tranny oil cooler into 01m is done

[petesell]

well i think it's well established that heat is the enemy of these autoboxes. those of us making lots of tq under BT setups are making even more heat, and probably have more invested in our trannys, so we do what we think is necessary to get a more life out of these things. mine is finally done so here it is. many thks to igor (20v1.8tnut) who always helps me out with the technical questions i have. also thks to nyc's best vw shop - tyrolsport. although it didn't go as smooth as it could have, it ended up being a top notch install as usual.

the cooler i bought was the one you see here - http://performanceparts.com/part.php?partID=14087

i liked the stacked plate design and the feature that allows cold fluid to bypass the core. this should help get the oil up to temp better in dead of winter. the kit i sourced from jegs only came w/5' of 3/8" hose, so you will need to source another ~4' from somewhere. not one autoparts store i went to carried it. you'll need to go online or hit me up since i've got an xtra 20' now.

for those unfamiliar w/these trannys, the oe vag 'cooler' attempts to cool the oil by running engine coolant thru a sort of heat exchanger on top of the tranny. most of us are scratching out heads at this type of german engineering since the coolant is kept at ~190*, and you want to keep your tranny oil below ~175* optimally. so the oe cooler is ditched and replaced with something we hope will keep the temps down. anyone w/first hand experience can feel free to jump in and offer any tips or ideas. here's how it went w/my install -

bumper off and cooler attached. nice snug fit if you ask me. in front of the radiator is the best place for the cooler, but you can do a side mount if you wanted. you can't see it that well in the pics, but there is a good ~2" between the cooler & radiator

next you should depressure the system and drain the pan. this is a good time to change the fluid anyway, since you're going to lose some when you take off the oe cooler. to do this you have to disconnect the 2 coolant lines and then loosen the 2 hex bolts and it should pop off. good riddance

the coolant lines will no longer be of use & have to be tied together. i suppose you could just cap them at the source, not sure. ends up like this -

you'll need adapters/fittings to tap into the 2 ports for oil.

-6AN to 12mm like this one

*note - one of these aluminum fittings i supplied broke during install you may want to use another material.

then you'll need a -6AN 90 deg to hose fitting. i went with a russell twist lock like this -

clamp the lines to the cooler & tie it down nice nice.

the lines end up just about even or 1/4" lower than the bumper. i'm not lowered (shine springs) so am not worried about bottoming out at all, but at the same time if these lines got cut somehow it could prove catastophic, so i cut a piece of alum sheeting i have sitting behind the radiators in my house for a shield -

quick spray of black paint. remind me to scuff the sheet next time.

here's the finished product. nice & stealthy if you ask me. i'm loving the r32 bumper. besides looking badass, look at the airflow to both the cooler & SMIC

Modified by petesell at 1:17 PM 6-21-2007

[Mikes72sb]

^^^^^^^

Nice write-up, Pete

And another nice install by Tyrolsport

You know, Pete. My old cooler is almost identical to the one you bought IPT used banjo fittings on my trans case. Any reason why you went with the AN's?

Nice job on the protection. You guys know what happened to me with my lines

You know, this is the first time I've ever seen a pic of your car I always thought it was silver Good move with the R bumper. Airflow is key. That is why I love my new grill, plenty of air

[petesell]

thks mike. i took another look at the pic of yr cooler and i don't think it's the same one, if that's what yr getting at. but - it does look exactly like the one currently on ipt's website.

as far as the fitting go, i had no idea what ipt used, so i went with what i thought should work. feel free to post details of your fittings - one of the reasons i made the thread was as a reference for other people wanting to do this, so the more options the better. i'm keeping a close eye on things and if any leaks develop i may end up changing fittings and using crush washers instead of the rubber o-rings. so far, so good.

[Mikes72sb]

Those AN's should work out fine.

[Fortuna Wolf]

That's quite a nice install.

Have you measured temps since before and after the install? I'm curious to see how much this helps.

Also, where did you find the -6AN to 12mm adapters?

[Thumper1044]

Looks like a really clean install. I'm trying to figure out how I can keep the water cooler and then put an air cooler downstream going back to the tranny. I've always heard that this is the preferred method, especially for you snowbirds. Also, if your in stop and go traffic, there is not a lot of air accross the fin cooler and this is where you can really generate some heat. Just my thoughts.

[petesell]

Quote, originally posted by Fortuna Wolf »

Have you measured temps since before and after the install? I'm curious to see how much this helps. Also, where did you find the -6AN to 12mm adapters?

i have not. a temp gauge is the next project, but i doubt i'll get to it till after the summer. hwy speeds will reap the most benefits of this set up obviously.
the adapters can be found at summitracing.

Quote, originally posted by Thumper1044 »

I'm trying to figure out how I can keep the water cooler and then put an air cooler downstream going back to the tranny. I've always heard that this is the preferred method, especially for you snowbirds. Also, if your in stop and go traffic, there is not a lot of air accross the fin cooler and this is where you can really generate some heat. Just my thoughts.

since the oe water 'cooler' is placed directly on top of the tranny, you would have to get real creative to run both in sequence. i have to agree that stop/go traffic is where this type of cooler won't perform well, judging by how hot the lines get. only a temp gauge can determine exactly how much hotter we're talking about, if at all.

[petesell]

well unfortunately for me, one of the fittings started to leak

here are the fittings used. the silver fitting leaked much worse & i'm wondering why wondering if it has anything to do with the angle coming off the head? the blue fitting is flat-

well after removing the fittings i believe the wrong o-ring was used, which was due to miscommunication on my part. my bad i guess. so i decided i'd use banjo bolts/fittings and crush washers. finding 12mm banjo fittings for 3/8" barb was a mother****er, but i finally got a metric 'equivalent' (actually a pinch tighter) from 034 motorsports and in they went - but not without another headache. after torquing them down & putting things back together i started the car & let it idle for a few minutes. but before i get to take it for a drive the same port is leaking with the banjos now
i put them in the same exact way & even torqed them both w/tq wrench, so no logical explanation for leak using crushwashers. so i took it out & thought to myself, let me try the oe o-ring , which i know works fine in igor's setup. the oe ring has to be seated in the tranny port before the bolt goes in. it's critical that the rings or washers (whatever you use) are seated perfectly. one week later and after several romps the banjos (1 w/washer & 1 w/oe oring) are bone dry

ended up looking like this-

one thing to note - the banjos are MUCH easier to access. you can get to them w/socket & extension. the AN fittings require battery & airbox removal.

Modified by petesell at 2:22 PM 7-24-2007

[Slow Jet]

Looks like a nice DIY. First time I see one for an O1M.

[Fortuna Wolf]

I actually plugged in with vag-com this weekend when I went on a trip...
Around town (flat) I get upwards of 130C just driving slowly from stoplight to stoplight (from spinning the torque converter unlocked under 30 mph). On the highway its between 100-105C since its in 4th with the TC locked.
In the city I was visiting... good god, its very hilly, I had to drive in 3rd a lot since 4th gear couldn't climb some of the hills (30% grades and crap). The transmission got so hot that I started to notice the fluid pressure dropping and shifts were getting loose again.

So, highway temps don't benefit that much from the external cooler, its the city and mountain temps that'll benefit the most.

[fricker3]

FortunaWolf,
130C seems high, that is 266F. I have read some trailer towing web sites and IIRC they say 225F is max desired.
They sell oil coolers with a 12V fan and a therrmostat. I am looking for one to add to my Jetta.
Please let me know if I am wrong here, because I have had my temp near 130C while towing a camper and I now have some slipping going on.
Eric

[Occams_Razor]

Quote, originally posted by petesell »

well unfortunately for me, one of the fittings started to leak here are the fittings used. the silver fitting leaked much worse & i'm wondering why wondering if it has anything to do with the angle coming off the head? the blue fitting is flat- well after removing the fittings i believe the wrong o-ring was used, which was due to miscommunication on my part. my bad i guess. so i decided i'd use banjo bolts/fittings and crush washers. finding 12mm banjo fittings for 3/8" barb was a mother****er, but i finally got a metric 'equivalent' (actually a pinch tighter) from 034 motorsports and in they went - but not without another headache. after torquing them down & putting things back together i started the car & let it idle for a few minutes. but before i get to take it for a drive the same port is leaking with the banjos now i put them in the same exact way & even torqed them both w/tq wrench, so no logical explanation for leak using crushwashers. so i took it out & thought to myself, let me try the oe o-ring , which i know works fine in igor's setup. the oe ring has to be seated in the tranny port before the bolt goes in. it's critical that the rings or washers (whatever you use) are seated perfectly. one week later and after several romps the banjos (1 w/washer & 1 w/oe oring) are bone dry ended up looking like this- one thing to note - the banjos are MUCH easier to access. you can get to them w/socket & extension. the AN fittings require battery & airbox removal. Modified by petesell at 2:22 PM 7-24-2007

So you were using the AN adapters with "O" Rings? Did you wrap the adapter metric threads with teflon tape? Do you happen to have the part number and brand of the AN adapters that you were using?

What brand and part number did you finally go with for the banjos?

I am going with Aeroquip AN adapters myself but since I have not seen what the OEM bolt looks like on the sealing end I am wondering if pipe thread teflon tape will be enough?


Modified by Occams_Razor at 9:37 PM 8-22-2007

[Occams_Razor]

Anyone have a picture of the top of the 01M without the cooler installed?

[petesell]

Quote, originally posted by Occams_Razor »

So you were using the AN adapters with "O" Rings? Did you wrap the adapter metric threads with teflon tape? Do you happen to have the part number and brand of the AN adapters that you were using? What brand and part number did you finally go with for the banjos?

reread the whole thread for answers...
teflon tape was used - it was kind of melted off when i removed the AN fittings. as stated, the banjos & washers were sourced from 034 motorsports. ask for dan. instead of washers you can use the OE o-rings like you see here - http://www.worldimpex.com/sear...1&y=5

[20V1.8Tnut]

hey Pete. When that temp gauge is gonna be installed?

[projects]

THis is adapter set for my tranny cooler.
upper two are 3/8 male npt to 3/8 barb, lower two are 12x1.5 to 3/8 npt female, they came form Fram G3746 fuel filter, and are useless parts for b3 passat fuel filter application.

below set is my old set, they are 12x1.5 to 1/4 barb, is on sale now.

[petesell]

Quote, originally posted by 20V1.8Tnut »

hey Pete. When that temp gauge is gonna be installed?

it went in a couple weeks ago. the sender is in the pressure port as seen below. should get me a good accurate reading.

after driving in different conditions i can say this cooler setup works very well - when it gets airflow. this was predictable.
w/outside temps 40-60F, cruising 60-80 mph nets a solid 140* - very nice.
commutes home are a little different. while it starts off 40-65mph, the last ~4 miles is 0-40 stop & go type crap. by the time i get home i'm 180 - 200*, depending on traffic. in two weeks so far i haven't gone over 200 , but keep in mind the outside temps at this time of year. i'll have a summer update and i bet the oil spends plenty of time >200*. for now, 40mph+ airflow is all you need to keep your ATF at a very nice low temp. of course, the faster the better. speed is good

a couple other observations - idling in park does NOT raise oil temps. in fact, if your oil is already hot, idling will lowers temps.

kickdown/WOT runs heats things up in a hurry. after 3 x ~70-95mph kickdown blasts i saw the temps raise to ~170/180 from 140 in only a few minutes. on the highway they'll cool right back down though.
i used a nice indigo gauge from new south for the OE look -

[20V1.8Tnut]

Your results are pretty much consistent with mine 180-200F in cold weather- that's what I saw before I installed a fan on the cooler.
I also monitored the temps with VAG-COM and they differ a bit from one another, but both, gauge and VAG-COM will give you a pretty good idea about the temperature.

[erevlydeux]

Sorry to resurrect, but I'm just curious: o-rings should work for both fittings on the top of the tranny, right?

[petesell]

yes, there's a link 5 posts up.
btw - i have all the hardware you need, minus the cooler & o-rings. if yr interested send an im.

[mrkrad]

you sure you don't have that backwards? the transmission fluid is dangerously thick at lower temps and the tcu has to take it easy until op temps are arrived. so this trans cooler so to speak would heat up the trans fluid quicker to prevent over pressure?

but i like your setup. post more pics of how you intercepted the lines etc?

did you keep the original system and add this inline or replace the one in the radiator?

what fluid type is actually going to the oe cooler? trans or coolant? (i have an audi a4 so it might be setup slightly differntly the audi has a different radiator for tiptronic with embedded heat exchanger)

[Bug-c]

Hello,
Do you remember what is the inlet and the outlet on the tranny?
please.

[allout]

What does it cost to have one of these tranny coolers installed?

[petesell]

Quote, originally posted by Bug-c »

Do you remember what is the inlet and the outlet on the tranny?

top port (closest to firewall) of tranny is outlet (hot).

[petesell]

Quote, originally posted by mrkrad »

the transmission fluid is dangerously thick at lower temps and the tcu has to take it easy until op temps are arrived. so this trans cooler so to speak would heat up the trans fluid quicker to prevent over pressure?

you are right, the tranny oil is thick & takes a while to warm up, and it should not be driven hard until it's up to temp which sometimes takes a while. it seems to be happiest @ ~160. this brand of cooler has a feature that supposedly allows thicker oil to bypass the cooler until it warms up. i am a little disturbed how long it takes to get up to temp on really cold days. on a few rare occassions, i made it to work (~15 miles) with the temp needle barely moving. of course on warmer days it heats up too quickly, so while this setup isn't sophisticated enough to get the best of all worlds, i believe it's better than the factory set up for 98% of driving conditions.

[Bug-c]

Quote, originally posted by petesell »

top port (closest to firewall) of tranny is outlet (hot).

Thanks !
for resum, is the work is better with this cooler, is it the same or the worse ?

[heuer21]

great write up! I am hoping that the 09A transmission i have will be similar. I run into one more obstacle than you... my intercooler is 11x31x3 inches...I think I am just going to fab up a bracket to place it where my sidemount went. And probably use a tamperature controlled fan....you gave me a bunch of ideas though! thanks

[rensho]

Are the holes there already, and tapped so that you can just add the fittings for the oil lines? Are they just currently capped?
Also, these ports in the tranny for the cooling lines somehow have a pump/directional flow so that they will flow through the new cooler all by themselves, without the aid of a pump?

Edit: Are the holes, the ones that are underneath the factory water/oil cooler?

Thanks for posting this.


Modified by rensho at 9:04 PM 4-6-2008

[farmdwg]

Does anyone have a good supplier for the banjos?

[rossasaurus]

http://www.034motorsport.com

[RCPaul]

interested in purchasing the bangos for adding a cooler to my tdi, can I purchase from you? Where do I get the o-rings??

[terry196greystone]

THANK YOU petesell! This is the exact DIY I was hoping to find. I just went through a nightmare 096 to 01M swap, figuring out the transmission vehicle speed sensor wring myself, and other computer leads that my 096 wiring did not have. It has been a long day's week on this trani job, and I want to protect it from a similar fate as the 096. I have read opinions from ahundred different people on flushing and ATF to use, each opinion different.- So I am just full of confidence (not), but a trani cooler is just what I had in mind. this will do more for the trans. than any $30 a liter atf vw has to offer.- AND THAT is MY opinion! Nice job, u r the man!!!!

[southwesterly]

I really really appreciate these numbers because i have not been able to find them online anywhere!
My only question is are these temperatures in Fahrenheit?

If anyone else has similar or different values please let me know.

[southwesterly]

I just installed this into my car.
I started above 120 C after 35 minutes of driving on the stock system and am now at 70 C highway and no more than 95 C stopped or ~80 C in the city.
I mounted a 5 3/4" x 11" x 3/4" tru-cool lpd cooler with the low temperature bypass valve on an angle from the front of the bumper (welded mounts to bumper) and used 90 degree fittings to thread the lines above the plastic radiator mounting base to hide the lines from being munched by a curb. an inline filter was added and the Sonex fittings were used instead of an fittings. The beauty of the sonex fittings is that the stock bolts can be used:
http://www.transmissionpartsus...k.htm
I ordered these through a local transmission shop who seemed very interested in the topic. If there is any interest, i will post pictures.
I also installed a temperature gauge which is now almost useless since my current temperature range does not span the current temperature readings...

[Cadenza_7o]

The coolant/ATF heat exchanger is also there to help warm up the ATF when cold. If your winters are frigid cold, the front mounted radiator will take a long time for the ATF to warm up.



Modified by Cadenza_7o at 2:59 PM 8-18-2009