of the procedure that I was expecting problems with (based on previous appends) ended up going smoothly; for some
reason I had more problems with seemingly incidental details (or at least they took me more time to get around). For instance, one of the ridiculous things that took me more time was removing the undercar shield around the crank; guess I didn't know that the "speed" nuts were simply supposed to be pried off (I didn't want to break them and was being careful, so I spent some unneeded disassembly time trying to get to the top of the frame member to remove it. Another problem I had was with the "useless" metal piece above the water pump; the procedure seems to indicate that you can remove this before you remove the waterpump, but maybe they made a running change on my block, but one bolt eyelet for that piece is shared with one of the waterpump bolts, such that you need to remove the water pump to remove this "useless" piece.
The mount itself seemed to go OK. There isn't much room between the frame rail and the bolt #2 described above, I found a 5/8" obstruction wrench worked very well for me (I couldn't even fit my universal joint in the small space; maybe needed one of those dedicated socket/universal combinations?). It took lots of time, but eventually came out OK. The mount itself is hard to describe how to extricate, but for me, with the engine cranked up high, there is a small curved section on the bottom of the mount than needed to clear the welded bracket on the frame, and the mount kind of "twisted around the back side of the engine and I dropped it down from below.
I didn't have to remove tension from the belt, the mount seemed to go in/out with the timing belt fully tensioned.
The other thing that took me lots of time was adjustment of the timing belt tension. I had the proper Schley tool (Thanks cousin Mike!) but the arrow pointer seemed to keep going out of adjustment when I was testing by rotating the crank bolt, even though I had tightened the 13mm tensioner bolt fully. I think the indicator can vary once you've tightened it depending on where you are in the engine cycle, but this threw me such that I readjusted the tensioner 3 or 4 times thinking it had gone out of adjustment. By the way, I found out the tensioner is pretty delicate; I dropped my old one, and it broke (the spring came out, and chipped off what looked to be bakelite inside the tensioner)...so don't do what I did with your new tensioner.
Also, it took awhile to get all the coolant back into the system...I had to fill the overflow bottle 2-3 times inbetween running the engine to get it to fill all the coolant galleys.
I'd do this procedure again (in another 78K miles?)...mostly it seems to be an exercise in patience...I liked it a lot, since it seemed to be much like a puzzle, one you shouldn't brute force. The patience comes when you're removing fasteners with limited clearance and counting/recounting marks on the belt/gears. I used the "bicycle chain" method of mounting the belt and it worked great. Leave plenty of time to do this job and it isn't too bad (especially considering the dollars saved in do-it-yourself labor).
The old belt looked OK to me, but the (plastic) pump impeller had a big chunk missing out of one part of it, so I'm glad I did it (was planning to do earlier this year but a familly problem prevented me from getting to it until now)
Thanks for the write up. Just finished mine.
Glad I replaced the water pump at the same time. It disintegrated as soon as I pulled it out. It also looks like it's been weeping for a long time.