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    Thread: Eaton guys represent...

    1. 03-30-2006 01:13 PM #26
      Quote, originally posted by Peter Tong »
      I'd love to see some Eaton dyno runs... so far though no one has posted up Post em up Eaton folks! I'm sure there are boatloads of folks that would be interested... perhaps we can pool some cash to help one of these guys dyno...

      what he said, of the two guys that i mentioned, both had dyno runs but never posted the actual charts, and those are the only two pg eaton conversions that have shared dyno info at all in the past 7 or so years ive been lurkin' on the tex

    2. 03-30-2006 01:52 PM #27
      WE just got a dyno in our province so now i only have to drive 3 hours to get to it
      i will post up the results in the summer right after i run [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]

    3. Member mej3's Avatar
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      03-30-2006 02:08 PM #28
      I'll take the challenge, one of the reasons we dont dyno the werewolf is the lack of dyno funds! (a slip of paper and bragging rights doesnt mean a whole lot) but in the name of SCIENCE and Economy! I say Spin those rollers!

    4. 03-30-2006 02:38 PM #29
      Rennen has a pretty good deal $75 for two back to back runs, and they're in Portland, ME

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      03-30-2006 02:38 PM #30
      Glen,
      How much would it cost for a few runs on your local dynojet? Lysholm's right... I've been on here since '99 or so and haven't run across an Eaton dyno either... they seem to be as rare or rarer than hen's teeth... perhaps we can rustle up some funds...
      Peter T

    6. 03-30-2006 02:51 PM #31
      Would be nice to see all 4, 5.... no 6 types of FI (G60, eaton, lysholm, turbo, centrifugal [rotrex or vortech], and of course twincharged ) dynos laid over eachother to visually see their strengths and weaknesses. Damn, I think there are more options for this old 8V than for the mustang, or honda guys have, LOL.
      OF course, we'll represent the twincharged sect, though this particular eaton is waaay underdriven. The dyno will probably look as if there was bigger motor spinning up the turbo a bit earlier than before. At one point, we'll experiment with smaller pullies to get more significant pressure out of the eaton and see what the net effect is. No matter the pulley size, being able to up the boost even more with the turbo is waaay cool .
      Meanwhile, the bare metal parts have been painted. Here's another pic.

    7. 03-30-2006 03:07 PM #32
      People with Lysholm will feel better about their $2500 lysholm, after they see an eaton dyno from a $250 eaton setup LOL
      By the way ... $250 eaton is 10 times cheaper than $2500 lysholm and as much as strong as a Lysholm and can push enought pressure, and also you can decide which to go : M45, M62, M64, M90, M112 .. you have the choice

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      03-30-2006 03:20 PM #33
      Quote, originally posted by jwatts »
      Would be nice to see all 4, 5.... no 6 types of FI (G60, eaton, lysholm, turbo, centrifugal [rotrex or vortech], and of course twincharged ) dynos laid over eachother to visually see their strengths and weaknesses. Damn, I think there are more options for this old 8V than for the mustang, or honda guys have, LOL.

      I think this is a great idea... got to have an Eaton dyno first though

    9. 03-30-2006 04:18 PM #34
      Quote, originally posted by DAMACGON »
      People with Lysholm will feel better about their $2500 lysholm, after they see an eaton dyno from a $250 eaton setup LOL
      By the way ... $250 eaton is 10 times cheaper than $2500 lysholm and as much as strong as a Lysholm and can push enought pressure, and also you can decide which to go : M45, M62, M64, M90, M112 .. you have the choice

      i've said it a thousand times, of the many eaton claims over the years there has never been a single shred of dyno data ever posted on the tex...and there have been plenty of conversions

    10. 03-30-2006 04:30 PM #35
      All of the different types have their shortcomings... even the lysholm. Some show in power curves, whether it's lack of top end, bottom end, etc... some are noisy, some are known to be more delicate than others, etc. Everything is compromise, so if it bolts on and you don't like it... unbolt and trade for another option. We have a lot .

    11. 03-30-2006 06:27 PM #36
      Iceman's 2.0 ABA will be getting this Big bad mama jamma with two pully sizes (normal 1bar and 1.7bar). Not sure if he's doing turbo as well. probably won't need it with the big 2.0 to fill up lol. keep in mind like the g60 you can PORT these buggers. You can make them better with rotor options. so there's alot of unknowns that will be answered as people explore these options.


    12. 03-31-2006 10:33 AM #37
      Quote, originally posted by jwatts »
      All of the different types have their shortcomings... even the lysholm. Some show in power curves, whether it's lack of top end, bottom end, etc... some are noisy, some are known to be more delicate than others, etc. Everything is compromise, so if it bolts on and you don't like it... unbolt and trade for another option. We have a lot .

      the inability for the traditional eaton to effectively pump at over 10psi, which cannot be overcome w/ a bigger eaton, that on this motor a healthy underdriven g60 can effectively and efficiently push 15-17psi, makes the eaton a performance downgrade as a standalone, i applaud you and Sam for all the digi I work, and the twin charger setup is a good solution...that being said, I want the noobs, as well as anyone going the eaton route to understand that as a single charger replacement, the eaton is good on the wallet but the consequence is lower performance after you hit the 10psi wall, this fact makes the eaton a poor choice. No porting, displacement increases, or anything else will make this charger anything else but the worst choice for this application, a fact that has been absolutely beaten to death over the years on this forum
      Those who have been since the late 90's may recall that BBM scrapped their original plans to use the eaton due to the fact that they couldn't get the performance of a gladder...sorry dudes, but for this application this charger is the suck

      Modified by Lysholm at 7:34 AM 3-31-2006


      Modified by Lysholm at 7:35 AM 3-31-2006

    13. 03-31-2006 12:23 PM #38
      well, horsepower aside, it can produce torque in spades. Also, it is probably the most rugged design as well as probably being the most efficient when being bypassed in the normal G60 position (since there is no internal compression, and no seals draging on the casing). Then again, that probably depends on how much air it is trying to force through the bypass, which would be based on charger size and rpm, heheh.
      The ruggedness comes from a rigid case casting and the degree of looseness that the rotor-to-case clearance can be run while still pumping air.
      It may not be the perfect choice for a high hp, 1bar+ boost application, but I wouldn't call it the dead nutz wrong choice. The G-Lader is a tough cookie to replace, but drive an 8:1 8V for a while and yes, anything is better than that boostless torture.

    14. 03-31-2006 12:44 PM #39

      hay dude its not a war i think we all can agree eaton << G60 << Lysholm on power. That has never been the debate or argument. never.
      Sure i find it odd theres no eaton dyno's i'll pay for the first dyno session in atlanta whoever brings it, the hour is on me.
      Sure i find it odd that lysholm owners are the only ones harping on the subject.
      take it e-z man. it's all good we're all one happy family.
      i certainly am not interested in selling Eaton kits. I am not invading anyones territory so back off.
      I will be open minded and give everyone a shot once at least. And that is a good thing.
      next up : ROTREX represent. Someone find me one of those buggers to strap on.
      peas and corn [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] world peas n all that jazz

    15. 03-31-2006 04:09 PM #40
      Quote, originally posted by Lysholm &raquo;
      ....
      Those who have been since the late 90's may recall that BBM scrapped their original plans to use the eaton due to the fact that they couldn't get the performance of a gladder...sorry dudes, but for this application this charger is the suck

      I understand you've got a Lysholm a you are happy with it ( too much money .. ) but your statement is not true, Eaton charger is great aplicacion, so don'y shoot so high, maybe an Eaton fires you up
      But anyway, we are talking about a 250$ Charger which can produces enought boost and also push much more aire inside than others.

    16. 03-31-2006 04:21 PM #41
      Quote, originally posted by mrkrad &raquo;
      next up : ROTREX represent.
      If you have $3500 Thats how much the conversion kit is

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      03-31-2006 05:37 PM #42
      Quote, originally posted by mrkrad &raquo;
      hay dude its not a war i think we all can agree eaton << G60 << Lysholm on power. That has never been the debate or argument. never.
      Sure i find it odd theres no eaton dyno's i'll pay for the first dyno session in atlanta whoever brings it, the hour is on me.

      Wow Sam... thats pretty generous
      My props to jwatts, G60Scuzz, Guillem, kompressorRaddo, and mej3 for actually doing something with an Eaton instead of talking so much about it [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] Now we only need to find out what the results are... Anyone close enough to Sam to take up his offer?
      Iceman?

    18. 03-31-2006 06:14 PM #43
      give me 4 months, and I'll have a dyno of an eaton setup for you all to see...........

    19. 03-31-2006 08:00 PM #44
      Iceman can pay for his own damned dyno, LOL

    20. 03-31-2006 11:36 PM #45
      tell y'all what...
      i'm gonna (hopefully) get the tranny back in my corrado this weekend.. friggin axles unbolting.. gggrrrr
      i will get the pig inspected, and pop my m90 back on.. hopefully with some boost leaks fixed.. and get 'er dyno'd.
      i'll even post up the charts...
      approx cost on my conversion was $800 all said & told.. that was including a new IC, piping, charger, and paying a friend for his trouble to weld it up for me. does it outperform my g60? yeah, i feel it does... maybe that was due to the 3 months spent NA.. but, i can also boost 15-18 psi on this.. all.. day... long... spinning the charger @ revs the G60 would get VERY pissed at.. very quickly.. oh.. and it's rugged as all heck.. i've already sucked weld spatter through it, and repaired it to new.. lets see a G60, or for that matter, lysholm.. take that abuse, and still come back kickin
      -nate

    21. 04-01-2006 10:21 AM #46
      with two eaton guys next door to me sounds like it may be time to plan for a group dyno at Rennen, i would really like to get the slc on the rollers after i get it back together and i'm sure i could get three or more guys from our area

    22. 04-01-2006 11:37 AM #47
      i hate to be a dink, but.. i'm not a fan of rennen.. perhaps it was my first meet with some of their customers, but when i watch an older guy get an award for having done a BEAUTIFUL restoration on a beetle, and i then listen to a crowd of guys sporting rennen badges, make fun of him for it.. makes it so i won't be giving the shop that turned them out, any of my business....
      however, i can always hope that the owners/operators are not the same, so @ some point, i'm sure i'll go down.

    23. 04-01-2006 06:28 PM #48
      there's also podium performance, the mobile truck, if you/we attend any of the local road course events at NHIS, Hanscom etc., he's at those periodically, i used to see him at COM club and PCA Northeast events alot, [IMG]http://**********************/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]
      i wasn't aware of any attitude issues at Rennen, but that is pretty crappy

    24. 04-01-2006 08:33 PM #49
      Quote, originally posted by Lysholm &raquo;
      i wasn't aware of any attitude issues at Rennen, but that is pretty crappy

      i think it was customers, not workers... and i hate to use the term but.. "typical mkIV owners" was the feeling i got.. and since there was a plethora of rennen banners slathered on their cars, shirts, hats... i was left with a nasty taste in my mouth..
      oh well.. i'll visit someday.. when i feel like paying for the fuel for my hungry corrado to drive the 2 hours to portland..
      -nate

    25. 04-02-2006 12:03 AM #50
      i'm sorry Sam i'm not trying to pick on you, and i think Peter is being rather pleasant...i'm generally the agressive one...which leads me to story time...
      I think the reason i am so crabby about the subject is due in part to the fact that back when g60's were still relatively new, and $ less important than going faster, the eaton was repeatedly proven to not produce, i was actually dealing w/ Magnuson Products and considering an M45 back in the late 90's. I did a lot of back and forth tech w/ them, and ultimately they steered me to G60Performance(which is now BBM), i had already had my heart set on a twin screw but at the time was unaware that Whipple was in fact Lysholm principle, and didn't think that i could get an autorotor this side of the Atlantic. After a good chunk of time on the phone w/ Betz...and after he finally believed that i did not work for Eaton/Magnuson...he informed me that they had dropped the eaton in favor of the newly imported opcon that Kenne Belle had just become stateside distributor for...the reason given at that time was that the eaton couldn't even come close to matching the g60 once pushed above 10psi
      fast forward a few years, more and more g60's are in bad repair and chargers are becoming paper weights and door stops at an greatly accelerated rate, Smaller companies like Motortechnik, HSM, ORZ, KK, and BBM are now performing repairs to chargers previously thought unrebuildible by the original stateside rebuilder, New Dimensions, who had been trained by VW sanctioned, and now defunct, TEC of Germany...colorful ND trivia is that only 2-3 GT1 modded chargers ever came out of New Dimensions, and all failed under warranty...more interesting is that ND also produced another version of the Failed Rimmer Engineering style Eaton kit also based on the M45 that was marketed as a non upgradeable replacement for stock g60 power. Oliver (ORZ) had a replacement kit in the works based on the European M63?(may have been a metric conversion) charger, but it was squashed when Magnusun, in their infinite wisdom, decided that because they had never heard of the M63, that no such charger was ever produced by eaton.
      ...in the midst of all this, several enthusiasts w/ delusions of grandeur, Joezx6 comes to mind, produced some very nicely engineered replacements, again mostly based on the M45, although most of these kits(along w/ their creators) simply vanished from the Vortex all together, or stopped responding/posting in g60 land, usually immediately and mysteriously after alleged dyno testing
      so yeah, i may be a raving lunatic when it comes to this topic, but it is certainly not because i'm some ignorant jingoistic Lysholm owner, i was open-minded for the first or second time around, but now i'm just fed up w/ Eaton Drive-byes that leave dozens of g60s wounded and go absolutely nowhere,

      Modified by Lysholm at 9:08 PM 4-1-2006

      Modified by Lysholm at 9:09 PM 4-1-2006

      Modified by Lysholm at 9:11 PM 4-1-2006


      Modified by Lysholm at 9:18 PM 4-1-2006

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