How to retrofit a rear climate control panel (Was: Bud's Phaeton for sale)

[geoffrey_fake]

I am sure this isn't what you wanted to hear, but here it goes anyway: after retrofitting the rear panel, assuming everythings ok with it and the wiring, it will come alive as soon as you switch on the power the first time. You will need to code the climate control unit to enable correct operation of the panel (so that i can actually change ac settings, not only display them). BUT if you - by any chance - made a mistake in wiring the CAN BUS, this will also cause the panel to stay completely dark, even if you've got the power wired to it. This is my experience from my own retrofit about a year ago. I think it is unlikely you've got a dead panel - more likely has to do with the wiring. You're sure you got the right wires for the CAB BUS and do note you need to observe polarity of the bus wires!

Jouko

Hi Jikuisma

Well i did the wriring as discrebed here by Terry's Pin one in orange Green wire and Pin two in Orange and brwon wire.



i will see with the VCDS what it is about, I still waiting for the delivery from Ross-tech fedEx had a problem of delivery adress.. makes me mad waiting that long.

But well with luck maybe tomorrow

[geoffrey_fake]

Ok it works now and perfectly.

Was a litle wiring false contact.

I did not have the cable with the connector that connects to the Climate rear pannel, so what i did, i found a connector in my old PC ( computer ) the power connector for Floppy disks etc ( white connector with 4 cables ) i just cut it from my pc and it goes perfectly in the rear of the module.

Its a quite and easy solution, cut the power connector with the maximun cable you can have, then when you try in your climate rear module, be sure to put in the right way, there is only one way where the connectors goes inside the power connector.

in the pictures below, the face where you see P7 written on, its the side that is the most closed to the numbers (1234) in the rear of the pannel. you will see what i mean once you have both in hand.

[IMG][/IMG] [IMG][/IMG]

[wouterjansen60]

I used a 4 seat version in my 5 seater, actually it does not look bad!

[PanEuropean]

Photos re-hosted.

Michael

[geoffrey_fake]

Mine Retrofitted

[Gabs08PHTN]

A couple of questions for those who have already performed the rear panel retrofit:
Whad did you use to tap/splice into the can wires?
Did you disconnect both batteries?
I am a little bit concerned about cutting or splicing into the can wires to be honest.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[geoffrey_fake]

Gabriel

I did not cut anything concerning cables of the car.
I used a network cable CAT 5 ( 5 cables inside) like the ones you have everywhere ( like telephone cables)
Then I openned that network cable and extracted 2 cables enough long to go from the trunk to the air-co unit
In the trunk you need to connect that 2 cables to 2 existing CAN cables I just unpluged the socket and put each cable in the respective hole of the socket and put all back and it works.
close everything then pass the cables from trunk to the car interior put all back and connect that 2 cables to a power Flopy disk plug ( there's a picture here) , I did not have a plug from VW so I just found out that the Flopy disk power plug it goes well, and I connected all together put in the rear of the unit and it works.

I did not unplug any battery or whats ever.
I just didn't left the key in the car contact thats all. ( all off)

all works perfect.

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Geoffrey,
So you mean that I can connect the cables to any socket where there are orange/green and orange/brown can cables, don't you?
I have been having a look a the trunk of my car over the weekend and I noticed that I could possibly conect the cables either to the tow detection controle module which sits behid the drivers side battery, or to any of the modules that sit below the hatshelf. Actually, the tow control module is connected to the wiring loom that runs into the main convenience control module under the hatshelf.
By the way. how did you route the cable from the trunk to the rear seat? Did you have to disassemble the left side cover of the trunk?
Thanks in advance.

Gabriel

[geoffrey_fake]

Gabriel

You need to access the panel in the trunk just above the rear window


You should ask Thierry to host his pictures; it shows clearly what to do

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi all,
I have just finished running all the wiring needed for the rear control panel to work.
As advised on previous posts, I used a twisted pair that I removed from a 5m long cat5 ethernet cable.
It was much easier than what I was actually expecting and I did not need to remove the rear seat at all. All in all, it took me about three solid hours!!!
I connected the power wires to the rear cigarrete lighter and the CAN BUS wires to the parking aid control unit. Perhaps it was the trickiest part since I disassembled the socket where the CAN wires were, removed the CAN wire connectors and inserted the rear AC panel CAN wires into those connectors. Then I put the connectors back in place, reasembled the socket and plugged it back.
In order to run the rear AC panel CAN wires from the boot to the rear seat I had to remove the driver's side cover panel of the boot. To do so, first I had to remove the center rear trim, the upper left corner trim and to lower the tray that holds the control units.
At that point, I could gain access to the thick wire loom that runs by the rear seat. What I did then was to slide an 6mm piece of flexible plastic tubing through the orifice through which the wire loom run. Then at the rear seat I forced my hand between the door trim and the side of the seat in order to grab that piece of tubing.
Once I grabbed it I attached the rear AC panel CAN wires to the other end of the tubing and pulled it gently. Once the CAN wires were at sight, I routed them below the rear seat (there was no need to lift it at all) towards the transmission tunnel.
Then, I routed a long tie-wrap from the rear of the center console towards the rear seat. I had to push one of my hands hard below the center portion of the rear seat in order to get hold of the tie-wrap end, which I managed, with quite a lot of effort truth be told, to route in between the transmission tunnel carpet and the rear seat.
At that point, the only thing I had to do, was to tie the CAN wires to the tie-wrap and start pulling gently the opposite end of the tie-wrap. This way I managed to get the CAN wires to the center console.
Subsequently I connected the power wires and the CAN wires to the yellow VW repair wires, inserted the connectors into the socket and assembled the socket.
So, now I am looking forward to receive my rear AC control panel, which I purchased to a German seller. Once I get it, I will assemble it and I will pop into my friends place (he's got the VAGCOM stuff) to have the J523 coded. And if no further issues arise, the beer is on me!
Cheers.

Gabriel

[geoffrey_fake]

Gabriel

Its really cool taht you managed to do the bigest part of the work

Installing the AC unit its only a few seconds.

In some Phaetons you don't need to Code via Vag-com
I had to do it unfortunately but very easy .

Hope to see some pictures soon

Cheers

Geoffrey

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Geoffrey,
Yes all the tough work is finished. It is quite likely that tomorrow I receive the rear AC panel and I am looking forward to have it installed. And I also hope that the connection I made onto the parking aid control unit works.
By the way, where specifically did you make the CAN connection?
I guess that I will have to code the front information display as it is currently coded 0400427 and I will have to change the second digit to 5.
I will keep you updated!

Gabriel

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi all,
As I mentioned on my previous post, this morning I received the rear AC control panel. I have just installed it and it works beautifully.
Besides, I did not have to code the J523 unit. As soon as I plugged the panel, turned on the ignition and off it went, all the buttons were ready for use.
Now I wonder why coding is a must in some cars, whereas it is not in some others. Would it have something to do with the cotrol head software? Mine features release 2257.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[vinyin]

Congrats that it worked!
Could you please post pictures of the wiring you did? I'm especially interested in the part of plugging in to the canbus of the car.

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi,
Well, although it seemed that the rear AC control panel was up and running I had to code the J523 unit as I was getting a series of faults after performing a VCDS scan. All related to the retrofit of the new module.
I had to recode the gateway, controller 19, with the original code in order to have it refreshed and accept the new control module.
After coding, erasing all the faults and doublechecking that every single bit involved in the installation of the rear AC control panel was sound I was still getting the following:

Address 28: HVAC, Rear Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 158 F
Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0117
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000

1 Fault Found
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533)
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation

I wonder if it might have something to do with the CAN TP 20 protocol that my Phaeton features, since the rear AC control unit comes from a 2003 Phaeton which used the CAN TP 16 protocol.
Could someone give me some insight into this fault and possible ways to sort it out?
Any ideas and suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[Paximus]

The 3-seat rear HVAC display is 3D0 919 158F for MY2003 and 3D0 919 158H for MY2008. But that could refer to some incidental production change.

The scan fault line seems to be saying that the J533 Combi Instrument can't get a response when asking the 'new' HVAC display what its adaptation settings are. As you suggest, maybe it's asking the question in the wrong language, because it now knows the 'new' device exists but doesn't get a reply.

Or maybe there's some adaptation possible for the 'new' display or the combi instrument.

Chris

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Chris,
I am planning to give it a go this late afternoon. As you mentioned, I was planning to have a look at the adaptation of the rear AC panel and see what comes out of it.
I believe that the gateway and the rear ac control panel are speaking the same language most of the time, since the control panel itself work flawlessly.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[jkuisma]

Hi all!

The 3-seat rear HVAC display is 3D0 919 158F for MY2003 and 3D0 919 158H for MY2008. But that could refer to some incidental production change.

The appearance of the panel has been changed (at least) twice. First, the tone of the gray plastic has been changed to a lighter tone (circa 2007). Then, together with the facelift in 2010, the background lighting of the panel changed from light gray to inverted: i.e. black background with bright lettering. Electrical changes? Dunno.

The scan fault line seems to be saying that the J533 Combi Instrument can't get a response when asking the 'new' HVAC display what its adaptation settings are. As you suggest, maybe it's asking

There's an important change made to the J533 gateway as a part of the "CAN BUS refresh" made for MY2008 cars. The new gateway supports the so-called "long coding" and the installed controller list can be edited via adaptation. This was not the case with the "old" (2002-2007) CAN gateway. You simply re-coded zero to trigger automatic recognition of existing controllers. See this thread on how to edit the "installed controllers" list of the newer gateway! I think this is the reason for the error you are seeing. It probably won't affect the functionality of the panel in any way, as it only communicates with the ZAB unit and they are on the same bus - do not need the gateway to carry over any messages from convenience-CAN to other buses.

Or maybe there's some adaptation possible for the 'new' display or the combi instrument.

As far as I know, there is nothing to be adapted in the rear AC panel. It is "plug and play".

Jouko

[Gabs08PHTN]

There you are:














Gabriel.

[geoffrey_fake]

Gabriel

can you adjust the TC seating for people behind from the J523 ?

normally you should be able to do it.

Cheers

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Geoffrey,
Yes. All the controls are fully operative from the rear ac control panel and all the changes or adjustments done on the front control panel are displayed on the rear ac control screen accordingly.
The only thing is that I got a fault related to the communication between the gateway and thre rear ac control panel. I am still on the process of sorting it out.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[M1LUM]

So proud of all you boys !

[geoffrey_fake]

Gabs08PHTN
I have also a error but doesn't affect the functions of the rear panel and J523, as i understood after thousands testes... that error its only the lights of that module.

means, if you remove the contact key, switch ON the lights manually and go out of the car and close the car with the remote, all lights inside will be on, but not the ones in the rear module.

However, if you put the key in the contact all works perfect. ( lights boutons etc)

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Geoff,
That sounds interesting. I will give it a go and report back.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[Gabs08PHTN]

Geoff,
Yeap, that is right. I have the same issues with the ilumination of the rear AC panel.
By the way, what VCDS scan error do you get?

Gabriel

[jkuisma]

Yeap, that is right. I have the same issues with the ilumination of the rear AC panel.

Where are you getting the power for the rear panel from? The +12V at the rear cigarette lighter is cut out when you lock the doors, I believe. It stays on for some time if you leave the key in the ignition lock.

Jouko

[Gabs08PHTN]

Jouko,
You are right. I have just checked it at the fuse box located above drivers footwell and the fuse for the rear console power outlet does not get any power neither with the the key on the ignition, nor with the key on position 1. It receives some juice with the ignition on position 2.
Checking the wiring diagram for the rear AC panel I realized that the rear AC control module is connected to the same fuse as the clock, that is fuse 31. And fuse 31 is powered all the time, I checked it too.
So I guess that all of us who have installed the rear AC control panel ought to wire it up to fuse 31, rather than to the rear power outlet.
IMPORTANT TIP: While checking the fuses, I noticed that fuse location 32 is free and it is powered all the time, so alternatively I think that we could route the wiring to that fuse.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi all,
I had some spare time this afternoon, so I run a wire from fuse space 32 towards the rear AC control module. So now all the lights come on as they are supposed to do.
The work was fairly easy. I routed the wire from the rear AC panel towards the fuse box first behind the center console side pannel, then above the footwell upper cover and then onto the front of the fuse box. (This was the trickiest part as the wire had to come through a small gap between the fuse box and the steering column) Then I crimped that end of the wire to a small flat male terminal and connected it to number 32 female terminal in the fuse box. At the other end, prior the rear AC console connector, I installed a 5amp fuse.
This is a preliminary set up, as I just wanted to check if everything worked as desired. In any case I am planning to route the wire towards the rear of the fuse box in order to have a proper installation.
Pictures coming soon!
Cheers.

Gabriel

[geoffrey_fake]

Hi all,
I had some spare time this afternoon, so I run a wire from fuse space 32 towards the rear AC control module. So now all the lights come on as they are supposed to do.
The work was fairly easy. I routed the wire from the rear AC panel towards the fuse box first behind the center console side pannel, then above the footwell upper cover and then onto the front of the fuse box. (This was the trickiest part as the wire had to come through a small gap between the fuse box and the steering column) Then I crimped that end of the wire to a small flat male terminal and connected it to number 32 female terminal in the fuse box. At the other end, prior the rear AC console connector, I installed a 5amp fuse.
This is a preliminary set up, as I just wanted to check if everything worked as desired. In any case I am planning to route the wire towards the rear of the fuse box in order to have a proper installation.
Pictures coming soon!
Cheers.

Gabriel

Its good to know all that, however, I have eated seats behind, so the ligthts of that butons works perfect, maybe I should connect the module to that swicth and test...

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi,
As promissed here it is the picture of the preliminary wiring to fuse 32.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[PanEuropean]

Hi Gabriel:

In the picture above, it looks like you have just picked up current from the hot bus bar at the fuse 32 position.

Have you considered perhaps running your red wire into the back of the fuse panel, attaching it to the lower side of the fuse 32 position, then stuffing a fuse into the fuse 32 position to protect the circuit? My concern is that even if you have put an in-line fuse somewhere downstream on the red wire, the circuit is not fully protected because you have a permanently hot wire (the red wire) from the fuse panel to the point where you have located an in-line fuse.

It's actually not all that difficult to get access to the back of the fuse panel, and you can use a VW repair wire to plug into the protected side of the fuse 32 position, then splice that onto your red wire.

Michael

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hi Michael,
Many thanks for your wise words.
Yes, I thought about it, it is a matter of finding some spare time to do it . I planned to do it last weekend but it was pouring with rain all the time. And now with storage room that take the set of summer tires plus the set of winter tires that I want to sell and the mortorbike I do not have much room left inside my garage.
As soon as I have completed the project, I will post some pics illustrating the procedure.
Cheers.

Gabriel

[Gabs08PHTN]

Hello everybody,
I have been sourcing the parts that I need for the proper installation of the power wire to the rear AC panel and I came across the following part number 000 979 133 for the repair wire plus connector that I would have to fit into the fuse box.
I would very much appreciate if someone could confirm it.
Thanks in advance!

Gabriel

[Paximus]

Hi Gabriel,

000 979 133 is replaced with colour E (000 979 133E) and is "1 set of single wires each with 2 contacts in bag of 5 'order qty. 5'

Whatever that means...

Chris

[Gabs08PHTN]

Thanks for the info Chris,
I think that what they mean is that these repair cables are sold in sets of five units, they feature connectors on both ends, and therefore the minimum order quantity is five.
That sounds good to me, as I was actually planning to purchase a set of male and female four pin connector housings, four female and four male repair wires, so that I can connect four repair wires to empty fuse locations, use one of them for the rear AC panel and use the remaining three as spares just in case I wanted to retrofit any other devices. This way I will not have to disassemble the fuse box cover each time.

Gabriel