I miss my 2010 JKU. Anyone know when the pricing for the 2012 JK's will be available on Jeep.com??
Absolutely 150% disagree with that statement.
Very easy to make that claim living in Canada where your hot isn't quite the same as everywhere else. I won't make comments about what you do in the cold, you don't make comments about what I do in the hot ok?
First off 100 degrees down here sitting in traffic the LAST thing you want is the top down. My phone actually overheated and shut down sitting on the passenger seat while stuck in traffic back in May.. not july not august.. MAY! I was driving around at the time with a wool hat on to keep my hair from catching on fire. I haven't put the top down in about 2 months because it is just flat out way too hot, maybe late september i'll put it down again.
All windows out and door tops taking a 30 minute drive without even hitting traffic I show up some place and have to change since I am soaked through shirt, shorts and all.
Just went on vacation and I had planned to take the jeep but the GF nixed it due to the lack of AC. at first I Was pissed but then i was extremely glad we didn't as it was in the middle of that heatwave. We were camping the way back from waterfest and we'd have just packed up and headed home without the AC in the rental car.
I'll be figuring out how to fit the AC in with the cummins in the next few weeks.
Funny she'd drool if she saw your profile since right now she is selling it (to me) to buy an outback.
Luckily I convinced her last night that I should get my JSW first so she can drive that while I sell my mk4 to pay for the TJ giving her money to put down on the outback.
When I went looking for a vehicle for my son, safety was the only priority over price. For $21G he got a base JK with 4 wheel drive, no air, no power windows. He got good solid transportation with Stability control, roadside assistance, warranty. Not a bad deal in my books, especially since we have winter for what feels like 9 months of the year, and we live 40 kms away from the city.
1.Women hate sweating. Going somewhere with your GF, wife, mother, sister, etc, on a 90% humidity/90 degree day, and they will refuse to ride along with you without AC.
2.Going somewhere where you don't want to smell like a sweaty pig. Going out on a date, job interview, going to work, going out with friends, etc...
3.Hot and humid as balls+torrential downpour=top up/doors on/AC on
If I am just driving by myself, and not going anywhere where I am concerned about offending anyone with my sweaty smell, I rarely use the AC in most other situations.
The comparison between Camrys and Jeeps was meant to gauge priorties. A lot of people have no problem putting down 30-large for a plebian sedan or minivan, but you are aghast at the thought of Jeep costing as much or more. It's all about preference and priorities. You'd rather have a $32K Kia, and I prefered to spend my $32K on a Wrangler. Different strokes...
If you bought a soft top unlimited for 25.5K it would cost you at least 10K to duplicate what came in a 35K rubicon. The hard top alone I think is close to 2500 bucks after the fact. Dana 44s with lockers will cost you a few grand, similar tires are a few hundred a piece. At least full doors are standard on the JKs, but i think the set of half doors are a few grand unpainted.
You won't find anyone driving around with the top down on a convertible or jeep right now because it is just way too hot. Warm enough for AC and too hot to be exposed in traffic are two entirely different things.
Who said anything about formal occasions. I went to meet a friend on saturday to check out his YJ diff. There were dowpours on the way but it was also 90+, top couldn't be down no ac, windows /doors out so I could breath with the humidity and i was soaked with both rain and sweat. Jeep was the appropriate vehicle for the event. IF had AC it would have been cranking and I would have been dry.
I plan to wear tuxedo shorts and probably ride a bike to my wedding actually, I'm man enough to call the shots and do what I want
not every jeep moment works with the top down and not every region is top down a substitue for no AC.
For the record ATL also gets more rain then most of the northwest which everyone thinks is rainy. AC is also really helpful in clearing up fogged windows when its pouring and hot as hell so your inteior is like a sauna.
Furthermore I was asking a legitimate question. I was not trying to make any point or exaggerate anything. Instead of asking for clarification you assumed that I was trying to play with the numbers to make some stupid point.
I wanted to know, for my own info, if I would be better off spending the premium for a Rubicon or could go with a lesser model and do the necessary upgrades myself for less. Was Jeep actually pricing the Rubicon out as a good deal, or charging a premium because the Rubicon is RTF?
You have finally answered my question- but the amount of bull**** I had to go through to get it is just staggering...all because I typed 23 instead of 25...
GA has been doing obdII emissions for a long long time now, there are no plans I am aware of to include diesels. I'm fully up on the emissions stuff and actually knew about the new tests where they clear codes and recheck readiness before people who actually do those tests did.
My title is a diesel and exempt. GA is not very retro active with things and if they add diesel emissions inspections it will most likely only be new vehicles going forward. We contacted the state numerous times before starting the swap and everyone we spoke to (have it in writing) said we were cool to go ahead. Walked into the tax commissioners office showed documentation for the swap and the title was changed. Federally yeah well that is another question
As for the swap, yes its about 300lbs heavier then a 4.0, I needed 2" spacers to level it out. It runs like snot and would never go back to a gasser in a jeep.
On the trail? it wasn't that tough of a trail but the last time I had it out I was 2wd only since I still have the 4.10s in the front (3.09s in the rear) so no 4wd for me. I was making it up and over things easier then any of the 4wd gassers in the group. Back up a little and just charge front end would just pop up and over anything in my way. Only things I went around was the deep mud.
4bt in a 1500 or larger is a waste of your time and money, the engine is underpowered for a vehicle that size and a 3/4 ton you could just buy with a real sized cummins.
For the record I am all for emissions I've got cats on my 350hp 1.8t and 600hp 2.0t...
Take a quick peek at the remaining 2011s to get a grasp of how overpriced these things are. 2 door Rubicons can still be found selling for $34k+. Frankly, if people buy them for that much, then by all means continue selling them for that. But for people that care about value, that is the deal breaker. The base models (starting at 22k) still don't come with power doors or locks.
Regardless, Jeeps are still awesome and I will own one someday. Just not a brand new JK.
Last edited by Hostile; 08-09-2011 at 12:20 PM.
300 pounds added to the front end? Holy crap. You can keep that. Ill take ass heavy over nose heavy every day of the week. Its just too tall and heavy for my tastes. I would rather lose a little bit of hp and torque but retain some weight balance. An ISB 3.3 would be perfect in a Wrangler with 110 hp and 300 ft/ lbs torque (and ~550 wet). What transmission are you running? NV4500? If so, thats probably why you are making it over things that the gas powered guys are slightly struggling with. The torque band of the diesel helps too (I actively wheel a factory diesel 60 so I know the advantages first hand).
I would pay $35k for a Jeep if it had a proper, light duty factory diesel offering. You can put a V6 or V8 in it and it will still be completely unattractive to me...and many others. Look at how Defenders are selling. They are RHD, old as crap, gigantic rot boxes, completely uncomfortable and have drivetrains that arent up to the job most of the times and people are sacrificing all of that for the boxy off road look and the diesel. A JK is more comfortable, looks about the same but could never capture that part of the market because there is no diesel. People want a diesel. People who trail ride want a diesel. With gas the way it is now, people that actually wheel over long distances are drooling for diesels. You dont need 50+ gallon long distance tanks with a diesel therefore cutting down on tank size and weight. Jeep will attract more people with this V6 but not as many as they could if they slapped an AdBlue system (probably more instensive than that but theyve got the tech to do it) on there and sold a diesel. A trail machine that offers a solid 20+ mpg built would sell, even at $36k. Hell, my 60 will do that all day long and Cruiser guys drool.
Last edited by MCTB; 08-09-2011 at 12:46 PM.
All I said was I thought the trailer was pretty cool especially the skill involved to build it so complete with his own hands.
Who ever said he takes it on the actual trail during real 4x4 action?
He typically takes it on the trail solo or with his g/f to get to secluded camping spots, not run the frigging Rubicon trail with it. When he is going to get muddy, the trailer stays behind at the camp site.
Should probably experience it before commenting really. When I had the rear shaft out and in "fwd" mode so 4.10s still it will sag/dig so hard the tires just light up. Weight is not much of a concern with this much torque300 pounds added to the front end? Holy crap. You can keep that. Ill take ass heavy over nose heavy every day of the week. Its just too tall and heavy for my tastes.
AX15 right now without any issues (many run it in these swaps without a failure so no comments about it not holding up ) although I do want a shorter first gear, with the 3.09s, 31s and this much torque feathering the clutch is next to impossible. It is a breeze to drive with the 4.10s and swapping in a NV3550 which a much shorter first but roughly the same gearing 2nd through 5th will put me about in the middle of 3.09s and 4.10s on the ax15.What transmission are you running? NV4500? If so, thats probably why you are making it over things that the gas powered guys are slightly struggling with. The torque band of the diesel helps too (I actively wheel a factory diesel 60 so I know the advantages first hand).
So, whats the point if it never goes on the trail? What is he packing that cannot fit in the back of a TJ with the rear seat folded down? I camp too. The beauty of camping is that you choose a place to camp off of a trail so you would actually wheel for a day, pull off to the side and set up and relax. In the morning break it down and then continue on. If you KOA or camp at off road parks, a trailer would make sense. Its cool that your friend bought a military surplus trailer, put a lid on it and framed it to handle a tent and threw larger tires on it. Thats awesome. I still stand by my statement that they are a complete pain in the ass on the trail for anyone that is behind one. Its the truth. They are the aids of the off road world right now. It was roof top tents and has grown to the trailer with a roof top tent. Its different types of wheeling I guess. I wheel over distances. You drive as far as you can until it gets dark, then camp and then go again. Trailers are a liability. Then again, thats all my opinion based on personal experience. My fiance wheels and camps with me. All the gear I take to keep her comfortable fits in a box that would fit in the back of a TJ (tent, table, chairs, vestibule, sleeping bags, cots, kitchen stuff). The list of things "required" to go camping is getting ridiculous. When you need a trailer, its time to reevaluate. Again, thats just my opinion and my "e dick" kicking in.
So an extra 300lbs of useable engine is bad but an extra 300lbs of gear you have to keep on you while wheeling is good?
Just like i have uses for my torque there are uses for the trailer. Maybe he brings bikes on the rails attached to the trailer sometimes and now has a nice safe place to lock them up without dragging them behind him on a trail.
Maybe they also use it to hunt and he now has a place to lock and stow their guns as well as a place to haul back anything they shoot.. Gonna throw a deer in the back of your TJ with the seats folded down?
Shocking not everyone does exactly what you do!
How many 911 owners take their car to the track? How many truck owners actually tow stuff?
Yeah no **** that sales would drop if there were a competitor. Fact is, no other manufacturer has the balls to make a solid axle rig with a removable top.No one else offers it right now but they did. If the manufacturers that used to sell a competitor brought one out again, I think that the Jeep would drop in sales. If Ford released a real Bronco (like the 66-76) or Toyota built a real FJ (not that submarine like/ different bodied T4R FJC), Jeep sales would be done. Since no one does, the Jeep sells. Since no one does, Jeep can ask whatever they want for it.
For the record, so I don't seem like Jeep fanboy, I would probably buy a modern version of an FJ40 over a Wrangler if Toyota ever made one.
Wait are you kidding? You say that an electronic traction control system is "better" than a lockers, but then in your next sentance you say "keep your electronic everything else..."...?BTW, sometimes "real" lockers are a hindrance and a system like ATRACS is much better. Sorry but its true. You can keep your electronic everything else too.
The only situation that I could think that a locker would be a hinderance would be a tight switch back. And then in that situation you simply unlock the axle.
Yes this is all nice and well, as I would rather have these features as well, but no other vehicle from the factory offers these features, so your argument is invalid.Give me manual pins on my sway bar (I play in the mud and rocks and wires get snagged and break). Give me manual hubs so I can completely freewheel my front end to cut down on wear.
Oh come on, unless you are running 38's and beating the **** out of your rig, a NP will not just randomly explode. That being said, I would rather a gear driven case too as the chains will have a tendancey to stretch out over time.Give me a gear driven transfer case (chain driven NPs have a habit of exploding when pushed as their cases arent that strong)
Oh the beauty of a 6 speed transmission. Coming up to a large rock garden? Put it in first and have an awesome crawl ratio. Doing a moderate forest trail that doesn't require going super slow? Use 2nd or 3rd gear. Got a long ride back on the highway? Thow it in 6th.I will take it in something between 3.3 and 3.8:1 (4:1 is nice to say but in real life, you really dont need gearing that low unless all you do are large rocks).
It was more of a hobby than trying to gain approval from the "real" off roaders. As you said, it is his Jeep, his trailer, and if that is how he wants to roll it is up to him. Would I do it? Probably not.
I doubt he will be doing any wheeling in Virginia, so I think you are safe from getting stuck behind him on the trail.