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    Thread: .:Shaved Bay Information Resource Thread:.

    1. Member mushroom_curry's Avatar
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      09-28-2011 10:09 PM #151
      Are the systems with pressure correct caps on built in end-tanks (ie, Scirocco rads) insufficient for using as an overflow/pressure release system then?
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    2. 09-28-2011 10:18 PM #152
      Quote Originally Posted by mushroom_curry View Post
      Are the systems with pressure correct caps on built in end-tanks (ie, Scirocco rads) insufficient for using as an overflow/pressure release system then?

      I have never seen one.

      But if it is like most VW cooling systems, it isn't an overflow. Most VW's use an expansion tank from the factory. Much better setup then a overflow, but ALOT harder to hide/plumb in a shaved bay then a simple overflow.



      Also, not saying you HAVE to have an overflow on a daily, but I like to do everything right the first time, and not have to mess with it later. If constantly checking/hoping/cleaning is your thing, go ahead and don't run one. On a car I put 30k on a year, and rely on to get me to work everyday, that is not possible.


      And if you EVER plan on going to the track, you better have one.

    3. Geriatric Member need_a_VR6's Avatar
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      09-28-2011 10:33 PM #153
      You can run a 'cap only' system (like the stock early mk1) as long as it's the high point.
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    4. Member rollinslow95's Avatar
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      09-28-2011 11:38 PM #154
      Quote Originally Posted by JohnStamos View Post
      Water/coolant expands when hot. If the system is a closed system, you will blow the weakest joint, when the pressure gets high enough, hence the need for a pressure relief (AKA: Rad cap.)

      This happens all the time while driving. On a show car, trailer queen, its not that big of a deal.

      But on a daily, everytime the system gets hot enough, and pressure builds, coolant has to be displaced from the system, so it leaves through the over flow spout on the radcap adapter.

      If there is no overflow, it will just leave coolant all over your bay.


      A GOOD overflow setup, will recirculate the coolant. It will have the coolant source connected to the bottom, so that if the cooling system is low, the rad cap is open, and there is enough coolant in the overflow to provide enough force, gravity/weight of the coolant in the overflow will push coolant back into the system, self burping it of air.


      With out a overflow, you need to constantly check/worry about where your coolant level is/how much you have lost, and you have no good way to check.
      Great info, I do realize that it expands as it heats and understand the point of releasing pressure in the system, but looking into older systems that do not use an overflow or expansion tank, and thus just using a pressure cap, is there any way to incorporate that type of system into our cars? like need_a_vr6 stated, being that it would be made the highest point(aka:fitting a different style upper rad hose to make the inline cap sit above the radiator line)

      On a side note, i want to talk more about hiding, moving, and modifying charchol canisters. Where do most people move them to? Maybe give an option for emissions required and non emission required area. Ive always wandered about this modification.
      Last edited by rollinslow95; 09-28-2011 at 11:44 PM.

    5. 09-29-2011 12:24 AM #155
      What gauge wire should be used in the bay?

    6. Member pubahs's Avatar
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      09-29-2011 02:05 AM #156
      Quote Originally Posted by need_a_VR6 View Post
      You can run a 'cap only' system (like the stock early mk1) as long as it's the high point.
      This... the highest point is the main focus of any coolant system. Reason why I am just going back tot he stock coolant bottle (brand new it will look clean) shaved? no. But clean and functions properly, yes.

      There are some good examples out there of custom coolant overflow tanks though, I snapped a few pics at waterfest this year. I could post them if anyone is interested.

      Also can someone show me exactly this 'shielding' you speak of? I am wondering if I have this issue as well.
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      09-29-2011 07:47 AM #157
      Here is a picture of shielded wire. The wires carrying the signal are wrapped in a conductive sleeve, either foil as shown here or a woven braid. The shield is grounded, which reduces electrical noise and makes for a cleaner signal. Other things in the bay create "noise," like ignition coils and plug wires.


    8. Member
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      09-29-2011 07:54 AM #158
      Quote Originally Posted by rollinslow95 View Post
      On a side note, i want to talk more about hiding, moving, and modifying charchol canisters. Where do most people move them to? Maybe give an option for emissions required and non emission required area. Ive always wandered about this modification.
      A lot of people just delete them, I built a new one because I didn't want fuel smell and wanted to pass emissions. I kept the OEM OBD1 location under the frame rail, but the stock canister was too long and would have hit the ground. I could have shortened the stock one, but I like making things.











      The OBD2 style are a little harder because they're above the tire, they can hit if you're really low. In some ways that helps because they're already hidden, but you have to relocate the plumbing.

    9. Member eurovw95's Avatar
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      09-29-2011 10:09 AM #159
      Anthony great seeing you at h2o.. I can't wait to see this thing in person

    10. Member pubahs's Avatar
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      09-29-2011 10:37 AM #160
      Afazz.. is there some sort of aftermarket shielding we can get for the wires? I guess I am confused if this was something built into the wires themselves or an external shield?
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    11. Member
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      09-29-2011 10:47 AM #161
      You can buy shielding braid separately, this can be used if you're building a harness with your own heat shrink.
      http://cableorganizer.com/metal-braided-sleeving/

      Or you can buy shielded wire, this is much easier.
      http://order.waytekwire.com/products...20And%20Cable/

      These guys sell milspec stuff
      http://www.p-r-s.com/Catalog%202007/PRS%20Wire.pdf

      I have not used either of those products specifically, but similar types. The other guys in here might be able to get you a more specific product recommendation for shielded wire.

      Coby good seeing you too! Stop out sometime and check it out

    12. Member rocklizzard91's Avatar
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      09-30-2011 05:16 AM #162
      im interested in redoing my whole bays wiring.
      its already 90% tucked when i swapped in my 9a 16v and converted to megasquirt

      id like to use one of the fancy mil-spec connectors you have afazz
      where could i acquire one of those?

      ive got a cool idea i would like to try
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    13. Geriatric Member need_a_VR6's Avatar
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      09-30-2011 06:21 PM #163
      I have used braid in the past but unless you need to use it for a specific reason, the shielded, twisted pair cables are better. It can be tough to find in the right temp rating and chem resistance shielded cable. So keep an eye on that when choosing.
      -Paul
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    14. Member SenorBrandon's Avatar
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      10-01-2011 06:09 AM #164
      This threads the best. Anyone have some input on using 2.0l wiring? I have almost everything to build a 16v abf clone. It seems most people only talk about shaving the bay on a VR6. Thanks for making this thread, I plan to use it alot this winter!

    15. Member gangstagolf's Avatar
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      10-01-2011 02:53 PM #165
      Very nice I like!
      I'm going to be shaving my bay for my 24v swap here soon. Many awful cell pics to come lol
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    16. Member SooprmanX's Avatar
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      10-01-2011 06:48 PM #166
      On the VR6, part of the wiring harness is on the firewall at the top. It just goes across the engine bay from right to left. I am thinking of disconnecting that harness and rerouting it into the rain tray. Will I need to wrap all that wiring in additional cover because of the water that gets in the rain tray?

      Engine pic that is going to get half-shaved.....


    17. Member g-rocco60's Avatar
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      10-04-2011 02:39 PM #167
      Quote Originally Posted by pubahs View Post
      This... the highest point is the main focus of any coolant system. Reason why I am just going back tot he stock coolant bottle (brand new it will look clean) shaved? no. But clean and functions properly, yes.

      There are some good examples out there of custom coolant overflow tanks though, I snapped a few pics at waterfest this year. I could post them if anyone is interested.
      pics i would like to delete my factory coolant bubble but still wanna have a overflow of some sort
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    18. Member surge1468's Avatar
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      10-04-2011 05:31 PM #168
      anybody have a recommendation who can shave a good bay in new england

    19. Member Lamy207's Avatar
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      10-04-2011 07:22 PM #169
      I can help you out. Pm me
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    20. Member pubahs's Avatar
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      10-04-2011 11:30 PM #170
      Great example of an overflow IMO.. could be slightly higher up though

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    21. Member jeuro's Avatar
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      10-05-2011 12:16 AM #171
      Quote Originally Posted by JohnStamos View Post
      You can remove the FCM, all its wiring, ect, which gets rid of almost 1/4 of the bays wiring.


      This is my entire fan wiring setup. It is easily hidden, and uses the stock fan/fanswitch.




      He seems to be speaking of the heater core though, which most people with shaved bays don't run anymore. It takes ALOT more work to do it "right" and have full functionality. (Ala Afazz. )
      how exactly do you have this rigged up?
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      10-05-2011 12:36 AM #172
      that looks like an inline filler with an overflow tube running to the ground

      all that work and he left the a/c lines sticking out of the firewall??

    23. Member RATFINK's Avatar
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      10-05-2011 12:44 AM #173
      i wish i had someone i could pay to do it on the west coast mine is scaring me.
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    24. Member SooprmanX's Avatar
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      10-05-2011 04:14 PM #174
      Quote Originally Posted by harlequin80 View Post
      that looks like an inline filler with an overflow tube running to the ground

      all that work and he left the a/c lines sticking out of the firewall??
      I saw that too. What I'm thinking is that he normally has AC working on his car but removes it for big car shows or something....

    25. Member pubahs's Avatar
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      10-05-2011 04:58 PM #175
      Esp. since he made a custom cover plate for it as well, with chrome acorn nuts as well. Nice finishing touches.

      Those AC lines polish up nicely too!
      - Chris

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