Eurovan 5th gear swap experiences

[vwhusaberg]

I have a 1992 Eurovan 2.5L manual Canadian model (gas). The transmission code is DKA.

It revs too high on the highway, and I want to replace 5th gear with either a .658 or a .622, but I'm not sure which one to choose.

I want to cruise between 55 (88kph) and 75 mph (120kph) with very low revs, but I am wondering if the engine has enough torque to pull the .622 gear going against a headwind.

Has anyone tried either of these gearsets in a similar van?

Thank-you

[CdnVWJunk-e]

Where can you source a .622?

[vwhusaberg]

They have them at the link below:

http://www.advancedautomotion.com/in...p?cPath=69_137

[CdnVWJunk-e]

Hmm. So they do. What 5th does your EV have now? If you drop it too much you may find that your revs are lower but you'll be out of your torque curve but I'm sure you already knew that.

[gti_matt]

The I5's torque curve is very flat, peaking quickly at 2200rpm and staying very close to that up to about 4000 and then it falls off fast. You'd have to get it to drop below 2000 for it to suffer much:

http://www.a2resource.com/brochures/...e/source/8.jpg

Just from mine, my impression is that it pulls well even as low as about 1700. I don't know what revs a .622 5th would result in but unless it drops it real bad, I think you'll still easily be in the sweet-spot range of torque. For an engine that was designed for lower-end grunt, I'm kinda mystified that VW fitted it with such a short 5th gear.

[vwhusaberg]

Ya I don't know what VW was thinking. It has a .837 5th gear now. Technically, it looks like this transmission is from a 1997 Diesel Transporter, but still...?

I ordered the .658 gears and will report back here when I get them installed.

[CdnVWJunk-e]

Ya I don't know what VW was thinking. It has a .837 5th gear now. Technically, it looks like this transmission is from a 1997 Diesel Transporter, but still...?

I ordered the .658 gears and will report back here when I get them installed.

Yes, let us know. That should provide a substantial drop in RPMs.

[Scirocco53]

I purchased a EWB transmission from the UK, which has the .700 5th, but it is broken. For the money, it's a dealer only item, and would have to be ordered from Europe, unless I shell out the $400 to Advance.

[CdnVWJunk-e]

I purchased a EWB transmission from the UK, which has the .700 5th, but it is broken. For the money, it's a dealer only item, and would have to be ordered from Europe, unless I shell out the $400 to Advance.

Are you sticking with the AAB?

[Scirocco53]

Are you sticking with the AAB?

Yes, but I am building a monster motor.

[vwhusaberg]

OK I still haven't put in my new .658 5th gear, but I finally got out for a drive in the van for an emissions test (failed on NOx) and I recorded the RPMs at different speeds in 4th and 5th gears so I'd have a baseline.

I know my 4th gear RPMs won't change with a 5th gear swap, but I was curious because I might have to use 4th a bit more with such a tall 5th...and my next step might be some taller tires which will have an effect on all the gears.

4th gear, 60km/hr = 2200RPM
4th gear, 70km/hr = 2600RPM
4th gear, 80km/hr = 3000RPM

5th gear, 80km/hr = 2200RPM
5th gear, 90km/hr = 2500RPM
5th gear, 100km/hr = 2750RPM
5th gear, 110km/hr = 3050RPM
5th gear, 120km/hr = 3300RPM

[gti_matt]

Any update on this?

[gti_matt]

Just did some rough calculations using this site:
http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/t...calculator.htm

Assuming a stock configuration in the 1993 Eurovan 5MT with a 5th gear of .84 and a final drive of 4.61 (all from http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/...e/Page0006.jpg) and the 195-70-15 tires I have now...

A .658 gear will drop revs at 70mph by 766 rpms (wow).

A .622 will drop a further 152 rpms for a total of 918 rpms.

So at 70mph we should see a drop from somewhere around 3500-3600 to a little over 2600 with the .622 and a little over 2700 with the .658. Given the green band on the Eurovan's tachometer, I would think it would be just fine at that engine speed and not bogging.

[CABNFEVR]

4th gear, 60km/hr = 2200RPM
4th gear, 70km/hr = 2600RPM
4th gear, 80km/hr = 3000RPM

5th gear, 80km/hr = 2200RPM
5th gear, 90km/hr = 2500RPM
5th gear, 100km/hr = 2750RPM
5th gear, 110km/hr = 3050RPM
5th gear, 120km/hr = 3300RPM

Hmm well by looking at these figures i dont know if i would swap gears. If your carrying/towing a load you could find yourself in trouble shifting from 4th to 5th. Stock is showing when you shift your just in the torque curve. Swap out to the 5th's your talking about and when you shift your dropping out of the torque zone under 2000rpm and it could be a long climb back up after you lose your momentum. If you dont tow or carry heavy loads then you might be ok. Then again i havent driven an EV to much to know forsure, just going by the figures above.

These transmissions are based on 02A's correct. So are you guys getting the 5ths from G60,passat and b4 passat td/tdi boxes.

Also maybe a 6spd conversion work better if possible

[gti_matt]

Yes, it'd be a big drop from 4th to 5th, so if towing a load you would need to probably rev it out more in 4th first (like shift at 4K from 4 to 5). I myself don't tow...I just want lower revs on the highway. Revving at 3500rpm the whole time is

[vwhusaberg]

OK I finally got around to swapping out my 5th gear. According to the charts, the DKA code transmission is supposed to have a .837 5th gear, but the one I took out had 34/45 teeth. According to my calculations that is .756 (right?).

Anyway I installed the .658 in and here are the results:

60km/h = 1300RPM
70km/h = 1600RPM
80km/h = 1900RPM
90km/h = 2200RPM
100km/h = 2400RPM
110km/h = 2625RPM
120km/h = 2850RPM

It's much nicer to drive now. I expected a major gap between 4th and 5th, but the shift felt normal. The revs drop exactly 1000RPMs when I shift from 4th to 5th.

I'm happy with the results, and I think I'm going to put taller tires on next. 2850 at 120km/hr is much better than before, but it's still high compared to other automatic minivans out there with their overdrives.

The engine has plenty of torque down low, and would maintain speed just fine around town at 60km/hr at 1300RPM without any sign of lugging. Keep in mind that this is a regular Eurovan (not a camper), completely empty with no seats in the back, so it's pretty light.

In hindsight, I think the .622 may have been an even better choice, especially for someone who does a lot of highway driving and wants to keep the stock tire size.

[vwhusaberg]

By the way, the puller I used was a $15 Power Fist 3" 2-jaw puller #8046009 from the local Princess Auto store here in Ontario, Canada (princessauto.com).

The puller worked perfectly on the large gear, but it barely worked on the smaller gear. I had to leave some of the bolts loose on the puller, and wiggle it into place as far as it would go. The arms weren't directly across from each other, but it worked anyway.

If I was more patient, I would have ground the arms a bit thinner so they would fit better.

[gti_matt]

Great info...thanks! Yes my gut feeling is that these do pull well even at little as 1300rpm in 5th. Maybe not up a hill but I shift really early when lazing about town and it seems to do fine w/o bogging.

Does it maintain speed OK still going up a hill at highway speeds? Is passing in 5th gear at highway speeds significantly affected?

Also please let us know longer term what your fuel economy improvements (if any) are.

[vwhusaberg]

It is more capable of passing on the highway now that it can go fast enough to do so.

I'll check the mileage this summer. I only use it to haul my dirt bike and racing kart around. I've never bothered to check it before.

It must be better on fuel now, but my main reason for doing this was to make the van more useable and tolerable on the highway.

[vwhusaberg]

We don't really have any highway hills around here to try it out on, but the revs are still plenty high...I wouldn't expect to have any trouble there at all.

If someone was planning on towing a heavy trailer, I suppose they may want to think twice about doing this swap.

[STANIMAL]

Thanks to gti_matt for pointing me to this thread . Most of the time my van is empty , but we do take trips in it . I assume that with this swap , I would still be able to take a few people without a problem , they're not the fastest vans in the world to began with , but would like it to pull without too much hesitation .

[BigDan1]

waking up this thread .....

what a great source of infos ....

How do I get the transmission code for my eurovan westfalia ?
is there a sticky that gives all trannies+ diffs specs ?
I have a 94 2.5L gas , 5 speed manual eurovan westfalia ...

like mentionned at the beginning I too find that I rev too high for the speed .....
I tought of swapping the diff gearing , but seems like only the 5th tranny gear is to be swapped .

thanks

[gti_matt]

IDK if there's a sticker anywhere (there probably was at one time but after nearly 20 years it might be gone or lost or unreadable).

However can you use this?

http://www.t4-wiki.de/wiki/Getriebek...haltgetriebe_2

Translate that to English though unless you do read German :-)

Your manual transmissions for a '94 should be one of the 02B transmission models. Cross reference it to your production date which would be on the sticker on the door jamb of the driver's door. Make sure you check for more than one row in that chart because some gearboxes may have overlapped.

Assuming your 1994 is a production date of fall 1992 to early 1994 there are about 8-10 different transmission gear sets listed but if you look at them, they're all either about 0.837 or 0.756 more or less for 5th gear. Nothing is down near the 0.622 that you can get from a Passat TDI 5th gear conversion. So I think it's safe to say that any 5th gear that you can get of 0.6xx will be an improvement over what you have now.

[BigDan1]

Bside , I have a spare transmission & engine from a 96 ....

I guess there is no clue on transmission to identify it ....

[gti_matt]

The link above seems to have a pic example on where to see markings on an 02B transmission although the pic isn't that great. Take a look at the pic and see if you can find the same locations on the bellhousing of your trans.

[BigDan1]

some codes like : DQH , DCV, DJZ are better then others
revs would be much better

have to check my tranny code ....

[BigDan1]

finally my two transmissions codes are CCW & CRL
both with .837 5th gear ratio ....

went on ebay.de for a better coded transmission .....but they cost a lot ...

I read what vwhusaberg did ...put a .658 5th for better revs ( european ratio)

but let`s say that you climb a hill , and you have to drop in 4th , at a certain point , the engine will go for 3800 rpm @ 60 mph ( 1.023 4th )
unless i drive @ 50 mph ( 3200 rpm )


I wonder if we could get better 4th gear ratio like .971 ( european model)

[Tosca]

waking up this thread .....


How do I get the transmission code for my eurovan westfalia ?


thanks

The gearbox code is located with the paint code, engine code etc in the fuse box inside below and to the left of the steering wheel. In my Doka, the sticker is on the left side, facing out to the right.

I spent ages looking for the code on the tranny then consulted the owner's manual which pointed me in the right direction. Mine's CCW which has the shortest available gear combination. I've barely owned this truck for a month and have only driven it once to get it home, but want taller gearing as soon as I can get it.

If you're willing to do more work and spend more money, a 6th gear would be ideal. Some versions of 02b have a taller 4th (vwhusaberg) than others. With the taller 4th the results are probably OK but I have the shorter 4th and want the .622 top gear, so the gap between 4th and 5th could be a nightmare on some hills, especially when loaded.

Check out this info on recently and soon-to-be available 6 speed kits for our transmissions:
http://www.vwtuningmag.com/gearbox-conversion-kit/
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=327268

[BigDan1]

for the moment, found a used set of .756 that fitted direct in there ...will try this way
has to be better then the original .837 .....350 rpm lower by calculator ...

[Long1Pham]

I just wonder if you did your 5th gear swap and is there an improvement on the fuel? Thank you. long1pham