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    VWVortex


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    Thread: 84 GTI engine swap

    1. 06-19-2009 10:14 PM #1
      Had this car for about 2 years, body in great shape, engine... well it runs reliably, but would need some TLC to bring it back to it's full glory.
      My dilemma was what to do... massage the old dog back to life and keep it original... or take a fantastic base and make it something more.
      I went with making it more.
      Base Car:
      1984 VW Mk1 Rabbit GTI Convertible - West German Manufacture
      1.8L 90hp w/5sp manual trans





      Modified by rstolz at 7:32 PM 6-19-2009
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    2. 06-19-2009 10:22 PM #2
      id say unless you plan on restoring it to stock, throw something kickass in there

    3. 06-19-2009 10:39 PM #3
      Which is what I did:
      After a couple months of research and a couple more convincing the wife that it was a perfectly reasonable option
      Here's what I found:
      1.8T 225 hp AMU engine from a 2001 audiTT quattro w / 6sp manual trans.

      All looked perfect and sweet ...
      Until the first dry fit... Couldn't get the dam trans to fit
      After more research, and a contact working within Audi/VW, that thing just isn't gonna fit. Bummer, there goes my 6sp
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    4. 06-19-2009 10:49 PM #4
      So we pulled the tranny... pain in the rectum, spent an hour trying to pull the thing only to find out we missed a bolt
      Second dry fit w/out trans:


      beautiful.
      more research has turned up that I can fit a VR6 5sp tranny... parts are ordered. Unfortunately new CV's, shafts and hubs are needed, which means the very cool 4-bolt VW alloys have to go and be replaced by 5-bolt wheels
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    5. Member
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      06-20-2009 07:01 AM #5
      Shouldn't the trans fit buy trimming some of the inner fender well?

    6. Senior Member urogolf's Avatar
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      06-20-2009 08:56 AM #6
      cabby gti?
      would a g60 or passat 16v o2a trans fit?
      ................................................www.CCCIS.com

    7. Member macosxuser's Avatar
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      06-20-2009 09:38 AM #7
      Yeah, you should be looking for a 4cyl O2a (I think mines from a Corrado G60...) I don't think the VR6 02(x) ones bolt up to the 1.8t. Also any 4cyl O2j should work as well.
      Quote Originally Posted by sandrunner View Post
      Every time I paint a motorcycle, I take it out in the grass and gently set it down on its side after reassembly but prior to the first ride. It breaks the magnetic attraction between fresh paint and the ground.

    8. 06-21-2009 02:46 AM #8
      We're all talking about the same trans... see link - 02A trans is the one I have, same as used on G60 and vr6 Jetta III models.
      http://www.zelek.com/diagram_c...t.htm
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    9. 06-21-2009 03:25 AM #9
      It may have been possible, but there would have been extensive modifications needed, and i blew a lot of my budget on the engine.
      So to keep things simpler, I went with the 5sp tranny.
      From what I understand:
      Even if it did fit, or I made it fit (like pushing a square into a circle opening... we'll make it fit!)
      The 6sp quattro trans would either have needed internal mods to make it run as a FWD, or I would have needed to set the car up as an AWD (very cool idea, I just don't have the $$$ for it).
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    10. 06-23-2009 07:10 PM #10
      Quote, originally posted by macosxuser »
      Yeah, you should be looking for a 4cyl O2a (I think mines from a Corrado G60...) I don't think the VR6 02(x) ones bolt up to the 1.8t. Also any 4cyl O2j should work as well.

      My apologies, You were right on that account. The bolt pattern is different
      The guy who gave me the information about the VR6 got a stern (something like this ) phone call.
      Also Looking into boring the new hubs to fit a 4-lug setup so i can run the wheels I have now... I know about potential torque issues if I decided to drag race (snap), but beyond that is there anything else I might watch for?
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    11. Member -teknien-'s Avatar
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      06-23-2009 07:32 PM #11
      no such thing as a cabby gti..
      good luck with the swap.
      Quote Originally Posted by g60vw View Post
      If I thought like that I would have gotten out of mk1's back when they were still A1's
      Quote Originally Posted by goosler View Post
      screw all of you & your stupid cars.........see you at madness!
      I'm a 1%er

    12. 06-23-2009 10:33 PM #12
      Quote, originally posted by -teknien- »
      no such thing as a cabby gti...

      exactly my thoughts

    13. Member s-rocc's Avatar
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      bunch of old german junk
      06-23-2009 11:20 PM #13
      Quote, originally posted by rstolz »
      Also Looking into boring the new hubs to fit a 4-lug setup so i can run the wheels I have now... I know about potential torque issues if I decided to drag race (snap), but beyond that is there anything else I might watch for?

      there is absolutely no reason why you need to go 5 lug to run an 02a. i suggest you stop listening to whoever is telling you what you need to do to put this car together. you could run a damn 020 with that motor if you wanted to (although i wouldn't reccomend it). a vr6 02a (corrado slc or mk3 vr6) and a 4 cyl 02a (from either corrado g60 or b3 passat 16v) have different bellhousings. you do not need/want a trans from a vr6.
      you will have no problems with torqu and 4 lug hubs. you would need MASSIVE power and drag slicks before you started breaking lugs off.
      this / is / where / your / sweet / mods / go

    14. 06-12-2015 11:39 AM #14
      I've always regretted leaving this one open ended so many years ago. If you've seen me post around, you know I did "finish" the project... 3 or 4 times in the intervening years.

      In the interest of closure, here is a synopsis of what has occurred. This project was a lot of "firsts" for me;
      automotive wiring,
      using a multimeter,
      reading wiring diagrams,
      fabrication (any, but...) including mounts, exhaust, brackets, etc.
      First suspension install,
      turbo motor,
      pulling an engine,
      pulling a trans,
      replacing a clutch,
      taking apart an axle... you get the idea

      back in '09, I stopped posting the build. I wasn't getting out of it what I thought I would, and it was getting embarrassing to keep finding out that my "good sources" were basically full of **** (sorry for the language, mod). I stepped back, stopped listening to anyone, did my own research, moved the car to a new location, and continued the work on my own.

      This won't be a strict chronological pictorial tale, should be close though:


      From above you know I originally had a 6sp from an AWD TT. I ended up trading that for a pile of mostly useful parts.


      As you also know, I bought a VR6 02A... that was stupid. And was the last time I listened to ANYONE else. Shipped that thing back in the same condition and in better packaging (I am a packaging engineer, it's what I do). The supplier said it arrived cracked, and they wouldn't refund anything (lying sack of ****, sorry again).

      I swallowed it and bought a g60 02A from them, as they eventually discounted it, at least.

      That arrived ok, in really ****ty packaging, but apparently unharmed. i took pics and sent them to the supplier side by side with how i had packed the trans i sent them, with a few choice words. No further communication.

      Back to car work. I acquired a beautiful lightweight (14lb) flywheel and VR6 clutch setup from Mobile One in Glenview, IL. Same guys I traded the 6sp to. Good group, nice guys.

      I bought a set of axles from them and a worn out 02A shift box/cables.

      Went together, easy as pie. Modified my axles with teh 100mm axle flanges from the set I bought: piece of cake. a block of wood, a hammer, and a lot degreaser, and the axles were completely rebuilt, both sides.


      (yes the bearings were installed too)

      Installed a very pretty set of Weitec GTN coilovers, ordered from the UK. Literally 1/2 the price of what I would have paid stateside. Including the shipping.



      In between all this we fab'd up motor mounts:

      washed engine bay:


      and made mounts:




      I can't find a picture of the passenger side mount.
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    15. 06-12-2015 11:41 AM #15
      It was at this point the car was moved to it's second location. No pics, but it was a crappy barn on my grandparents old farm... lots of space and a smooth cement floor, but terrible lighting and I had to use a generator to run anything more demanding than a drill. This, I think, was spring of '10.

      At this point I fab'd up a full T-back exhaust, 2.5" (my first ever exhaust fab work). again no pics on hand, I'll add when I find 'em. I had someone else weld the downpipe, which worked fine, but the measurements were off, and it hung down too low.

      By August of that year (2010), I got sick of it's second home 1.5 hour drive away) and moved it to my (new, we had purchased the house in May) garage. A deep 2.5 car, this pic is from 2012, after building a real work bench.


      With the engine, trans, and exhaust in place, it was time for wiring... the first time...
      I don't think I have any pics. I was able to wire up the 1.8T engine harness to the Mk1 wiring. it was ugly, but it... usually... worked. As with most of the car, this was my first foray into automotive wiring. I taught myself how to read the diagrams, strip, crimp, solder, and use a meter. tedious and stressful, but immensely satisfying when it turned over the first time.

      I was able to get it driving at this point. Unfortunately it was plagued with electrical gremlins. ground shorts and other issues. And when it did run, it wasn't running right.

      A marathon of fixes later, and most of the basic mechanical issues were sorted. new sensors, new soft vac lines, new coil packs, MAF and TiP.

      Still wasn't right


      tripped across a good deal for a complete harness, in-car and engine side. bought that and installed it:
      . lots of wires.

      got it running with it's second wiring. Still not right. found numerous splits in coil pack section of harness. replaced coil pack harness.


      much better. also replaced intake manifold gasket, PRV and DV. All leaky.

      On the road again, and this happens:


      On the road again...

      trans blows up. Diff let go, pinion shaft sheared...

      Send out trasn for rebuild. LSD install. takes 3 months due to back-ordered and unavailable syncro parts.

      At about the same time, since the engine is out I install 034 silicone PCV hoses, VC gasket... and attempt to trim the wire harness...which goes terribly... I get it to work, but it's a terrible hack job.

      relocated and reran intercooler and piping. Originally sitting in front of the radiator, I move it to under the bumper, make brackets to angle it backwards and paint it black. Gives me a little more space for the radiator.
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    16. 06-12-2015 11:42 AM #16
      Due to the hacked wiring I take the plunge to full standalone management, ditch the garbage job i did on the mkIV harness, and go from scratch.

      Old wiring:


      New Wiring:


      At this point we're getting into 2013. As part of this process I also redo the exhaust routing (my skills are vastly improved from the first time), and (I also have a better job) buy an aftermarket downpipe; has to come from UK, becasue no one stateside makes an AMU 1.8T to Mk1 downpipe (can't blame them).
      Sorry, no pics on hand.

      With everything installed:


      Get it running. Missing and dies. Logs look rough... Compression test reveals almost no compression on cyl. 4.

      Well... Frack.

      Send the engine out for a top dollar rebuild. We're in summer of 2013 now. November sees my twin boys born. 2 weeks later I get the engine back. It sits until April/May 2014. before reinstalling the engine I replace all the vacuum hard lines.

      With the engine back in I get her going again... runs much smoother... but... of course, right?

      smoking like crazy, oil leaking from turbo and smells terribly of oil.

      Pull the turbo, find this:

      cracked exhaust housing...

      proceed with researching and rebuilding turbo. Locate a new exhaust casting out on ebay, from Latvia. Gotta be better than chinese, right?


      that pretty much ends 2014.

      enter 2015.

      replaced the 02A shifter, needed new cables anyway, and it was a good deal for the whole unit. put the interior back in, and am cleaning it all up.

      so far this year it's driving great. Even if it hasn't been farther than 10 minutes from home.


      Things not mentioned but encountered:
      blown brake booster
      SAI delete
      heater core delete.
      All other emissions delete
      A/C delete.
      Crank sensor failure
      CTS failure
      Starter failure
      fried one light switch
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    17. Member wolf_walker's Avatar
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      06-12-2015 01:18 PM #17
      You deserve a medal Sir. Learning the hard way, bad luck and perseverance!
      One man's garbage is another man person's good un-garbage....

    18. 06-12-2015 02:38 PM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by wolf_walker View Post
      You deserve a medal Sir. Learning the hard way, bad luck and perseverance!
      haha, yea, thanks, i certainly had a few, and the dammed thing was really close to being punted twice.


      In the end the engine was not as advertised. I bought it advertised at 40k miles. no way it had less than 140k.

      I certainly do not recommend for people to jump into a project the way i did. A great way to learn, but just brutal... and hard on the pocketbook.
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

    19. 08-03-2015 03:41 PM #19
      Add another to the list. DV failure. Again. Have slow spool and DV honking with a little flutter at peak boost of 15-16psi. At least I can still drive it though, and the repair is simple.

      I've put probably a 100 miles on it now with the DV being the only serious issue, and that one won't stop me from driving it, so finally a big .

      The only other concern is with the cluster; I'm not confident in the tach under heavy load or quick transitions. I may try a new crank sensor first, but it doesn't feel like it's a crank sensor fail, more like the tach needle isn't responding to inputs properly. My shop laptop won't run without being plugged in, so getting logs from the QPeng standalone would require wiring in a power inverter, which I don't feel like doing right now.

      I don't like the idea of buying another used cluster that may be as bad or worse than what I have...
      Apparently I am Snarky and condescending. That may be true, but just remember, I am completely calm while being so.

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