02m vs APtuning 02j

[TBT-Syncro]

was anyone able to check out the new dog engagement gears from APTuning at Waterfest?

[zwogti]

Quote, originally posted by TBT-Syncro »

was anyone able to check out the new dog engagement gears from APTuning at Waterfest?

I would like to know that too, I am waiting on the new gears to come out for 8 months now

[gdoggmoney]

Somehow I think I ended up with one of the original posters spare transmissions.....

drop me a line, it's an EHA with a broken reverse switch socket

[kenny_blankenship]

Are euro TDI 02M's worth a shot at drag racing? I'd love to run one, but I don't like the thought of having to go overseas to get any part for it when it breaks (key word is when and not "if")

[themadskater905]

on/off topic...any issues with the eurospec 6spd 02j's? of course im not on the power level of you guys but it worked amazing for me so far...


Modified by themadskater905 at 4:39 PM 7/29/2009

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by kenny_blankenship »

Are euro TDI 02M's worth a shot at drag racing? I'd love to run one, but I don't like the thought of having to go overseas to get any part for it when it breaks (key word is when and not "if")

Do you have ratios.

...and the Eurospec 6 speed are built on 02J cases and just extend the input shaft with adapters to accept the extra gear. I am certain they are good quality, but have no idea if the could handle a hard shift from 4th to 5th with 400 Ft Lbs. behind it.

[themadskater905]

Quote, originally posted by hypothetical »

and the Eurospec 6 speed are built on 02J cases and just extend the input shaft with adapters to accept the extra gear. I am certain they are good quality, but have no idea if the could handle a hard shift from 4th to 5th with 400 Ft Lbs. behind it.

i didnt get the add-on kit they sell.

i got a whole new built tranny. the gears in the eurospec i have are 1/3.30, 2/1.94, 3/1.31, 4/1.09, 5/.89, 6/.75, 3.94 final
and as for strength, i quoted this from their site "Eurospec 6-speed transmissions now feature strengthened mainshafts and gears using SAE 3310 material, precision ground and cryogenically treated for maximum strength."

http://www.eurospecsport.com/p...s.htm

[18T_BT]

the eurospec can't handle 350ft/lbs in 2nd or 3rd gears whilst drag racing

[themadskater905]

first, sorry for thread-jacking, second, it can in fact handle it, and it does it well. i have vids on youtube. what makes you say it cant do it? did you have a bad experience?

hell the stock trans held up for a lil while under the apr kit. until it ripped the teeth off third...


Modified by themadskater905 at 5:29 PM 7-29-2009

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by themadskater905 »

first, sorry for thread-jacking, second, it can in fact handle it, and it does it well. i have vids on youtube. what makes you say it cant do it? did you have a bad experience? hell the stock trans held up for a lil while under the apr kit. until it ripped the teeth off third... Modified by themadskater905 at 5:29 PM 7-29-2009

First sorry for sounding like a dick but APRs kit doesn't really produce enough power to even be worried about it. The gears in your eurospec box are FACTORY and just as strong as 02J gears.

Breaking 3rd(1.308 ratio) really is the easiest gear to bust mostly due to where 2nd at redline lands 3rd. Right at torque peak most times.

[.therealvrt]

When i told eurospecsport my power they told me their tranny wouldn't hold

[themadskater905]

i know it doesnt come close to your guys kind of power i got it because at the time i didnt know any better (over a year ago) but anyway i have it know so im just gonna stick with it. and im aware of the whole 3rd being easier to snap

anywho so any idea why they would list their trannys as having cryo gears and such if they dont?? i know it at least came with diff gears than stock. shifting at the same point (about 6000) stock trans was 3rd-100ish, 4th-130ish, and 5th went thru 150. new trans was 3rd 85, 4th 105-110, 5th 125ish, 6th went pretty much right to 160. vids to prove this on youtube.com/madskater5 (old trans is the 0-150 one, new trans is the 60-140 one)

either way it works great for me. im more focused on my camaro for speed anyway-vw is just DD

Modified by themadskater905 at 10:01 PM 7-29-2009


Modified by themadskater905 at 10:03 PM 7-29-2009

[Sales@ForceFed]

As we all know, 4 cylinders are usually easier on gears than VR6's. From what I have seen, the eurospec gears sold 4-5 years ago doin't last at all on VR6's making mid 500's whp. I tuned two VR's with those gears and one broke on the way to the track, and the other didnt make it past one run.
Quaife gears are fairly strong, but when trying to run 9's in a 2500+ pound car with 600+ whp, they don't last forever to say the least.
I don't understand why nobody is on here bashinq Quaife like they do to the other brands.

[kenny_blankenship]

Quote, originally posted by hypothetical »

Do you have ratios. ...and the Eurospec 6 speed are built on 02J cases and just extend the input shaft with adapters to accept the extra gear. I am certain they are good quality, but have no idea if the could handle a hard shift from 4th to 5th with 400 Ft Lbs. behind it.

02M, ERF code

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by kenny_blankenship »

02M, ERF code http://i65.photobucket.com/alb...a.jpg

Man I am confused by that page of data. It seems all the 4th and 5th are so close it is a mis-print.

The difference between a .977 and a .975 is about 15RPM at 3000 between shifts.

Weird

[Sales@ForceFed]

02M trans has two final drives, one for gears 1-4, and another for gears 5-6. I remember thinking the same thing, lol.

[hypothetical]

Thanks Kevin... Figured something like that but was surprised by the numbers...

Now i can do some figuring.

[Mark Morris]

Quote, originally posted by themadskater905 »

it can in fact handle it, and it does it well. i have vids on youtube. what makes you say it cant do it? did you have a bad experience? hell the stock trans held up for a lil while under the apr kit. until it ripped the teeth off third...

Yeah-- he has first-hand experience breaking them in his own car. APR kits and broken trans don't usually go hand-in-hand.

[themadskater905]

Quote, originally posted by Mark Morris »

Yeah-- he has first-hand experience breaking them in his own car. APR kits and broken trans don't usually go hand-in-hand.

yeah i wouldnt have thought so either...until it happened. i wasnt even trying to go fast when it happened. just pulling away from a light. of course it may of been a developing problem...it happened only about a month after i had the kit installed

[kenny_blankenship]

Quote, originally posted by Kevin@ForceFed »

02M trans has two final drives, one for gears 1-4, and another for gears 5-6. I remember thinking the same thing, lol.

Thoughts on the ratios for drag?

[Sales@ForceFed]

<<<Thoughts on the ratios for drag?>>>

- The quickest and fastest MK4 1.8t drag car uses an 02M.....

[Bigjuice]

What time did it run??

[Sales@ForceFed]

old setup - 10.65@137 on 24.5x8.5 M&H
new setup ?.?? on 26x10

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by Kevin@ForceFed »

old setup - 10.65@137 on 24.5x8.5 M&H new setup ?.?? on 26x10

Kevin. Has Ed solved the high RPM shift issues he was experiencing? That 26 in tire should should help the short spacing between gears at the big end. That car should be deep nines at 160+ very soon...

[lugnuts]

It was much better after freshening up the trans. The previous one had a good amount of wear.
The ratios were nearly perfect for the old 10.65@137 setup. I had a dual rev limiter setup which allowed the car to go to 8750 in 4th.
Even if that was not done, hitting the limiter at 8500 would have only cost a couple hundredths of ET.
Hopefully we will be able to stretch the rpm on those 26's and make some big mph haha. Can't wait to see what it runs.

[Bigjuice]

Quote, originally posted by hypothetical »

Kevin. Has Ed solved the high RPM shift issues he was experiencing? That 26 in tire should should help the short spacing between gears at the big end. That car should be deep nines at 160+ very soon...

Does shaving every other tooth on the syncro help with engagement @ high RPM?

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by Bigjuice »

Does shaving every other tooth on the syncro help with engagement @ high RPM?

Never done every other tooth. I have only ever removed one for everyone already missing in stock form. So if the syncro has three teeth missing I remove 3 more(Carefully.) It definitely helped my issue. Pretty dang smooth at 8800rpm...

This is on an 02A/J tranny, don't believe anyone's ever done it on a 02M.

Kevin Oct 3-4 for Ed's next track event? Let's get some decent videos, lol...

[purple-pill]

Quote, originally posted by Kevin@ForceFed »

<<<Thoughts on the ratios for drag?>>> - The quickest and fastest MK4 1.8t drag car uses an 02M.....

I thought it was a street car?

[lugnuts]

We've tried a few different syncro tooth removal methods on the 02A gears. There were some other factors (shift cable, ends, etc) that could have clouded the results.
Also, we tried removing the actual syncro teeth off of the gears as well. It is possible to remove too many and the teeth will break off of the gear.
Lately we simply removed every other tooth from the syncro and it works well *when everything else is right.

The FFE car is scheduled to be at the outlaw race there will be plenty of video there.
Waterfest was a big disappointment, nobody seems to have videotaped the 4 cyl finals. There were about 20 people in the stands too, I guess the show portion was just too exciting.

The old setup was what I would call a street car, with an open downpipe. I said "drag car" to emphasize the drag ET record the car had, but I suppose posting in the "drag forum" already stated that for me, lol.

[gdoggmoney]

Quote, originally posted by lugnuts »

We've tried a few different syncro tooth removal methods on the 02A gears. There were some other factors (shift cable, ends, etc) that could have clouded the results. Also, we tried removing the actual syncro teeth off of the gears as well. It is possible to remove too many and the teeth will break off of the gear. Lately we simply removed every other tooth from the syncro and it works well *when everything else is right. The FFE car is scheduled to be at the outlaw race there will be plenty of video there. Waterfest was a big disappointment, nobody seems to have videotaped the 4 cyl finals. There were about 20 people in the stands too, I guess the show portion was just too exciting. The old setup was what I would call a street car, with an open downpipe. I said "drag car" to emphasize the drag ET record the car had, but I suppose posting in the "drag forum" already stated that for me, lol.

Every other tooth from both the brass bits? The syncro & hub I believe it is called? (Not the piece that slides over them, which I think is the slider)

Just trying to get this right. I have an 02J to build and want to do it right once.

Ed mentioned this before but I don't recall the specifics. Be nice to get it down here.

[Bigjuice]

Quote, originally posted by gdoggmoney »

Every other tooth from both the brass bits? The syncro & hub I believe it is called? (Not the piece that slides over them, which I think is the slider) Just trying to get this right. I have an 02J to build and want to do it right once. Ed mentioned this before but I don't recall the specifics. Be nice to get it down here.

About to do the same on my O2M, I heard that every other tooth works....

[hypothetical]

Only the soft brass sycro ring. Not the gear or the slider. Doing this procedure. Allows your trans to have twice as many chances to mesh. If all cars shifted at 10K they would use syncros with less teeth.

[gdoggmoney]

Quote, originally posted by hypothetical »

Only the soft brass sycro ring. Not the gear or the slider. Doing this procedure. Allows your trans to have twice as many chances to mesh. If all cars shifted at 10K they would use syncros with less teeth.

Does it still shift as well at lower RPM's also?

I can't really see any cons here to this procedure. It does make sense logically.

[hypothetical]

Quote, originally posted by gdoggmoney »

Does it still shift as well at lower RPM's also? I can't really see any cons here to this procedure. It does make sense logically.

If you suck at shifting you will see the cons quickly. You can destroy the brass ring twice as fast. This is not a fix for bad driving rather a solution for getting the gears lined up better at high speed. I don't drive the car daily, if I did I probably wouldn't do one to two.

[Mark Morris]

Every-other-tooth off the syncro rings works pretty well when shifting quicker and/or at higher rpm. Get most of the material off the syncro tooth *carefully* with a die grinder, and smooth off what is left with the appropriate jewler's file. Brass is soft (duh) so take your time and be careful when cutting/ grinding. Clamp the ring gently in a vice with some soft jaws or a rag, and only tighten the vice just enough to hold the piece while grinding it. Be careful not to crack the syncro ring in the vice.