Dealer or Carfax screwed me when i bought my car lol..

[onequickg60]

not much to laugh about but. bought a 2008 Audi TT Jan/2011 (not from a major dealer but a decent used car place that got pretty good reviews when i asked around) i drove an hour to get the car and it was snowing out, salt everywere i checked the car as best as i could and bought it.. ( it was cold and icey middle of 1 of the many storm the east coast got in jan) dealer shows me a carfax that come up clean no issue at all.. so i buy it.. for a few months me and my wife have been talking about buying a truck so today i go to a dealer and he starts questioning me and then shows me there carfax and now it shows potential odometer rollback back in 7/2009 (wasn't on the carfax report dealer showed me).. 8/2010 shows a sellers disclosure from the auction place the dealer bought it from saying structual frame damage that may impact the safety and reliability so have frame inspected.. i start looking under the hood more and i notice some backyard shade tree repair work.. some of those repair that if you know what you need to look for you will find.. i had my brother and a few other friends look for stuff after i found and they didn't notice til i pointed them out..

the dealer i was going to trade it in says the cars not worth anthing to them and offered at best 10k.. car has 24k miles on it lol.. he tells me the dealer i bought it from should of know about the frame damage cause when he bought it at aution he would of had to sign a statement saying he knew he was buying a frame damaged car..

i called the dealer i bought it from and he says carfax takes time to update and the report he had at the time i bought the carfax was accurate.. he admits if he woudl of know PA law says he woudl of had to tell me and have me sign a statement saying i was aware of it.. i told him the that the report i was looking at says when he bought it at action he would of signed something say he knew what he was buying at auction a frame damaged car.. so he's claiming he didn't know..

he then back peddle a bit and say how he's sorry i'm not happy and what can he do to make it better he offered to let me trade the car back to him but still hit me with negative equity if i'm upside down in the loan (i'm about even in equity) but with my down payment and the 5k negative equity in my passat i traded (passat was in accident in 9/2010 and dealer was made aware of if thats why i had to eat so much negative equity) he was to try to make sure he still makes out after this lol..

so i told him what i was about to buy and the deal i had on the table with the dodge dealer new 2011longhorn dodge dakota quad cab 4x4 power seats, remote starter $23,500.. and he starts saying how he can try to find a used 1 and can he call me back in a few days i say go ahead and we hang up..

so what should i do.. i really needed the truck for a trip we are talking for thanksgiving.. were going to tennessee were my in-laws just moved and we were going to rent a uhaul trailer and empty there storage unit and bring them the rest fo the house hold stuff.. and since i was going to buy a new truck in march the deals now make it worth moving the time table up on it..

do i call a lawyer, or wait to see what kind of deal the dealer can get me on truck.. do i trust him to get me a clean truck lol.. or do i talk my wife into trading here dodge journey for the dakota and piss her off lol.. she hates car shopping and has been prety pissed after today..

any advice is welcome if ayone has been in this situation before and can tell me about there experiance it would be great..

[onequickg60]

i guess noone has ben threw something like this lol..

ok to give an update the dealer calls e back tuesday and tells me he is willing to allow me to trade the car back to him.. but he won't give me fair trade value so far KKB says the value is 20k to just oover 24k.. he tells me he won't even give me close to that because i rolled over negative equity from my last car.. so even low KBB value 20k he won't give me and my payoff is 23k lol basicly he's a typical dealer trying to make moeny of the incident..

he proceeds to tell me he will fix the car and wants his local body shop to view the car and he will call the guy and get back to me.. i tell him fixing the car really doesn't do me much cause the car still has the carfax branded frame damage lol.. so he says its either that or low trade in or buy back which leave me putting several grand out of pocket.. he tells me he will call me back today and let me know when to take hm the car.. ( i drove a 1hr and a 1/2 to go buy this) he keeps saying how sorry he is and he is sorry for the inconvience and wants to mak eme happy.. my last words to him were if he wanted to make me happy he would give me fair trade value and a decent deal on another car from his lot thati coudl take and trade in fo rmy truck.. he says nothing but he wall call me tomorrow (today)..

so no call from him and around 3pm i called a lawyer who specilizes in these cases and the filed the complaint online..

i'll update again when i have something to add lol.. hopefully someone will find this usefull..

[PDing]

I don't understand what your negative equity from your previous car has anything to do with what the value of the car is. The negative equity got rolled into your current car payment when you traded it in. He lowered the value of your trade because the car was damaged and not admitting to any wrong doing when they sold it to you. To further reduce the value because your last car had negative equity means they're sleaze bags.

If they can't produce a disclosure form stating that you acknowledged buying a car with structural damage, have fun with them in court, if you have time and money.

[GolfVIDriver]

Yeah, this one is like 3 parts you're stupidity, and 1 part dealer liability.

Regarding the CarFax - if its there now, and it wasn't when you bought it, you might have a case for false representation. I went through something similar with a '99 Suburban I bought from a used car dealer. Long story short, there was an error in the paperwork when it was traded in, I bought it, and my true miles butted up against the higher "guessed" miles at trade in, and branded the title "Odometer Rollback". Because this took place during his paperwork process and before I bought the truck, I had a case for damaged resale value. The dealer claimed it on insurance and I got a check.

However....

1. You bought a used car and didn't inspect it properly. If you found it after the CarFax issue, you should have found it on your pre-purchase inspection. NO EXCUSES.

2. You traded a car in with negative equity. Thats a cardinal sin. You should have known better than that.

3. The accident and your negative equity have conspired to bury you in this car. Even if he gives you top dollar for the TT (which he should not - its wrecked) whatever offer he gives you is going to be lowered by the negative equity.

And after a small period of ownership, now you want to trade the car in again.

Sorry dude....Bottom line - you f**ed yourself. Live with it.

[edit] Oh yeah - Buying a Dakota? You are just setting yourself up for another negative equity situation - those lose a LOT of value in their first year.

[onequickg60]

Golf i don't know what the stick up your butt is but your opinion is all your own..

NJ law states any car sold with any frame or structual damage must be reported to the buy and a written statement show the buyer was made aware of the damage..

the dealer was told and signed paperwork at auction when he bought the car state the car has structual or frame damage.. i inspected tha car as best as i could and the damage is only something a person/ bdy shop trained to look for would see.. structual frame damge isn't noticeable unless looked at buy a pro and put on a frame machince to see how far out of spec it is.. the dealer knew what he was selling me and even went as far as to have the damage covered up..

the fact that he sold me the car knowing what it was puts him at 100% liability regardless of my trade..

if the car has a clean carfax i would have positive equity in the car.. times have changed and so have my needs so regardless of your financial situation i can afford to trade the car and be fine regardless of negative or positive equity.. i know my limits and truth be known trading the TT for the dakota would of lowered my payment..

i'm not sure what your reading but the dealer who i bought the car from wants to low ball me on trade.. but the fact is is he stand by what he sold he would offer top value for it..

and yes i now have my 2011 Dakota Quad Cab..

and to update the rest who are reading..

last saturday the 19th leave the dealer with my dakota the dealer who sold me my TT must of got the summon from the court cause he called me at 7pm trying to ge me to come in the next buisness day so he could make things right.. but due to the fact i was going on vacation that didn't happen.. so this saturday i might be taking a trip to see him and see what happens..

so golfvidriver the stupidity is on you.. the stupid odometer story is far from a frame damage car issue.. things worked out for you and thats more of a minor issue.. not sure what the laws are were you are but its clear here.. i could of bought the car sight unseen and still be in the right..accident damage costing more then 1000$ and all frame damage must be reported to the buyer..

and i thought i was very fair in asking for the same trade value i could of got from any other dealer but he still wanted to make a buck off the deal he screwed up in the first place..

[EricjJT7]

You are not the only one who has unknowingly bought a car that has been wrecked. The last car that I bought was from a completely dishonest individual who I met at work (and was later fired in a completely unrelated incident). It was actually his dad's car, but to shorten the story I ended up trading cars straight up, both being worth about the same assuming they both were in the same exact condition. I asked him for the vin over the phone the night before I went down to check the car out, and typed the vin incorrectly (not sure if he either gave me the wrong vin or I just wrote it down wrong). Since I could not get the vin to work for a carfax I decided to just ask him and his dad in person if the car had been wrecked, and inspect the car a little more vigorously in person (not very car savvy when it comes to repairs). I ended up asking them a total of three or four times if the car had been involved in an accident and if it had a clean title, and they lied to me flat out about the car having a clean title and the car never being wrecked. I mentioned to them that I wanted to have the car inspected by a professional, but somehow let them convince me that it would just be a waste of time and money (couldn't have been further from the truth in reality for me). Because of my excitement for driving away with a more performance oriented car, I overlooked all of the red flags that the car had been involved in some type of major front end collision. I knew the car had a coolant leak, needed a new clutch, and would need new rotors, but I overlooked all of this in order to be sitting in a sports car instead of a sedan. I ended up driving the car home, leaving them with my car and its title, only to find out that very day that the car had been wrecked. I called the guy back immediately and he played dumb, as if he didn't know it had been wrecked. I offered to trade the car back, paying all the taxes out of my expense and handing him an extra 500 dollars, and he still would not trade back. Long story short, unless you are buying your car from a close relative or friend and you absolutely know for a fact that the car has been well cared for, always take the car to a reputable shop/mechanic and never buy a car until you have run a carfax for yourself (don't rely on anyone else's carfax but your own). If you do both of these things, the chances of you walking away with a lemon are much smaller than if you don't or only do one of these. Also if you can, bring someone who is car savvy along with you and see what their opinion is on the car you are looking at.
If you haven't already done so, file a complaint with the better business bureau as that dealership sounds like a complete scam.

[EricjJT7]

While it doesn't look bad in the picture, it ended up being a terrible mistake for me as the Firehawk ended up costing me roughly eight grand more than the 2002 Jetta GLI over the period of just one year, as it had lower resale due to its rebuilt title and also ended up costing me $5,000 in repairs. I could have saved up and bought something much nicer--lesson learned.

As a side note, here is a picture of the Firehawk next to an Audi R8 V10

[JohnnieWalker85]

Not sure why all these people are saying it's your fault, it looks like this dealer deliberately and knowingly broke the law. I feel like if a similar dispute happened at a retail store over a cell phone or TV people would be on your side.

[onequickg60]

Sucks to see others have been screwed in a simular manor. There no update yet as with work and christmas coming i havent had time to go up there. I did talk to the dealer last wednesday and he says he's still willing to make things right. But wont get into specifics to what he want to do. Next saturday looks like a good day for me so hopefully nothing comes up and i can get this taken care of this fairly.

[onequickg60]

Quick update.

This might come to an end tomorrow. I went to work tay forgetting my cell so of course the dealer calls and my wife pics upand tells him off lol. Her first time talking to him since this all happened. He received the paperwork from the court sayinhg he was being sued and want to convience my wife going threw a laywer isnt the best way to go that we can settle this without it. She goes off and hangs upon him. She calls me and tells me what happen and tells me not to call him back. But the person i am i convence her to atleats hear what he has to say. So i waited til it got late and called him about an hr ago. Now he wants to give 22k for it but that leaves me putting out 1400 to pay it off and no car..

Got a bit pissy with him and and said i offered him this deal the day the problem came up. And why the change of heart. He tells me he consulted a lawyer and is convienced he can win the case but wants me to be happy. Tells him i cant be without a car and he has to give me a deal on something he has on the lot.. he tells me to look at his website and let him know what i like.

I call him back and give him 2 car that meet what i need family hauler the can fit 3 kids in the rear. 08 touareg and 08 a6 about 35k miles on each. Touareg is sold. So he offers me a 08 infinity g35x nice car but im not an infinity fan but i tell him to work on numbers for it and the a6.. he does have some other nicer cars but there a4, is250, 3 series, everything else is high mileage or cheap american pontiac solstice, cobalt. But there all too small. Tomorrow hes going to call with the numbers and before i hung up i told him since my wife has to sign off on the tt what ever he comes up with has to make her happy. Shes already pissed and i refuse to sleep on the couch lol.

So tomorrow if the deals not right it goes in the hands of my laywer.

[EricjJT7]

Good luck with the case, I hope it goes your way so the dealership can learn they have a responsibility to warn buyers about a car if it is a lemon. In my opinion a dealership should be held responsible if they sell someone a car with a salvage/rebuilt title without informing the buyer first.

[PDing]

Quick update.

This might come to an end tomorrow. I went to work tay forgetting my cell so of course the dealer calls and my wife pics upand tells him off lol. Her first time talking to him since this all happened. He received the paperwork from the court sayinhg he was being sued and want to convience my wife going threw a laywer isnt the best way to go that we can settle this without it. She goes off and hangs upon him. She calls me and tells me what happen and tells me not to call him back. But the person i am i convence her to atleats hear what he has to say. So i waited til it got late and called him about an hr ago. Now he wants to give 22k for it but that leaves me putting out 1400 to pay it off and no car..

Got a bit pissy with him and and said i offered him this deal the day the problem came up. And why the change of heart. He tells me he consulted a lawyer and is convienced he can win the case but wants me to be happy. Tells him i cant be without a car and he has to give me a deal on something he has on the lot.. he tells me to look at his website and let him know what i like.

I call him back and give him 2 car that meet what i need family hauler the can fit 3 kids in the rear. 08 touareg and 08 a6 about 35k miles on each. Touareg is sold. So he offers me a 08 infinity g35x nice car but im not an infinity fan but i tell him to work on numbers for it and the a6.. he does have some other nicer cars but there a4, is250, 3 series, everything else is high mileage or cheap american pontiac solstice, cobalt. But there all too small. Tomorrow hes going to call with the numbers and before i hung up i told him since my wife has to sign off on the tt what ever he comes up with has to make her happy. Shes already pissed and i refuse to sleep on the couch lol.

So tomorrow if the deals not right it goes in the hands of my laywer.

I'd put it in the hands of the lawyer. I don't know why you still want another car from this sh*t-hole.

He'll get you out of that car and into another one and shaft you on the finance.

[onequickg60]

Im just trying to give him the chance to make things right. Im not into lawsuits. My wife says the same thingbut my thinking is since everything is proceedingwith the lawyer it doesnt hurtt to hear the dealer out.

Todays update is he called but me and ancing not an option now as me and my wife are showing 3 cars on our credit report it might be another month before her journey comes off. intrest rate was too high.

He did finally make an offer to pay off the TT and i walk away owing nothing. But it leaves me with no car and with my wife needing to take our kids to school while im at work thats not an option. 2nd option was i keepvthe car and he would give me 3k fine but its going to cost more then 3k to fix it. So he gives me option 3 of him gitting it fixed giving me a loaner and when its all fix a few dollars for my trouble. Hedid get into detail of what a few dollars for my trouble would be but i told him i would call him tomorrow after i get to talk it over with my wife.

Messed up thing is when i bought my truck last month i went in with a capitalone blank check and ended up using dodges alley financial for the zero apr lol blank check expired about a week ago.

The saga continues but could be over soon. My lawyers retainer was 1100$ so i guess any deal i make ill try to get part if not all of that included.

[pknopp]

Sorry, I would let the lawyer handle it. I'm not a lawsuit person either BUT the dealer was 100% in the wrong and basically he's got his nuts in a vice if this is taken to court.

If I was the lawyer and a car was intentionally misrepresented in this way I'd ask for the car to be paid off, a new car free and clear and costs.

Carfax offers a gaurantee also and I doubt very seriously that it was simply a case of it not being updated.

[g60rabbit]

Im just trying to give him the chance to make things right.

You gave him the chance to make it right already though no? Isnt that why you got a lawyer?

Think about it this way.

You gave him a chance to make it right.

He said no dice.

But after getting a lawyer he has the BALLS to settle EVEN THOUGH he KNOWS he will win?? Where was this offer before the lawyer?

Does that make any sense. You called his bluff and now he wants to give you another one of HIS cars that he will probably make a profit on to make you happy??

You take his deal someone will get screwed in the future. You take him to court you maybe put him out of business.

[DuNa]

Bro, I had a similar case last year with a dealer.
He made it so it never happened.


So, if the dealer wants to wash his hands, make him pay off the TT, and reimburse you for your Passat, aka, give you the amount back that you could go and buy another for, totally disregarding the negative equity, which will now belong to him since he messed up. As another fee, charge him for the lawyer. You want to walk away scott free, as you are just a consumer, he is a business.

Tell him that

If he agrees, let him go (your choice, though).

If he disagrees, take it to court and demand the full Retail value of your Passat back (no matter what the equity was), Retail of the TT, AND compensation for legal fees, time loss and headache.




Lay the cards on the table, and see what game he wants to play.

[onequickg60]

Havent updated in awhile but talked with my lawyer late thursday and let him know the dealers offer and he advised me to make 1 counter offer to avoid court, he suggested a few diffrent option and told me pick the best that would satisfy me. His option were from the defense side he said these were offers he would accept if he was the other lawyer to avoid court cause it will cost him alot more as he is working on a triple damages claim. So friday i call and was told he was out p, saturday i call and tod he just left but would be back later. I call a few time more then they tell me to call his cell. I ask for his cell number they tell me they cant give it to me. I ask why tell me to call him cell if you dont want to give me the number and just hang up. My wife remember his cell number is on the buisness card in the paperwork for the car. So i call the cell no answer. So i call again this time leave a message with my counter offer. I told him he pays off the TT and he can take it, plus pay us all the payments we paid so far, plus lawyer fees and a few grand for our trouble.

It been about 5 days now with no call back.

My lawyer informed me as of dec 21 st he was officially served and as of jan 3 rd no official filing as to if he got his lawyer yet. He has 30 day from the 21 st to let the court know that he got his lawyer and a court date can be issued.

[onequickg60]

My lawyer called me today.. the dealer got a lawyer and offered a settlement of buying the car back for what i owe.. but in the same breath tells my lawyer its a PA issues and NJ has no jurisdiction and that he told me the car was in a accident so its all on me lol..

I had the car looked at by 1 of the shops in my area and he said he could geta estimate on damage with stripping the front end down but he was able to see creasing on the fire wall and a few other things that suggest it could go either way when it come to totaling the car out. Depends on how far out of wack it is with it being aluminum it might not be fixable. And he said not to many shops can handle a car like the TT with it being aluminium up front. He has another shop a few towns over that has the tools for aluminium welding and suggested i take the car the for a look but with out removing any panels no real quote or damage estimates could be done..

[JLJetta]

You are able to get 'out' with only $1500 loss?

I suspect the lawyer will cost you more than that!

[deagle]

be wary of a carfax w/out of state travels, as some dealer purchases are not required to report salvage/rebuilt titles on sales, nor do they have to disclose them to you

use its true that carfax needs time to update, but gaps in their service records should throw up a flag

(i use experian auto check)

in addition, a pre-purchase inspection would've revealed damage"

you may lose a few grand, but so did that guy.....and his job, and he might goto jail/prison, so you still won

[1.8Tango]

I thought Carfax covered for something like this? Don't they have a guarantee?

[deagle]

you aren't the only one screwed :

http://consumerist.com/2009/09/buyer...messed-up.html

i think carfax does have a guarantee, but its only for select cars, not everything carfaxed (legal loophole)

i remember when i was searching for a car, some carfax reports had the guarantee emblem, while others did not

b/c the dealers had carfax, i used experian auto check as a cross reference (picked up everything carfax did, plus some extras.....for me it was an extra service record, but it could've also picked up something negative the carfax didnt)

[onequickg60]

I wasn't posting dealer info but my lawyer says as long as i dont slander him posting dealership is ok..

Ridesmartauto.com

Taken from there website

We specialize in low mile, high quality vehicles. We handle Audi, Acura, BMW, Buick, Cadillac, Chevrolet ,Chrysler, Dodge, Ford, GMC, Honda,Infinity, Lexus, Mazda, Mercury, Nissan, Scion, Toyota,Volkswagon, and many others. Most vehicles are still under factory warranty and all are CarFax certified.

Its one of the reasons i went to them when searching for a used TT. I put alot of trust in those work and admit i failed to do full inspection of the car..

To update things I've been talking with my lawyer going over all the next steps. The other lawyer was avoiding my lawyer til yesterday my lawyer i gove him the ok to leave the message we would be filing for a trial date if he didnt get back in 48hrs. But today his lawyer called and they went over what negotiations. And the dealers lawyer said he would talk with the dealer and call by middle of next week.

If he files trial paperwork today trial would be this time next year. And the dealer must be under the impression i cant afford to drag it out. But im in it for the long haul about to buy my wife a little cabrio to drive around in and lower all insurance coverage on the car and let it sit.

The dealers lawyer has made any counter offers since the first they talked over a month ago.

[deagle]

fight the good fight !!

while you could've done the pre-purchase inspection, they still had no right to sell you a defective product, while misleading you....thats called fraud

[deagle]

forgot to add that they have no right to sell you a broken car , that could've put you and your family's life at serious risk

[onequickg60]

Looks like settlement is near. Dealers lawyer called back today. His counter was is a full buy back payoff on the car, my lawyers fees, and 2k cash to me.

Waiting for my wife to call me so i can go over it with her and see if she will give the final ok. She hates this dealer alot so something is telling she will say no or tell me to do what ever i want.. lol if your married you know what that means.

[deagle]

Looks like settlement is near. Dealers lawyer called back today. His counter was is a full buy back payoff on the car, my lawyers fees, and 2k cash to me.

Waiting for my wife to call me so i can go over it with her and see if she will give the final ok. She hates this dealer alot so something is telling she will say no or tell me to do what ever i want.. lol if your married you know what that means.

it seems like a fair offer, they aren't out to stick you, and you aren't out to stick them

could've also been an honest mistake in that they actually didn't know about the fault (that carfax didn't pick up either)

[Jrod511]

Looks like settlement is near. Dealers lawyer called back today. His counter was is a full buy back payoff on the car, my lawyers fees, and 2k cash to me.

Waiting for my wife to call me so i can go over it with her and see if she will give the final ok. She hates this dealer alot so something is telling she will say no or tell me to do what ever i want.. lol if your married you know what that means.

You really need to check with your wife? Getting the car paid off, lawyers fees, AND $2k? Come on. You aren't even entitled to that much; I'd take the deal and run.

[MAC]

Looks like settlement is near. Dealers lawyer called back today. His counter was is a full buy back payoff on the car, my lawyers fees, and 2k cash to me.

Tell your lawyer to take that deal asap before the dealer sobers up.

[Aseras]

Looks like settlement is near. Dealers lawyer called back today. His counter was is a full buy back payoff on the car, my lawyers fees, and 2k cash to me.

If they are offering that, they know they are going to loose bigtime in court. It's probably a treble damages case too, for knowingly defrauding.

[MAC]

Who cares ? Whats his time worth ?

He's not only getting out of this car, and his negative equity from the trade, but also getting 2k gravy and the lawyer paid for. TAKE IT !!!

[tbaeastcoast]

I hate dealing with the stealership

[danthedj]

Some people's english is so poor it hurts to read this thread.

Was the car purchased in PA or NJ? I know the OP states that NJ law states Blah Blah Blah but also somewhere in here states that in PA its not the case. Ultimately, if the car was purchased in PA where there are no such laws, you aren't owed anything.

As such, take the deal and RUN.

[Chiropractor JW]

Take the deal! And in the future, NEVER buy from a dealer that spells "Infinity"

[onequickg60]

its been awhile been busy and on vacation and no real updates..

i didn't take his last mainly he made it 2 days before i was making a payment and doesn't make it worth it.. between my down payment and the payment i was making it would of been a wash.. and if the car was in the condition it was suppose to be in when i was trading it in for my truck i would of got possitive equity in the trade.. so knowing that any deal i was to make with him had to be simular to the same out come of if i would of been able to trade it..

but as off a few weeks ago my lawyer informed his lawyer he had 1 more shot to make a decent counter offer of he would be filing for our first court date..

they came back with an offer i accepted.. he is paying the car off and taking it, paying my lawyer, i get all the payments i have into the car, and even my down payment (i didn't even ask for the Down payment). He gets to deduct mileage on the car at 20 cent a mile.. i've been trying for a week now to set up a time for him to inspect the car ( he want to make sure its mechanically sound). So today he finally called me back to tell me he will be coming here to NJ and he will bring a mechanic. I will also have my mechanic look over the car with him.. so we set a date for monday to meet..

danthedj


Some people's english is so poor it hurts to read this thread.

Was the car purchased in PA or NJ? I know the OP states that NJ law states Blah Blah Blah but also somewhere in here states that in PA its not the case. Ultimately, if the car was purchased in PA where there are no such laws, you aren't owed anything.

As such, take the deal and RUN.

the only diffrence in NJ and PA laws are NJ requires you to disclose in writing the sale of a frame damage car.. pa doesn't require it in writing but its still illegal.. either way if we go to court i win PA just require more work and instead of consumer fraud it becomes fraud by deception..