2871R or 50 Trim

[Big_Tom]

What do you guys think? I know what they're capable of, but I want to hear what you guys think would be a better turbo for a 320whp to 340whp car. My motor WILL have IE rods. Lets hear it peeps Also I don't care about the difference in price, only the turbo itself.


*another update... Car is now DBB 50 Trim'd (1-8-2013) Just a couple new pics







*edit* garrett journal bearing 50 trim in pics below. (2-12-2011)

From Feb 2012 Dyno

From Feb 2012 Dyno

From Feb 2012 Dyno

[20aeman]

2871 for that range. Get the smallest turbo for the job....that way you actually have a decent powerband and transient response. If that 320hp goal ever moves up to 400...then the 50 trim is the better bet.

[lucas13dourado]

I dont think a 50trim will make 400whp really easily, I guess he didnt specify whp or bhp but anyway..

if you have rods just do the 2871r, spools and respool is a lot faster...

the 50trim is for people running stock bottom ends who want ~300whp (or for the more brave ones 350+)

[velocity196]

50 trim will make that with less money spent. 400+ on meth. Gotta luv that crack

[lucas13dourado]

hahaha.. he does have a 01 jetta. we can hope its 01.5, thats when they switched to wideband 02 sensors.
if thats the case then yea, 400 is achievable for sure

[screwball]

DBB 50 trim

[Pisko]

a 50trim with a 630cc file is mad fun and a bit brutal..just how we like it
you`l love it..
Go for the 63a/r housing, it wil save you some fuel when/if DD driven..

Modified by Pisko at 5:22 AM 9-12-2009


Modified by Pisko at 5:22 AM 9-12-2009

[AL@PagParts.com]

I would say for your power goals and a enough overhead to get close to or at 400whp, the 2871r is perfect. There's only like 4lbs/min on the comp that separates these turbos. If you develop that itch later on, the upgrade route of the 50trim will be greater (I'm talking 400+whp). But its always at the expense of response. If this is your daily driver, I'd say 71R all the way.


Modified by AL@PagParts.com at 5:39 AM 9-12-2009

[Big_Tom]

Quote, originally posted by screwball »

DBB 50 trim

I can't find much info on them on the vortex

The car is my daily driver, I commute about 50 miles round trip to work everyday. I do think I'll be very satisfied with 320whp, but if i do get the itch to bump it up a bit i still think either turbo can support 375whp. I'm not trying to build a monster, just a beast haha. Thanks for the info guys, keep it coming.

[The*Fall*Guy]

I've always wondered what a 2876r would be like..

[Big_Tom]

I've read those are very unbalanced turbos and best suited for high rpm applications. I've seen people say bad things about them in the SR20 forums way back in the day when i had a G20 w/a det swap

[The*Fall*Guy]

I've heard the same thing.. Although one would assume that the spool would be better than a 30r or a 50trim..

[BoostinBejan]

Quote, originally posted by The*Fall*Guy »

I've heard the same thing.. Although one would assume that the spool would be better than a 30r or a 50trim..

But for the price you're paying for spool, you won't make much power.

There's a reason people don't run 2876's, 3082's, etc.

[The*Fall*Guy]

Sure.. But wouldn't it still offer say 50-75 whp more than a 2871? Just curious..

[AL@PagParts.com]

Quote, originally posted by The*Fall*Guy »

Sure.. But wouldn't it still offer say 50-75 whp more than a 2871? Just curious..

I used a 2876r back in '04. It made 420whp but surged a bit and wasnt as responsive as you would think.

[Big_Tom]

Another question i had was whats the max safe psi for each of these turbos. on dyno day i may want to run 25 to 30 psi. Can these turbos pump out those psi numbers at the track or dyno without damage?

[AL@PagParts.com]

Quote, originally posted by Big_Tom »

Another question i had was whats the max safe psi for each of these turbos. on dyno day i may want to run 25 to 30 psi. Can these turbos pump out those psi numbers at the track or dyno without damage?

Well, the journal bearing system w/ the 50trim comp would require unsafe shaft speeds to achieve boost levels over 25psi. On a ball bearing, no problem.

2871r runs out of its efficiency range after around 27psi.

[Big_Tom]

Quote, originally posted by AL@PagParts.com »

Well, the journal bearing system w/ the 50trim comp would require unsafe shaft speeds to achieve boost levels over 25psi. On a ball bearing, no problem. 2871r runs out of its efficiency range after around 27psi.

That's exactly what i wanted to know. Also, what type of psi will they hold revving to 7k or so? Is the 2871R big enough to hold 20+ psi up there?

[AL@PagParts.com]

Quote, originally posted by Big_Tom »

That's exactly what i wanted to know. Also, what type of psi will they hold revving to 7k or so? Is the 2871R big enough to hold 20+ psi up there?

Here is my 3071r WG kit. 2871r should be pretty similiar. Only pushing to 6.5k (22psi / 350+whp). Holds up decently

[austyg243]

Get a 3071r spools around 3200 and makes 300whp on low boost. when you want more power. turn ur boost controller up.... my .02 I have a 3071r so if you want a video of spool up let me know

[BoostinBejan]

After going from 3071 to 3076, I would probably say either do the 2871r, or the 3076r. 3076 doesn't really spool up any later, but makes much more power up top.

[austyg243]

boostin bejan is probably correct

[transient_analysis]

the 3076 feels the same (maybe a hair slower) as a t3/t4 .63 at the same psi (16ish) on my setup..

3076 may spool 100-200rpm earlier and feels more consistent than my old t3/t4 setup..

I'd envision the 3076 to shine around 24psi on pump.. just need to fix a pinhole coolant leak before I give it a go.. but as of right now I still really like the t3/t4.. I think it's a good starter turbo for a daily

[20aeman]

Quote, originally posted by transient_analysis »

the 3076 feels the same (maybe a hair slower) as a t3/t4 .63 at the same psi (16ish) on my setup.. 3076 may spool 100-200rpm earlier and feels more consistent than my old t3/t4 setup.. I'd envision the 3076 to shine around 24psi on pump.. just need to fix a pinhole coolant leak before I give it a go.. but as of right now I still really like the t3/t4.. I think it's a good starter turbo for a daily

I think the difference between a 50 trim and 30r on pump gas is going to be minimal. To get your money's worth on the 30r, you really have to run race gas and turn the boost up. For comparison's sake, here is a dbb 50 trim vs. hta30r...sort of apples and oranges, as the 50 trim setup has a set of cams and runs 1 psi more boost...but whatever (even then, the price difference between an hta30r and a dbb 50trim is a nice set of cams)

edit: this is awhp btw

Modified by 20aeman at 6:33 PM 9-12-2009

[20aeman]

Quote, originally posted by lucas13dourado »

I dont think a 50trim will make 400whp really easily, I guess he didnt specify whp or bhp but anyway.. if you have rods just do the 2871r, spools and respool is a lot faster... the 50trim is for people running stock bottom ends who want ~300whp (or for the more brave ones 350+)

people don't see 400whp on 50 trims because that's usually a budget turbo on budget builds. Nobody ever sticks a set of cams on, or an intake manifold, or runs race gas/e85/meth etc. They take a stock smallport, throw rods on it, and crank the boost up...even then, they hit respectable numbers in the high 300 range.

Here is a non budget 50 trim build....almost 500awhp...AWHP..probably translate to 550whp on a fwd:

[AL@PagParts.com]

omar you need to run a dbb chra cause the poor journal bearings overheat at over 25psi. Main reason why you dont see too many high hp journal 50trim dynos.


Modified by AL@PagParts.com at 6:53 PM 9-12-2009

[cincyTT]

Quote, originally posted by 20aeman »

I think the difference between a 50 trim and 30r on pump gas is going to be minimal. To get your money's worth on the 30r, you really have to run race gas and turn the boost up. For comparison's sake, here is a dbb 50 trim vs. hta30r...sort of apples and oranges, as the 50 trim setup has a set of cams and runs 1 psi more boost...but whatever (even then, the price difference between an hta30r and a dbb 50trim is a nice set of cams)

99.9% of the people are running journal bearing 50trims. The journal bearings are going to eat up a good % of the power along with adding lag compared to the dbb version. Also, the 3076r is rated 52lbs/min where the 50trim is i believe 46lbs/min, thats about 60hp less. Most people will be running both in the 20-23psi range on pump and that would be worth a good 20whp min. But you are correct, when the 30r is pushed towards 30psi, it really shines

[20aeman]

Quote, originally posted by AL@PagParts.com »

omar you need to run a dbb chra cause the poor journal bearings overheat at over 25psi

Well, I ain't gonna fix it if it ain't broke. So I'm gonna break it so I can go dbb.

but I'm sure with decent ve, the journal 50 will make 400 wheel at <25psi.


Modified by 20aeman at 6:56 PM 9-12-2009

[AL@PagParts.com]

Quote, originally posted by 20aeman »

Well, I ain't gonna fix it if it ain't broke. So I'm gonna break it so I can go dbb.

Now you're talking . But when you want to start making some serious power w/ journals, you have to get bigger wheels to reduce shaft speeds and increase flow. Or run bigger motors..



Modified by AL@PagParts.com at 7:00 PM 9-12-2009

[20aeman]

Quote, originally posted by AL@PagParts.com »

Now you're talking . But when you want to start making some serious power w/ journals, you have to get bigger wheels to reduce shaft speeds and increase flow. Or run bigger motors.. Modified by AL@PagParts.com at 7:00 PM 9-12-2009

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking as well. We'll see how this sucker will hold up. DBB will take me 30 minutes to install anyways, when this thing eats it.

[lucas13dourado]

Quote, originally posted by 20aeman »

people don't see 400whp on 50 trims because that's usually a budget turbo on budget builds. Nobody ever sticks a set of cams on, or an intake manifold, or runs race gas/e85/meth etc. They take a stock smallport, throw rods on it, and crank the boost up...even then, they hit respectable numbers in the high 300 range. Here is a non budget 50 trim build....almost 500awhp...AWHP..probably translate to 550whp on a fwd:

well thats the thing, I was going for what he said "rods" not cams or intake or that stuff

good stuff tho

[Big_Tom]

How would an internal wg 50 trim be? Has anybody ever ran one? I've never had a problem with internal wastegate turbos and i'd like to stick with that if possible.

[austyg243]

Get a EWG for the noise they sound so sick. I wish my 3071 was ewg....:/

[Big_Tom]

i was trying not to switch to external wg because i have never used them before. and i dont like the idea of them making my car loud as hell. even if i did switch to external wg, i'd still have my dump tube put back into the downpipe

[cincyTT]

an external will regulate psi better. If you plan on keeping the psi up on the 50trim, an internal should be fine. Its when you run to low of psi that it can cause issues


Modified by cincyTT at 12:06 PM 9-14-2009