Interesting thread. Good luck with the final steps.
I thought I'd throw this together as I'm just about done...but due to Murphy's law something is bound to go wrong.
So, much like my Turbo thread please throw in your $.02 and help if you can.
(I'll update this list as I remember items I used)
** basic sockets/hand tools (30mm for axle/driveshaft hub bolts)
** angle grinder
** 12mm X 1.50 die for threading the shifter rod if you want to keep your exising mk3 golf ball shifter. Note: The mk4's don't use a thread, it seems they use some other mechanism - you'll see when you get your shifter box and cables.
** welder (I had someone do it - more info will be below)
** engine hoist
** triple square socket (for driveshaft to tranny bolts)
** 4 jackstands (or a lift)
** extra jack
** drill and drill bit for drilling through metal (shifter box)
** an accurate laser measure (measuring for custom-length axles) - or you can trust my measuring which would be specific to my car and the way my motor sits in the engine bay with the re-located motor mount.
Equipment purchased for swap:
(I'll update this list as I remember what else I bought)
** 02m 6speed Tranny, flywheel, clutch, starter, shifter box & cables off of ANY 24v VR6 model car (one example is 2003 Jetta GLi, but I believe 2002 had a GTi version with 24v's).
Disclaimer: be very careful when ordering parts at the dealership - make sure it shows the 6sp transmission on his ETKA. While I'm unsure exactly which car had the 24v o2m combo I DO KNOW that the 2003 Jetta GLi did. Be careful again, I believe in '04 it went to the 1.8t motor.
** 24V VR6 Tstat housing (this is because the 12v housing actually interferes with the transmission when you shift)
** 24V Tstat housing bolts. This housing is longer than the 12v so even the long bolts from the mk3 version won't work.
** 24v upper and lower radiator hoses...b/c the oem hoses have too many 'kinks' in them due to the different angles of the new tstat housing outlets (pointing in different directions now)
** Don't forget to order new axle nuts for your axles (on the spline where the hub is) b/c I'm pretty sure they are one-time-use only.
** Custom-made trans mount (I'll talk more about this later, there are a couple ways to go about securing the trans to the subframe)
** "Modified" existing front mount (let this be your last worry as it's not that complicated)
** Custom axles (some have cut down 02m axles but they aren't cheap to buy and then customize)
** 24V 02m slave cylinder line (you can't just connect your existing slave line to the o2m. This needs to be modified.
** Flywheel-to-crank and clutch bolts (24v vr6 o2m)
** Don't forget to get the harness/plugs for trans speed sensor and reverse light (b/c your mk3 12v vr6 plugs don't match up).
My "Method" of swap (some things can be done differently if you use your imagination.
The trans bolts right up to the 12v vr6 motor. Before you do this, you'll need to remove the old flywheel/clutch assembly (of course) and re-install with new dealer-sourced bolts. Once torqued down you can install the transmission.
I did it by pulling the motor out entirely. And I'd suggest you do it also if you plan on moving the transmission mount. And even if you make your own mount you'll probably need that room anyway.
That is your biggest hurdle (besides the driveshafts), getting the rear mount situation "fixed". Once you've done that you can put the motor back in.
while the motor is out I pulled the exhaust to allow myself room to get the stock shifter box out. Use your Bentley here and you'll figure out how that comes out...it's fairly straight-forward yet a pain at the same time (bolts up top in the pass compartment and also underneith).
Once the old box was out I test-fitted the new one. Problem is, no bolt holes match up. This is where your mechanical and creative proficiency come in...find a way to mount your box (like that?)
Once that is done you can put the motor back in (if you do it with the motor out of course).
Once your motor is back in all you are doing is swapping some sensor plugs on the trans, hooking up the coolant hoses, swapping the starters and grounds, etc...
Oh, one last thing....you can now install the axles. I made it easier by unbolting the ball joint to allow movement of the control arm to get the new ones in. You can do it any way you want - there may be an easier way to do any of this, I'm just documenting what I've done.
Ok, now for the specifics (with pics and in no particular order) :
Here's why I went this route anyway:
I somehow broke my bolt kit on the peloquin and it spewed out silver paint.
I wanted a beefier trans that had oem parts availability. What I've heard from some reliable sources is that the O2m (in stock form) has been able to hold well over 450-500whp/trq on AWD cars. EIP's R32 held up to a bit more than that for a long time - and that is with traction. So I figured it was a good choice.
The 02m Shifter box/cables:
And of course the o2m/clutch/starter:
The slave cylinder line (you can only get the "round thing" in my left hand by ordering the entire line - and no, it's not listed as a slave cylinder):
That connector b/w my thumb and left index finger plugs into the slave cylinder assembly (which *should* be on the trans when you buy it). You can see it on the picture below...it's hard to see, but is right above the starter and has a yellow cap on the end (that yellow cap was put in there to keep fluid from seeping out during shipment).
Here is the trans mount that I sourced from dutchdub.com:
Here's the link: (Updated June 2008) and scroll about half-way down to see more pics.
The problem with this mount is it's not PERFECT. I think that's because it's meant for an AWD (ie. R32 tranny) conversion. It gets you close but not quite. if you use this mount you MUST cut off and re-locate your "cup" that sits on the rear subframe
Here's how I did it...
I cut it out:
And attached it to the transmission mount that I got from dutchdub:
By doing this, I can simply put the motor back in the car, bolt down the other two mounts and see where the cup "sits".
That's when I called the welder and had him stick weld it in one small spot (just to keep the mount there when I pulled the motor again).
This way you get the perfect fit.
I then pulled the motor and allowed him to get about 85% of the mounts' circumference welded (factory design had less then that maybe for drainage? So I didn't stress when he couldn't get all the way around it).
Here's what we ended up with:
Here's what I did to mount the o2m shifter box in the car...
It's hard to see, but there is one bolt that I drilled through the middle of the shift box and also through the bottom of the car. It's on the part of the shifter b/w the shifter and radio area (behind the stick shift).
The other two washers are going to take bolts that go into existing threads in the box itself. I put rubber washers in it to keep vibration down.
As you can see in the above pic I just cut a piece of angle iron and drilled holes through it to make a steady fasten. Time will tell if this will hold up...if not, I'll have it welded. Here's a pic:
Here's my custom driveshafts from The Driveshaft Shop
The length of the driveshafts (as measured from the "flat" of the inside of the hub just above the ball joint/knuckle):
Measured at ride-height. If you are up on jackstands you can simulate ride-height (according to driveshaft shop) but sitting the jackstands in the front under the knuckle in the front suspension.
**Remember, this is total length and the point it was measured from was discussed with the driveshaft shop. If you are unsure exactly where to measure from ask who is doing your axles**
If you are doing it using 02m axles then you'll need to find the amount needed to cut off and go from there.
These driveshafts are "Level 2" which they said are made to hold 350whp. FYI, they cost about $750
And on the drivers side I've got room even with the relocated mount:
And another closeup pic of the driveshaft itself:
So this is where I'm at...I'm just waiting on some misc parts to arrive at the dealer (they ordered me the wrong bolts for the driveshaft to tranny fasteners).
There are two connectors on the tranny: One in back (I think the speed sensor) and one up front towards the starter (I'm not sure what that is) but both of them have different connectors than the 12v 02a...so you'll have to swap them out.
New info as of Feb 24, 2009
****Assuming your o2a/VR6 MK3 has the same color wires this is what you need to do to get your O2M speed sensor to wire up to your MK3 wire harness****
Get your hands on an o2M speed sensor (Hopefully it came with the trans) AND the plug/wiring that comes out of it.
Now cut your o2a speed sensor plug off of the harness and solder the wires like so (OEM 02a wiring on left - o2m on right):
Black -----> Black/White
Blue/White -----> Blue/White
Red/Green -----> Brown.
I have added pictures on a post dated Feb 24th, 2009.
Other than that, I just swapped over the starter cables/grounds/etc... and started wiring her up.
I'm having an issue getting pressure in the clutch slave cylinder (clutch pedal at the floor) but I think that may just be an issue of me losing some and bleeding it out.
I'm sure I left a few things out, I'll add in stuff as I remember. And I'll keep adding to this thread as I progress.
Don't go with my measurements on the axles until you double check them for yourself...I have yet to test drive the car so I could run into some issues. My goal is to update this thread/post after I drive it to verify that the axles are perfect and everything is fine.
Until then, please use this thread as an informational source only and that you could end up with a totally different scenario than I.
Where I sourced my parts:
02m trans and related parts: Dean at BVA Motorsports
Slave and other oem parts: vw dealer
Driveshafts: The driveshaft shop
Hope this is a good source of info. If anybody has other info to add please do so!
EDIT: 5.30.06 to add a couple items I forgot to purchase for the swap.
EDIT: 6.2.06 tool list addition.
EDIT: 2.24.09 Added specific info on wiring of speed sensor so odometer/speedometer can work.
Modified by nater at 10:01 PM 2-24-2009
Last edited by nater; 06-30-2010 at 05:37 PM.
Quote, originally posted by EternalXresT » Hey nater show what u did/how the front mtr/tran mount look. cant really see what you did to it.
I haven't done (yet) anything to the front mount - although I'll take pics soon to show that it DOES bolt up on the one side. The problem is it doesn't have a through bolt (from right to left side) that you have with the o2a...so therefor my guess is it may not hold up too long.
As for the back/trans mount...
I literally cut it from the subframe and just moved it - had it welded back in place.
Below is just after I cut the mount off the subframe:
And a wider shot of the "area" where the mount once was (notice the 'hole' in the subframe...that was where the mount sat):
Here's the mount just after I moved it down and forward slightly (notice that same 'hole' that is barely poking out of the mount on the right side of it):
And a side-view - looking from under the wheel well on the drivers side.
You may need to scroll to the right a tad on this pic (or a couple others) as when I resized some came out slightly too big...and I'm not going to be resizing anytime soon.
I'll post pics of how the trans/motor is mounted up front...but it'll hold for now in stock form.
Last edited by nater; 06-30-2010 at 05:25 PM.
Something I just did this morning...
For those of you that want to keep your stock Golf Ball 5 speed shifter knob...
You'll need to thread the shifter rod to accept it. Your MK3 Golf Ball shifter (and maybe other mk3 shifters too?) is a 12mm X 1.50 Pitch.
I bought a 12mmX1.50 pitch die today, cut about 2" off of the shifter rod (because it's pretty tall in stock form) and threaded the rod.
It now accepts the Golf Ball shifter.
Tip while threading: Counter-hold the shifter rod with a pair of vice-grips to keep it from turning too much while threading...those plastic parts may break under the twisting/load of you using the die (even with oil).
**added on to the first page** (if anybody cares).
Quote, originally posted by AggvGtivr6 » Why not just get a 20th shift knob, it is a 6speed car now
I'd love to. But I ran out of money...
And the wife has finally gotten on to me. All the new ones are about $179.
If you only knew how much money I've spent on this car in the last 1.5 yrs you'd understand why my wife finally put the Kaybash on this $170 gear shifter...
And to be honest, I'm kinda putting the kaybash on it too...I'll get it later on.
I just need this to get me going and then later on (in 6 mos or so) I'll get it...when it's "off the radar".
Axles installed, wheels back on...
Car still up on jackstands as I need to get the exhaust back in and would like to keep it accessible.
This gearbox is amazing-feeling just sitting in the car.
Effortless shifting like butter through all 6 gears...what an amazing difference.
I'll have pics of the driveshafts installed later today.
Here's some other stuff I thought I'd add for more detail...
If you go the route I did (just mate the o2a hydraulic line for the slave to the o2m line) then you'll like this pic.
The diameter of the o2m line is larger (8mm vs 6 I believe) so a simple compression fitting doesn't work - and metric compression fittings are hard to find already. I had to compromise and get a reducer (well, sorta). This pic shows the compression fittings that connected the two lines (and yes, it's holding very well).
Make sure you get the fittings from a reputable place that sells compression fittings and general hydraulic-equipment parts. They are made to hold some serious PSI.
And for those asking about my front mount...I finished that today. It's nothing special as it's not welded. But it is strong and bolted up to the tranny well enough to hold the power I'll be putting down.
This pic is self-explanatory. All I did was cut plate steel and drill holes in it to accomodate the bolts. One for the mount (on the bottom) and one for the tranny (up top), as well as a spacer between the bolt/steel and the tranny.
This pic also shows a tad bit of the 24v thermostat housing.
Looking closely at the above pic, you'll see a smaller bolt attaching to the block (This is just using the existing mount and engine block - so no modifications there).
And a front shot.
Looks like the knock sensor wire is blocking it but you can see that I used a bolt (very bottom of the mount on the left side to go through the mount and into the tranny. Again, this took no modifications, I was only using existing holes in the mount and in the tranny.
Make this one a short bolt - b/c it ends only about 2 inches in...and it would suck if you were torquing it down and cracked the tranny.
Last edited by nater; 06-30-2010 at 05:28 PM.
Drove it today for a while...car is AMAZING!!!! Still have to work out some slight kinks.
For example: 24V upper rad hose (I used the 24v tstat housing) and lower rad hose still don't quite mate up to the 12v radiator.
The lower hose I decided to modify from my 12v (I had to shorten it).
The upper rad hose is the 24v one - and it touches the rad fan support. I used a device similar to what VW added to protect the a/c lines from the fan...but that keeps sliding off the hose.
What I think I'll do is cut the rad fan support and then protect the hose with something (maybe an aluminum pipe sleeve of some kind.
The 3" exhaust made an even bigger difference then the tranny IMO (as far as the car feeling faster).
This thing is fast as balls now .
Problem is the clutch isn't holding any of the power...at about 5-6psi the damn thing slips. And I'm sick of working on this car.
EDIT: For those of you doing this swap in the future note that the driveshaft shop axles seem to be perfect (length-wise). I was worried about clicking when going around corners or something like that...not as of my first drive.
I know I'll want to turn up the boost but even at 8.5 psi this thing is amazing (compared to before).
Modified by nater at 10:41 AM 6-11-2006
Last edited by nater; 06-30-2010 at 05:29 PM.
awesome nate. ive gotta rebuild my vr, and though im going to stay all motor, i was debating on this project myself. keep us updated man.
Quote, originally posted by EternalXresT » rear tranny mounts that wont involve moving the tranny mount "cup"
that would be perfection
zomgz <3 I wanna do this!!!! some day, maybe with my peloquined 02a dies.
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'78 Mercedes 450 SLC, '87 Scirocco 16v, '97 Audi A4, '98 Jetta TDI
Yesterday I got the muffler/tailpipe section welded back in and she quieted up a bit.
I love that 3" exhaust!!!
Today I decided to play around with the clutch slave cylinder to see if the clutch slipping had something to do with that (worth a look before I pulled the trans).
Turns out I either bled it wrong and had too much pressure or something else weird...
cuz she holds and she is ****** FAST!!!!
What a perfect box for this turbo vr6!!!!
Last week I received the correct plugs/harnesses for the speed sensor (trans) and reverse light from BVA Motorsports (Thanks Dean!).
They plugged right in and both work perfectly. Now I know how fast I'm going.
Modified by nater at 8:59 PM 6-17-2006
Quote, originally posted by HOTSKILLET98 » Bump. What was the total cost of the project including labor? Do you think this was a better option than the Quaife or APT kit?
I'm not sure what the total cost was to be honest...
But the parts alone cost me over $2600.
And I'm not sure if it's a better option than the quaife or apt kit...my thoughts about this is that the o2m can handle quite a bit of power and it's "OEM" so if anything ever breaks (like a gear etc) then it's all OEM parts stuff.
On the quaife...I heard their parts are expensive. So if I break a quaife gear that would cost me some coinage...
So that's why I went the route I did.
Quote, originally posted by VertigoGTI » Out of curiousity, how is the transmission while cruising on the highway?
I actually forget what RPMS I ran with my o2a at say 60mph in 5th gear but I'm pretty sure 6th gear is very close to where 5th was....so it's rather close.
If I had my choice I'd maybe change the final drive slightly to make it a bit taller.
No. But if you look around you may find somebody that has...I don't know who - because if I did I would have used their mount.
But I know some guys have been talking about making them for some time.
Quote, originally posted by Rado.16vT » nice thread, what hp are these o2m known to handle? Also how much did those d shafts cost ya?
Quote, originally posted by nater »
These driveshafts are "Level 2" which they said are made to hold 350whp. FYI, they cost about $750
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