Granite's 1982 Scirocco Update Thread

[Granitethewolf]

Quote, originally posted by vwdaun »

Just out of curiosity, what viscosity oil did you put in? VW engines like thicker oil - generally 10w40 or 20w50 in the summer. Too thin an oil will cause the buzzer / light to come on because of low oil pressure, just like it's supposed to.

I put in 5w30 oil, so what should I change it to now- 10w40 or 20w50? I'm guessing I can keep my new oil filter on there that I changed with the 5w30 oil right? Lastly will it harm the engine to drive it on the 5w30 oil or should I stop driving it until I get the oil changed out again?

I also did put in newish spark plugs- they are semi used that I used to have in my 89 honda accord. They are bosch platinum +2's and side by side of the plugs that were in the car they were a near perfect match by thread length. I hope they are okay to use.

Today I picked up a new cap & rotor, some new spark plug wires are on the way, and lastly I picked up a bottle of chevron/techron fuel system cleaner.

[xenergy_one]

Quote, originally posted by Granitethewolf »

I put in 5w30 oil, so what should I change it to now- 10w40 or 20w50? I'm guessing I can keep my new oil filter on there that I changed with the 5w30 oil right? Lastly will it harm the engine to drive it on the 5w30 oil or should I stop driving it until I get the oil changed out again? I also did put in newish spark plugs- they are semi used that I used to have in my 89 honda accord. They are bosch platinum +2's and side by side of the plugs that were in the car they were a near perfect match by thread length. I hope they are okay to use. Today I picked up a new cap & rotor, some new spark plug wires are on the way, and lastly I picked up a bottle of chevron/techron fuel system cleaner.

Using the wrong type of oil can be serious. I have the same engine and I run Castrol GTX 20w 50. I get it for $11 for a 5 quart jug at wal-mart. I don't think you need to worry about a little of the 5w 30 be left in the oil filter.

[Granitethewolf]

Quote, originally posted by xenergy_one »

Using the wrong type of oil can be serious. I have the same engine and I run Castrol GTX 20w 50. I get it for $11 for a 5 quart jug at wal-mart. I don't think you need to worry about a little of the 5w 30 be left in the oil filter.

Ah, good to know. I'll go pick some up tonight- I think I will change the oil to the castrol GTX 20w50 tonight too

Anyway just got done installing the new cap/rotor and as i guessed didnt make much of a difference....but tinkering around I did find out (I think) that my fuel injector seals are shot.

While idling I sprayed some carb cleaner at the base of each fuel injector on the intake manifold and every single injector made the idle either smoothed out or sputtered worse making it miss.....
Bad fuel injector seals....no?

Now I am just wondering how easy it is to change the fuel injector seals.


Modified by Granitethewolf at 6:36 PM 8-25-2009

[xenergy_one]

Quote, originally posted by Granitethewolf »

Now I am just wondering how easy it is to change the fuel injector seals. Modified by Granitethewolf at 6:36 PM 8-25-2009

On a car as old as yours I would say you will need to change out the injector shrouds and seals. The injectors can be really, really hard to pop out when they are old. Some of the shrouds may crack apart in the process. I will dig up some pics of what you need, tools, etc. The shrouds screw directly into the head so you have to be careful not to hose the threads. Once you are finished, it will make a big difference.

[Granitethewolf]

Quote, originally posted by xenergy_one »

On a car as old as yours I would say you will need to change out the injector shrouds and seals. The injectors can be really, really hard to pop out when they are old. Some of the shrouds may crack apart in the process. I will dig up some pics of what you need, tools, etc. The shrouds screw directly into the head so you have to be careful not to hose the threads. Once you are finished, it will make a big difference.

Thank you, I hope the intake manifold doesn't have to be removed to do any of that work X.X.
You almost make it sound like the injectors pull right out of the shrouds with no tools while the shrouds are just screwed into the head?

Also I just got done changing the oil to some Castrol GTX 20w50 and my oil buzzer still goes off. I got a feeling my oil pressure sensor must be bad because according to the last owner this car never had any oil pressure issues before.

Edit- I see napa sells the injector seals and the fuel injectors but not the shrouds. Is it dead necessary that I get new shrouds? I mean can I try just replacing the injector seals for now and do the shrouds later if they really are needed?
Also Is this what I need for my oil pressure issue with my oil light coming on and my buzzer going off when I go over 2K rpms? Id much rather replace this before spending the $ on a new oil pump.
http://www.napaonline.com/NOLP...25015
Just asking because there also is a much more expensive oil pressure gauge switch- but I dont have an oil pressure gauge in my car anywho.



Modified by Granitethewolf at 9:21 PM 8-25-2009

[xenergy_one]

I didn't remove my intake manifold to do my injector seals although working space was minimal. You will need a pry bar of sorts to get those injectors to pop out. You will have to get the shrouds from a VW dealer or from http://www.autohausaz.com.

I have no experience with oil pressure problems so I don't know the answer to your question. I wouldn't drive the car if your oil pressure is in doubt. That napa oil pressure switch looks right. The switch is cheap so it's an easy place to start.

Maybe someone can chime in here with some beta on oil pressure/sensor issues.

[Rannoch]

You should have replacement shrouds on hand. The ones in your engine are going to be fairly brittle and may break when you pull out the injectors.

[Granitethewolf]

Are the injector shrouds the same as injector Insulators??
http://www.autohausaz.com/sear...lator

I'm having a tough time finding those shrouds so please link me to them if injector insulators are not the same thing as injector shrouds


Modified by Granitethewolf at 9:47 PM 8-25-2009

[vwdaun]

Quote, originally posted by Granitethewolf »

I also did put in newish spark plugs- they are semi used that I used to have in my 89 honda accord. They are bosch platinum +2's and side by side of the plugs that were in the car they were a near perfect match by thread length. I hope they are okay to use.

They may be of a different heat range, so unless they're what's called for, I'd consider picking up the correct plugs.

Good to hear you changed your oil. The sender is the next logical place to look....

[vwdaun]

Quote, originally posted by Granitethewolf »

Are the injector shrouds the same as injector Insulators?? http://www.autohausaz.com/sear...lator

Yep, that looks like what you need.

[Granitethewolf]

Awesome, now I guess the last question is what tools do I need to do the job without too much trouble?
I'm quite curious as to what turns those injector insulators out once you have the fuel injectors pulled out of em. Speaking of which the injector seals are just o-rings that stretch and fit into a spot on the injectors right?

Sorry for all the questions, Ive just never done any work on fuel injectors before so I would like this to go smoothly.

Edit-
Looks like I found the answer I believe from my Bentley, it says:
"...use a 12mm hexagonal (Allen) wrench to remove the plastic inserts from the intake air distributor. Clean the inserts & reinstall them with Loctite 620 or its equilivant to a torque of 15foot/lb..."

I take it by Intake air distributor they are talking about the head/intake manifold? This is all in Section 4 Page 55 on the top left of the page.


Modified by Granitethewolf at 10:12 PM 8-25-2009

[xenergy_one]

You can buy a three pack of large allen wrenches from autozone for like $10. it comes with a 12mm and a 17mm that is useful on those tranny drain and fill plugs.

[Rannoch]

That's exactly it there.

[xenergy_one]

Here are some useful pics of what is needed. The bolt in the photo is the same size and thread pitch as a wheel bolt. I found mine at advanced auto but I am sure a NAPA will have them. You don't really need to have the bolt through the pry bar. I ended up using the curved end myself.

Modified by xenergy_one at 9:26 PM 8-25-2009

[Granitethewolf]

Thank you Xenergy! Im going to see if I can get it all at napa when I go to work today. By the way those 3 large allen wrenches look a bit odd, looks like you use a socket wrench or ratchet on them.

Oh, I should probably get a torque wrench for when I put in the new injector shrouds/insulators, would hate to over tighten those and screw up any threads.

[baupfhor]

Quote, originally posted by Granitethewolf »

By the way those 3 large allen wrenches look a bit odd, looks like you use a socket wrench or ratchet on them.

You are correct, thats why they are so pimp. I highly recommend getting a set of them, 4mm thru 10mm, then of course the 3 he mentioned.

[xenergy_one]

When you go to back out those insulators they like to crack. Small pieces can fall down into your intake. I used a spare piece of fuel hose as a vacuum to get them out. If the 12mm wrench strips the insulator you will have to chip it out. What ever you do, don't biff those threads. I messed mine up and had to get an M24 tap to fix them.

[Granitethewolf]

Well I have everything ordered except for those insulators, neither napa or autozone can get them so I will have to order them online as soon as my room mates & I are moved into our new place next week

Out of curiosity is there anything I can spray on the old insulators to back them out easier like WD40/PB blaster or something? Also I had figured after I got them replaced one at a time I would use my shop vac to suck up and pieces that may have broken off.

I'm still a bit worried about my oil pressure issue even though im sure that its just a bad pressure light switch (I hope) If not I think im goona take it by a shop and see if they can quick put a pressure tester on it. My engine doesn't sound like its dropping oil pressure either, I heard that you can tell because the top end will get notably louder because it will be the first part not to get oil, but my head looks like its getting plenty of oil and it doesn't sound any louder or different from when the oil light wasn't coming on

Not much going on today as none of my parts came in, just goona clean it up some more

[xenergy_one]

I sprayed wd-40 on mine. Maybe it helped. 3 out of 4 of them came out just fine.

If the sensor doesn't solve it, you could drop your oil pan and just make sure everything looks good. Check for metal shavings, play in the rods, etc.

Waiting for parts to come in the mail is just par for the course. The $$ saved is significant. Today I priced an SKF bearing at NAPA = $72. Online I found it for $22.

[Granitethewolf]

I probably wont drive the car again until I have to move it to our new place and every time I have driven it ive been easy on the rpms- mostly because that buzzer in the dash bugs the hell out of me. So far both times that I have drained the oil there is no metal shavings to be found.

As far as that price on napa parts keep in mind I get a discount of 10% above store cost so that means often i can get parts for half the shelf price or even less. You'd be surprised It tends to make up for the cost of shipping and the time factor, also the ease of returning something too.

[petebee]

Quote, originally posted by xenergy_one »

What purpose does the nut threaded on the bolt serve? Just keep the pry bar from slipping down further towards the injector?

[xenergy_one]

The nut is threaded onto the injector. Then the bolt is threaded into that. It is very difficult to pry against the injector without damaging it. It is also hard to pull straight up on it. The nut and bolt gives you something to pry against.


Modified by xenergy_one at 8:24 PM 8-26-2009

[petebee]

Ahhh...got it. Half of the nut threads on the injector end, other half threads on the bolt! Duh

[Granitethewolf]

Still waiting on all my parts to come in

Anyway someone mentioned to me that the main bearings on the crankshaft (I think) could wear out causing low oil pressure....is this possible or common for the 8v engines?
I know im sure im worrying way too far ahead of myself, I gotta see how my new oil pressure light switch acts and if it still goes off then I need to invest in an oil pressure gauge for a real reading.

[vwdaun]

That would be a good possible cause... but I would tend to discount it as changing to a thicker oil had no effect. Try the new sender, and if that doesn't work see if you can get a true pressure reading. Another semi-common failure is the oil pressure warning circuit in the instrument cluster.

[LastMartian]

Keep it up! Your'e doing an awesome job.

I'm glad that you got into those injectors and shrouds, I didn't know how delicate they really are. And to check the seal with carb cleaner is pure brillance!

Your story is inspirational

[xenergy_one]

Quote, originally posted by vwdaun »

That would be a good possible cause... but I would tend to discount it as changing to a thicker oil had no effect. Try the new sender, and if that doesn't work see if you can get a true pressure reading. Another semi-common failure is the oil pressure warning circuit in the instrument cluster.

I think any 20+ year old car should have an oil pressure gauge. I'd like to put one in both my Scriocco's. Does anyone know the best brand/solution for getting this done?

[Granitethewolf]

Thanks everyone. I haven't gotten into doing injector work yet as I dont have all the parts in and I am in the middle of moving, so i dont wana work on the rocco's injectors and render it unmovable for a short time until after I got it moved to its new garage while I can still drive it

So my oil pressure light switch came in but I wont have time to put it in until Sunday most likely, if that doesn't fix it then im going to buy an oil pressure gauge to see if its just the oil pressure system circuitry in the dash (which I would have to remove the buzzer, the flashing oil light doesn't bother me lol.)

[Granitethewolf]

Quote, originally posted by vwdaun »

That would be a good possible cause... but I would tend to discount it as changing to a thicker oil had no effect. Try the new sender, and if that doesn't work see if you can get a true pressure reading. Another semi-common failure is the oil pressure warning circuit in the instrument cluster.

What do you mean by "sender" you mean the oil pressure switch im changing? Also what do you mean by "but I would tend to discount it as changing to a thicker oil had no effect." You mean the idea of the main bearings being worn out is pretty unlikely?

First im going to change my oil pressure light switch and if that doesn't solve it then im going to get an oil pressure gauge to get a real reading to see if the dash circuitry is faulty or not.


Modified by Granitethewolf at 3:40 PM 8-29-2009

[Granitethewolf]

Well, I just got done changing the oil pressure light switch and it didnt make any difference- my oil light/buzzer still comes on when the engine is over 2K rpms.
Now all that's left to do is to buy an oil pressure gauge and get a physical reading of what the hell is going on. All it comes down to now is faulty oil pressure electrical warning system or a bad oil pump....

Anyway she is loaded up and ready to go packed full of my tools and radio from my garage to carry to my new garage tomorrow. I'm quite excited to move out of an apartment and into a real house, still renting though
aaand back to packing my things for the move....

[Rannoch]

If you hit your dash hard above 2k rpm does the buzzer go away?

[Granitethewolf]

Quote, originally posted by Rannoch »

If you hit your dash hard above 2k rpm does the buzzer go away?

I haven't tried this yet I do notice that the buzzer wont go off until im about 2150-2200 rpms and the tone of it changes if i push the horn buttons, also i notice if i sit at exactly 2000 rpms and i hit the horn buttons it will make the oil light/buzzer go off.... its a bit strange i should make a video of it sometime lol.

[Granitethewolf]

Can someone tell me exactly what size bolt and nut to get to do this with an injector? I meant to ask sooner

[whosurdaddy]

if u search u'll find the size. i think i remember it being m12x1.5 i've looked at probably 200 pages today. i'm about sick of cools cars that run. i'm pretty sure it's in the 16v faq section. good job getting her runnin.

[Patter$on]

"Update" When replacing Injector seals, pay special attention to the valve. Everything was going as well as could be expected, (i.e. slow and agonizing) but I get to #4, finally decide to pull the valve cover, scratched my really cool hammertone paint, get #4 out, and wouldn't you know it. Stuck Wide friggin open. As mad as I get with CIS a seemingly simple answer. I'm hoping a replacement takes care of it. the lousy idle, running full rich, super horrible gas mileage. I suppose it could be worse. My hats off the Bosch for being able to fire all that crap off. I think a G60 Valve cover or something cool is in order.