How I got our kids to like our Phaeton - DIY rear seat entertainment

[jkuisma]

During our almost year of Phaeton ownership, me and my wife have learned to appreciate all the positive qualities of the car. Our two daughters (1 and 4 years) have not been that happy. In our previous Audi, they could watch cartoons in the rear but this was not the case with our Phaeton. So I was kindly asked to come up with a solution for a DIY rear seat entertainment system. Now that it is completed, I thought I might share this with you.

1. Rear screen

This is where it all starts from. First, I considered installing dual screens to the back of the front headrests. This would have been a major undertaking with the 18-way seats. Not to mention that the OEM screens are pretty darn expensive and I feel that they are placed a bit too high for the kids to view.

My next thought was that I would install a single roof mounted screen. I gave up on this idea once I dismounted a part of the headliner: There is awfully much stuff in there with all the sunroof related wiring and such. Not much room for extra wiring.

Then I stumbled across a very interesting console mount monitor on Ebay. It was pretty cheap but had a decent 800x480 native resolution, video input and it was available in grey color matching our interior. It definitely isn't OEM but I think it integrates pretty ok with the center console. It has a very good viewing position for the kids and does not get into the way no matter what you are up to in the rear.




It also is positioned so that it does not interfere with the use of the handrest or the storage bin:



2. Front screen - OEM ZAB modifications

Since our kids are too young to "operate" the system themselves, we needed to get the same video displayed on the front screen and therefore have some means to control what is played. For this I integrated the system with the OEM head unit ZAB. For this to work, I had to:

- Purchase a simple extra connector that goes to the OEM TV Tuner (which the car already had). The adapter has two video inputs and stereo audio in. This is a no brainer if you have the OEM TV Tuner. There seem to be solutions for cars without TV Tuner available for about $200 on eBay.

- Get rid of the blocking of TV while on motion. This is not trivial in a Phaeton. The speed signal is transmitted to the ZAB via CAN BUS. You need a special adapter to piggyback the CAN BUS, grab the speed signal and modify it. I purchase such a box for about $200 from Kufatec. Installation was a bit tricky. The whole ZAB needs to come out and the wiring of the TV-in-motion box is, though simple, prone to critical errors. The manual referred to the factory wiring only by wire colors and this resulted in me connecting CAN HIGH to entertainment BUS and the CAN LOW went to convenience bus! I can assure you this resulted in - ehem - interesting behavior of the car and about 50+ logged fault codes. Fortunately this was nothing a good old VCDS could not fix and Kufatec promised
to modify the installation instructions. This tv-in-motion box does its job and does not interfere with any other functions in the car - even navi works as intended. The box can be easily disabled using steering wheel buttons.

Now we get to see the video in front even with the car on the move. I assure you, this is not to be able to watch the videos but to be able to pick the next film for the kids...

3. Audio

Nothing needs to be done here except coupling the new audio inputs of the TV tuner to the audio source. The audio is played whenever TV/AV input is chosen. All the normal stuff, DSP/equalizer, balance, fader, works as expected.

4. AV source

I did think about using a "portable media player" or such. But as I compiled a list of things I wanted it to be able to do:

- play back kids' videos (MPG, recorded from digital TV broadcasts at home)
- play back DVD's
- play back MP3's
- be able to store my whole MP3 collection (>50 gigs) and tens of hours of kids' videos
- have simple user interface with 100% remote control support
- syncronize new media from home server automatically (via WLAN)
- Digital terrestrial TV would be nice

I soon realized that only a full-fledged media PC will do the job. I chose a pre-owned HP NC6400 dual core laptop. It is coupled to HP basic port replicator.

They fit pretty nicely to the side of the trunk:



The laptop is not modified and it can be detached from the dock with a click of a button. Now I have a good reason to have my VCDS cable in the car - I can do side-of-the-road diagnostics if ever necessary. The PC is running Windows 7 Home Premium (I am using it's Media Center) and it has a HD capacity of 250 GB which is slowly filling up via WLAN every time it syncronizes over WLAN in the garage.

5. Controlling the system

As the laptop is running Windows Media Center, it has native support for remote controls and there is no need to have a keyboard or a pointing device. Most media center remotes are infrared. It would have been possible to install the IR receiver in the cabin, but this would have necessitated more wiring and the remote would need to be pointed at the receiver. Fortunately there is a RF based media center remote available from Keyspan. Think I paid about $100 for it.

Works like a champ: with the receiver in the trunk, the remote works flawlessly anywhere in the car.

6. Powering the laptop

Getting power to the laptop/docking station is simple. There are handy 12V travel power supplies available for less than $50. It replaces the standard power supply and converts 12V to whatever is needed by the laptop: that is 18V in case of the HP. I tossed this power supply to the righthand side battery compartment together with another important box: a special power controller. I had made this (relatively simple) circuitry a few years back for my previous car-PC project. It monitors the accessory power (ignition lock pole 15) status and based on that, it powers on the PC when the car is started and powers it down (=hibernates Windows) politely once the car is parked again. It has a main power relay making sure the laptop does not get power while the car is parked, as it would on drain down the battery. The only thing visible is a manual power button which I use to power on the PC when I want to use it. I placed this button where a keyless start-stop button would reside (yep, my car does not have keyless access).



Since the Phaeton does not have a mechanical ignition lock, there is no real accessory power signal (pole 15) in the car. Most of the units under the rear parcel shelf are fed with constant +12V and they are "powered on" by CAN BUS. This was a problem as I needed the ACC power signal to control the laptop. I did find CAN BUS power controllers from the net (expensive - $150 or so!) but a thorough reading of the factory wiring diagram revealed that there is a ACC power wire in the factory telephone wiring. So this was solved easily.

7. Other bits and pieces needed

I think that this was a pretty simple install, after all. Not many extra "boxes" were needed to make it all work. The ones that I used are installed in the "avionics compartment", that is below the rear hat shelf. Mmmhp, it is pretty crowdy in there now:



What I added:

- Video signal splitter/amplifier: needed to split the video out signal (there is a designated video out readily on the HP docking station) for the front and

rear screens. The video signal for the rear screen goes directly to it. The front screen is interfaced via the TV tuner.

- Ground loop isolator for the audio signals: this helps to reduce the whining in the audio signals which is always a problem in installations like this.

- TV Tuner. Yep, got it and it works pretty well! This is a very neat Cinergy DT USB XS Diversity which cost about $100. It has dual tuner / diversity receiver. Unfortunately, Windows 7 Media Center does not support the diversity function yet so I am getting distortion in the reception at speeds beyond 100km/h. Can live with that for now as live TV is not that useful in a car - in my mind, anyway.

- Antenna adapters: I think this is pretty neat! I purchased FAKRA adapters which I use to couple the Cinergy tuner to two of the OEM TV antennas. These antennas reside in the rear window and they have built-in amplifiers which need +12V. It is provided via phantom power supplies on both antenna adapters. I sourced parts from ebay for a few bucks. Works very well and I did not have to resort to some aftermarket glue-on-the-window antennas

I guess that's about it. Did I have to rip off the whole of the car's interior? No, not really. It was quite simple actually. I did take apart the front center console to install the power button. I routed the wires for power button and the rear monitor from the cabin to the trunk. This was a PITA. Trust me
on this, the only way to pull wires from the cabin to the trunk is by first removing the rear seat and backrest. From that on it was simple.

It did take a few days for me to put it all together. But it sure was worth it. Happy kids = happy wife = better understanding for my next "project" whatever it may be.

And look, doesn't my Phaeton look happy now?

[eurolok003]

Thank you for this most interesting and well-detailed post. I was thinking of mounting a roof monitor, but now I will probably not try. Thanks for saving me some headache and frustration!

[Jxander]

That was a fantastic post. Very informative and i am sure it will lead others to perform a similar upgrade.

However, I got more excited about the pictures posted and those fine looking wheels. I assume these are OEM Phaeton on the newer generation European models. The bright silver color(hyper-silver?) on the wheels is much classier than the dull silver on my Challenge wheels. If you don't mind, tell us about those wheels.

[jkuisma]

I assume these are OEM Phaeton on the newer generation European models. The bright silver color(hyper-silver?) on the wheels is much classier than the dull silver on my Challenge wheels.

The photo is taken from a bit odd angle, my wheels are pretty common "Omanyts". They're silver with a polished outer lip, 19" in size. Here seems to be a whole thread on the subject: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3831433

[mhoepfin]

Wow, impressive!!!

[Prince Ludwig]

A very nice installation (which may very soon be used as a crib sheet!) however, in your case wouldn't some of this been cheaper?

Harry

[AudianerA6]

Zed ze typikal VW Warkuß smile!

just kidding. Do you have Myrthe wood? I have it too (I suppose), but mine doesn't have this 'greenish' touch?! How is the wavy grain on your wood? Is it sharp and very detailed with small thin grain or extremely blurry?

Oh and by the way, your TV upgrade looks very professional. BMW used to have a similar if not even the same design for the old Chris Bangle BMW 7. To bad, that this might not look good in a 4 seater.

[jkuisma]

Haha, thanks guys!

Harry, yes, should have asked my wife to prescribe our kids what you proposed - would have spared me a lot of time spent in the garage. What comes to money, the parts I used were not expensive at all. The set has been working fine ever since. I have even gotten to use the laptop for something useful - fixed my cranky electric trunk lid with VAGCOM while on the road.

Do you have Myrthe wood? I have it too (I suppose), but mine doesn't have this 'greenish' touch?! How is the wavy grain on your wood? Is it sharp and very detailed with small thin grain or extremely blurry?

My car has the "pappelmaser schwarz" wood from VW Individual. It is (most of the time) pretty much gray but when exposed to bright light, it looks brownish. I know this is stupid but it was one of the main reasons I chose this particular pre-owned Phaeton :-) Here's some more photos of the wood:

[RCT(V)]

On the assumption that “Espoo, FIN” is Finland . . . I am pretty certain “jkuisma”, that if you were a little more accessible, you would have Phaeton owners queuing on your driveway to do the installation on their behalf

[gibber_2k]

I realy like how simply you have done this, I never thought to use a laptop and docking station, genius. I have bought myself a p4 car pc that I am going to fit.

Can I ask how bad is the noise interferance?

[jkuisma]

Can I ask how bad is the noise interferance?

You mean audio or video? I have a simple ground loop isolator in between the audio cables and there is no noise in audio whatsoever (this was a surprise as I had lots of trouble with it in my previous car).

Video is nearly flawless even though I have some regular audio RCA cables carrying the composite video signals. Will replace them with properly shielded cables eventually.

I was pretty surprised with the quality of the built-in monitor of the ZAB infotainment: Even though it accepts only regular composite signal it renders the PC image very well. The picture quality is at least as good as on the rear monitor (which has 800x480 native resolution, although it is wired with composite as well). Of course you would not want to work with spreadsheets on the screen but the quality is very good for media center and video playback use.

Jouko

[EnglishPhaeton]

Hi Jouko,

thanks for all the info in this thread, it is being put to good use with the Mac Mini install now proceeding!!


Thanks again
Stu

[WillemBal]

Hi Jouko,

It is already some time ago that you posted your solution for video and MPEG audio in your car, via the TV tuner connections. It looks like I have the main materials in house to realize such an upgrade and after reading your description, I have some questions.

You wrote:
2. Front screen - OEM ZAB modifications

Since our kids are too young to "operate" the system themselves, we needed to get the same video displayed on the front screen and therefore have some means to control what is played. For this I integrated the system with the OEM head unit ZAB. For this to work, I had to:

- Purchase a simple extra connector that goes to the OEM TV Tuner (which the car already had). The adapter has two video inputs and stereo audio in. This is a no brainer if you have the OEM TV Tuner. There seem to be solutions for cars without TV Tuner available for about $200 on eBay.

Am I correct that this simple extra connector is just enabling you to connect a second screen? I have the OEM TV tuner, and my thinking was to leave it installed, so that the ZAB thinks that there still is a TV tuner, and to splice the Y and C video leads (which go to the ZAB) into the S-Video out connector of a laptop.

And do the same with the audio outputs. The TV tuner has front left and front right audio outputs. I want to take off the leads of the connector (which go to the DSP amplifier) and connect them to the audio outputs of the laptop. Is this basically the way you connected your laptop to the system, i.e. by means of bypassing the TV-tuner?

It is a bit puzzling what you wrote, in particular this quote below:

- Video signal splitter/amplifier: needed to split the video out signal (there is a designated video out readily on the HP docking station) for the front and rear screens. The video signal for the rear screen goes directly to it. The front screen is interfaced via the TV tuner

.

I do not really understand how you use the TV tuner to "interface" the composite video out. Perhaps the TV tuner has its way to convert composite video into S-video for the ZAB screen. But wouldn't it have been much simpler to use composite video for your rear screen and S-video for your ZAB screen? Your docking station does the conversion for you! I explain that below.

Next question is about the laptop and its connections:



I am pretty lucky to have an obsolete HP7610B laptop. It looks similar to your laptop and the docking station I have looks 100% identical to yours. When I look at the picture above, I see a yellow connector that looks like a "Tulip" connector for composite video. But my understanding of the video system of the P is that it is using S-video, which has chrominance and luminance. The S-video chassis connector (looks like an old style mouse connector) is located right next to the composite video out connector on the docking station. Do you have a particular reason to use composite video out instead of the better quality S-video out? As I wrote above, you can use both video outputs, eliminating the need for a video splitter.

A question about powering the laptop. I read about how you did it. What I don't understand, is this:

......a special power controller. I had made this (relatively simple) circuitry a few years back for my previous car-PC project. It monitors the accessory power (ignition lock pole 15) status and based on that, it powers on the PC when the car is started and powers it down (=hibernates Windows) politely once the car is parked again.

Why don't you use terminal 15 directly? It should be available. I can see on your photo below that you don't have a Nokia car phone controller. This controller remains on for about 15 minutes until shutting down the ignition. My guess is that I could tap terminal 15 from the telephone controller and then adjust the hibernation settings in such a way, that the laptop shuts down in hibernation mode once it is running on its own battery.

You wrote:

Since the Phaeton does not have a mechanical ignition lock, there is no real accessory power signal (pole 15) in the car. Most of the units under the rear parcel shelf are fed with constant +12V and they are "powered on" by CAN BUS. This was a problem as I needed the ACC power signal to control the laptop. I did find CAN BUS power controllers from the net (expensive - $150 or so!) but a thorough reading of the factory wiring diagram revealed that there is a ACC power wire in the factory telephone wiring. So this was solved easily.

Is this basically the solution I was suggesting earlier? But what is "ACC power signal"?

Other question: How does it switch on automatically? Or is it always in sleep mode and you just need to do something with your remote control to waken it up? Or is this the answer:

The only thing visible is a manual power button which I use to power on the PC when I want to use it. I placed this button where a keyless start-stop button would reside (yep, my car does not have keyless access)

I guess a (toggle) relay, connected to terminal 15, could do the same thing. And I guess that you made some soldering inside the docking station to connect the on/off switch to your switch in the front of the car?

Get rid of the blocking of TV while on motion. This is not trivial in a Phaeton. The speed signal is transmitted to the ZAB via CAN BUS. You need a special adapter to piggyback the CAN BUS, grab the speed signal and modify it. I purchase such a box for about $200 from Kufatec. Installation was a bit tricky. The whole ZAB needs to come out....

Are you aware of any alternative solutions for the "TV in motion" functionality? My purpose is not to watch TV, but to be able to use the multimedia capabilities of the car.

You wrote that you wanted to be able to do a couple of things. For example:

- have simple user interface with 100% remote control support

I assume that your a using a mini Bluetooth remote keyboard for this purpose?

Last question: If you had to do it again, would you do it the same way, or differently?

Looking forward to the answers,

Willem

[jkuisma]

Hi Willem! Looks like you have put some serious thought into your install plans. In fact you have digged even a bit deeper than I did! Great!

Am I correct that this simple extra connector is just enabling you to connect a second screen? I have the OEM TV tuner, and my thinking was to leave it installed, so that the ZAB thinks that there still is a TV tuner, and to splice the Y and C video leads (which go to the ZAB) into the S-Video out connector of a laptop.

My TV tuner is still in place. The modifications to it are: I have "stolen" two diversity antennas which are now used by the DVB-T tuner I have installed to the laptop. And then, I have added a row of connector pins to the TV tuner. These pins enable, as you guessed, composite video-in and audio-in to the tuner. When I switch the ZAB to tv tuner mode, I get the option of watching analogue TV (now obsolete here in Finland) or switch to either AV1 or AV2. The PC picture comes via AV1. AV2 is currently unused but could be used for, say, rear view camera.

Your idea of splicing to the car's wiring loom between the tuner and the ZAB could certainly work. You are right in that it could result in a slightly better picture quality on the ZAB. My current setup with signal splitter and composite video is not as elegant. On the other hand, it did not require any changes to the original wiring loom (as it would be a problem - noot)

Is this basically the way you connected your laptop to the system, i.e. by means of bypassing the TV-tuner?

As I explained above, I did not bypass the tuner - I connected the video and audio via the tuner's designated inputs.

I do not really understand how you use the TV tuner to "interface" the composite video out. Perhaps the TV tuner has its way to convert composite video into S-video for the ZAB screen.

For anyone interested on this, answer is yes: there are designated composite in pins (normally unused) on the TV tuner. I even recall the pinout has been posted here on the forum at one time.

Why don't you use terminal 15 directly? It should be available. I can see on your photo below that you don't have a Nokia car phone controller. This controller remains on for about 15 minutes until shutting down the ignition. My guess is that I could tap terminal 15 from the telephone controller and then adjust the hibernation settings in such a way, that the laptop shuts down in hibernation mode once it is running on its own battery.

How to power-control a car-pc is a VERY hot topic on car-pc related discussion boards and there are maaany approaches to this. What my setup does is pretty simple:

- the laptop is powered (note! Not booted) whenever the car is on (terminal 15 active)
- the laptop is started manually, by pressing a push button on center console, whenever you feel like entertaining yourself. This brings the PC back from hibernation.
- when you turn off the car, the laptop's power button is triggered by a momentary relay circuit and this tells the computer to hibernate
- some time later (about 5 mins) the power to the laptop is cut off, there's a time delay circuit for this.

The laptop should not be permanently powered as this would drain the battery. On the other hand, you need to ensure the laptop is powered on long enough for the computer to hibernate. This is important as it seems like the laptop battery tends to drain out in this kind of use (especially in the winter time, as it is freezing and the battery really takes no charge). What you need to note, as well, is that once the power to the laptop is cut out, the docking station will disconnect and this will cause all docking-station connected devices to disappear from the laptop (assuming it is still running). Next time you reboot it it will re-detect all devices. This could take minutes and pop up a confirmation question or two. Therefore I don't think it is a good idea to just cut the power and let the computer hibernate automatically when on internal battery.

Is this basically the solution I was suggesting earlier? But what is "ACC power signal"?

Yes, I used the terminal 15 on telephone connector. It is sometimes referred as Accessory or ACC terminal. Although I recall that this terminal is shut down immediately as you turn of the ignition? There could be another one in that loom which stays on a bit longer?

How does it switch on automatically? Or is it always in sleep mode and you just need to do something with your remote control to waken it up?

I decided that it is best to turn on the PC by using the push button whenever needed. We usually let the kids enjoy it only on longer drives - not on our way to the grocery shop. I am hoping this is also good for the PC's health as it is not started for every short commute.

And I guess that you made some soldering inside the docking station to connect the on/off switch to your switch in the front of the car?

Yep, I simply piggybacked the external switch to the wires going to the power switch on the dock. There are no modifications whatsoever to the laptop itself. I have, in fact, another similar laptop and docking station I have transformed into a "video surveillance station" at our summer cottage. In that one I built a optoisolator-relay circuit which hits the power button whenever the dock is seeing power but the laptop is turned off. This way, you could get the pc to start automatically whenever the dock is powered on. To turn off the PC, you would probably have to resort to the "hibernate when on battery" trick, but I suspect you would then get those issues with external devices... My surveillance PC is supposed to be turned on permanently and this is guaranteed by an UPS... :-)

Are you aware of any alternative solutions for the "TV in motion" functionality? My purpose is not to watch TV, but to be able to use the multimedia capabilities of the car.

The only trick I have heard of is taking the whole ZAB apart and bypassing the internal circuitry to feed in the video directly to the display panel. It was quite some time ago, but there was a company who offered a kit for this. This way, one does not even need the TV tuner.

I assume that your a using a mini Bluetooth remote keyboard for this purpose?

Actually I have a simple Windows Media Center Remote - it is enough for controlling the media center. My version is a RF one (instead of IR) and it works flawlessly even though the receiver is connected to the docking station in the trunk.

Last question: If you had to do it again, would you do it the same way, or differently?

This setup has really worked surprisingly well and having a full-fledged car-pc has its advantages.

I am leaning, though, towards a "thinner" setup for future installs. In fact it was just last Sunday when I placed an order for a "kit" for our VW EOS: I will replace the factory radio with Sony XAV-601BT. It is the first retail device to support this new, exciting standard called Mirrorlink (see this link) which enables full interraction between car display "terminals" and mobile devices.

What I might be tempted to look into - in the future - is how to "mirrorlink" enable the ZAB. It would require - at minimum - "touch enabling" the ZAB. I am thinking that this could be done as soon as there's a mirrorlink client for (embedded) PC's. You would need to feed in the video from the PC to the ZAB, add a touch screen layer to the ZAB panel and wire it to the PC. Should be doable and would be kind-of all-in-one solution to all bluetooth connectivity and navigation upgrade needs. But let's see how well this works with "off the shelf" products in my EOS first... :-)

Jouko

[VloJoh]

Willem,

I think I know what is going to happen pretty soon

John

[WillemBal]

Hi Jouko,

Thank you for answering so quickly! Yes, I indeed put some serious thoughts in it. Something is brewing here (John)

I have "stolen" two diversity antennas which are now used by the DVB-T tuner I have installed to the laptop.

Good solution! The antenna's are right there where we want it: in the trunk. And DVB-T is using the same frequency band as the analog UHF TV. So connecting them to a low cost USB DVB-T tuner would be a great solution. Just won

And then, I have added a row of connector pins to the TV tuner. These pins enable, as you guessed, composite video-in and audio-in to the tuner. When I switch the ZAB to tv tuner mode, I get the option of watching analogue TV (now obsolete here in Finland) or switch to either AV1 or AV2. The PC picture comes via AV1. AV2 is currently unused but could be used for, say, rear view camera.

Aahhh, this is A(audio)V(ideo) source 1 and 2. I didn't realize that they are present. I could go that route as well.

For anyone interested on this, answer is yes: there are designated composite in pins (normally unused) on the TV tuner. I even recall the pinout has been posted here on the forum at one time.

Got it. There are pretty cheap USB or PCMCIA operated DVB-T tuners available which can be connected to this input.

How to power-control a car-pc is a VERY hot topic on car-pc related discussion boards and there are maaany approaches to this. What my setup does is pretty simple:

- the laptop is powered (note! Not booted) whenever the car is on (terminal 15 active)
- the laptop is started manually, by pressing a push button on center console, whenever you feel like entertaining yourself. This brings the PC back from hibernation.

I hope to find a logic signal somewhere, that switches state when "TV" is selected on the ZAB. I could use that signal to switch on the laptop. I think I would power the laptop through terminal 15. Some more research is needed.

Yes, I used the terminal 15 on telephone connector. It is sometimes referred as Accessory or ACC terminal. Although I recall that this terminal is shut down immediately as you turn of the ignition? There could be another one in that loom which stays on a bit longer?

I wouldn't mind that it shuts down immediately after switching off ignition. I need to be careful about saving energy of the LH battery.

My surveillance PC is supposed to be turned on permanently and this is guaranteed by an UPS... :-)

Judging by your exposed ingenuity, I'm sure you can remotely watch what is going on around your cottage.

This setup has really worked surprisingly well and having a full-fledged car-pc has its advantages.

Such as adding a USB or PCMCIA GPS receiver (antenna is already present), Google earth navigation and much more.

I am leaning, though, towards a "thinner" setup for future installs. In fact it was just last Sunday when I placed an order for a "kit" for our VW EOS: I will replace the factory radio with Sony XAV-601BT. It is the first retail device to support this new, exciting standard called Mirrorlink
(see this link)

Thanks for the link. This might open a bright future for GP0 and GP1 P's.

What I might be tempted to look into - in the future - is how to "mirrorlink" enable the ZAB. It would require - at minimum - "touch enabling" the ZAB. I am thinking that this could be done as soon as there's a mirrorlink client for (embedded) PC's.

It can be done quite simply with a touch screen kit. These are available in various sizes and simply connect to the PC via USB. Perhaps even Bluetooth touch screens are available, avoiding the need for extra wires from ZAB to trunk. This solution makes the operation of the media centre a lot more simple.

You would need to feed in the video from the PC to the ZAB, add a touch screen layer to the ZAB panel and wire it to the PC. Should be doable and would be kind-of all-in-one solution to all bluetooth connectivity and navigation upgrade needs.

We think the same way!

But let's see how well this works with "off the shelf" products in my EOS first... :-)

I'm very interested to see how this would work. Meanwhile, I'll start with some explorations to see what the quality of the video would be using the S-Video output of the docking station.

Willem

[j3w]

Has anyone got a photo of the 'avionics bay' without the additional stuff?

Yes, I'm too lazy to unscrew it if there's an alternative...I'm wondering if I can put a stereo amp in there. I'm collecting parts for a massive stereo upgrade right now, will post pics and a how to when the project is done...at this rate, say 2013, 2014.

[jkuisma]

Willem! Do report on any findings on:

I hope to find a logic signal somewhere, that switches state when "TV" is selected on the ZAB.

and

explorations to see what the quality of the video would be using the S-Video output of the docking station.

The new Sony head unit for my EOS did not make it here this week... So no install tomorrow, will need to plan for something else instead... One though that crossed my mind re: mirrorlink is, that there is a 7" version of the Sony's mirrorlink head unit already on sale (701HD that is). This thing has screen measurements identical to Phaeton's ZAB. What someone with a good confidence on his electronics skills and 600 euros to spare could do, is to buy one 701HD and brutally take it apart. Put the touch screen element on the ZAB and feed the video from the unit to ZAB's video in. Hide the Sony somewhere out of sight and use the ZAB as a touch screen interface for it. No need for PC of any sort.

Damn. Will have to check how the cheaper model performs in the EOS. The 701HD retrofit to Phaeton sounds pretty tempting and very doable, indeed...

Jouko

[WillemBal]

I'm collecting parts for a massive stereo upgrade........

Massive stereo?

Willem

[WillemBal]

This should give you a good impression of what you might expect in a fully loaded avionics bay. Just be careful not to toast your hat shelf.



Willem

[j3w]

Massive stereo? Willem

Well perhaps massive is an overstatement, I listen to a lot of music of many types and the only thing I cannot stand about my limo is the terrible stereo, so I'm putting together a really high quality replacement.

I'm thinking of taking the output from the head, feeding it to a digital summing processor, and from there to a large mono amp to feed a 12 inch trunk mounted sub. That will be crossed over to two way components in each door each getting something like 175-200 watts each and a lower powered pair of ambiance tweeters in the front.

I'm going to add iPod connectivity to the system, and that should make my Phaeton the ultimate freeway ride.

Thanks for the photo, I'm going to drop the tray this weekend and take measurements.

[WillemBal]

Willem! Do report on any findings on...

Hi Jouko,

This weekend, I spent some time in the trunk, sorting out various signals.
I can report back about the quality of the video. The screen remained black, whatever I did.
I first tried to work on the following wire group:

15 Video - C - front positive
16 Video - C - front negative
17 Video - Y - front positive
18 Video - Y - front negative
19 Vehicle Ground (GND)

I unclipped terminals 15 thru 19 from the T54 connector block and connected them to the S-video output of my laptop. As soon as I powered on the TV, my laptop started acting weird, doing all kind of things which looked like it was adapting itself to whatever it was seeing at its S-video output. The laptop's resolution changed, became unresponsive, but the ZAB front screen remained all black. I then used the Windows projector wizard to see if I could make a connection, including modification of various resolutions, all to no avail.

After having given it some thoughts, I believe that the S-video connection between R78 TV tuner is feeding its Y and C signals to the ZAB screen via a modified wiring method. I think that the designers created a different output for each, meaning that the signal is inverted and sent through the Y- and C- leads to the ZAB. It's a technique to reduce "common mode" noise, similar to what is done through twisted pairs of CAT5 and 6 cables. So this is not going to work with the coax signals we have from the laptop. Unless some electronic circuit is made to convert it into symmetrical signals.
This makes it impossible to bypass the tuner as far as video is concerned. I've been doing some further digging in various wiring diagrams, and I found a very useful alternative.


It seems that terminals 47 thru 53 are intended for connection to the so-called "Steckdose für video", U22. It was an option in long gone days, to connect to a high-end video system. In my car, the wiring to these terminals is missing. So I will get some new terminals to click in the existing T54 TV connector and wire them to the laptop.

The terminals are:

47 Audio left front external connection option
48 Audio right front external connection option
49 Audio/Video ground front external connection option
50 Super Video System front external connection
51 Super Video System front external connection
52 CVBS front external connection option
53 Complete audio/video shielding front external connection

My guess and my hope is that terminals 50 and 51 are the S-video terminals. And I bet that you used terminal 52 for composite video to the ZAB?
So the next thing to do is to see if these leads can be used to feed in S-Video in either AV1 or AV2.
If this is not going to work, then I will use the composite video input, just like you did.

I haven't figured out yet whether there is a logic "TV on" signal. The tuner is powered on at all times via terminal 30, so it looks like it is brought to life via CAN bus.

To be continued...

btw... Touch screen enabling the ZAB screen might be possible using this


Willem

[Defiants]

I was kindly asked to come up with a solution for a DIY rear seat entertainment system.

How things change. I learned to like our '63 Belvedere when shown just how long a walk home it was.

As for entertainment, we were issued the good ol' Car Bingo cards. Besides their entertainment value, they were also constructed of a thick enough board that with only a couple of swipes, the parent could instill a great sense of peril in the child, yet not leave markings which would arouse the curiosity of the authorities.

--Guy.

[WillemBal]

...As for entertainment, we were issued the good ol' Car Bingo cards...

I think we are mostly enjoying ourselves prior to and during the installation process of all these gadgets.

Willem! Do report on any findings on:

explorations to see what the quality of the video would be using the S-Video output of the docking station.

I managed to make the S-Video input work using self-made "repair wires" which I inserted in the TV tuner terminal block, pin numbers 47 through 51. Also managed to make an RF wireless mouse work, and used a DC-DC converter for power supply to the laptop.
The TV source must be set to AV2, I guess that this is the input for the S-Video.
After some playing with it, I must say that the small dimensions of the screen make it difficult to navigate, while the Spotify I use to manage my music, isn't adapting well to the smaller scale.

Reaching this stage, I think there still is a lot to do to make this a success. For instance, the TV-in-motion wiring from Kufatec needs to be installed, and also some work is necessary to switch on and off the PC.

I think it would be better to see whether we can make the Mirrorlink work on our cars. This may solve a lot of problems, bearing in mind the ageing of the original TFT screen may require replacement anyway.

Willem

[jkuisma]

I think we are mostly enjoying ourselves prior to and during the installation process of all these gadgets.

I would have said the same, without adding the smileys! :-) This is absolutely true. It is the feeling you get once you finish a successful install... Then it is a whole different thing if the setup is ever really useful in practice. But, in case of the "rear seat entertainment" our kids have appreciated it a lot.

I managed to make the S-Video input work using self-made "repair wires" which I inserted in the TV tuner terminal block, pin numbers 47 through 51.

This is very good info, thank you Willem! I will need to wire my PC for s-video the next time I "drop down" the rear shelf.

After some playing with it, I must say that the small dimensions of the screen make it difficult to navigate, while the Spotify I use to manage my music, isn't adapting well to the smaller scale.

Yep, you are right. I think I am using 800x600 which is OK with Windows Media Center interface but text in small font is a bit difficult to read. It is perfect for video playback, though.

Reaching this stage, I think there still is a lot to do to make this a success. For instance, the TV-in-motion wiring from Kufatec needs to be installed, and also some work is necessary to switch on and off the PC.

True. And as the Kufatec adapter isn't exactly cheap either... There isn't really any alternative for it. The switch-on and switch-off thing costs only a few euros in parts and some soldering, so it is simple.

I think it would be better to see whether we can make the Mirrorlink work on our cars. This may solve a lot of problems, bearing in mind the ageing of the original TFT screen may require replacement anyway.

I completely agree. I have now used the Mirrorlink in our EOS for a few weeks and it works VERY well. Especially the navigation works wonderfully!

The only thing keeping me from ordering a Raspberry Pi is that I have not yet found a suitable (free or sold in retail) Mirrorlink client for Linux. Once it is released (surely only a matter of time) this will make a great setup.

Jouko