P0171 back again!@#!@#

[jachong]

I had the issue from day 2...over 80° in PA.

Oh well, nevermind Are you running any software? I'm running APR stg1. (93 Octane program)

During all this saga some people have said that maybe the interior diameter is not the correct, thus creating more turbulence and sending the MAF crazy?

[KIDVersion 1]

As I stated, I run Unitronic stage 2 and so does my friend.

The TWINtake uses the exact same size tubing so I am not doubting the size.

[low_passat]

What PCV? How much space from silicone elbow to the maf?

It's filthy, but here you go. BSH PVC Fix

I could bet that is because of the warmer weather you have (compared to the Northeast)

Contrary to popular belief, it does get cold in AZ. It can get below freezing overnight here in the winter. I have driven my car 75+ miles round trip to work 5 days a week, so there has been plenty of road time at cooler temps..

[jachong]

**Drop the mic**

Ok I give up... maybe I should just invest on the BSH PVC Fix.

[KIDVersion 1]

It's filthy, but here you go. BSH PVC Fix.

Ok...same as me. I'm at a loss. I'll just wait for a response from Forge.


29 August 2012 by santorum, on Flickr

[KIDVersion 1]

Oh and as of yesterday, I pushed the tube further into the elbow silcone. The silicone now touches the weld for the MAF sensor.

[KIDVersion 1]

Just a log from today, as the code came back.

Friday,14,September,2012,15:13:24:50881
VCDS Version: Release 11.11.4
Data version: 20120807

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 01: Engine Labels: 06F-907-115-AXX.lbl
Control Module Part Number: 1K0 907 115 S HW: 8P0 907 115 B
Component and/or Version: 2.0l R4/4V TFSI 0020
Software Coding: 0403010A18070160
Work Shop Code: WSC 66565 257 00032
VCID: 366837EE4181BCA8CB9
4 Faults Found:

000768 - Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected
P0300 - 008 - - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00101000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 115556 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 16:21:51

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1215 /min
Load: 40.0 %
Speed: 0.0 km/h
Temperature: 27.0∞C
Temperature: 26.0∞C
Absolute Pres.: 1010.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V

000772 - Cylinder 4
P0304 - 008 - Misfire Detected - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00101000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 115556 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 16:22:10

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1303 /min
Load: 29.8 %
Speed: 0.0 km/h
Temperature: 32.0∞C
Temperature: 26.0∞C
Absolute Pres.: 1010.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.478 V

000770 - Cylinder 2
P0302 - 008 - Misfire Detected - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00101000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 115556 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 16:22:10

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1303 /min
Load: 29.8 %
Speed: 0.0 km/h
Temperature: 32.0∞C
Temperature: 26.0∞C
Absolute Pres.: 1010.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.478 V

008567 - Bank 1; System Too Lean off Idle
P2177 - 001 -
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 3
Mileage: 115639 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 07:05:20

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2462 /min
Load: 43.5 %
Speed: 101.0 km/h
Temperature: 87.0∞C
Temperature: 20.0∞C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.224 V

Readiness: 0000 0000

---

This is the time stamp from the highest engine load. Today was 82º F.

Engine Speed: 3,160 rpm
Engine Load: 100.8%
Intake Air Mass: 61.83 g/s
Lambda Sensor - Current Value: 0.82
Lambda Sensor - Specified Value: 0.8
Lambda (Idle) - Self-Adaptation: -3.1%
Lambda (Partial) - Self-Adaptation: 21.5%
Boost Pressure - (specified): 1,510 mbar
Boost Pressure - (actual): 1,530 mbar
High pressure - system adaptation: -0.34 bar
Rail Pressure - (specified): 109.97 bar
Rail Pressure - (actual): 109.67 bar

---

Here is an old log time stamp (it is almost a month old and I wasn't looking at all the same measuring blocks) with the WINtake, no code, and similar engine load:

Engine Speed: 4,200 rpm
Engine Load: 100.8%
Lambda Sensor - Current Value: 1.04
Lambda Sensor - Specified Value: 0.98
Lambda (Idle) - Self-Adaptation: 0.5%
Lambda (Partial) - Self-Adaptation: 9%
Boost Pressure - (specified): 2,280 mbar
Boost Pressure - (actual): 1,590 mbar

I wish I had logged rail pressure and intake mass, but I can always do it again.

[gilotin661]

ummm sir. wheres ur battery?

[KIDVersion 1]

ummm sir. wheres ur battery?

In my trunk.

[KIDVersion 1]

Update

I got off the phone with Sean at the Orlando office and here is what is being offered:

- send back my current WINtake and get sent a brand new WINtake
- send back my current WINtake and get sent a brand new TWINtake

They just had a customer with the same issues send their WINtake back and installed a new WINtake and have had no issues since. So I am opting to have a new WINtake sent to me and I will go from there. If the issue returns, I can send it back for the TWINtake.

They are waiting on a shipment from the UK and as soon as it comes in, the "swap" will take place. I will keep this updated as I know more.

[jachong]

Update

I got off the phone with Sean at the Orlando office and here is what is being offered:

- send back my current WINtake and get sent a brand new WINtake
- send back my current WINtake and get sent a brand new TWINtake

They just had a customer with the same issues send their WINtake back and installed a new WINtake and have had no issues since. So I am opting to have a new WINtake sent to me and I will go from there. If the issue returns, I can send it back for the TWINtake.

They are waiting on a shipment from the UK and as soon as it comes in, the "swap" will take place. I will keep this updated as I know more.

Excellent, would you mind sharing the phone number you dialed?

Thanks!

~ja

[KIDVersion 1]

Excellent, would you mind sharing the phone number you dialed?

(407) 447-5363

This is the Orlando, Florida office.

[KIDVersion 1]

Update

On Thursday I got the same code again shortly after filling up the car. I went home and cleared the code. About 40 miles later, the issue returned (6 psi) and at about 55 miles, the MIL came on. I did a lot of driving that day and I was getting used to the MIL and lack of boost. Then, a strange thing happened at about 90 miles; MIL was still on, but I was once again hitting 19 psi. Car felt 100% normal! Thinking it may be a fluke, I just ket driving, waiting for the issue to return.

Yesterday, I drove to work with MIL still on (knowing it may take several key cycles to reset) but no issues. Perfect acceleration, 19 psi, and everything sounded fine. Started the car up after work and MIL was off! Drove home with no issues, and I beat the car hard (so hard that I actually got pulled over...got off on a warning). Today, no MIL and no issues.

I told Sean at Forge that I will let this tank of gas run it's course (not saying it's gas related because I always get the same gas) to help me keep track of mileage, but as of now, the issue has resolved itself!

So my question, is has anyone with the issue tried just letting it run it's course and see if it fixes itself? I will ask my friend to put his back on and let it go for a while to see if the same thing happens.

[KIDVersion 1]

Update

This morning, the issue and MIL came back on fairly quickly. So I am now waiting on the shipment from Forge.

[KIDVersion 1]

I spoke with Sean this morning and both our intakes have been shipped out today (2nd day air) and will arrive on Thursday, just in time for my trip to OCMD. I will know if the issue is resolved during the trip. Lord...I hope it is.

[KIDVersion 1]

Update

Thursday, the new pipe and clamps arrived from Forge for the WINTake. I installed them before our trip down to OCMD. No major difference in the pipe but big improvement with the clamps. Much tighter seal. Drove all the way there (about 180 miles) with no issues. The next day I noticed a loss in boost (about 10 psi instead of the usual 6 psi). Most of Friday and Saturday yielded the old issue; 6 psi. Luckily, I was just cruising the strip at about 30-35 mph and never really got on it. MIL came on Sunday morning and I cleared the faults (the usual) at the Show. Shortly after leaving the show, the issues returned. Cleared the faults before coming home and 4 miles later the issue returned.

The last thing I have tried is swapping coil pack around. Usually, I get cylinders 2 and 4 misfires along with the lean fault. So I swapped the position of the coil packs to see if the misfire changes location. If so, I will buy new coil packs and pray that fixes the issue and I will urge Chris to do the same.

[jachong]

Update

Thursday, the new pipe and clamps arrived from Forge for the WINTake. I installed them before our trip down to OCMD. No major difference in the pipe but big improvement with the clamps. Much tighter seal. Drove all the way there (about 180 miles) with no issues. The next day I noticed a loss in boost (about 10 psi instead of the usual 6 psi). Most of Friday and Saturday yielded the old issue; 6 psi. Luckily, I was just cruising the strip at about 30-35 mph and never really got on it. MIL came on Sunday morning and I cleared the faults (the usual) at the Show. Shortly after leaving the show, the issues returned. Cleared the faults before coming home and 4 miles later the issue returned.

The last thing I have tried is swapping coil pack around. Usually, I get cylinders 2 and 4 misfires along with the lean fault. So I swapped the position of the coil packs to see if the misfire changes location. If so, I will buy new coil packs and pray that fixes the issue and I will urge Chris to do the same.

Among all the errors you are getting (related to this) are you also getting a "Knocking sensor error"?

[KIDVersion 1]

Among all the errors you are getting (related to this) are you also getting a "Knocking sensor error"?

Nope. Only system too lean and random misfires.

[Vinnyty]

Neith the stock or unitronic tune are designed for an increased intake diameter. I believe unitronic can code it in if needed but you would want to talk to them first.


Problem Solved!

[KIDVersion 1]

Wait, seriously? That's the solution? If so I'm on the phone with my local tuner tomorrow morning.

[KIDVersion 1]

That doesn't make sense...then why no code with the TWINtake? Same size piping.

[Aleremb1]

Hey guys, what's the update on this problem? I just got my Wintake last week and didin't install it yet, afraid of the problems described by so many users.....appreciate the heads up.

[KIDVersion 1]

I'd hold off. I opted to upgrade to the TWINtake for free and have had zero issues since.

Many Golf R owners have been experiencing the same issues with the WINTake. As of a week or so ago, Forge was not selling any more WINTakes until they solved the issue. I saw on Instagram last night that a possible solution has been found. They are confirming it. If its true, I will ask for my WINTake back.

[jachong]

I'd hold off. I opted to upgrade to the TWINtake for free and have had zero issues since.

Many Golf R owners have been experiencing the same issues with the WINTake. As of a week or so ago, Forge was not selling any more WINTakes until they solved the issue. I saw on Instagram last night that a possible solution has been found. They are confirming it. If its true, I will ask for my WINTake back.

I'm holding off my WINTake until they find a solution...hopefully everybody that is affected will get to the bottom of it.

[slowhatch]

Sigh, people still messing with the forge cai. I wanted to love that intake so bad (it sounds wicked), but it is what it is and when you change the cross sectional area (ie. piping diameter) that the MAF uses to calculate flow rates and then don't adjust for it in the tune there is NO WAY the car will be able to modify the fuel trims properly. The ecu has no clue that you've changed the area where the maf sits and thus continues to use the same base tables to calculate flow rates from the resistivity of the element. Me and another member data logged this issue repeatedly and the flow rates that we recorded were 30-40 g/s LESS than what i recorded when i pulled the intake off, re-installed the stock intake, and threw in a K&n filter. Its not that the intake doesnt flow better, it probably does, but what it also accomplishes, is to SKEW the maf readings to the ECU, which will result in the computer thinking there is a lean condition and throw you into limp mode and throw a code.

I was in denial for a LONG time about the issue and finally just got rid of the intake all together and haven't had a single issue since.

[low_passat]

Sigh, people still messing with the forge cai. I wanted to love that intake so bad (it sounds wicked), but it is what it is and when you change the cross sectional area (ie. piping diameter) that the MAF uses to calculate flow rates and then don't adjust for it in the tune there is NO WAY the car will be able to modify the fuel trims properly. The ecu has no clue that you've changed the area where the maf sits and thus continues to use the same base tables to calculate flow rates from the resistivity of the element. Me and another member data logged this issue repeatedly and the flow rates that we recorded were 30-40 g/s LESS than what i recorded when i pulled the intake off, re-installed the stock intake, and threw in a K&n filter. Its not that the intake doesnt flow better, it probably does, but what it also accomplishes, is to SKEW the maf readings to the ECU, which will result in the computer thinking there is a lean condition and throw you into limp mode and throw a code.

I was in denial for a LONG time about the issue and finally just got rid of the intake all together and haven't had a single issue since.

Than how do you account for me (and others) that have NEVER had an issue/code from it?

[KIDVersion 1]

Than how do you account for me (and others) that have NEVER had an issue/code from it?

This.

[alerxovawo]

This sucks I really wanted to order this intake. Looks like the VWR intake is the best bet now...but it costs $549 The VWR intake should fit the passat correct?

[low_passat]

Than how do you account for me (and others) that have NEVER had an issue/code from it?

This.

And just to add, the very intake I have, I got from MochaVDub when he parted his car. He also initially reported a CEL in this thread, but not sure if it was ever confirmed as P0171.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...1#post69926684

Just out of curiosity, any chance you have the canister/filter backwards? Perhaps that could cause turbulence.

[KIDVersion 1]

Just out of curiosity, any chance you have the canister/filter backwards? Perhaps that could cause turbulence.

When I installed it, it was correct. When I started playing with things and put it on backwards to try. Still happened.

All I know is that Forge has stopped the selling of the WINTake until it is fixed. I saw a possible fix on Instagram but am waiting for the confirmation.

[Aleremb1]

When I installed it, it was correct. When I started playing with things and put it on backwards to try. Still happened.

All I know is that Forge has stopped the selling of the WINTake until it is fixed. I saw a possible fix on Instagram but am waiting for the confirmation.

What is the possible fixing? Could not find it.

[jachong]

What is the possible fixing? Could not find it.

^^ X2

[Onese1f]

Ordered a wintake from someone on the forums...put it on last night, no problem! Started my car this morning to a CEL..haven't gotten it coded yet but I'm afraid it's going to be a P0171. GOD DAMN IT.

[jachong]

Ordered a wintake from someone on the forums...put it on last night, no problem! Started my car this morning to a CEL..haven't gotten it coded yet but I'm afraid it's going to be a P0171. GOD DAMN IT.

Sorry to hear that

But.. welcome to the club!

What transmission you have? auto/manual?

[Onese1f]

I'm an auto tranny in an 08 FSI. Thinking it might be the downstream clamps that need to be replaced, I've scoured the internet for hours and have narrowed it down to the clamps and a MAF cleaner for my temporary fixes tonight. Along with that I spoke with Sean at Forge in Orlando and he said they were working on getting the problem fixed and were aware of the issue..took my name and number as a tally for the amount of problems reported in and apparently there have been alot! He said a possible quick fix might also be a MAF spacer that they offer?

I was SO tempted to sell this system and just bite the bullet on a P-flo but if it's being worked on I think I can live with my stock airbox just a little bit longer.