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    Thread: Damp Carpet, Soaked Underlay, Water Leak - Wet Fox

    1. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 01:49 PM #1
      Quote, originally posted by voxwagen88 »
      Stood beside it in the rain for hours.
      Trying to sort out how the carpet is getting wet.

      My original post in the "What did you do to your Fox today?" thread seemed to elicit a number of replies expressing similar issues.
      As water leaking into the car seems to be a shared and common problem, I thought I would start a fresh thread and copy those comments to it.
      Hopefully the Forum will be able to help dry out these leaky cars.
      And be able to find it with a search.
      Quote, originally posted by j-boogie253 »
      I've got the same problem
      I fixed my trunk to where it doesn't leak at all, even fixed my sunroof so it doesn't leak either....then found my carpet was saturated on the driver side a month later
      I can't seem to track it down, but it seems like it is coming from the corner by the windshield
      Sometimes I can see little water droplets by the hood release handle
      Not sure if it's the firewall or the windshield

      Quote, originally posted by mr.ramsey »
      x3 on the wet carpet. I think its leaking from the engine bay. The drains in the drip tray area must be leaking in somehow. Both my driver and passenger side kick panels get wet. The water seems to collect behind the drivers seat for me. Been thinking about drilling some drain holes.

      Quote, originally posted by midnightsun »
      i just shop vac my back seat after it rains

      Quote, originally posted by j-boogie253 »
      Same for me. I know my drip tray drain holes are clear and they work, but maybe there is something I can't see where they leak into the car as well
      Oh well, I also have to do the post-rain shop vac too or else it'll start stinking

      Quote, originally posted by lilgreydentwagen »
      mine also does this. i'm thinking it's the seal around the windshield leaking because there is a little bit of rust right where the trim piece wraps around above the dash. it almost always gets wet right above the hood release when it rains. i'm going out now to put my new ish back seat and trim panels in

      Quote, originally posted by efritsch »
      Odds are the frame under the windshield is rotting away. Had that happen more than once.


      Quote, originally posted by geniegate »
      Mine does that too, more than "wet" I've had water sloshing around in there, but I've never seen the seats or the dashboard get wet. A total mystery.

    2. Member j-boogie253's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 02:11 PM #2
      I hope the frame under my windshield isn't rotting away...I'm hoping for a simpler solution to my problem
      In hopes of finding the leak or leaks, (and just for the hell of it) I detailed even more of my engine bay and underside of my hood

      Still have yet to discover the leak source
      If you were a Volkswagen....who would your owner be?

    3. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 02:16 PM #3
      A couple of weeks ago I noticed the carpet in the driver side rear passenger foot well was wet.
      The windshield had been recently replaced so I hoped that it was leaking and the fix would be fast and simple. A glass man with 10 years experience shot water at the car for more than an hour and couldn't get it to leak.
      The good news was that the windshield didn't seem to be leaking. The bad news was that the leak was somewhere else.
      While I was standing in the rain trying to figure out where the water was getting in, I noticed the rain tray plastic cover was pretty much Swiss cheese. Got a new one.
      But was this where the water was getting in?
      I thought it best to dry out the car before testing it.
      And I found a lot more water than I was expecting.
      The carpet seemed dry to the touch, but when I lifted it up looking for signs of rust, I found the felt underlay was waterlogged. Checking further, the underlay in the driver's foot well was also soaked.
      And that's is where I am. Drying out.

    4. Member j-boogie253's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 02:23 PM #4
      ^^^^x2^^^^
      I pulled the carpet to find the underlay (cushioning) to be soaked
      I've been lucky enough to catch some dry weather so I detailed the bay and again made sure those drip holes were working properly
      Got it all dried out now and just waiting for another good down pour
      If you were a Volkswagen....who would your owner be?

    5. Junior Member adamjones128's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 06:20 PM #5
      Do you drive your car when its raining out or just let it sit? I know that on my fox there is a small hole from the previous owner messing up the position of the jack stand on the passenger side. I can feel the underneath of the carpet with my finger poking through the hole, so I would guess water can spray up there when your driving at highway speeds on a rainy day....

    6. Member doppelfaust's Avatar
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      05-01-2010 07:07 PM #6
      Quote, originally posted by j-boogie253 »
      In hopes of finding the leak or leaks, (and just for the hell of it) I detailed even more of my engine bay and underside of my hood

      You missed a spot.

    7. Member JGWarner's Avatar
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      05-02-2010 01:36 AM #7
      Where did you buy a new drip tray?

    8. Member mike in SC's Avatar
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      05-02-2010 06:43 PM #8
      My fox shares the same issue as many other fox owner's do.
      The water getting into my car has to do with seal. It does not come through the bottom, but rather the top of the seal (looking at it from the inside).
      Take off the bottom rubber trim at the edge of the dash to see if it comes from there.
      (sheriff)Early, I though you said this was a drug possum.
      (Early) Sure, I drug him from the ditch.
      (sheriff) I wish you told me that before you sold him to me.

    9. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-02-2010 09:25 PM #9
      Quote, originally posted by JGWarner »
      Where did you buy a new drip tray?

      Dealership.
      Had to stretch it to get it on. Fit is a bit frustrating, but it didn't snap during the install.
      The drying out continues. Both rear passenger foot wells are now dry.
      The driver's underlay is still more than damp.
      For "fun" I checked on the passenger side, and compared to the driver side found only a little water. Just the outer half of the underlay was wet. The underside of the carpet was moist.
      Took a peek at the vapour barriers in the doors and they seemed fine.
      Getting there.
      Quote, originally posted by mike in SC »
      The water getting into my car has to do with seal. It does not come through the bottom, but rather the top of the seal (looking at it from the inside).
      Take off the bottom rubber trim at the edge of the dash to see if it comes from there.


      Do you mean you have water coming in at the top off your windshield?

    10. Member mike in SC's Avatar
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      05-02-2010 10:34 PM #10
      Do you mean you have water coming in at the top off your windshield?
      [QUOTE=voxwagen88]
      Sorry, I didn't describe how I imagined it might look.
      The water comes in from the bottom of the windshield. Somehow, someway the water seeps from behind the windshield and past the seal.
      I have also had to seal a few pinholes in the drip tray. This also created a problem with rust along the seam along the upper (but inside, above the fuse box) firewall.
      (sheriff)Early, I though you said this was a drug possum.
      (Early) Sure, I drug him from the ditch.
      (sheriff) I wish you told me that before you sold him to me.

    11. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-08-2010 02:28 PM #11
      The Underlay is finally dry.

      The drains in the rain tray seem to be clear. A weighted string can pass from the rain tray to the bottom of the wheelhouse liner with out a problem.

      The vapour barriers in the doors do look a bit suspect.
      Some tears and cuts. There is a waterline on the back of the door cards.
      Off to get some new plastic.

    12. Member efritsch's Avatar
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      05-09-2010 01:36 PM #12
      The doors themselves should have drain holes in them though. I can't see that much water getting in to the carpet from the doors and you not noticing it. Did you actually check the under the underpad? To look at the floor itself? Also, are there any grommets in your firewall that are loose/missing/in crap shape? I would pull the carpet and under pad right up and check the floor pan itself. VW's have big grommets in the floors that tend to let water sit around the edge as the get old and the floor starts rotting. I had a Passat that had holes in each location where the grommets used to be.

      If you can't find water leaking from the top, than start checking the bottom. It could be wicking up water from underneath.

    13. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-10-2010 12:16 AM #13
      Judging from the water/mold/mildew on the back of the passenger side door card and the water mark on the p side underlay, I think most of the water on the moist side is getting in past the vapour barrier.


      The poorly fitting trim between the door and the glass must let a lot of water in.
      Some of that water must be splashing the vapour barrier and coming through.
      The drain in the door is clear, but it did look like little streams of water had been coming through the lower edge of the vapour barrier.
      Perhaps it is a little bit of water adding up over years that has soaked the carpet.

      Odd, I thought, to find grommets in the floor. They seem watertight. The paint is intact over them.
      Will be checking the firewall for missing grommets.
      Last edited by voxwagen88; 05-10-2010 at 12:19 AM.

    14. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-16-2010 12:17 AM #14
      Bleach wipes took care of the mildew on the door cards.
      And the doors.
      I cleaned off the old vapour barrier residue.
      Made new barriers with the thickest plastic sheeting I could find at the building center.
      Held in place with construction grade red Tuck Tape.

      Tested the barriers by washing the car.
      The passenger side stayed dry. The Driver's side failed.
      Water found its way through 3 places on the lower edge where the tape overlapped.
      Retaped it. Will test again.

      Part of the failure may have been that 2 of the 3 clips holding the upper door trim in place had come unglued from the trim.
      Not much was pressing the glass in place against the outer trim. Seemed quite a bit more water came in the D-side than the P-side.
      Reglued fro the re-test.

    15. Member mike in SC's Avatar
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      05-16-2010 01:18 AM #15
      [IMG][/IMG]My fox has the same problem. It is not nearly as bad as before the windshield was repalced. However, I have some holes to take care of near the front sills.
      [IMG][/IMG]



      I am having these holes welded shut, hopefully next week.
      If anyone here has the leaking problem too, as I expect them to have, take the time to check this area before it's too late.
      Last edited by mike in SC; 05-16-2010 at 12:03 PM.

    16. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-18-2010 12:47 PM #16
      I redid the vapour barriers. Using a bit of Body Caulk to help control the the water.





      The Driver side let a drop or 2 through after 30 seconds of hosing down the window.
      The Passenger side stayed dry.
      Both were dry after 30 minutes of light rain.

      I'm becoming convinced that the driver side is much harder to make water tight as the outer door trim at the bottom of the window fits so poorly.

      Carpets are staying dry.
      Must be getting closer to a fix.

    17. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-30-2010 03:54 PM #17
      The car has been out in the rain most of the week. Gotta love rain to live here.

      The vapour barriers are holding. I'm confident enough in them to put the door cards back on.

      The drip tray seems to be working as the middle of the car seems to be staying dry.

      But I still have a puddle.
      The driver side foot well is wet at the bottom of the inner fender liner (if that is what it is). The puddle is down from where the wiring harness starts to make its way to the back of the car.



      There seemed to be water under the sound insulation. I lifted up the outer half. The floor was moist all the way back to the seat.



      I could see how water might be getting to the rear passenger area. The channel in the floor board could be funneling water from the front to the rear.

      I'm hoping the puddle was water that had been trapped under the sound insulation collected in one spot, but I doubt it.

      I poured about 10 litres into the rain tray and none came inside.
      The struggle continues. Let it rain.
      Last edited by voxwagen88; 05-30-2010 at 05:14 PM.

    18. Member JGWarner's Avatar
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      05-30-2010 06:08 PM #18
      Your efforts and observations are an encouragement to us all!

      I just discovered TWO new holes in my floorpan this week one of these days I'll have to strip the interior and do some leak hunting and cutting/welding. Hopefully it can wait till next year. Up til now I haven't seen a drop of water, but obviously it's getting in somewhere.

    19. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      05-30-2010 06:44 PM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by JGWarner View Post
      Your efforts and observations are an encouragement to us all!
      Hopefully at some point they will be useful as well.

      After playing in the front for a bit, I checked under the rear sound insulation and it was more than moist there as well.

      I wonder how putting 6 grommets in the floor aided manufacture of the car. All of mine seem to be sealed. The undercoating is intact around them.

      Maybe this one will be the race car as I have now removed about 10 pounds of sound deadening from one side of the car. And another 10 pounds of water.

      The rain has started again now.

    20. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      06-01-2010 12:04 AM #20
      After 6 hours of drizzle, the floor was dry.
      The rain picked up overnight and in the morning was a small puddle in exactly the same spot.

      It seems that the water is wicking in along this zap strap holding the harness in place.
      Hoping than plugging this hole will keep the water out.
      Last edited by voxwagen88; 06-01-2010 at 11:59 AM.

    21. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      06-01-2010 12:03 PM #21
      The hole letting the water in is quite tiny. A little water over a lot of years.

      Wonder if this will slow it, stop it or move the leak somewhere else.

    22. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      06-02-2010 12:19 PM #22
      That did nothing.
      I've built a wall of body caulk around the grommet where the water is pooling to see if I can tell if it is coming in from the grommet or somewhere along the path of the wiring harness. Or both.

      Off to search "Leak Detection".

    23. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      06-04-2010 02:03 AM #23
      I shot about half a can of spray powder around the foot well to see if it would give any clues as to where the water is coming from.


      The answer seems to be behind (or above ) those black bits.
      What ever they are.

      Am I going to have to pull the dash to find this leak?

    24. Member doppelfaust's Avatar
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      06-04-2010 03:17 AM #24
      Quote Originally Posted by voxwagen88 View Post
      I shot about half a can of spray powder around the foot well to see if it would give any clues as to where the water is coming from.
      http://members.shaw.ca/icollect03/wetpowder.jpg

      The answer seems to be behind (or above ) those black bits.
      What ever they are.

      Am I going to have to pull the dash to find this leak?
      Your persistence is really amazing! You're going to make some ground breaking discoveries for Foxers everywhere. Good luck with this, it certainly looks like you're going to have to pull the dash...

    25. Member voxwagen88's Avatar
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      06-04-2010 08:19 PM #25
      Well this is my plan.
      I'm going to try to block off water getting to the rain tray with some plastic.
      If water still gets in then I suspect the problem is around the windshield frame.

      If it stays dry, then the leak is in the drip tray.
      Maybe.

      Persistent like a Pit Bull.

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