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    Thread: parts are all ordered .. might as well start one of these trendy build threads!

    1. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-02-2012 09:07 PM #326
      how thick do you think a gasket actually is .. I'm wondering how many MM extra one adds to the spacer .. would a gasket really make THAT big of a difference on the tension of the chain? its a brand-new chain as well .. since the motor was apart we put in a new chain

    2. Member newcreation's Avatar
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      01-02-2012 09:25 PM #327
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      how thick do you think a gasket actually is .. I'm wondering how many MM extra one adds to the spacer .. would a gasket really make THAT big of a difference on the tension of the chain? its a brand-new chain as well .. since the motor was apart we put in a new chain
      There isnt much room for the spacer and split gasket to begin with very tight fit. adding the extra to it not sure how it would affect it. But in the past on all vr's i have split the gaskets

      Also we would need to know what head spacer you are using because there are 9.1 which is the most common for the R and is tight fit

      But there is 8.5:1 which means the spacer is a bit thicker and even tighter fit

      and hpa also has a 7.1 spacer which then uses a custom chain guide
      Last edited by newcreation; 01-02-2012 at 09:30 PM.
      -JAMES-
      DRIVEN/Built /UM Turbo R - VR NATION

    3. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-03-2012 04:20 PM #328
      spoke with gabe at bluewater .. he recommends machining down the upper chain guide

      Tom however does not feel thats necessary and adding a 1/2 chain link would work better .. plus he wouldnt have to take the transmission off again in order to do so .. HOPEFULLY IT WORKS

    4. Member newcreation's Avatar
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      01-03-2012 04:22 PM #329
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      spoke with gabe at bluewater .. he recommends machining down the upper chain guide

      Tom however does not feel thats necessary and adding a 1/2 chain link would work better .. plus he wouldnt have to take the transmission off again in order to do so .. HOPEFULLY IT WORKS
      Hmmm sketchy stuff here
      -JAMES-
      DRIVEN/Built /UM Turbo R - VR NATION

    5. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-03-2012 04:28 PM #330
      you also have to keep in mind the guy working on my car is the first guy in the world to swap a 3.6 fsi motor into a mk5 r32 .. so he can pretty much make anything happen which is where i gain his trust in what hes attempting but at the same time .. gabe who has one of the fastest r32s in the world, recommends machining down the chain guide

      if we machine down the chain guide .. the tranny has to come out along with a whole bunch of other things .. if he breaks the chain and adds another link .. a few hours of labor will be bypassed

      and i am in no way saying i recommend the extra chain link JUST because it will take less time .. but tom strongly believes that this is the way to go about fixing this problem

      in his eyes he sees that a modified chain guide would be more prone to failure than a chain with an additional link
      Last edited by JDM-JTI; 01-03-2012 at 04:30 PM.

    6. Member newcreation's Avatar
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      01-03-2012 04:45 PM #331
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      you also have to keep in mind the guy working on my car is the first guy in the world to swap a 3.6 fsi motor into a mk5 r32 .. so he can pretty much make anything happen which is where i gain his trust in what hes attempting but at the same time .. gabe who has one of the fastest r32s in the world, recommends machining down the chain guide

      if we machine down the chain guide .. the tranny has to come out along with a whole bunch of other things .. if he breaks the chain and adds another link .. a few hours of labor will be bypassed

      and i am in no way saying i recommend the extra chain link JUST because it will take less time .. but tom strongly believes that this is the way to go about fixing this problem

      in his eyes he sees that a modified chain guide would be more prone to failure than a chain with an additional link
      I hope which ever one you choose works and you have no issues at all. Something should work. But i know i would tear it all apart and make it so i didnt need those chain or guide mods. Just something else to worry about failing not saying it will. Just one of those things that would always bug me.
      -JAMES-
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    7. Member jmh2002's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 04:04 AM #332
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      you also have to keep in mind the guy working on my car is the first guy in the world to swap a 3.6 fsi motor into a mk5 r32... so he can pretty much make anything happen which is where i gain his trust...
      You sure about that?

      What would be concerning me is that this issue wasnt understood properly / and or was missed in the first place...

      Sorry to hear you having problems, again.
      Last edited by jmh2002; 01-04-2012 at 04:08 AM.
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    8. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 11:15 AM #333
      Quote Originally Posted by jmh2002 View Post
      You sure about that?

      find me another mk5 3.6 fsi with manual transmission swap in the world .. cause you're not going to

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...niteEcho-s-R32!

      theres the build thread on that car

      it was missed in the first place because the chain technically fit .. so why wouldn't we assume that it would be okay .. it was only after running the car and scanning it while giving it some gas that we found out what the problem was
      Last edited by JDM-JTI; 01-04-2012 at 11:19 AM.

    9. Member jmh2002's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 12:25 PM #334
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      find me another mk5 3.6 fsi with manual transmission swap in the world .. cause you're not going to

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...niteEcho-s-R32!

      theres the build thread on that car
      Your first post didnt mention manual transmission, but anyway Im not picking a fight so I wont bother searching in europe Ill just take your word for it

      I would however have liked to think that with so much 'knowledge' the headspacer/gasket combo would have been predetermined by the shop before installation... Seems like it wasnt even thought about? (IIRC there have been many threads over the years about headspacers, adding a link, custom chain guide, etc)

      To be fair, it seems like you have had more than just a few problems with this shop. Sorry to hear.

      I hope its all sorted out soon
      HGP-T 450PS, Unibrace, 225/40/18 AD08s, OZ Ultraleggera, Light BBK F&R, Recaro Interior, .:R extras, MFD Navi, Phatbox, JCaps, Neuspeed, PSS9s, H2Sport Stage 3, DLI-Teknik, GC links, bHPP, etc...

    10. Member DarkSideGTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 12:45 PM #335
      adding a link will make the chain longer and will affect timing. not sure I'd do that. I split an OEM head gasket and riveted it on the spacer. Then I had to grind down the rivets a bit to make it all flat.

    11. Member huichox4's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 12:56 PM #336
      Edit: thought about it and I was wrong ..


      this still applies though

      shaving the rails has been done for a while now on some HPA kits I believe and have never failed as far as I know, hopefully someone with shaved rails can chime in.
      Last edited by huichox4; 01-04-2012 at 02:52 PM.

    12. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 01:51 PM #337
      is adding another link to a timing chain "unheard of" or is it just not regularly done...

      ive got people telling me they have put their chains on with no modifications to anything at all

      others say modify the chain guide .. including gabe at bluewater .. who was nice enough to give step by step as to what to do .. even offered to ship a modified one out this way

      what risk am i running if i allow him to modify the chain and something goes bad .. worst case scenario it skips a tooth and boom engine done? or would it just run even funnier than before..

    13. Banned ThatVdub's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 02:04 PM #338
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      is adding another link to a timing chain "unheard of" or is it just not regularly done...

      ive got people telling me they have put their chains on with no modifications to anything at all

      others say modify the chain guide .. including gabe at bluewater .. who was nice enough to give step by step as to what to do .. even offered to ship a modified one out this way

      what risk am i running if i allow him to modify the chain and something goes bad .. worst case scenario it skips a tooth and boom engine done? or would it just run even funnier than before..
      I seriously think you should question anyone telling you to add links to a chain. That person would
      never touch my car again. Listen to Gabe, he is talented.

    14. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 02:08 PM #339
      im sorry but for your input to be beneficial to me .. you need to have first hand experience with this and i dont think that you have that, and i mean that with all due respect.. but if you havent taken apart your motor and personally screwed around with your chains then you are just speaking out of your ass .. sometimes you have to think out of the box and this could either A. work perfectly .. or B. not work out at all .. either way if it fails it not on me
      Last edited by JDM-JTI; 01-04-2012 at 02:10 PM.

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      01-04-2012 02:11 PM #340
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      sometimes you have to think out of the box and this could either A. work perfectly .. or B. not work out at all .. either way if it fails it not on me
      Do it then and let us know the outcome.
      Seems like a Polish method of doing things, but hey, I am willing to learn.
      Last edited by ThatVdub; 01-04-2012 at 02:13 PM.

    16. Member huichox4's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 02:49 PM #341
      I have been doing a few sketches and a little thinking and the extra link idea might work Just fine but I will take Gabe's deal of the modified rails. Modified chain snapping due to a little nick and crack caused when pressing the new link in there scare me more, the modified rails have been used before.

      it is all in the sprocket were the chains go to mess up timing, the sprockets will still move the same number of links, you will just need to adjust with the tensioner for any extra added slack.

      you can only ad 1/2 a link though I believe, like in bikes. sprocket ratios are only affected by tooth count and diameter in the sprockets not the actual chain.

      so disregard my previous comment ....
      Last edited by huichox4; 01-04-2012 at 02:51 PM.

    17. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 03:07 PM #342
      im guessing with your sketches you imagined the space created with the spacer+2 gaskets then what it would look like with an additional 1/2 link and how it would even out

      the thought of it sounds legit to me .. its just the actual abuse that the car will take on with the chain and the fact that its modified and its one of the most important parts to the motor is what sketches me out .. as long as its pressed together 100% mint then i think i should be fine

    18. Member huichox4's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 03:25 PM #343
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      im guessing with your sketches you imagined the space created with the spacer+2 gaskets then what it would look like with an additional 1/2 link and how it would even out
      actually I started like that but it didnt have to be that complex, chain length wont affect gear ratios just add the link and keep the link count between the cam sprockets as factory specs then the tensioner will need to be double checked to make sure it doesnt bottom out against the cover (which I dont think it will pappen).

      the thought of it sounds legit to me .. its just the actual abuse that the car will take on with the chain and the fact that its modified and its one of the most important parts to the motor is what sketches me out .. as long as its pressed together 100% mint then i think i should be fine
      If done well it shoudnt be an issue, I believe.

    19. Member Jamaican_tuner's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 03:46 PM #344
      Quote Originally Posted by JDM-JTI View Post
      you also have to keep in mind the guy working on my car is the first guy in the world to swap a 3.6 fsi motor into a mk5 r32 .. so he can pretty much make anything happen which is where i gain his trust in what hes attempting but at the same time .. gabe who has one of the fastest r32s in the world, recommends machining down the chain guide

      if we machine down the chain guide .. the tranny has to come out along with a whole bunch of other things .. if he breaks the chain and adds another link .. a few hours of labor will be bypassed

      and i am in no way saying i recommend the extra chain link JUST because it will take less time .. but tom strongly believes that this is the way to go about fixing this problem

      in his eyes he sees that a modified chain guide would be more prone to failure than a chain with an additional link
      Where are you getting this information from?????

      The guide that needs to be machined does not need the tranny to be touched?

      The guide is pretty much solid plastic, when you feel it and even grind it down it will be all clear.

      15 minutes tops with a steady hand and even a dremel tool!

      I successfully ran 9:1 spacer with split OEM head gasket and ground down guide with zero issues.

      Adding the link is un-necessary.

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      01-04-2012 03:48 PM #345
      Quote Originally Posted by Jamaican_tuner View Post
      Where are you getting this information from?????

      The guide that needs to be machined does not need the tranny to be touched?
      I think it is because the guy who is working on his car probably is not sure which chain guide is the one to grind down.

    21. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 03:59 PM #346
      Quote Originally Posted by Jamaican_tuner View Post
      Where are you getting this information from?????

      The guide that needs to be machined does not need the tranny to be touched?

      The guide is pretty much solid plastic, when you feel it and even grind it down it will be all clear.

      15 minutes tops with a steady hand and even a dremel tool!

      I successfully ran 9:1 spacer with split OEM head gasket and ground down guide with zero issues.

      Adding the link is un-necessary.
      im talking about removing the extra gasket .. id prefer the car to be run on 1 split gasket rather than 2 ..

    22. Member Jamaican_tuner's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 03:59 PM #347
      Quote Originally Posted by ThatVdub View Post
      I think it is because the guy who is working on his car probably is not sure which chain guide is the one to grind down.


      This is the guide that needs to be modded.





      See the height difference on the surface. You grind that down to make it flat.

      I will tell you the same like I have told every one over the years... Walk the beaten path. Walk the most tried and true tested path sacrificing a little originality if thats how you want to look at it.

      Most that go big, go home.
      The ones that make it make the same power as the off the shelf turbo kit.


      Turbo kits take days to install not months / years.

      Get this car back on the road
      Last edited by Jamaican_tuner; 01-04-2012 at 04:02 PM.

    23. Member DarkSideGTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 04:00 PM #348
      you are right about the gear ratio's not changing. As long as the links between the adjusters is on and you can properly tension the chain you "should" be ok.

      Another question is how is he going to do it? Our timing chains are not like bike chains. the pins holding them together are pressed in and then peened over so they cannot come out. You would need to grind down the end and then press it out. Then comes finding a new pin. Are these sold by anyone?

      do you have head studs or bolts? If bolts, keep in mind pulling the head means a whole new set of bolts.

      wait, isn't this car running already? so it has the lengthened chain on it now? **Edit** went back and read why you need to lengthen the chain.
      Last edited by DarkSideGTI; 01-04-2012 at 04:07 PM.

    24. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 04:01 PM #349
      Quote Originally Posted by ThatVdub View Post
      I think it is because the guy who is working on his car probably is not sure which chain guide is the one to grind down.
      once again .. you have no idea what you are talking about nor do you have any idea who is working on my car

    25. Member JDM-JTI's Avatar
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      01-04-2012 04:02 PM #350
      Quote Originally Posted by DarkSideGTI View Post
      Then comes finding a new pin. Are these sold by anyone?

      already ordered

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