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    Thread: The all carb diet.

    1. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 12:43 AM #211
      I need Help tunning it noone here knows how im currently running 115 main and 200 air the car is running RICh the spark plugs are BLACK and also the return line is puking gas what can i do about it?


      Modified by SpoolinJetta18T at 5:45 AM 10-14-2008


      Modified by SpoolinJetta18T at 5:45 AM 10-14-2008


    2. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 06:24 AM #212
      Rich during cruise, rich during idle or rich during WOT? You're running a return-style regulator I take it?
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    3. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 08:28 AM #213
      i think is running rich all over... lol as far as the return line im not running a return style regulator since im running a carter pump. anyone have a pic of it? maybe i can get one and see ho is installed, thank you

    4. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 09:10 AM #214
      Well, first off, post up every jet your carbs are set up with. Mains, idles, airs, pumps, chokes, etc. What do you mean by return line, if you're not running a return line from a regulator, I'm confused. If you're talking about your car being formerly a fuel injected model and you've blanked off the return line, that's ok if it has fuel in it. Also, what is your fuel pressure? How big are the needle valves that allow the fuel into the bowls? Etc etc. The only way we can help isolate your issue is to know all the facts .
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    5. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 12:32 PM #215
      ok the current jets
      115 mains
      200 airs
      F11 on the middle part
      65 idles
      32 chokes
      the fuel pressure is 4-8 psi (carter 4070)
      my GTi was Cis fuel injected when i swapped to Webers i used the main fuel line and the return line is open (i didnt know what to do with it) i have it with a hose attached to a bottle which it filles up by the end of the day.. as far as the needels going into my bowls im not sure what you mean....i was told to cap the return line and drill a whole in my gas cap...which i havnt.... just in case

    6. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 01:00 PM #216
      Cap the return line for sure, the venting will be taken car of by the lines coming to the charcoal cannister (or where it used to be anyway if you've deleted it). DO NOT drill a hole in the gascap, that's asking for trouble.

      Get a fuel pressure regulator, 4-8 psi is too much pressure. The pressure could be overwhelming the needles/floats and flooding the bowls. I'm running 3-4.5psi from a Facet pump, and it's perfect. The needles control how much fuel enters the bowls as the floats drop, if they allow too much in at a time, you could flood the bowls too quickly, same goes for having too much fuel pressure. Have the floats been set to the proper height? this could also be a problem. Best thing to do is to make everything proper, and if you still have a problem, then start troubleshooting.

      To recap:
      -fuel pressure regulator, set to 3.5psi
      -set float level properly
      -find out what the idles are exactly, they'll be named to this format: 65F2, etc. 65 seems WAAAAAAAAAAY big, considering they're probably universal webers and not emissions ones. Sounds like someone was trying to tune away a flat spot and just used a huge idle jet to compensate for something. You'll cruise on the idles, not the mains, so they seem way big. I'm running 60s on my Dellortos, and they are emissions models, which means I have to use huge idle jets. Right now I'm running only one sidedraft carb, and my idles are 62.5s.
      -double check to make sure the cold start choke mechanism isn't leaking. this could also be cause of the fuel issues. It's a very crude device. Best to blank it off with some plates and gasket material.

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    7. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 01:10 PM #217
      thank you i will check on that today i took the car to someone this weekend and he estimated me at 400.00 to tune my car... the car runs good but is running rich it starts in the mornings w/o a problem even when its cold.... my only concern is the car being rich the spark plugs are BLACk so that means is rich right... i got a narow band that i will install this week and maybe try to tune it my self with you guys help which i appreciate it alot thank you

    8. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 01:36 PM #218
      Well, if he's an old school carb tuner, it could be worth it. If it just some young guy behind a counter...I'd be wary. Carb tuning is a lost art, and the old school guys are the only ones who I'd even consider paying. Experience counts in this venture, 100%. The knowledge available in this forum is invaluable, especially the FAQ, but a lot of the old guys out there have been tuning carbs for 3-4 decades, if not longer. They'll know whats up. I know a shop that can put out 700whp mitsubishis, and they have their own dyno, but they shake their heads when someone comes in with a carbed car...so be careful what you pay for. You could get a car back that runs worse than it does now, but is leaner than it is currently. It's a fine balancing act to tune these things properly, everything has to overlap, or you get a less-than-acceptible 'overall', but great 'sections'. You could have a great cruising 'section' with a dangerously lean WOT, or even vice versa. Most shops tune for WOT and leave the rest out because they don't have a clue how to set up the mid-range...couple that with something like a carb, and you have a recipe for disaster .
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    9. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 02:30 PM #219
      yes i agree this guy everyone recommended him he specializes in european cars he did tell me he had NEVER seen a 1.8 webered... and that i was the 1st one he ever seen. im gong to do more reserch and learn more im sure i can get this thing tuned up correctly, besides the GTI is not my DD i have a mk1 cabrio as a DD so i dont have to rush it.

    10. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 02:35 PM #220
      If he's never seen a dual carbed VW...stay away. Unless he can prove he's tuned OTHER cars on dual carbs, he's useless to you and will rob you of your 400 IMO. Not on purpose, but there is such a thing as biting off more than you can chew .
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    11. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-14-2008 02:55 PM #221
      thank you i appreciate the help alot i was also wondering about the ignition a friend of mine GAVE ME for free a MSD SCI i dont know if it would work but it was free and free is always good....
      this is what i got
      http://robearracing.com/pd-msd...l.cfm

    12. Member Svedka's Avatar
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      10-15-2008 12:27 AM #222
      like before standalone said do not let someone that says they have never seena dual carbed 1.8 or any other watercooled DCOE setup. It's just asking for **** to hit the fan.

      Or maybe he is the new age tuner who bites off more than he can chew


    13. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-15-2008 06:39 AM #223
      Hehe, Before Standalone, that's a good one! I like it .
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

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      10-15-2008 08:38 AM #224
      start off with a new set of plugs also for tuning. dont try to clean your old plugs

    15. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-15-2008 08:45 AM #225
      i did get a new set thanks

    16. Member Svedka's Avatar
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      10-20-2008 10:25 PM #226
      why you sellin the mani alredy?

    17. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-20-2008 10:41 PM #227
      Going back to duals .
      Yeah...it's a bit of project Attention Deficit Disorder, can't help myself. If I'm not tinkering with what I have, I'm buying stuff I shouldn't .
      The single ran great, but now I've got the bug for a big cam and 7500 rpms out of the ol' 8v.
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    18. 10-21-2008 11:42 AM #228
      A single DCOE will let you spin that high. An 8v counterflow head most likely will not. Even the biggest commonly available solid cam will peak about 1000rpm before that.

      But try it! If you don't like it you can always switch back, haha


    19. Member Uber E's Avatar
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      10-21-2008 02:59 PM #229
      Completely new to this but heres what I just picked up.

      Weber dfev 32/36.

      It will eventually make its way to the 1.7 I just dropped out of the 81.


    20. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-21-2008 05:53 PM #230
      Quote, originally posted by MkIIRoc »
      A single DCOE will let you spin that high. An 8v counterflow head most likely will not. Even the biggest commonly available solid cam will peak about 1000rpm before that.

      But try it! If you don't like it you can always switch back, haha


      Oh I know, but the single just doesn't sound the same as duals, and we all know sound is the most important part of carbs .

      That being said, um...someone should still buy it from me!

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    21. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 01:11 PM #231
      Quote, originally posted by SilverTREK »
      Completely new to this but heres what I just picked up.

      Weber dfev 32/36.

      It will eventually make its way to the 1.7 I just dropped out of the 81.


      Mmmm, Weber DFEV setup, I'd love to try one of those one day. Keep us posted dude!

      Swapped back to my duals last night, damn I missed that growl. The single had it too, but it was nowhere near as loud .

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    22. 10-22-2008 03:38 PM #232
      ^^^That whats in my 76 now.Great set up to start with.Only had to tune it once in 5 years.

    23. Member Uber E's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 04:41 PM #233
      Beautiful. Thats exactly what im after with this car. It'll be some time before its running though. The to-do list is long and the wallet's quivering.

    24. Member the12for12's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 06:27 PM #234
      Quote, originally posted by SilverTREK »
      Completely new to this but heres what I just picked up.

      Weber dfev 32/36.

      It will eventually make its way to the 1.7 I just dropped out of the 81.

      A 32/36 Progressive (compared to CIS) will PULL harder and REV quicker in every gear.

      And if you can find a 38/38.....


    25. Member Uber E's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 06:31 PM #235
      I dont even remember what this car was like to drive. Its been SO long. Im anxious. Oh and it was automatic. SLOW was the name of the game.

    26. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 09:27 PM #236
      I've just had the most fun in weeks, and all I did was take my newly-returned-to-dual-carbed Rabbit for a spin to the bank. I live out in the boonies, so it was all open road. I drilled out some spare idle jets to ~62, vs the 58's I was using and the car is a bit snappier, mainly since it doesn't cruise at 16:1 anymore, but closer to 15.5:1 now. I should see if I can find some larger pump jets, or perhaps mess with the pump rod a bit. Might order some 30mm chokes too, to regain the lost low end grunt I had with the single.

      In summary: CARBS RULE!

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    27. Member Uber E's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 09:44 PM #237
      Awesome.

    28. Member 88vwFox's Avatar
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      10-22-2008 11:52 PM #238
      Quote, originally posted by SilverTREK »
      Completely new to this but heres what I just picked up.

      Weber dfev 32/36.

      It will eventually make its way to the 1.7 I just dropped out of the 81.


      about to be running the same carb on my 1.8l fox motor 9:1 cr but with a 276 cam it had digi in the last car but the motor is going in a car with cis-e so carb time. i can't wait i just hope the motor doesn't want more carb than i have.

      Budget $2500. car -$1040 = $1460 to make it better.

    29. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-23-2008 02:59 PM #239
      how do i adjust the floats? i think thats one of my problems

    30. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-23-2008 03:58 PM #240
      http://www.webernorthamerica.c...s.pdf

      All you need to know


      Modified by B4S at 5:45 PM 12-10-2008

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    31. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-24-2008 08:01 AM #241
      Thank you .... you the man .... thanks again

    32. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-27-2008 09:30 AM #242
      ok so i get in the mail a NICE set of velocity stacks i install them "bling bling" take the car for a ride and the car rides better the narrow band is not on lean anymore is on stoich in the safe zone when it had the filters it stayed on lean but yet the car was rumming RICH has anyone had this problem before? or any imput?

    33. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-27-2008 11:51 AM #243
      Filters really change the way the carbs take in air. Most likely, they were causing a very lean condition at idle, and once they transferred on to the mains, the carbs were tuned to go rich. I never run filters, but since I'm using a counterflow setup, I feel safe doing so.

      How did setting the floats turn out?

      I'm willing to bet that those 115 mains were drilled out in the past to something a lot larger, if you're still rich.


      Modified by B4S at 11:52 AM 10-27-2008

      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

    34. Member SpoolinJetta18T's Avatar
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      10-28-2008 10:04 AM #244
      i havnt adjusted the floats since gas is not pouring out of them and since the narrow band is on yellow... as far as the maine i also have a set of 120 and they are bigger than the 115 so i dont think they have been drilled out, maybe i need to go to 110. thanks for all the help also i got a MSD sport compact box and msd coil that was given to me would that make a diffrence once i install it? what should i set the timming as far as degrees to sorry for all the Q's

    35. Member B4S's Avatar
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      10-28-2008 01:12 PM #245
      Dude, just because the carbs are not puking gas doesn't mean they're fine. Float height is a VERY important part of carb tuning. If the floats are set even one millimeter too high or too low, it will change the way they react to tuning by a HUGE amount. There are more things to tune on a carb than jets, unfortunately.
      Fick Deps?, Get Deb!

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