10k Revs of 2.5L Big Turbo AWD Rabbit Madness!

[akauf]

and I thought I knew my **** , thanks for clearing that up, its actually make alot more sense

haha, no prob dude. I think this is a common misconception. I wasnt sure how it worked until i had a t-case off a trans and a good look at a diff for a awd vs a diff for a fwd. The inner and outer shaft clears it up.

The biggest flaw of the 4motion / haldex is still the lack of a center diff set up.

Also just noticed your the same guy posting in morphin's thread in golfmkv! All over these awd I5 swaps huh?

These builds have me thinking about converting the awd i did to a 2.5 and ditching that fsi bs.

[dubinsincuwereindiapers]

The gallardo unit would make VW awd conversions much simpler then wouldn't it?

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

He is wrong about one thing tho... The right axle does connect to the transfer case just doesnt power it

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

The gallardo unit would make VW awd conversions much simpler then wouldn't it?

Sure... No wiring and recoding to do... BUT expensive, the differential unit itself goes for ~$2000 and you would have to have a custom drive shaft made, possibly custom axles(Im goin to see if
r32 axles fit or if Gallardo axles will match the rear knuckle splines). On top of that you would need to fabricate brackets for it

[dubinsincuwereindiapers]

Fabrication being a non issue, what if any o2m tranny is the final drive compatible with?

[akauf]

I dont know about the coupler bs, but the Gallardo is full time awd. This WILL handle 1300ftlbstq before it starts to eat the gearing inside. UR makes custom rings for the differential to handle godly amounts of torque and horsepower. I figured it would have to be run with a full locking front differential because it is not a Haldex unit that kicks on when its told the front wheels are losing traction, so why not Also it would be sweet to have full time awd

It is a pipe dream as of right now, we just have one in our posession and I want to use it in something Who knows maybe over winter I will try to locate a transfer case for the front

Thats a front diff right? Which way does the drive shaft spin to drive it?

Background info: The 4 motion drive shaft spins ( if looking down the drive shaft form the front of the car at the input of the rear diff) clockwise (CW).

Situation 1: if this lambo diff receives a CW input (again looking at the input shaft to the diff) in a lambo, it would spin the wheels backwards if simply turned 180 degrees in a rwd application. You would have to rotate it 180 degrees and flip it upside down and then the pan would be on the bottom.

Situation 2:Now say the lambo diff receives a ccw input. The gears re now meshing on the wrong faces when the diff is turned 180 degrees and accepting a cw input from the 4motion drive shaft. Not going to work for helical gears. Reverse cut R&P is needed.

[akauf]

He is wrong about one thing tho... The right axle does connect to the transfer case just doesnt power it

the axle goes THROUGH the transfer case, as I previously explained. There is a bolt inside the axle shaft about 9 inches in that bolts the right front axle to the front diff. It spins freely inside the t-case and is carried by a bearing where it exits the t-case housing on the right side.

[EL_3grab]

no wiring and no different ABS controller + no lag

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97Yatmybd1s

all time 50:50 F/R split.

In essence any compact diff-case with 1:1 ratio and available choice of LSD

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

Thats a front diff right? Which way does the drive shaft spin to drive it?

Situation 1: The 4 motion drive shaft spins ( if looking down the drive shaft form the front of the car at the input of the rear diff) clockwise (CW). if this lambo diff receives a CW input (again looking at the input shaft to the diff) in a lambo, it would spin the wheels backwards if simply turned 180 degrees in a rwd application. You would have to rotate it 180 degrees and flip it upside down and then the pan would be on the bottom.

Situation 2:Now say the lambo diff receives a ccw input. The gears re now meshing on the wrong faces when the diff is turned 180 degrees and accepting a cw input from the 4motion drive shaft. Not going to work for helical gears. Reverse cut R&P is needed.

Its either or. You can turn it cw and ccw and the left and right hubs rotate either way. Are they helical gears or straight cut.... Like I said its a pipe dream right now, but it was in an audi and the owner wanted to go with a solid rear axle for a drag car, so this is laying around for now. Im going to call UR next week to see if they are in fact helical if So I may have reverse cuts made at a shop in Akron that cuts custom gears.

[akauf]

Its either or. You can turn it cw and ccw and the left and right hubs rotate either way. Are they helical gears or straight cut.... Like I said its a pipe dream right now, but it was in an audi and the owner wanted to go with a solid rear axle for a drag car, so this is laying around for now. Im going to call UR next week to see if they are in fact helical if So I may have reverse cuts made at a shop in Akron that cuts custom gears.

I am asking which way the input shaft turns in its normal orientation because that is the only way the the r&p teeth will mesh properly. Spinning it backwards works by hand but with torque applied it WILL sheer the teeth off the gears fast! A shop like you mentioned would likely need to make you a r&p.

Also, I asked about the viscous coupler because it must disconnect like the haldex or synchro coupling because with 4 motion there is no center diff. Ever see how a dsm drives with a welded center?? Drag strip ONLY use is all I can say. Looking the haldex yields the same results. You wont be able to park or turn in any kind of a tight radius. it will bind and snap / break axles, drive shafts and mounts. Not something you want to drive if your planning on making any turns at all really.

It looks like that's the way it works and I'd assume they would want the front wheels to disconnect when traction is no issue.

Not trying to shoot down your "pipe dreams", just genuinly interested in the possiblities of the lambo parts and being realistic about potential downfalls / issues. Outside the box is the way to be

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

Ever see how a dsm drives with a welded center??
Not trying to shoot down your "pipe dreams", just genuinly interested in the possiblities of the lambo parts and being realistic about potential downfalls / issues. Outside the box is the way to be

A new r&p would be 2k said and done.

[EL_3grab]

wouldn't it be easier to delete the haldex coupling and make some kind of adapter between the the pinion and the drive shaft

[akauf]

wouldn't it be easier to delete the haldex coupling and make some kind of adapter between the the pinion and the drive shaft

Thought about that on the mkv project I was working on too. Problem goes back to the lack of a center diff. See my previous post.

You can lock the clutch by replacing the worm screw the stepper motor turns in and out with a bolt. This is what regulates the pressure applied to the clutch. Once the haldex pump starts it would take a few seconds to pressurize but after that it would be full lock all the time.

At that point you can put a switch in to turn the pump on and off but there would a wait for the pressure to drop and build. Again, go for the drag strip, no good for street or road course use.


Ultimately I decided to wire it like stock and will be getting UM to make some adjustments.

[gabe@bwperformance]

All I can say is wow..... Now all the gears in my head are turning about a potential new setup

[thygreyt]

All I can say is wow..... Now all the gears in my head are turning about a potential new setup

do tell

[akauf]

yes do tell!

Also add a long runner manifold to those new ideas Make power all the way to 10k

Short runner / log style cant do that

[BlackRabbit2point5]

man not having seen this thread before made me realize how long its been since I've popped in here. Definitely keeping my eyes on this and rereading through a few times over the next few days. Planning on snagging another BGP up to build in about a year in preparation for a Precision Billet 6262 ball bearing. AWD conversion will definitely be following behind that shortly.

[dubinsincuwereindiapers]

man not having seen this thread before made me realize how long its been since I've popped in here. Definitely keeping my eyes on this and rereading through a few times over the next few days. Planning on snagging another BGP up to build in about a year in preparation for a Precision Billet 6262 ball bearing. AWD conversion will definitely be following behind that shortly.

[BlackRabbit2point5]

eh not quite, anyone on here who knows me knows this will happen but will take forever

[dubinsincuwereindiapers]

eh not quite, anyone on here who knows me knows this will happen but will take forever

Don't get upset bud.. Read in the context of the thread it begged for a "CSB"

[gabe@bwperformance]

Small update coming soon. The engine is officially back together and the T4 turbo manifold is complete.

[tay272]

Does that mean we'll be getting a dyno then soon?

[gabe@bwperformance]

Yes dyno stuff will be coming soon.

[gabe@bwperformance]

Just a little tease. Also these will be available for sale very soon. T4 turbo manifolds. it has a V-band flange for MVR 44mm Tial wastegates.

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

Hm I like that one. Is there not enough room for a tubular manifold like EJ tried to make? Im just curious as to why every option is log style? NBD just curious

[thygreyt]

just waiiting for the final prod, and dynos

[tay272]

Its been awhile, any updates or numbers yet?

[thygreyt]

Eurotuner magazine has asked us to keep things a little on the down low as they want to be able to show the progress in their magazine so I told them I wouldn't update with pics until something comes out from them.

-AWD swap is done
-Integrated Engineering has teamed up with us on this project
-wheels are CCW Classics

we just have to wait.... as always!

[tay272]

I know that already but they said they'd get some numbers for the NA setup about a month ago and that time has gone and past. I dont need anymore pics, just want some numbers. If they gotta be hush hush tho then whatever, Ill wait. Im just curious what kinda power it will have NA but Id still like to follow the rest of the build too.

[mar10]

I know that already but they said they'd get some numbers for the NA setup about a month ago and that time has gone and past. I dont need anymore pics, just want some numbers. If they gotta be hush hush tho then whatever, Ill wait. Im just curious what kinda power it will have NA but Id still like to follow the rest of the build too.

Agreed, I want video of this beast though

[thygreyt]

guys, we have to wait for the article...

i am fairly sure that we will be kept on the dark...

[kevin FaKiN spLits]

guys, we have to wait for the article...

i am fairly sure that we will be kept on the dark...

This. Oh and ship me that manifold

[akauf]

Hm I like that one. Is there not enough room for a tubular manifold like EJ tried to make? Im just curious as to why every option is log style? NBD just curious

Guy that made this manifold made a long runner before.

HE Performance, pics are here: http://www.heperformance.com/customerrides.html


07 rabbit, click see more details

Also check out the volvette, there is a video on utube of it running a r1

[zevion]

Guy that made this manifold made a long runner before.

HE Performance, pics are here: http://www.heperformance.com/customerrides.html

Cool, never seen this. Very sexy.

[DerekH]

Wow, that turbo mani is sexy!