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    Thread: Stage 4 supercharger reborn....The final fantasy....

    1. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-18-2009 09:57 PM #1
      R32 Supercharger project number 2

      OK, I just bought a used VF Stage 4 s/c kit minus the cams..call it Stage 3 if you wish.

      I’m looking for ways to get the most out of this setup and that brings me to this thread, so let’s get going.

      1. Software, who makes a flexable tune that could easily adapt to the following parts:

      a. Stock R32 intake manifold
      b. CAMS (Grind to be determined) I need help on this one please!!!
      c. Super-sprint headers
      d. Race test pipe
      e. Stock muffler setup including resonator
      f. Vortec V2 S trim blower @ 12-14 PSI
      g. Air/Water charge-cooler setup
      h. High flow fuel pump
      i. Bigger fuel injectors (500cc or larger)
      j. Possible water/meth (Map based)
      L. 928M, 5 Angle CNC machined impeller


      2. CAMS, what cams could I get to make the car breath better, what are the best cams for forced induction, What grind do you recommend?

      3. V2 pulley size, can I safely reduce that by one size, it’s now 3.7 inches. If so where can I get one that’s 8 rib?

      4. Air/water cooler, any suggestions, it will be located in place of the battery & air box. IM looking for low loss, but not too pricy.

      5. Flexible and Rigid Boost tubing, where to buy it? The route will be out of the V2, in front of the rad support over and down to the lower left opening, then up by the battery hold down after I make a hole, then into the cooler, out of the cooler into the stock intake, blah blah……I will need recommended sizes, sources to get the tubing, metal or plastic, etc.

      6. Boost tubing insulation, I need some for the engine bay, where can I get it?

      7. More to come later with pics………………….

      ....Stage 4 supercharger reborn....The final fantasy...


      Supercharger project No1 click below

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4059950

      Kit-1

      Kit-2

      Charger-3

      Cams-4

      Headers-5

      Old Dyno-6

      Air/Water ideas-7

      Hmmm-8

      Crank-9


      PRO MAF-10


      Final Fantasy-11




      Modified by vwgeorge2 at 1:15 PM 11-9-2009

      Last edited by vwgeorge2; 10-19-2013 at 07:20 AM.

    2. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-18-2009 11:06 PM #2
      PM's received, and replied.

      Thanks

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    3. Member 631 Corrado's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 01:55 AM #3
      im gunna lock onto this one

    4. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 02:19 AM #4
      whoa whoa whoa you are making 427 hp off this setup?!?!

    5. Member Slampig's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 02:31 AM #5
      watching

    6. Member R32R1's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 02:36 AM #6
      Quote, originally posted by 401R32 »
      watching

    7. Member Spoolin1X's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 02:39 AM #7
      Quote, originally posted by freud_g »


      thanks for using pictures without asking


      oh and BTW still for sale ... ....

      Seriously....

      Hitting switches in NYC.

    8. 09-19-2009 06:45 AM #8
      Quote, originally posted by JDM-JTI »
      whoa whoa whoa you are making 427 hp off this setup?!?!

      no. no he's not.
      apparently this post is riddled with "appropriated" imagery.



    9. Member Navydub's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 07:26 AM #9
      Good luck Bill

      I know you were determined to stay S/C and still make the power so let's see how it goes.

      1) As far as tuning goes, I'd definitely go to C2 or unitronic and drop the $$$$ for a custom dyno/road tune. Mike Z@Uni and Jeff@C2 are two of the best in the business, can't go wrong either way. It'll cost you a bit more than an off the shelf tune, but you'll make gobs more power.

      2) A blower isn't going to give you low end grunt. Unless you wanted to fit a roots type blower, which would be amazing, but epicly expensive. I'd stay just stick with the car's strong suit of top end power. Grab some TT 264's and be good to go

      3)I have no clue, you'll have to calculate blower speed at the RPM you'll be turning(7200rpm redline) and see if a smaller pulley is within the design limits of the blower.

      4) Air water, again no specific recommendation. I'd say a core with custom end tanks is probably your best bet here.

      5) For charge piping, I would again go custom. This will allow you to use whatever material you see fit (aluminum or stainless), and choose the exact route and piping size. Personally, if you were going to run A/W intercooling, I'd do like HPA did, and clock the blower so the outlet faces the back of the car. Delete the coolant res, relocate the power steering res, and then run the charge piping around the back side of the motor. It'd require you to get a short runner intake, but clones of the old HPA mani can be had for as cheap as 500$ on ebay.de.

      Turbo Unicorn | HS Tuning | 42DD | Cabin Krew

    10. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 09:49 AM #10
      Quote, originally posted by slackin’ at work »

      no. no he's not.
      apparently this post is riddled with "appropriated" imagery.



      You are correct slacken, 427 was the out of the box 2WD dyno for this kit... I however plan on quite a bit more from my AWD dyno...My goal is at least 450 AWD HP

      Thanks

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    11. Member gringoloco2000's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 11:49 AM #11
      Good luck man. You are the SC guru. Thanks for the advice on my wimpy Stage II. Maybe someday I can go Stage II.5 with C2. lol Definitely going to watch this project.
      Das PITA!

    12. Member newcreation's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 05:48 PM #12
      hmmm watching
      -JAMES-
      DRIVEN/Built /UM Turbo R - VR NATION

    13. Member R32R1's Avatar
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      09-19-2009 06:58 PM #13
      Okay so in reference to the "forgotton" thread and using a cogged setup, I noticed the setup you are running that powers the charger is cogged. How will this effect belt life?

    14. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 12:54 AM #14
      Update #1

      Finally cut out the VF resister in the MAF extention, no going back to VF/GIAC software ever again. The software worked, but my current software is way better! I cant wait for my stage 4+ software....

      Next I wrapped the MAF line with flexable EMI shielding to prevent unwanted signals crossing over onto my ECU. The shielding is soldered and terminated just below the battery tray, this should keep any EMI at bay...

      Then taped it all back up for proper fit and finish...

      Re-installed the usless air box containing my power steering reservoir, and yes this will be moved once again to accomadate the huge Air/Water charger cooler...

      Lastly a pic of my dirty axx R32, yes it will be cleaned up by H2O...


      OK, that's all for today...More to come

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    15. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 12:59 AM #15
      Quote, originally posted by R32R1 »
      Okay so in reference to the "forgotton" thread and using a cogged setup, I noticed the setup you are running that powers the charger is cogged. How will this effect belt life?

      The cogged plan has been scrapped!!! As long as I stay with a V2 charger I should be fine with its big 8 rib belt. I may look into a crank pulley size reduction if I can find one, this is further down the road though.

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    16. Member R32R1's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 11:11 AM #16
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »

      The cogged plan has been scrapped!!! As long as I stay with a V2 charger I should be fine with its big 8 rib belt. I may look into a crank pulley size reduction if I can find one, this is further down the road though.

      Good to hear. I'm really looking forward to seeing the outcome of this project


    17. 09-20-2009 11:59 AM #17
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »


      You are correct slacken, 427 was the out of the box 2WD dyno for this kit... I however plan on quite a bit more from my AWD dyno...My goal is at least 450 AWD HP

      Thanks

      Im all about aiming high... but do you seriously believe that?


      oh, and order some new strut mounts.


      Modified by slackin' at work at 9:02 AM 9-20-2009


    18. Member NJVWR32's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 12:05 PM #18
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »

      The cogged plan has been scrapped!!! As long as I stay with a V2 charger I should be fine with its big 8 rib belt. I may look into a crank pulley size reduction if I can find one, this is further down the road though.

      I've had my 8 rib belt in for 13K and have never had to touch it. You don't need a cogged belt. It will be changed at 15K for maintenance but that's it. HPA has done a tune for me but I haven't had a chance to run it yet due to a clutch problem. Clutch is fixed so it should be soon. Good luck with it and let's talk at H20.


    19. Member QBNR32's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 01:38 PM #19
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »

      Crank-9

      hey, its my old motor! seeing that pic makes me miss my old R. Its good that you arent going with the cogged belt because you will not have any belt life with it. It was absolutely necessary for me since I was pushing 20psi but it would not last very long at all. But for the week or two that it did last, I had this to play with


    20. 09-20-2009 06:12 PM #20

    21. Member gringoloco2000's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 08:52 PM #21
      Two weeks out of the belt? That is serious abuse. That looks like any timing belt out there and they last 100K miles. What would cause these to blow out so fast? More stress or heat than a normal timing belt? Just curious.

      BTW, pushing 20 psi on a SC is freaking nuts. Even if it only lasted 2 weeks, that is an accomplishment.

      Das PITA!

    22. Member R32R1's Avatar
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      09-20-2009 09:21 PM #22
      Quote, originally posted by gringoloco2000 »
      BTW, pushing 20 psi on a SC is freaking nuts. Even if it only lasted 2 weeks, that is an accomplishment.

      Exactly lol I thought that was only achievable with the V20 blowers

      pic for reference




      Modified by R32R1 at 6:24 PM 9-20-2009


    23. Member jessla's Avatar
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      09-21-2009 07:53 AM #23
      George, let me know how you make out with your tune. I have been running Stage 4 for years and probably have as many miles as anyone. I still intend to go turbo, but maybe you will convince me to keep the sc. C2 has pulleys:

      https://www.c2motorsports.net/....aspx


      Modified by jessla at 7:56 AM 9-21-2009

      GT35, HFC, Neuspeed exhaust. FK Silverline Plus X.
      Cleary Coachworks Clutch and Turbo Install.

    24. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-21-2009 04:24 PM #24
      Quote, originally posted by slackin’ at work »

      Im all about aiming high... but do you seriously believe that?


      oh, and order some new strut mounts.


      Modified by slackin' at work at 9:02 AM 9-20-2009


      Survey says, ummmmmm yes








      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    25. 09-21-2009 10:32 PM #25
      jessla,
      are you running one of those c2 sc pulleys in place of vf pulley? and if so are you getting more psi/hp/torque? and does it use the same belt? i'm interested because as you know i am alos running stage 4 set up for some time.

      btw, jason dale at black forest motorsport made a neat change to my overall setup related to my my full militek exhaust with militek headers. without the flapper on exhaust, engine management receives info that flapper is closed inhibiting engine performance. he brillantly installed a resistor simulating exhaust flapper open at all times and my car was noticeably stronger. are you running another ecu giac flash? any communication with guys at vf recently?

      interested in your reply.
      thanks,
      gh


    26. 09-23-2009 05:59 PM #26
      how's the work going on the sc? any updates?

      i'm bringing my r32 into the shop tomorrow and the shop owner, jason dale at blackforest motorsport, and his partner are friggin' geniuses when it comes to tuning vw, audi, porsche and some other really high end sport cars are going to do some work on my car. they will give c2 motorsport a shot out to ask about the 2.5 inch diameter pulley for v2 vortech unit for some extra boost (advertised as 15 psi)!!

      if i have more uummphh when done i'll post soem details.


    27. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-23-2009 09:29 PM #27
      Quote, originally posted by geoffreyhobika »
      how's the work going on the sc? any updates?

      i'm bringing my r32 into the shop tomorrow and the shop owner, jason dale at blackforest motorsport, and his partner are friggin' geniuses when it comes to tuning vw, audi, porsche and some other really high end sport cars are going to do some work on my car. they will give c2 motorsport a shot out to ask about the 2.5 inch diameter pulley for v2 vortech unit for some extra boost (advertised as 15 psi)!!

      if i have more uummphh when done i'll post soem details.


      Geoffrey

      Accually im working out the details for tuning myself I think the tune will be the heart of this build...As for the hardware, once I decide on the injectors the teardown will begin...Im doing the head-spacer/Headers/and injectors at the same time to save man hours...One thing im looking for is a picture of an R32 with the passinger side front fender removed, ive got a few ideas for the wasted space? thats all the details im going to share for the moment

      I have a list of many plans and ideas

      Thanks

      Bill

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    28. Member EIPtuningR32's Avatar
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      09-23-2009 09:52 PM #28
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »


      Geoffrey

      Accually im working out the details for tuning myself I think the tune will be the heart of this build...As for the hardware, once I decide on the injectors the teardown will begin...Im doing the head-spacer/Headers/and injectors at the same time to save man hours...One thing im looking for is a picture of an R32 with the passinger side front fender removed, ive got a few ideas for the wasted space? thats all the details im going to share for the moment

      I have a list of many plans and ideas

      Thanks

      Bill

      my excitement just jumped when you said that


    29. Member vwgeorge2's Avatar
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      09-23-2009 10:20 PM #29

      PRO MAF


      Who can tell me what this thing does for power?
      Is it worth $400?



      Thanks

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-final-fantasy....

      Stage 7= VF, HPA= V7-ysi, A/W Intake, Dual Jet Water/Meth, UM E-85 Flex 870cc, ProMAF, 268 Cams, SS Header, SS Mid pipe, Custom intake, Brisk plugs, Lambo flapper

    30. Senior Member TBT-Syncro's Avatar
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      09-25-2009 01:00 AM #30
      Quote, originally posted by vwgeorge2 »

      PRO MAF


      Who can tell me what this thing does for power?
      Is it worth $400?



      Thanks

      it does nothing for power. it's just an aftermarket MAF sensor (an incredibly accurate one). It's only useful if you have software thats matched for it. BUt it's also not needed with a R32, as you have factory wideband, and you can get an accurate tune with the stock maf.


    31. Member arupp's Avatar
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      09-27-2009 08:47 AM #31
      Nice Setup! What kind of water pump is that? Meziere?

    32. Member Tj_gti's Avatar
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      09-27-2009 09:42 AM #32
      wow

    33. 09-27-2009 08:45 PM #33
      this is all quite exciting as i am still running the vf stage 4 sc and will be watching these updates closely. i tried to call c2 motorsports to ask about the pulleys they are selling for the v2 blower but they are out until tomorrow at waterfest i believe.

      is anyone running the c2 2.75 or 2.5 inch pulleys? what is the size of the existing pulley on the stage 4 sc set up from vf engineering? i tried to measure and i'm getting around 4 inches which would make a jump to a 2.5 inch pulley kind of crazy in terms of increased strain on blower. anyone care to comment?


    34. 09-27-2009 09:09 PM #34
      Quote, originally posted by geoffreyhobika »
      this is all quite exciting as i am still running the vf stage 4 sc and will be watching these updates closely. i tried to call c2 motorsports to ask about the pulleys they are selling for the v2 blower but they are out until tomorrow at waterfest i believe.

      is anyone running the c2 2.75 or 2.5 inch pulleys? what is the size of the existing pulley on the stage 4 sc set up from vf engineering? i tried to measure and i'm getting around 4 inches which would make a jump to a 2.5 inch pulley kind of crazy in terms of increased strain on blower. anyone care to comment?

      as far as a pulley size you really cant do anything with it. the v2 has a 4'' on the blower nd a 6'' on the crank that s giving the overall 12psi. the blower from the stg4 kit is already spinning a few hundred rpm's over there limit so its really just all that blower can do. u can get sq- trim guts put into that blower to give u the room for more boost but the simple s-trim is already at its breaking point. this is my old kit believe me i know.....

      "Remember its a VW..........its not supposed to be easy, just worth it."

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      09-28-2009 01:35 PM #35
      why not go rotrex like that:
      http://www.r32oc.com/members-r....html
      http://www.r32oc.com/forced-in....html

      You can also do it yourself buying the bracket and supercharger from cgr:
      http://www.ccr-racing.com/shop....html
      it's the same bracket as storm developement and VR6 specialist use.


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