Another wiper motor failure due to aftermarket HIDs

[njpeteo]

I have 06 A3 2.0T no convenience/tech package. I have bought a 35W 6000k kit from HIDXenonLights.com for $79.99, plug & play. After the initial install, I have experienced a flickering issue where my lights flickered like strobe lights with the engine on (I didn't power from the battery and no relay used) I have fixed that by installing the anti flicker capacitor harness (plug and play). The lights work without any problems but the wiper motor is shot. Wipers didn't work the very next morning after the initial installation. I did searched this topic extensively but could not find any reasons explaining why this is happening. Do you guys thinkg the the flickering issue could be somehow related to the motor failure? Thanks...

[the4ringer]

hmm, im interested in hearing the cause/solution to this. i heard about the wiper motor issues previously, but i thought it was only occurring on the conv/tech package. Im looking into HIDs as well, having none of the packages mentioned, this is now a concern for me.

I looked up the site/link and it doesnt show anything about being a digital ballast. I'm wondering if thats the cause/root f the prob.

[terje_77]

You have to use a VagCom prevent the wiper motor burnout.

[tiptronic]

Could you tell us where did you install the ballast (location in the engine bay) So far, based on ur issue- it didnt matter whether it is 35w or 55w that causes the wiper-motor burnout issue.

(knock on wood- once again) I havent had any issues with the VVME kit i have, i have a new 35w Kit by Retro-solutions waiting to get installed and although it is digital (VVMEs are not) I am beginning to become concerned about longevity of my wiper-motor. I havent VAG-com my headlight set-up at all and i have driven for 35k miles without any issues.
I dont turn on my car with HIDs on - cause i know that there's a ''systems-check" that the ecu performs with the car (power check-where i see my custom LEDs and the rear OEM led tails flashes 6 times at start-up, Wipers also does a quick check by moving the arms about a quarter inch- i guess to get into 'ready' mode-) Im thinking with this ''power check'' i cant be sure if thats related to HID kits causing a power surge that burns the wiper motor

e


Modified by tiptronic at 5:11 PM 6/22/2009

[mkim]

Quote, originally posted by terje_77 »

You have to use a VagCom prevent the wiper motor burnout.

Plus a bypass/relay thingy. Vagcom won't solve it. Been there done that. Dealer fixed it no question asked but i did have to hide the fact that the hid blew it by putting stock parts back in

[tiptronic]

Quote, originally posted by mkim »

Plus a bypass/relay thingy. Vagcom won't solve it. Been there done that. Dealer fixed it no question asked but i did have to hide the fact that the hid blew it by putting stock parts back in

mkim- can you tell us what hid kit set-up did you have? (watts, ballast type, location of the ballast at install, etc)

e

[MisterJJ]

Quote, originally posted by mkim »

Plus a bypass/relay thingy. Vagcom won't solve it. Been there done that. Dealer fixed it no question asked but i did have to hide the fact that the hid blew it by putting stock parts back in

Wow. The bypass/relay should take any direct electrical issue with the ballast completely out of the equation. Seems like the only possible cause left is some kind of indirect interference from the ballast location. I've had xTec (non-digital) strapped to the outside of the headlight housings and I also have VVME ballasts strung up behind the bumper for the fogs. No relays and no VAG-COM changes. No problem. Oh... I also have convenience package.

[njpeteo]

[QUOTE=tiptronic]Could you tell us where did you install the ballast (location in the engine bay) [QUOTE]

I installed the ballasts on the sides of the housings...

[Gryphon001]

My ballasts are installed in underneath the housings, in the locations for the stock HID ballasts. I have a 55W kit though and the wiper motor blew about 2 weeks after the kit was put in. Dealer replaced the motor no questions asked, with the HID's still in the car, but I am afraid that it's only a matter of time before the motor blows again. I'm just looking around for a good kit that will work without blowing the wiper motor.

I've been told that these guys have a good product and I believe Tiptronic has been using these for a while without any issues with the wiper motor.

http://www.xtechid.com/products.php

... good luck.

What is this that people are talking about VagCom? What exactly would need to be done to the headlight set up to help reduce the risk of a blow out???


Modified by Gryphon001 at 8:48 PM 6/22/2009

[the4ringer]

im gonna check this guy out. read every page of the thread and thoroughly checked out his site, as well as asked him a few questions of my own, and seems pretty solid.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...age=1

[MisterJJ]

This is so weird. There seems to be no consistent reason for this. Maybe it has something to do with the brand. I don't think I've heard of any reports of failures by someone using the expensive xTec or the super cheap VVME.

P.S. I just noticed that njpeteo is from Wallington, NJ. Dude, I used to live there. Born in Passaic. At 5 years old I knew enough to get out of there though.

[mkim]

Quote, originally posted by the4ringer »

im gonna check this guy out. read every page of the thread and thoroughly checked out his site, as well as asked him a few questions of my own, and seems pretty solid. http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...age=1

that's what i bought. Came without the can bus and it blew the wiper motor. Told him and he sent me the can bus for audi and now it hasn't caused any problem for 3 months so far. Apparently VW and audi is different somehow he said? he said VW hasn't caused any wiper motor problems. By the way his kit is good i recommend

[tiptronic]

the4ringer,

I read through the Vortex post- the rep from Direct Connection Tuning stated that only A3s with Auto headlights/wipers had the wiper issues. I thought that i read a couple of post in Tude that had the wiper motior issue and [they] didnt have auto lights and/or wiper...

As for the can-bus adapter- Im thinking of getting it just to try... It looks like it will work also with the VVME set up (and the digital setup i have from RetroSolutions) The Ballast shown from Direct Conn is very similar to the VVME ballast. The retrosloution bulbs however, is better designed (metal based) and re-designed arch location to compensate that it will be used in housings/projections made for halogen- and they fit with the VVMEs ballast too!

e

[RallyPlaya]

Well im looking to install my 35W 6000k HIDs on my 06 A3, i have the Sport, Premium, and Winter Pkg, hopefully i dont get these flickering lights and Wiper problems, i have a 2 yr warranty on the HID kit, So Hopefully it works out for me il keep you posted, il probably install the kit Wednesday

[the4ringer]

Quote, originally posted by tiptronic »

the4ringer, I read through the Vortex post- the rep from Direct Connection Tuning stated that only A3s with Auto headlights/wipers had the wiper issues. I thought that i read a couple of post in Tude that had the wiper motior issue and [they] didnt have auto lights and/or wiper... As for the can-bus adapter- Im thinking of getting it just to try... It looks like it will work also with the VVME set up (and the digital setup i have from RetroSolutions) The Ballast shown from Direct Conn is very similar to the VVME ballast. The retrosloution bulbs however, is better designed (metal based) and re-designed arch location to compensate that it will be used in housings/projections made for halogen- and they fit with the VVMEs ballast too! e

yeah, im not sure about that either. I tried gettin info on the same thing and much to no avail, same results. from what i read, the can bus is for anti-flickering. Though i have heard some people need it. some dont, and theres no way of knowing if you need it or not. I think for the extra $30, its better to get it anyway. Youre still makin off like a bandit on the kit itself.

Quote, originally posted by mkim »

that's what i bought. Came without the can bus and it blew the wiper motor. Told him and he sent me the can bus for audi and now it hasn't caused any problem for 3 months so far. Apparently VW and audi is different somehow he said? he said VW hasn't caused any wiper motor problems. By the way his kit is good i recommend

yeah guy seems pretty solid. saw a few of your postings there as well, heh. what kit did you end up gettin? 6k? 8k? you have any pics ?

[HonDee-A3]

is there a spec for the can bus, i mean what exactly does the can bus do does it act like an transformer?
i ran 40W 6500k before and it blew mine motor when i had in auto switched-in.

[njpeteo]

Quote, originally posted by HonDee-A3 »

is there a spec for the can bus, i mean what exactly does the can bus do does it act like an transformer? i ran 40W 6500k before and it blew mine motor when i had in auto switched-in.

I have bought mine on ebay and it eliminated any flickering issues. I have no idea if it would prevent the wiper motor failure as I installed it after I blew the motor. I will be replacing the wiper motor this week so we'll see what happens...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...A1318

[MisterJJ]

Can someone confirm a case of wiper motor failure and NO flickering issues? I wonder if there is a direct link with the flickering.

[tiptronic]

I see that the can-bus device for anti-flicker is cheaper at the ebay site you provided. Less than the ones sold at Direct Connections.. I can only assume that they are of the same specs (if anything)... I will be placing an order for this. It's never too late to add one to my existing set-up.

e

[HonDee-A3]

tiptronic,
what's your ballast wattage again, think i've asked u this before....sorry.
i thought the theory behind to solve motor blown issue is to change to correct wattage so correct current are flown for the motor since electronic wise, headlight unit and motor are shared the same circuit.

[MisterJJ]

Quote, originally posted by HonDee-A3 »

tiptronic, what's your ballast wattage again, think i've asked u this before....sorry. i thought the theory behind to solve motor blown issue is to change to correct wattage so correct current are flown for the motor since electronic wise, headlight unit and motor are shared the same circuit.

Well... the latest report here is from someone with a 35w system. It would be great if everyone who has experienced a wiper moter failure could list all relevant stats. like:

Model Year
Conv/Tech Package
Auto lights
Ballast maker
Ballast wattage
Digital Ballast
Relay used
Anti-flicker device used
Location of Ballast
Vag-com changes
Did lights have flickering problem
Time before motor failure

P.S. Anybody have the wiring diagram showing the headlights and wiper motor?

P.P.S. Anybody have a spare blown motor that can be taken apart to see what exactly is "blown"?

[whizbang18T]

my 35w drop-in HIDs from retro solutions have been trouble free for the last 1.5yrs

[mike3141]

I believe what "blows" is the electronic motor controls failing due to voltage spikes.

[Gryphon001]

Here is mine, at least as much info as I have been able to come up with:

Model Year: 2008

Conv/Tech Package: NO

Auto lights: NO

Ballast maker: Ziitaku

Ballast wattage: 55W

Digital Ballast: Not sure, but I doubt it.

Relay used: Relay was put in first day, several hours after the kit went in. Had to remove it because it started causing some issues with the lights flickering and going out on top of the annoying 'bulb out' warning.

Anti-flicker device used: NO

Location of Ballast: Stock balast mount under the housing. Used screws and 3m tape to mount.

Vag-com changes: None relating to lighting. Only the window/roof remote close/open.

Did lights have flickering problem: Not noticed innitially when my mechanic installed them but as soon as the relay was put in it started. Lights go out when high beams are flicked and sometimes do not come back on (bulb out warning). Lights also take a long time to warm up.

Time before motor failure: Can't be really sure but around 2 weeks. Got them in at the end of March and so far have had no issues since other than the ones mentioned above^^^

Hope that will help narrow down the issue. I have a vested interest in getting this problem sorted out.

p.s. The measures I have take so far to try to reduce the risk of a blow out is to not turn on my wipers while the HID's are still warming up and to make sure the wipers are off if I am going to turn on my headlights. Not sure if that would make much of a difference, but I am trying anyways...


Modified by Gryphon001 at 7:27 AM 6/24/2009

[tiptronic]

I havent had any issues (yet)

model year 2007
Conv/Tech Package: No
Auto lights: No
Ballast maker: VVME LLC
Ballast wattage: 35w With 6000k H7 Xenon Bulbs.
Digital Ballast: No
Relay used: No- direct connection to existing Light bulb harness
Anti-flicker device used: No, but in process of ordering Can-Bus anti flicker module.
Location of Ballast: Stock location under the headlamp housings intended for Ballast mounting. 3M heavy duty adhesives.
Vag-com changes: Non- specific to the headlamps. VAGged- LED tails and rear-fogs and auto up/down window control
Did lights have flickering problem: NO- only slight dimming when Brakes are depressed (after installation and vagging of LED tails)
Time before motor failure: n/a Still Working 35k miles

Here are VVME's Ballast specs:
Lamp
Output 35 W
Nominal voltage 85 V
Nominal light output 3.200 lumen
Operating temperature -40°C-+85 °C
Lifetime >3000hours
High voltage converter and ignitor
Operational input voltage 8-32 VDC
Maximum input current 8 A
Minimum voltage loaded (lamp on) 60 V
Maximum voltage loaded (lamp on) 120 V
Output voltage from ignitor
Nominal voltage 23.000 V
Minimum voltage 18.000 V

Here are Retro-Solutions

DIGITAL
35 watts output
Ballast Control Full Digital
Efficiency >90%
Input voltage 8 - 32 vdc
Starting Current < 6.5 A
Hot Restrike Protection Full Protection
Plug and Play Yes
Radio interference None
Ballast defective rate < 0.05% (< 1:2000)
Ballast Lifespan 3500 hrs
Bulbs Lm variability +/- 100
Bulb CCT variability +/- 200
Bulb lifespan 3500 hrs
Life Expectancy (Avg.)4 - 7 years

[the4ringer]

*cough* add to diy sticky *cough*

[Gryphon001]

Hey Tiptronic, when you get your retro-solutions kit installed let me know how you like it. I am looking into it myself now.

[rish1103]

Quote, originally posted by MisterJJ »

Well... the latest report here is from someone with a 35w system. It would be great if everyone who has experienced a wiper moter failure could list all relevant stats. like: Model Year Conv/Tech Package Auto lights Ballast maker Ballast wattage Digital Ballast Relay used Anti-flicker device used Location of Ballast Vag-com changes Did lights have flickering problem Time before motor failure P.S. Anybody have the wiring diagram showing the headlights and wiper motor? P.P.S. Anybody have a spare blown motor that can be taken apart to see what exactly is "blown"?

This is a good idea but how about starting a seperate thread for this? helps weed out the back and forth clutter?

it would also be good if people could provide where they bought their can bus anti flicker module.

I have a vvme 35w kit. I ordered it a couple of weeks ago but I havent installed it yet. I'm still trying to figure out if anything conclusive turns up with this flickering issue.

[tiptronic]

Quote, originally posted by Gryphon001 »

Hey Tiptronic, when you get your retro-solutions kit installed let me know how you like it. I am looking into it myself now.

I was customizing my 2nd FK projectors w/ new LEDs..and was waiting to get that finished then install the Retro-solutions kit.. However, I dont think i will finish the project soon enough, so i might just get the bumpers off, and just install the retrosolution on the existing set up.
as a matter of fact, there is nothing wrong w/ the VVME ballast, so i might just use the Retro-solution's bulbs and see about their 'claim' for best focused/evenly spread light output....

I also have the can-bus code/error/anti-flicker module- waiting to get installed (got it via ebay- $28 plus change for a pair)- i should be able to just reach through the enginebay and attache it to the existing ballast. as for the bulbs however, the H7 clamps are not the best and is a PITA to install (w/out taking bumpers/headlamps off)

When will i get that done.. hmmm..this weekend maybe too busy


Modified by tiptronic at 11:13 AM 6/30/2009

[TPE_A3]

No offense guys...

But I find it fascinating the lengths enthusiasts who bought non-HID cars are willing to go to install HIDs! If they are THAT important (given the known issues aftermarkets cause) why not simply not buy a car unless they have the HIDs?

I do appreciate the aesthetics etc of my HIDs on my TT, and yes, honestly, would not have bought a TT without HIDs...but from a driving point of view...in MOST driving situations, the HIDs, while superior to Halogen, are not so much better that the halogens are unacceptable.

Just a comment from the peanut gallery. I do admire your ingenuity, knowledge and perseverance to get these things to work properly!

[Gryphon001]

In many cases it is not the case of the HID's being superior to halogens, it is a case of esthetics. As for not buying non-HID cars... all to often it's not an option. I find most A3's I see in Canada don't have HID lights. It was just part of an expensive package when you bought the car new, was much cheaper to retrofit and most people were not aware of the technical issues involved. As far as I know Audis are the only cars that have this issue, I've never heard of it happening on any other car. In my case the car was bought off the showroom floor so I didn't even have a say in the matter. Believe me if I could have gotten the Bi-Xenons as a stand alone option I would have forked up the cash at the dealership.

Over all I think it's kind of retarded that you can get Bi-Xenons on a friggin Rabbit now for less money than on an A3. I don't see them being very different lights and now I see more Rabbits with Bi-Xenons than A3's.

That's my little rant for today...

[tiptronic]

Quote, originally posted by TPE_A3 »

No offense guys... But I find it fascinating the lengths enthusiasts who bought non-HID cars are willing to go to install HIDs! If they are THAT important (given the known issues aftermarkets cause) why not simply not buy a car unless they have the HIDs?

Because the A3 model i have is what i can afford then.... I cudve easily gotten a GTI or a mazdaspeed3 but i wanted an Audi. Some of us cannot afford a 33k audi for the added options.
Halogens are indeed acceptable- but HIDs are better- at least in my case.

[Gryphon001]

LOL... over 32K is the base price for the A3's in Canada. Mine was about 42K out the door. and to get the HID's it was part of a $2500 package that included only auto dimming mirrors, rain sensing wipers and a few extra lights.

[tiptronic]

Okay, so today, i managed to get a day off, decided to tackle installing my new HID kit (RetroSolutions Digital HID). I pranced around the house all day and decided to do the light project around 4ish. I finished (re-aiming, etc.) at 1030p...motherf....

Anyway, the kit, as mentioned is from RetroSolutions. Digital HID, 6000k bulbs, 35w. I also recieved in the mail the can-bus code error module.

With the talks about wiper-motor- I am a bit concerned if this new kit will be my downfall- since i've been using the VVME kit for 30k miles w/out a hitch. I was only going to install the bulbs and keep using the VVME ballasts and also add the can-bus module. I eventually dediced to clean up the VVME install, and use all new parts from RS. I have mentioned before on another post that the ballast from VVME and the ballast from RS are of the same size, casing and only a few differences on operating specs (except the RS has lower amperage for start ups and re-strikes). The only difference I see from the ballasts is the label/spec info- plus RS being 'digital'. The Bulbs on the other hand has a very distiguishable difference from that of VVME's. It is shorter, and the arch location is slightly off- to compensate the halogen's filament location. These xenon bulbs are designed, as i read and gathered, for original halogen housings. The FKs projections i currently have are made for halogens (incidentally, the new dayline led headlamps from the GB are made for halogen bulbs).

As a result, the output is an even blanket of very white light (it's whiter not bluer like that of VVME's, although same kelvin temp, and the VVEM's output has a distinct bright spots upfront). The cut offs are fairly same, it is as sharp as it was w/ VVME's The output, IMO, is that of an OEM A3 hids (almost).

With the can-bus module installed. I'm not sure if it is RS's digital ballast or the work of the can-bus module- but the start-ups are 'softer' and full output is achieved sooner (5-7 seconds) while the previous VVME took minimum 15seconds for full brightness, and start-ups are typical bright flash, then softens and gradually achieves brightness.

Again, it's either the Can-bus or the RS's digital ballast- but i no longer have that slight interference when depressing the brakes. Used to, w/ the VVME's, when i depresse the brakes, the HID output will have that noticeable (for me) interference in the form of quick dimming of the lights (blink of an eye). parking into my garage, it was quite noticeable as the brighit spots on the wall show's the unstable interference from appying accel or brakes... W/ the CAn-bus and Digital ballast combination, i see no distiguishable interference at all. I'm happy.

I did try the wiper's and it worked fine.......................so far.

I have restarted and shut-off the car half dozen times already, and wiper still works............................................. ..........so far.

I will try to keep u guys updated w/ the progress as to the performance of these kit

I want to share also a bit of a scare experience when i installed these kits. After installation, i fired them up, and NICE... Then turned it off. So i cleaned up a bit, (not installed bumpers yet), then wanted to check it out again, and fired it up again, then let it sit for 10minutes for burn-in of the bulbs. came back out, then shut them off. Started putting the bumper back (also installed S3 grill- just wanted to see if i like it..i do, but that gap at the bottom bothers me..i'll keep it on for now, but will eventually return back to prems or Sline(need to get it painted) as i re-fitted the bumpers back on- i wanted to fire them up again- and the right was flickering like a strobe light- WTF?! turned it off, turned car off, then on again--and fired it up- still flickering- checked connections of the can-bus, and all were fine, fit, tight. I was like- " freaking ballast is probably bad ". just to check agani, i turned them on again, and this time both sides were strobbing like i'm in a dance club! I was panicked! Then i noticed the battery symbol was flashing on the mfd along w/ bulb out (fogs disconnected) . I tried to start the engine and all i heard was that dreadful "tktktktktkkktktktktk'
DAMN! i d rained the battery! I just realized for the amost-6 hours that i was working on the car- I had the doors open, the stereo going, and did not noticed that i left the interior lamps at full blast- constant on. D'uh! I was also watching British F1 gp on my laptop) So- I pulled up the good'ol Passat and jumped her- YAY! she started, and the HIDs fired-up BEAUTIFULLY!.

Drove around the block- and had to re-aim the right side (also, i forgot to put a customized hard foam "washer" so that the clamps will have a good tight pressure on the bulbs on the projector seat- obviously a common flaw on these cheap headlight/H7 applications). I re-seated the bulbs - so that the output/cut off is proper. The left side was fine, as i managed to remember to tighten it up w/ the custom washer i made.

I drove it about 5miles RT- from my house- via a 2 mile canyon drive, then back to the freeway loop back to my house. Drove thru some rutted roads to see if they will wobble like the VVMEs in these FKs- and they are as sturdy as OEM! I'm satisfied so far!...

i'm tired, bed-time.

e


Modified by tiptronic at 12:00 AM 7/2/2009

[HonDee-A3]

i encountered the same ended up changing the battery literally, bcos think i much over tried without starting up the car.
how ever it seems that the retro fit you got's a good solution for the FK's "wobble" issue, cos i had that issue also, but as the main concern, motor issue, i've got couple of theories on my side that no-auto switch cars would not suffer, or if u do have auto switch, manually switch the light.

fingers crossed for you tip and well done, show us ur new set up~