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    Thread: Routan Brake Issues - Again!?

    1. 12-18-2010 11:07 AM #26
      Quote Originally Posted by Steveaut View Post
      I thought I would mention that I have 8k miles on a 2010 SEL and no brake problems as of yet. I am wondering if VW found a solution with better pads and/or rotors and have upgraded everyone who have had replacements. My Journey first went out around 18k and then a continuous 10-15k after that. The idea that it could be a caliper sounds logical to me. If they don't properly retract it would cause excessive heat and wear, causing warping.
      I do not want to jinx myself, but I have 7500K on my 2010 Routan SE, and so far brakes seem good. Low brake dust, and not any vibes or anything!

    2. Junior Member
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      12-19-2010 08:24 PM #27
      Chrysler/Jeep/Dodge brakes suck. Period.

      And NOT all minivans eat brakes like that- my 2003 Eurovan has 115k on the original rotors (on our 3rd set of pads) No shimmy. Ever. Never been resurfaced even.

      Good, thick, oversized rotors and huge calipers vs. undersized chinese Chrysler junk...

      I had a Grand Cherokee back in 03' that had a similar issue. Dealer replaced the first time, I paid the second time, then the third time- I did some research. There was a class action lawsuit pending on the brake issues!

      I ended up being reimbursed for the replacement I paid for out of pocket and FINALLY got the rotors replaced with an improved part. I got rid of it shortly after that.


      Sorry to chime in here, I was only curious because a friend just bought a Routan and I was sniffing around...

      Cheers
      Kyle

    3. Member
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      12-21-2010 08:16 AM #28
      If VW won't cover the costs, then don't buy the VW rotors again. Tire Rack sells Centric brand rotors for our vans. These are the same rotors that Powerslot rotors use, just without the slots. They are about $50 each are a much better quality than the stockers.

      Yeah it's $200, but I would bet these will not warp like the stock rotors. This is what I will do if we end up having the same issues. 3k miles so far and they are okay.
      Current: 2013 TTS / 2013 Odyssey / 2002 S2000
      Previous: 2014 Golf TDI / 2011 Cayman / 2013 GTI / 2002 996 targa / 2007 RX8 / 2006 GTI / 2006 A3 / 2003 WRX / 2000 Golf TDI / 1987 Wrangler / 1987 RX7 Turbo / 1984 RX7 GSL-SE / 1982 RX7 / 1978 280Z / 1977 Buick Century

    4. Member
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      58 Ragtop Bug, 2005 Passat Wagon, 2010 Routan SEL
      12-21-2010 12:33 PM #29
      Here are some rotor upgrades. All rotors are not created equally. Some big box autoparts stores sell lower cost parts because we all watch our money. But those lower prices usually come with a sacfrifce and the manufacturers cut material from the parts to keep the costs down. You want to find a rotor with the thickest rotor surface before it gets to the cooling veins of the rotor. Manufacturers will make the veins longer and take the surface thickness away thus resulting in a thinner rotor while still maintaining the proper surface to surface thickness. For example if a rotor is supposed to be 1-1/4 thick surface to surface that distance needs to be maintained but everything inbetween is fair game for material removal. So if you were to look at a rotor from looking at the veins the rotor surface might measure 3/8" on either side of the veins, but by removing a 1/16" or more form either inside surface would result in more rotors out the door for the manufacturer. A 1/16 might not seem like much but it could be the difference between warp or no warp possibly. Also look for a rotor that is either slotted or cross drilled, that will help in the cooling process allowing the hot gasses and surface temp to escape. I personally prefer cross-drilled rotors. I have been thru countless rotors and pads on my GMC Yukon (horrible brakes). When I switched to cross drilled rotor my warpage problems were gone for good. I could warp a set of OEM rotors in a months time. Only draw back to the crossdrilled rotors is some places will tell you they can't cut them because of the holes in them. You'll need to go to an oldtime repair shop to have it done because they're the only ones who understand how a brake lathe works. I heard a guy tell a customer that when the holes pass past the cutter, the cutter will move into the hole and break the cutting tool. I tried to explain to him that the feed of the tool is only moving a few thousandths of an inch over the whole cutting surface and he may only remove 10 thousandths of an inch to true a rotor (business card thickness) and the tool will not move in any farther than the feed rate tells the tool to move I'm hoping more businesses get into the game for these rotors but here are a few links to rotors. Either site has pads to choose from. Just a little food for thought, though not the answer for everyone. We're at 3,700 miles and all is smooth so far.

      http://www.frozenrotors.com/search/index.php
      Just enter the vans info and you'll need to choose 2009 as the year.

      http://ebcbrakes.iwebcat.com/_Member...57176&hdnSts=0
      Same as above choose the van either 2009 or 2010. The GD series are the ones.

      They claim that the cross drilled rotors crack, Ive got over 100K on crossdrilled rotors with no cracks.

    5. 12-22-2010 04:26 PM #30
      Looks like mine will be back in for a brake job. About 14K miles on the clock and brakes/rtors replaced at about 4500.

    6. Global CSI Moderator
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      01-04-2011 10:38 AM #31
      Unfortunately the problem is inherent in the design of the rotors. Not in where they were produced.
      You can put the best rotors in the world on that car and they will still warp. Vw/Chrysler would need to spec a larger and thicker rotor to help dissipate heat properly. All aftermarkets will make the rotor to fit, based on the crappy oem specs.

      So, get used to having new rotors put on...because recall or not, Chrysler still needs to redesign that rotor.
      FYI, I'm in the same boat as you guys! These rotors suck!


      iPhone

    7. Member VWroutanvanman's Avatar
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      2010 Routan Norge SE w/RSE
      02-20-2011 08:14 PM #32
      I know this is going to sound odd, but some brake rotors are very sensative to lug nut torque. I didn't have problems with my brakes until I had the tires rotated at the first oil change. I then later had a flat on the RR, and darn if the lug nuts were on so tight it took a long breaker-bar to remove them. So.......make sure your wheels aren't over-torqued. I'm not sure of the value (reading on torque wrench), but it isn't much. After checking all 4 wheels, they were all over-tightened. VW dealer should have the value. By the way, it was the VW dealer that did that first oil change and rotated the tires.

      PS..... I'm not saying that there isn't the possibility of poor quality parts, but the torque of the lugs should be correct so that can be ruled out as a problem. Also, the dealer replaced the rear rotors and pads under warrantee at 12,000 miles, and were very good about it.
      Last edited by VWroutanvanman; 02-24-2011 at 08:11 PM.

    8. Global CSI Moderator
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      2008 Passat 4Mo 3.6L Wagon, 98 VRt, 2010 Routan/Caravan :)
      02-20-2011 08:53 PM #33
      I agree, over-trq can EASILY warp rotors.


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    9. Member
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      02-20-2011 08:55 PM #34
      Quote Originally Posted by nater View Post
      I agree, over-trq can EASILY warp rotors.


      iPhone

      + 1 here

      I can't stand getting my cars back from inspection only to rotate the tires in 5K to have to hang from the breaker bar!

      BTW :The correct wheel nut tightness is 95 ft lbs (130 N·m).

    10. Member Whataguy's Avatar
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      02-24-2011 07:07 PM #35
      09 with 16,000 miles 1.5 years old went into garage today (towed-in via road side assistance, unrelated 'bad key' error - wouldn't start). Coincidentally had an appointment scheduled for next week; tapping noise underneath rear, constant, stops when brakes applied. Diagnosis: "brakes gone". Dealer said nothing can be done for warranty, acknowledging all the brake issues. $374 for rear disc and pads.

      Guess I will make a call to VWCanada, but not optimistic. Any Canadians have theirs replaced post 12 months?

      No history of 'rear' brake issues on this unit, yet 'front' brakes had issues - rotors repaired once, and then rotors replaced at about 5,000 miles.

      Thanks.

    11. Member VWroutanvanman's Avatar
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      02-24-2011 08:19 PM #36
      Thanks for that torque value. I'll go back and check my wheels.

    12. Junior Member
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      04-05-2011 01:19 PM #37
      So my Routan came down with this very symptom 4000K into ownership. When traveling > 40 mph and stepping on the brake, the van starts to shudder as if had improperly balanced wheels. Obviously this shudder comes from warped rotors. I brought this up to my dealer on a routine 6K service and they did mention 2 things:

      1) This is a know issue
      2) It has to be reported before 12K otherwise you are approaching end of warranty for these parts and they are up for a regular service.

      ... and they will address it! Just like that - no hassles, no bickering.

      I was also floored how helpful they were and friendly -- a big to my dealer. I get to drop off the van for service this fri and get a loaner to serve me throughout the service time. I do feel lucky that to find a good dealership with a great service rep.

    13. n00b
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      1990 Chevy Silverado 2002 VW Passat Wagon 4 Motion 2009 VW Routan and coutless other DUBS
      04-10-2011 09:51 PM #38
      Well my 09 Routan SE with 19000 miles also had horrible brakes. They were so bad it felt like the wheel would come out of your hands. So I put a set of cross drilled and slotted rotors on there to help with the heat. I bought the set on E-Bay and I figured I had nothing to lose. Here is the
      Item number: 280646211102 and the seller id atlautosports [/B]they are nice looking rotors amd are zink plated for rust. The pads they sent are good ones also. I must say it is night and day with the difference. It is a much firmer pedal. We have only had the van about a month and noticed the proble. I beleive that with only 19000 miles the front rotors and pads must have been changed before. They didnt look to bad but they sure were.

    14. 04-10-2011 11:22 PM #39
      Here is my History so far.

      Demo purchased with 13,000km = 8000m

      front brakes resurfaced at 20,000km = 12,500m

      Rear brakes squeal, new pads + rotors at 30,000km = 18,500m

      Front new pads + rotors at 42,000km = 26,000m

      All done under VWOC warranty with very little effort on my part.
      Forsale: Full screen MFA Euro Cluster :337 BBS RC's mint : Euro Gamma Radio with indash 6 Disc CD Changer : Lots of other misc parts : Parts Located In Canada
      Please search my user name for parts for sale.

    15. 04-13-2011 04:11 PM #40
      I purchased a used 2009 Routan last year with 36,000 miles and immediately I had that problem with the brakes.

      This was my solution to this problem (I have now 44,500 miles) and so far is working great. I installed cross drilled & slotted rotors with metallic pads. There is the option of using ceramic pads but they are very noisy with this kind of rotors, but they do brake the with very little effort on the brake pedal. Is my opinion that the regular rotors get too hot causing them to warp, cross drilled & slotted rotors cools down a lot faster. All high performance cars have this kind of rotors to cool it down while braking at high speeds. So far in my Routan is working great, like a charm.

      If interested I got it from this guy on EBAY

      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FRONT...item3f08db1a01

    16. Moderator 71sbeetle's Avatar
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      04-13-2011 06:18 PM #41
      our history is easy:
      each 6k miles visits:
      new front brake rotors
      new front brake pads
      new rear brake rotors
      new rear brake pads
      .......

    17. Member Tr0p1c_6er's Avatar
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      08-27-2011 02:37 PM #42
      Has anyone had problems with the pedal assembly? I put new cross drilled slotted rotors and ceramic pads front and rear, now when you push the pedal you get this weird squishing sound like mashing the air out of an airbag or something. Can't imagine changing the parts would have caused that (we bled the brakes well when we finished, no air bubbles, and I did the bed in process that was recommended.)

      Anyone have any suggestions on what may have happened?

    18. Member VWroutanvanman's Avatar
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      08-27-2011 06:10 PM #43
      It would be interesting to get all the manufacturing dates of our vans with brake problems. At some point Chrysler must have either run out of bad inventory, or realized that there was a brake rotor problem, and changed inventory (Chinese rotors?).......my date of manufacture on my '10 Routan SE is 11-09.

    19. Member
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      08-27-2011 06:46 PM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by Tr0p1c_6er View Post
      Has anyone had problems with the pedal assembly? I put new cross drilled slotted rotors and ceramic pads front and rear, now when you push the pedal you get this weird squishing sound like mashing the air out of an airbag or something. Can't imagine changing the parts would have caused that (we bled the brakes well when we finished, no air bubbles, and I did the bed in process that was recommended.)

      Anyone have any suggestions on what may have happened?

      If it sounds like air when pressing the brake pedal down more it's possible the power brake booster has gone bad. Do the brakes feel mushy or poor too and is it runnning rough? If it's running rough then you are leaking vacuum, but you would also hear it hissing(indside) while running. What you did should not have caused anything to happen with the booster, but if when you bled the brakes you somehow over extended the pin that pushes on the diaphram inside the booster and tore the rubber that would be about the only way I could see it happening but I highly doubt it. That does not look like a fun job, about all you can see is the master cylinder when you open the hood. Any chance your still under warranty? So they can't get too picky, put your old stuff back on

    20. Semi-n00b
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      08-29-2011 09:58 AM #45
      Is this issue happening on all trim level Routans? What year Routans is this happening on? Is this just a total problem for everyone who purchased a Routan?

    21. Junior Member
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      08-29-2011 10:36 AM #46
      Yes, all trim levels 2009-2010. No one has any issues yet for 2011 model's that I know of.

    22. 08-29-2011 03:40 PM #47
      Well I also figured I was not getting the brake problems until about 3 months ago.... Big time shaking in the steering when braking hard... Warped rotora... Just changed them using drilled rotors from Ebay... 4 rotors + 4 sets of pads $220.00 shipped and taxes included. Had the installed at a local garage for under $200.... $400.00 for new brakes all around is a good deal in my book.
      The rotors should be a lot better than the cheapos Chrysler uses.... Hoping to get at least 50k km with them.

    23. Member Tr0p1c_6er's Avatar
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      08-30-2011 08:50 AM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by 58kafer View Post
      If it sounds like air when pressing the brake pedal down more it's possible the power brake booster has gone bad. Do the brakes feel mushy or poor too and is it runnning rough? If it's running rough then you are leaking vacuum, but you would also hear it hissing(indside) while running. What you did should not have caused anything to happen with the booster, but if when you bled the brakes you somehow over extended the pin that pushes on the diaphram inside the booster and tore the rubber that would be about the only way I could see it happening but I highly doubt it. That does not look like a fun job, about all you can see is the master cylinder when you open the hood. Any chance your still under warranty? So they can't get too picky, put your old stuff back on
      Yeah, the brakes don't feel right either but the van isn't running rough as far as I can tell. There doesn't seem to be a constant noticeable hissing either. I did put ceramic pads on though, could that account for the brakes feeling like they grab less?

    24. 08-30-2011 04:39 PM #49
      Quote Originally Posted by Tr0p1c_6er View Post
      Yeah, the brakes don't feel right either but the van isn't running rough as far as I can tell. There doesn't seem to be a constant noticeable hissing either. I did put ceramic pads on though, could that account for the brakes feeling like they grab less?
      I don't think the ceramic pads will make the vehicle feel like it grabs less. If anything, it should feel like it brakes much better and grabs more. I switched all of my prior vehicles to ceramics and they always stopped better and were quiet. I will eventually on the Routan, but as long as VW replaces them for free, which they recently did, I won't worry about it. I suspect that was a one time benefit and the next time, at or near 40K miles, I will need to buy some ceramics and new rotors and do it myself.

    25. Member Tr0p1c_6er's Avatar
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      08-31-2011 09:48 PM #50
      Does anyone else get a whooshing sound when you mash the pedal? I also can't get the ABS to engage on pavement.

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