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    Thread: 1.8t Wiring Harness Info

    1. 01-01-2006 04:31 AM #1
      What do I need to make this thing run? I'm OK with using a standalone system, as this is going into a 1960 beetle, so I don't have to worry about smogging it, but I'd like to get it up and running with the stock ECU. I don't have a car to reference, just the wiring harness, so I've got a lot of spaghetti to go through.

      This is what I've got so far:

      These are the plugs that go to the engine wiring harness. Are these all necessary, or can I just not use some of the plugs?

      Is this the upload port(I don't know what it's actual name) that tuners use for programming and things like that?

      This grey one doesn't seem too important, maybe cruise control? What's with the wound orange ones, they seem to go through the whole wiring harness.

      This is the one I KNOW I need, the DBW pedal, but the 2 green wires in this plug, I havn't followed them yet, anyone know what they are for?

      I have the gauge cluster and I'd like to make at least some of it work in the future, but for now I just want to get the motor running.

      Thanks a bunch, any info or advice would be greatly appreciated.

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    2. 01-01-2006 06:15 AM #2
      WOAH!!! Hold the phone!! Did you say 1960 Beetle??? Are you swapping in a 1.8T or are you trying to get Motronic to work on an aircooled engine?? If you are swapping... keep us posted. But if not.... then you are CRAZY!!! The carb and points system works well enough for those old VW motors. Sell that harness and cluster to someone with a MK2 or Corrado doing a 1.8T swap.

      -Nick-


    3. 01-01-2006 10:23 AM #3
      Power it up. and see if you can communicate with the ecu. see if the check engine light comes on. Where is your Immobilizer key sensor?
      SsTuNE.com
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    4. 01-01-2006 01:12 PM #4
      There are so many + points on the wiring harness I don't even know where to add power! I think your suggesting using the whole wiring harness in situ, but I'm beyond that right now. I could solder everthing back together, but I know I have to separate the parts I need from the complete harness anyway, so I went that direction.

      What does the immobilizer look like?

      It's possible that I have the plug for the immobilizer but don't have the immobilizer itself.

      I'm dealing with a barebones setup here, like a battery, a starter switch, an ECU and the MOTOR wiring harness, so I'm trying to find the lowest common denominator that will make it run.

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    5. 01-01-2006 01:15 PM #5
      Uh, Nick, I guess I'm totally gone then...

      http://www.germanlook.com/Foru...=4697

      This guy is certified nuts..

      http://www.germanlook.com/Foru...=6197

      Jason


      Modified by Volkdent2 at 5:50 PM 1-1-2006

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    6. 01-01-2006 02:58 PM #6
      bump
      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    7. 01-01-2006 03:14 PM #7
      Thats crazy, i dont know crap about the questions you ask, so free bump. Keep us up to date on this project!!

    8. 01-01-2006 05:11 PM #8
      OK, so you have it mounted transversly in the rear seat area? Wow. THIS looks cool. Do you have any kind of Bentley manual for the motor?

      My understanding of emissions laws in CA was that the NEWEST part, car or motor, had to meet the emissions required of it, which would mean you needing all the modern stuff that came with the motor. If so, ouch, sucks to be you. I hope I am wrong about that.

      My paper Bentley book has 150 pages just to cover the wiring diagrams and is in black and white making it harder to figure what the plugs are. I don't know what to say other than recommending getting a book or CD if you don't have one. If you do, lots of reading?


    9. 01-01-2006 09:10 PM #9
      Well you have a small problem. That engine WONT run without haveing the key that the ecu and cluster are prgrammed to. You cant see the immobilizer its senses the key via small wires that can be traced back to the cluster. I dont have my bentely manual installed right now. Do you have the key?
      SsTuNE.com
      C2motorsports Flash Dealer
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      http://www.youtube.com/audi4u
      395whp/325wtrq MKV Rabbit

    10. 01-02-2006 12:13 AM #10
      After spending a lovely afternoon with my Bentley manual, I've made some advances, but the immobilizer is still an issue. Apparently REVO can bypass that, I'm going to make some calls tomorrow.

      The main connector is the brown one. It has all the important stuff. The orange and orange/brown ones are part of the diagnositic port. Some of the stuff is ABS and cruise control, and this wiring harness seems to be from an automatic, so there's that crap too.

      As far as the motor/smog thing is concerned, I think a car this old is exempt completely, I think the cutoff is somewhere in the 70's right now. If you're right about it needing to pass smog, it won't be any harder than anyone else here to make it run, I'm using the cat and O2 sensors and all that, but I'm hoping nobody ever looks.

      I'm going to call some shops tomorrow to try and figure this out. Any recomendations on some great west coast shops?

      Jason


      Modified by Volkdent2 at 4:17 AM 1-2-2006

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    11. 01-02-2006 12:27 AM #11
      ----- As I kneel down and praise the Volkswagen Gods for bringing forth this..... I hail he who fuses finley crafted boosted 20V motors with that of the classic Dub..... Ok seroiusly.... thats HELLA COOL!! PLEASE, get that car running and get us some video... and forever you shall go down in Vortex history!!!

      -Nick-


    12. 01-02-2006 12:49 AM #12
      make me one too while you're at it! that's a sassy beast right there!

    13. 01-02-2006 02:05 AM #13
      Let me get mine done first, just to see if it actually works!!!

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    14. 01-02-2006 06:27 AM #14
      Yes revo can bypass that. That would be perfect. If you need a revo controller after you get the revo installed. then i have one i can sell you you cheap. Im me if your interested.

      As far as you harness i would tie all the power connecteors together and connect the negatives and grounds and see if you get a CEL. then you should be good to go.

      SsTuNE.com
      C2motorsports Flash Dealer
      audi4u@optonline.net
      http://www.youtube.com/audi4u
      395whp/325wtrq MKV Rabbit

    15. Member vrisk's Avatar
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      01-04-2006 01:02 AM #15
      All mk4s smell a bit like crayons/candles. All mk3s smell like hot plastic and crayons. All mk2s smell like water damage, and all mk1s smell like mold and electrical fires.
      It's a VW thing.

    16. 01-04-2006 01:20 AM #16
      It looks like trying to stick with the VW ECM is really just getting to be a bigger headache.

      I've made a call to 2Bennett adn he referred me to 034 EFI. I think this might be the way to go as they can use all the stock sensors and then I can add more control of the things I need, for example, at what degree the fans come on, how often the fuel pump is primed, all that.

      Anyone have any experiences with 034 Motorsport/EFI?

      Any other suggestions of excellent standalone stuff? And I don't mean in the MOTEC range here.

      Jason


      Modified by Volkdent2 at 1:28 AM 1-5-2006

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    17. 01-04-2006 01:30 AM #17
      no experience with 034, but i've heard many rave reviews about it. However, just to be fair and let you know, since you seem to be fairly electrically inclined, Megasquirt can do just about everything you need it to do with the addition of an "autotuning" feature called megatweak (something the 034 doesn't have i'm told). This rapidly speeds up the refinement of the base map to a useable map. And you can build the meqasquirt ecu for $250. To run the ignition you may need other components but it will most likely still come out cheaper to run an MS setup than 034, and MS is just as capable and reliable. However, if you don't mind paying more for the ability to plug and play than 034 is a good choice also, since i think they make plug in harnesses for swaps like yours. Just something to think about.

    18. 01-04-2006 01:38 AM #18
      Well, $250 is way less than the approx. $2200 I'm looking at! It will be about $1600 for the 034 EFI and then about $600 for the custom wiring harness. I don't know what standalones are going for, so $1600 doesn't sound to bad to me, but $600 for a wiring harness seems a little steep. I can make my own wiring harness if given the correct wire sequence.

      I had a great conversation with Javad over there, and what I really like about this setup has less to do with it and more to do with the customer service, and even though I'm not even an owner, he took a lot of time to help me understand what all the parameters are, and he's down in Fremont, about 1.6 hrs away, VS nobody near me. I'm going to need to tune this thing, and I like the idea that I can take it down there and have it gone over.

      I'm a TOTAL newb to this standalone thing, so any comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

      I also have a question about the QUALITY of the control of the MegaSquirt. They have bitrates or something like that. It's like the difference between the quality of CD and the quality of MP3, they both make music but one sounds way better because of the amount of information included. How does the MegaSquirt stack up against the 034 EFI?

      Jason


      Modified by Volkdent2 at 5:40 AM 1-4-2006


    19. Member Issam Abed's Avatar
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      01-04-2006 06:29 AM #19
      Quote, originally posted by Scarab_Beetle »
      And you can build the meqasquirt ecu for $250. To run the ignition you may need other components but it will most likely still come out cheaper to run an MS setup than 034

      Although Megasquirt is a good bang for buck system.In order to get it to run 4 COP's,4 Injectors (which it cant do sequentially),stock sensors,etc your looking @ more than $250US and about 3-4 separate dismantled boxes.Not an all in one box like 034/other SEM's out there.
      The reason 034's name is always coming up whenever SEM questions are asked is because the service is unbeatable.When you deal with 034,you dont deal with any middle men,dealers etc. ,you deal with 034 only.
      If you want to continue a MS vs 034 debate I am sure there is a thread knocking around here somewhere that is aching to be revived from the archives (such as this one)

      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »
      How does the MegaSquirt stack up against the 034 EFI?

      It doesnt.You get what you pay for.
      Looking forward to seeing this project running.Ask away and your questions will get answered

      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »

      I'm a TOTAL newb to this standalone thing, so any comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

      Since your installing a stock engine into the Bettle I suggest using the Stage Ic system($1100US retail) rather than the Stage IIc system ($1600uS).All it means is that you will either have to convert to 16V Plug wires or to 3-PIN AEB coils.There are a couple of 1.8T's running around on Stage Ic and they seem to be performing well.
      Do you really want to use that instrument cluster?

    20. 01-04-2006 06:52 AM #20
      I figure the best way is to do a search for Whatever systems you like. See what technical info is out there. Get a feel for the users to see if they can provied support if needed. I wont get into which is better. Dont forget you were going to pay $750 for a chip......lol
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    21. Geriatric Member need_a_VR6's Avatar
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      01-04-2006 10:05 AM #21
      Jason, I'm a pretty experienced Megasquirt user, if you have any questions let me know. Links below should help a bit:

      http://www.megasquirt.info
      http://www.msefi.com

      Again, Issam, you're spreading not so true info about the MS system. I have almost, if not all, 034 features built into an MS ECU here. It's still just ONE box, not three or four. 3 ignition outputs, PWM idle support, launch, tach out, switching tables, VR input, etc.

      -Paul
      1995 GTI VR6 - Retired - 12.90@106 R32 power - 12.833@106 12v power
      KPTuned - Official MegaSquirt: Sales - Repair - Installation - Tuning
      MK3 Race Car Partout

    22. 01-04-2006 12:07 PM #22
      Quote, originally posted by Wizard-of-OD »
      Although Megasquirt is a good bang for buck system.In order to get it to run 4 COP's,4 Injectors (which it cant do sequentially),stock sensors,etc your looking @ more than $250US and about 3-4 separate dismantled boxes.Not an all in one box like 034/other SEM's out there.
      The reason 034's name is always coming up whenever SEM questions are asked is because the service is unbeatable.When you deal with 034,you dont deal with any middle men,dealers etc. ,you deal with 034 only.
      If you want to continue a MS vs 034 debate I am sure there is a thread knocking around here somewhere that is aching to be revived from the archives (such as this one)


      It doesnt.You get what you pay for.
      Looking forward to seeing this project running.Ask away and your questions will get answered


      Since your installing a stock engine into the Bettle I suggest using the Stage Ic system($1100US retail) rather than the Stage IIc system ($1600uS).All it means is that you will either have to convert to 16V Plug wires or to 3-PIN AEB coils.There are a couple of 1.8T's running around on Stage Ic and they seem to be performing well.
      Do you really want to use that instrument cluster?


      well, i don't have experience with 034 so i won't say how MS stacks up to it, but just remember here that while I'm just trying to let you know about alternative options, Wizard here is trying to sell you something I would advise you extensively research both and come up with a conclusion for yourself as to which is more worth your time and money. http://www.megasquirt.info, and i believe their forums are http://www.diy-efi.org. The reason that megasquirt is cheap is because it is an open source, continually evolving system that isn't meant to make profit but to make it easy for anyone to get involved in SEM fuel injection. When you spend money on megasquirt, you spend money on parts, the knowledge on their forums and their software is free. While Wizard like to pull the old, "you get what you pay for", several of my friends use MS in non 1.8T applications, and none of them have EVER had a problem with reliability or setup in over a year of use. And yes, its batch-fire... question being who really cares? It works. The whole point of MS is to be simple, reliable, and easy to work with. But even though its too late i'll try not to turn this into an argument. I'm not in any way bashing 034, i'm sure its a great system and it has proven results. However, its only fair that you are informed of ALL of your options before you shell out over a grand on an 034 system if you can accomplish the same thing with an MS system. Check out the MS site and their forums for some information, ask around about all the systems you're interested in, and then make your choice.


    23. Member Issam Abed's Avatar
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      01-04-2006 04:17 PM #23
      Quote, originally posted by need_a_VR6 »

      Again, Issam, you're spreading not so true info about the MS system. I have almost, if not all, 034 features built into an MS ECU here. It's still just ONE box, not three or four. 3 ignition outputs, PWM idle support, launch, tach out, switching tables, VR input, etc.

      How is it not true Paul?
      If your MS system does all that the 034 system does then why doesnt it do Sequential Injection?Why does it still use a Ford EDIS (unless you developed something and I am still stuck in time) and finally what would be the price from you built and ready to go...

      Quote, originally posted by Scarab_Beetle »
      While Wizard like to pull the old, "you get what you pay for", .

      If the shoe fits...
      Quote, originally posted by Scarab_Beetle »

      several of my friends use MS in non 1.8T applications, and none of them have EVER had a problem with reliability or setup in over a year of use.

      So why arnt you running MS then?Your always asking questions in my 034 threads.If its reliable and easy to build then build one up for yourself...I dont do best friends cousins son.If read up on MS enough to know that there arnt any 1.8T's running on it as yet.
      Quote, originally posted by Scarab_Beetle »

      And yes, its batch-fire... question being who really cares? It works.

      I care,and so does everyone else out there.You guys make sequential injection out to be a bad thing when it isnt.

      Not trying to stuff 034 down the guys throad.Just raising valid points....


    24. 01-04-2006 04:39 PM #24
      Quote, originally posted by gtiboy66 »
      here is the wiring specs since the MK4 Golf Bently is tough to read.
      Its not 100% of wiring but more than enough to get the vehicle running and working.

      there are 5 plugs in the rain tray that connect the wiring.
      Brown Plug
      Pin #
      1. black/purple wire Fuel Pump Relay
      2. purple/white fuel pump relay
      3. red/black starter interlock relay
      4. red/green ignition for ECU
      5. blue/yellow power fuse 43
      6. yellow/black power for instruments fuse 34
      White Plug ( I did not use this plug had mosly dummy lights and vacuum vent valve switch)
      Pin#
      2. black wire goes to pin 19 on instruments
      3. white wire goes to pin 20 on instruments
      4. white/red wire clutch vacuum vent valvs switch
      Orange Plug
      Pin#
      1. grey/white goes to pin 5 on cluster
      3. red/black goes to back up lights ( I did not use this)
      6. blue/white speed sensor
      7. green/grey A/C
      8. Blue/red A/C
      9. Green/ Brown Goes to cluser
      Blue plug most wires meet up to DBW petal
      Pin
      7. Yellow/Brown Leak Detection pump
      9. Leak Detection pump
      I did not use this either.
      Black plug I did not use either it is for most accesories. Such as cruise control.

      The other plug you will need is a large 14 pin plug near the battery.
      I did not use all the wires but I did use most. I ran my own aftermarket fans so I do not have much wiring in there for them.
      Pin#
      1. green/blue oil pressure switch
      2. black/green power for speed sensor Fuse 7
      3. white/blue speed sensor.
      4. purple engine coolant temp sensor.
      5. red/purple power for fuel injectors fuse 32
      6. yellow/black power for engine control fuse 34
      7. brown ground
      8. black power computer fuse 29
      9. Brown/white MFA computer

      There you go good sir. Also you do not have to use Revo, Unitronic also makes an immo defeat which you will need unless you have a matching key, cluster and ECM.


    25. Geriatric Member need_a_VR6's Avatar
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      01-04-2006 06:03 PM #25
      Quote, originally posted by Wizard-of-OD »

      How is it not true Paul?
      If your MS system does all that the 034 system does then why doesnt it do Sequential Injection?Why does it still use a Ford EDIS (unless you developed something and I am still stuck in time) and finally what would be the price from you built and ready to go...

      It doesn't do seq injection because it doesn't have to for 95% of apps out there. No reason for a performance application, emissions/cold start/etc maybe valuable but not worth my time to figure out.

      My ECU isn't using EDIS at all, MS V3.0 built for a VR decoder off the stock 60-2, bench tested and working driving 3 ignition outputs for waste spark for a V6. All bench tested but will be installed shortly. It'll go up to 4 for COP if you use a AEB style cam trigger as well.

      If you're going to trash something for not having enough features, you should do more reasearch first.

      I have about $300 into the ECU parts itself, probably less. That's setup for a "hot" ignition output to drive coils directly. It'd be cheaper if I was using an external coil driver.

      -Paul
      1995 GTI VR6 - Retired - 12.90@106 R32 power - 12.833@106 12v power
      KPTuned - Official MegaSquirt: Sales - Repair - Installation - Tuning
      MK3 Race Car Partout

    26. Banned
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      01-04-2006 06:25 PM #26
      sequential injection is overrated


    27. 01-04-2006 09:26 PM #27
      I'd like to know what "batch fire" is, what the difference between sequential and non-sequential is.

      Here's the thing guys, a lot of people say, "oh, you don't really need that". For example, a guy is puttting a WRX motor in a bug, and he's asking about the turbo's water cooling system. One guy writes back "oh, you don't need that". That's retarded. Why would someone go through all the effort of designing something that wasn't really needed?

      I'm a little worried that there are some of those people posting here. I'm looking for a VERY reliable system to run my car. I don't want to have my head running hot, my timing advanced "just a little" too much. I want a powerful engine that will run reliably and propery whether it is cold and rainy outside or it's 110 degrees. I know the engineers that designed the stock ECM thought about those issues. I don't know if 034 EFI or MS did, but I'd like to choose the one that would run my engine in a similar way as a stock ECM, albeit with much higher output. I understand that asking for more power from an engine than it was designed for will decrease it's life, but I certainly don't want to run a EC system that will contribute to it failing prematurely.

      The whole reason I've gone to all the trouble of installing a 1.8t mid-engine in a crusty old bug is that I want reliable high horsepower, and I want it to be Volkswagen(I know, I know do a VR6, I still can, don't worry) So, if sequential is something that contributes to it's longevity, than I want it. If batch fire does the same thing EXACTLY, great. I just don't like cutting corners. This isn't about cost, I've spent $5k just on my front suspension alone. It's about the right product for the situation at hand.

      Mk3North mentioned Unitronic to replace the immobilizer. This is the first I've heard of it. How much is it? I have an 02J tranny, where does the wheelspeed sensor get input? How well will the stock ECM run when some of the inputs are missing? If the Unitronic piece is inexpensive, I can wire up the stock ECM to run for now. But if it's not cheap, then the standalones look better and better.

      If you are selling stuff, your really not an unbiased poster. If you can make unbiased true statements, then I'd like to hear.

      I had aircooled motors for years. Constantly fixing one thing or another. I want to install this motor, tune it up, and drive the bejesus out of it for as long as I want, and not have the ECM be part of the problem. Besides safety and emmissions, does the 034 and MS take into considerations the same sort of data the stock ECM does?

      You guys are awesome, I didn't expect to get such good feedback from so many sources, thank you.

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    28. 01-04-2006 09:37 PM #28
      "Since your installing a stock engine into the Bettle I suggest using the Stage Ic system($1100US retail) rather than the Stage IIc system ($1600uS).All it means is that you will either have to convert to 16V Plug wires or to 3-PIN AEB coils.There are a couple of 1.8T's running around on Stage Ic and they seem to be performing well."

      I'm not sure why installing a stock engine into a beetle figures into the decision making process. It also sounds like I'm giving up something by going back to AEB coils, as well, I'd have to buy the AEB coils when I already have AWW coils. What is gained with the IIc system over the Ic system?

      "Do you really want to use that instrument cluster?"

      Not any more. I was thinking it would be nice to have the error codes come up but it looks like running VW ECM would bring out more codes than the fourth of july.

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    29. 01-04-2006 09:43 PM #29
      "I'm not in any way bashing 034, i'm sure its a great system and it has proven results. However, its only fair that you are informed of ALL of your options before you shell out over a grand on an 034 system if you can accomplish the same thing with an MS system."

      The problem here is you can't compare the two either. I'm sure they are both great systems, but they may be apples and oranges, you can eat both, but they taste different.

      You said you can accomplish the same thing, which I presume is making the engine go brum brum, but do they really have the same quality of control of how the engine is functioning?

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    30. 01-04-2006 09:45 PM #30
      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »

      Mk3North mentioned Unitronic to replace the immobilizer. This is the first I've heard of it. How much is it? I have an 02J tranny, where does the wheelspeed sensor get input? How well will the stock ECM run when some of the inputs are missing? If the Unitronic piece is inexpensive, I can wire up the stock ECM to run for now. But if it's not cheap, then the standalones look better and better.

      Unitronic can also divorce other systems that you will not be using from the ECM such as airbags, ABS, ASR as well as the immo. I do not know the exact price, although I am assuming it would be competitive to the REvo one, so you are looking at approx $600 US for the chip and immo + whatever delete. My best advice would be to contact them, they are great with customer service.

      tel: 1.866.341.CHIP
      info@unitronic.ca


    31. 01-04-2006 09:49 PM #31
      This stuff is golden. gtiboy66 posted this to me a few days ago, but then the whole immobilizer issue came up. What I would love, even if I don't use the VW ECM, is for each of these points to be written for total idiots. Just clarify things then make it a sticky or something.

      For example "3. red/black starter interlock relay-needs to be connected to... or can by bypassed by..." I don't have a clutch valve vent switch for example, what do I do with that wire instead? Do MkIIs have these things? I have a total MkII/MkIII drivetrain, but I don't have any wiring coming from it.

      Jason

      Quote, originally posted by gtiboy66 »
      here is the wiring specs since the MK4 Golf Bently is tough to read.
      Its not 100% of wiring but more than enough to get the vehicle running and working.
      there are 5 plugs in the rain tray that connect the wiring.
      Brown Plug
      Pin #
      1. black/purple wire Fuel Pump Relay
      2. purple/white fuel pump relay
      3. red/black starter interlock relay
      4. red/green ignition for ECU
      5. blue/yellow power fuse 43
      6. yellow/black power for instruments fuse 34
      White Plug ( I did not use this plug had mosly dummy lights and vacuum vent valve switch)
      Pin#
      2. black wire goes to pin 19 on instruments
      3. white wire goes to pin 20 on instruments
      4. white/red wire clutch vacuum vent valvs switch
      Orange Plug
      Pin#
      1. grey/white goes to pin 5 on cluster
      3. red/black goes to back up lights ( I did not use this)
      6. blue/white speed sensor
      7. green/grey A/C
      8. Blue/red A/C
      9. Green/ Brown Goes to cluser
      Blue plug most wires meet up to DBW petal
      Pin
      7. Yellow/Brown Leak Detection pump
      9. Leak Detection pump
      I did not use this either.
      Black plug I did not use either it is for most accesories. Such as cruise control.

      The other plug you will need is a large 14 pin plug near the battery.
      I did not use all the wires but I did use most. I ran my own aftermarket fans so I do not have much wiring in there for them.
      Pin#
      1. green/blue oil pressure switch
      2. black/green power for speed sensor Fuse 7
      3. white/blue speed sensor.
      4. purple engine coolant temp sensor.
      5. red/purple power for fuel injectors fuse 32
      6. yellow/black power for engine control fuse 34
      7. brown ground
      8. black power computer fuse 29
      9. Brown/white MFA computer

      There you go good sir. Also you do not have to use Revo, Unitronic also makes an immo defeat which you will need unless you have a matching key, cluster and ECM.

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    32. Member Issam Abed's Avatar
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      91 Audi 80 2.0T
      01-04-2006 10:37 PM #32
      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »

      I'm not sure why installing a stock engine into a beetle figures into the decision making process. It also sounds like I'm giving up something by going back to AEB coils, as well, I'd have to buy the AEB coils when I already have AWW coils. What is gained with the IIc system over the Ic system?

      Well the major difference between the Stage Ic and IIc is the ability to run direct fire.Stage Ic only needs the block mounted VR sensor (hence can only do wasted spark) whereas the IIc needs both the VR sensor and the Hall Sensor (camshaft positioning sensor).With the IIc you are able to run your stock AW'X" coils and obtain an OEM look but I only suggested Stage Ic if you didnt care about that and wouldnt mind running plug wires.Stage IIc also has 8 GPO's (general purpose outputs) whereas Stage Ic only has 2.You can use GPO's to control :
      1. idle control valve
      2. boost control solenoid
      3. Radiator Fan
      4. Fuel pump
      5. etc..

    33. 01-04-2006 10:44 PM #33
      So as far as performance is concerned you think regular plug wires are as good as the coil pack ignition?

      I think I would use more than 2 GPOs. I want to run cooling fan, fuel pump, boost control solenoid, and a couple of other cooling fans to keep the engine bay cool in it's mid-engine configuration. I guess I'd rather have too many GPSs then not enough is my point.

      Though I want to get it running in it's stock form right now, (maybe 180hp? I know its AWW, but it should do what the AWP does right), but later I want to get this thing to a point where there aren't too many cars around, at least 2wd, that can keep up with it up to 120mph.

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

    34. Member Issam Abed's Avatar
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      91 Audi 80 2.0T
      01-04-2006 10:55 PM #34
      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »
      So as far as performance is concerned you think regular plug wires are as good as the coil pack ignition?:

      I think external coil packs and regular plug wires will do the job of COP's just fine.The reason I use Plug wires on my own 20V is because I read countless threads where these guys coimplain about COP failure.They are prone to failure so I just use a parts that are easily replaceable and do the job just fine.Granted the engine does not have coil packs but it does look somewhat OEM with this:
      (AGN 20V Valve cover)

      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »

      I think I would use more than 2 GPOs. I want to run cooling fan, fuel pump, boost control solenoid, and a couple of other cooling fans to keep the engine bay cool in it's mid-engine configuration. I guess I'd rather have too many GPSs then not enough is my point:

      Ok well your allready over 2 GPO's so that rules out Stage Ic.Guess the choice now is Stage IIc using your stock coils or spending more money and going with plug wires ,something I am sure you have no intention on doing.
      Quote, originally posted by Volkdent2 »

      Though I want to get it running in it's stock form right now, (maybe 180hp? I know its AWW, but it should do what the AWP does right), but later I want to get this thing to a point where there aren't too many cars around, at least 2wd, that can keep up with it up to 120mph.

      120mph?Easy tiger...my girlfriend use to have a 66' with a 1.8 engine.Every roundabout left a quirky feeling in my stomach after the ass would come out.Imagine what your going to do...

    35. 01-04-2006 11:00 PM #35
      Quote, originally posted by Wizard-of-OD »

      120mph?Easy tiger...my girlfriend use to have a 66' with a 1.8 engine.Every roundabout left a quirky feeling in my stomach after the ass would come out.Imagine what your going to do...

      That's what the mid-engine is for...

      and this

      Jason

      If I could just get paid for my sleepless nights....
      1960 VW Bug UBRDUB
      Walkaround
      1st Drag Run /
      Dyno Run
      Oval Ragster-'57 Rag/'04 Boxster S

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