My All Motor 8v...Redux

[crazydubman]

hell ya it is

[MkIIRoc]

Here's a video of the first pass of the event...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhhhDfdqM9Q

And here's the 3 best slips...

Looks like it's now the fastest A/M 8 Valve around with a 110mph pass. Plans are in the works to be the first in the 11's and the quickest A/M-8v within the next few months. Don't plan on methanol though, it will be weight and suspension tuning. Methanol is currently on the back burner, since it's going to need some major work to get it running correctly.

[crazydubman]

so awesome Kris. i never get tired of watching that car. you know 11's are within its grasp. oregon here it comes haha. have you ever thought of heading out to infinion someday??? there track prep and air is so much better than sac.

[chrisbmx68]

bad ass

[8V Fury]

Congrats. I wasn't able to make it to see you run, was replacing axles and also helping my friend do stuff to his car today.

[secondgen]

bravo.

[scirocco8v1984]

Ya Ya!! 1.63 60'..... Holy Launch Batman!!! Great Job Man, My Turn This weekend ..I keep you posted on my dyno #'S This week Too!!!!!

[MkIIRoc]

Thanks everyone!

Let me know how the car does Joey... sounds like a beast and "street legal" on top of it!

[MK123GTi]

awesome hp #s. I thought I was about maxed out at 159 whp with my similar setup. Now I see there is 20 more hp to be found. My motor just blew up at the track because it was starved for fuel. I race oval track in fl, I switched from a 1/4 mile to a 1/2 mile track and It didnt occur to me that the fuel bowl would run out and lean out the motor on the longer track. I droped a valve and ran amuck on the piston and the head. So I am back to the drawing board.

Just curious what Target a/f is best for a high compression motor?
I am running 13.5/1 with 110 race gas

What total spark advance are you running?

I am running a bertil racing cam with .59 lift but I dont know what the duration is. It is deffinatly more pointier that yours. I think its out of the old usf3 motors. Who makes your cam? I think I need a different one as my power peaks at 6700 rpms I need the car to pull to 8000 rpms or I would have to change the final drive.

Awesome car

I hope I can catch you in the HP #s when I get my motot back together

Modified by MK123GTi at 1:56 PM 5-27-2009

[MkIIRoc]

Quote, originally posted by MK123GTi »

awesome hp #s. I thought I was about maxed out at 159 whp with my similar setup. Now I see there is 20 more hp to be found. My motor just blew up at the track because it was starved for fuel. I race oval track in fl, I switched from a 1/4 mile to a 1/2 mile track and It didnt occur to me that the fuel bowl would run out and lean out the motor on the longer track. I droped a valve and ran amuck on the piston and the head. So I am back to the drawing board. Just curious what Target a/f is best for a high compression motor? I am running 13.5/1 with 110 race gas What total spark advance are you running? I am running a bertil racing cam with .59 lift but I dont know what the duration is. It is deffinatly more pointier that yours. I think its out of the old usf3 motors. Who makes your cam? I think I need a different one as my power peaks at 6700 rpms I need the car to pull to 8000 rpms or I would have to change the final drive. Awesome car I hope I can catch you in the HP #s when I get my motot back together Modified by MK123GTi at 1:56 PM 5-27-2009

Have you considered an electric pump? I run an edelbrock on the drag car and a mallory on the mini. Seems to work ok, but yes, fuel starvation can be a problem. Manufacturers always rate that their pumps can "support 600 hp!" but for how long, haha.

I run mine at 12.5:1 a/f on C12 fuel from VP. Best gas out there from what I've used. Dialed it in after the first pass this past weekend, and that's what it seems to like. I let Techtonics make a master of my cam, so they can punch out more. What type of followers are you using? It's going to need 37mm followers to use it.

I run 35 degrees locked out.

Don't compare dyno to dyno though. Everyone brags about their numbers including me, but you have to look at gains. My thing was that a few changes netted me a 30whp gain. I could only have 150 on another dyno or 210 on the next. But I gained 30hp on the same dyno, and dropped 3 tenths. That's what really counts.

[MK123GTi]

Yea I am running an electric pump. I just need to turn up the pressure on the regulator. The mechanical pump on the front of the block is fake. We are not suposed tu use electric pumps.

I was trying to avoid buying new followers if I could. The cam I have now is .59 lift but with a 33mm base circle so I had to run longer valves (102mm). I am using the 35mm buckets with lash caps. I just ordered the supertech 35 42mm valve terain from TT. They are shorter valves than I run now.

What base circle is your cam? is it because of the larger base circle that you need the larger buckets
Where is the cheapest place to get the 37mm buckets?

Who did the boring of the head to fit the larger buckets?
I dont know if my machine shop can do it or not I would rather have an experienced vw person do the new seats and bucket work.

sorry if i am asking too many questions but i want to get it right this time, and you got your motor dialed in where i want to be.

thanks


Modified by MK123GTi at 11:40 AM 5-28-2009

[MkIIRoc]

Sneaky sneaky on the fuel pump, haha.

I don't remember the base circle, I'll see if the paperwork has it on it.

I run 104mm length valves with lash caps. You could try the 35mm flattop's, I thought you were running regular shim followers. I think it may hit the side of the follower though.

Eurospec machined the head, along with deeper spring pockets to run v8 valve springs..


Modified by MkIIRoc at 6:35 PM 5-28-2009

[MkIIRoc]

Alright, now it's time for readers inputs!

I need to drop some weight off the car, and here's the idea's thus far.

To me, performance comes first, looks second. I still want it to look decent though.

I'm making 2 possibly more fiberglass hood skins this weekend. 1 is spoken for and is going to oregon with me. I will see how much energy I have to punch out more. I don't think there is much interest for scirocco hood skins though.

On to the voting...

For the rear, should I...

1. Skin the hatch and put in 1/8" lexan.

2. Make a one piece pin on fiberglass hatch/spoiler/glass. Then just paint the hatch part grey, the spoiler black, and put a fake window sticker where the glass would be

3. Make the hatch out of one piece of lexan, and scuff/paint the area where the hatch would be flat black. Then just pin it on.

[bulletsballer]

#2 sounds kool but mite b spendy idk

[ny_fam]

Its not on your list but I've seen the rear wheel wells cut out an shock braces welded in.

[75injectedSB]

2 sounds about your best bet, although time consuming for sure. If the hood is not skinned already, you could start there as well. Full lexan will drop quite abit of weight.

[B4S]

If you're not already running ATV suspension and brakes in the back, do so now . Thin little 4-wheeler discs .

I'd do the hatch before the hood, mainly because you want as little weight transfer to the rear as possible, no?

[MkIIRoc]

Yes, but overall lightweight is more important. Being FWD, the weight is naturally biased forward.

Got the windshield out...it WAS crack free

Starting pushing and it splintered. Only after that happened did the idea of running guitar string through the seal and working it around pop in my head. After that, it came right out.

I though the stock windshields just had a seal...mine was bonded as well. Maybe it was replaced or I was misinformed.

[MkIIRoc]

A trip to TAP plastics today knocked my wallet down $300 for plastic, fiberglass, resin and supplies.

But I have a lexan windshield that knocked off about 16lbs. Turned out pretty good I think. Just don't sneeze, or it will scratch!

As soon as the wind quiets down I'll start on the hood. 2 layers of 8 oz glass with some baltek mat sandwiched in between. Then a gloss black gelcoat on top. Should be pretty damn stiff (they had a sample they made in the store with those fabrics) and weigh less than 15 lbs or so. That will knock off about 40lbs.

Then the same for the rear hatch, and that should save another 50lbs.


Modified by MkIIRoc at 7:40 PM 5-30-2009

[88vwFox]

SWEET!!!! this thing is crazy. i love the level you are taking the 8v to.

[littlegti84]

Are you splashing a mold off from a stock hood and then laying up the woven/Baltek/woven on that to make your hood? Just curious as I work in composites and am very interested in seeing how this turns out. As far as the hatch, you had mentioned at one point of making a glass hatch then putting a window sticker on it. Why not cut it out and then add a lexan window. Maybe I misunderstood.

[MkIIRoc]

I think that's what I'm going to do for the hatch actually.

For the hood, The mold didn't turn out as well as I would like. I'm still learing how to glass. The PVA decided to eat the paint off the the factory hood, so now I'm not so concerend about being careful.

So now I have a halfass female mold that I will try to just use as the hood itself. I'm going to gelcoat the top of this one, then spray pva, then lay mylar sheet to see how smooth it gets. I don't plan on it being great, but good practice I suppose. Man, the baltek soaks up resin like a sponge. I'll put up some pictures later. It is the shape and contour of a stock hood, just has glass weave texture on the top.

Next I will be laying the hood up with contoured wood blocks around it to build a deeper mold, then laying glass/glass/baltek/glass to make an exact copy. I'm going to build the mold strong, and brace it so I can make more if required. If that turns out good, I'll trim the first hood up to use on the rabbit ministock and use the nicer hood. Then I'll use the same technique for the hatch.

If you can offer any insight since you work in the industry, it would be appreciated. I'm kind of winging it right now.

The halfass mold/hood did come out ok, and I think some gelcoat/mylar on top will smooth it out pretty good. It weighs 5 lbs. Pretty strong, but flexible so will probably brace the underside with some 1"x1/8" aluminum strips and glass them on the bottom. Right now it's about the consistency of 3/16" lexan. Holds it's shape, but if you press in the center, it bows. Doesn't make any cracking noise, even if I bend it pretty hard.


Modified by MkIIRoc at 8:17 AM 6-1-2009

[littlegti84]

I emailed you so you have my direct email address. Be glad to help in any way I can...

Are you going to just run with the gelcoat finish or will you be painting the hood and hatch?

[scirocco8v1984]

Alright I Did It....Got the scirocco going friday about 330 and dyno at 530 all super conseritive 0 degrees cam timing and 26 overall ignition timing just to be safe! Netted 148 WHP oh yeah boy!!!!! Then sat. morning drove 35 miles to track and ran 13.7@97 MPH no stress bar same ol crusty slicks "sorry Kris Didn't have time to mount the others" I bet theres about 3 or 4 tenths left in traction and probabally another 5-10 WHP To get on the dyno....Overall a good first time out with about 75 mile on motor gonna dyno some more thursday or friday.....I'll Keep you posted on the latest....And yes thats right 13.7 @ 97MPH Also ran some 13.8 & 13.9's @ 93 MPH So Theres more .......

[MkIIRoc]

excellent buddy! Run some higher octane gas and throw about 34* of timing at it!

Get those slicks mounted too. You'll be rolling on lugnuts soon if you don't, haha.

[scirocco8v1984]

You Know It !!!! Shoulda Seen The Looks Of The Pro Bracket Racers Faces Lookin In My Engine Compartment "Wheres The Turbo!"

[littlegti84]

Are you guys running knock box ignitions or standard with MSD or something. And as far as total advance... Are their recurve kits for these distributors? I just got mine up and running, but with the original distributor...(84 GTI) without the vac advance hooked up. Any leads in the right direction here would be super.

[scirocco8v1984]

My Dist. Is The Factory 1984 scirocco One!!! Also My co-worker sells re-curved if need be,So Far I haven't had any problems and I used to have 1.8L W\ 14.1 Comp......

[idrivemyself]

Ditch your dizzy... http://www.autosportlabs.com/

A complete kit can be put together for less than the cost of a 6AL.

[MkIIRoc]

I run a mallory box to an msd coil from a locked out distributor.

idrive-

meh, we drag race. My motor launches at 6k, and stays between 5.5 and 8, so I just need basic stuff, not the fancy computer stuff. That and I don't know how to work things like that, haha. I run constant load, constant throttle.

Does that offer 3 rev limiters? Burnout, staging, and top end? Start retard, selectable retard, onboard map, window switch ( not just top end...start and stop) window retard, digital display/pushbutton interface for $199 fully assembled, no other parts to buy?

Joey, congrats on the numbers and I'm sure it will put down more. Try some C12 or similar for a pull or two and see if you pick up more power as well. I'm sure it has better burn rate and oxygen content than avgas, but I've never really looked at avgas. It makes sense to me that fuel designed for a motor to run ~2500rpm (guessing) won't work as well in a motor pulling to 7+


Modified by MkIIRoc at 6:16 PM 6-1-2009

[idrivemyself]

You got me there. It doesn't currently offer all of the features you listed but I'm sure you could add in your Mallory box for the rest...

But it fits my bill for roundy-round racing.

Nice job on the windshield btw.


Modified by idrivemyself at 3:06 AM 6-2-2009

[MkIIRoc]

Thanks.

Yep, if it works, stick with it. Seems like a good price. I wonder if they can add that kind of stuff later with software/hardware updates.

[crazydubman]

im liking that windshield a lot Esh.

its 1/8" right? thats NHRA spec? did you use rivits or screws for mounting it? did you seal it with anything or just bolted it straight?

[littlegti84]

Thanks to all of you for all of the information. I planned to get mine running with the stock ignition and go from there. Now that I have had it running with the electric fuel pump and coil and such temporarily bolted to the core support, it's time to permanently mount the coil and the "little black box" and such (deleted the rain tray, so all of the original mounting points are gone) I thought I'd see if I should be running something different. Sounds like I should be ok if I keep the total advance reasonable and stick with premium... and keep my ears open for the slightest hint of detonation.

[kenny_blankenship]

for hatch: Smash out the glass, then replace it with lexan