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    Thread: Integrated Engineering's "Project 2.5L Engine Dyno" Build Up Thread

    1. Banner Advertiser Sales@IE's Avatar
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      1.8T High power engine dyno.
      11-23-2011 01:39 PM #1
      Hi guys! While we have some engine parts already available for the 2.5L, we are about to really get kicking on a *bunch* more. Since many of these parts will require power testing, we will be setting up a 2.5L on our in house Superflow 902 engine dyno. I'll be chronicling that build as well as the coming engine build & parts development all in this thread.


      IE engine dyno.... this big power 1.8T is about to get shelved to make way for a 2.5L I5

      Currently the plan (as of today) is to get this stock '09 2.5L we have mounted up. And that means getting off the top shelf!

      Pete running the official IE engine lift


      This is the new 2.5L I5 power plant for the engine dyno, this guy is going to see A LOT of cool stuff in the future.

      We have decided to run totally stock accessories and go from there- so that means figuring out how to hold the dang motor into our ~ longitudinal dyno setup without any motor mounts coming in from the "sides" as traditional- so the fun starts.


      As any good part, mock up starts with paper


      The final engine mount solution drawn up and ready for prototype


      If it does not work, looks like it could make a good kitchen counter decoration

      We also need to adapt our bellhousing, starter, and throwout bearing etc. I will cover that stuff here just for kicks. Then we will be wiring it up on AEM's new standalone ECU, which will give us fast, consistent control over the engine. Then the testing will commence, starting with tuning the stock 2.5L on pump fuel (91 for us) and working up from there. Somewhere in the middle we anticipate building the motor to turbo spec, and the R&D will continue.


      We will also give you updates on other 2.5 projects not necessarily for the engine dyno, anyone guess what we are working on here?

      So, hopefully I won't bore you guys to death and you will stay tuned You will have to understand however that some of these products take literally seasons to develop from idea to shelf part- hell we have some that the development time is over a year! So, don't get too crazy on me if the updates on a particular part aren't ultra frequent.
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      09 Rabbit 2.5T
      11-23-2011 01:55 PM #2
      Sounds pretty sweet!

    3. Member cracKness's Avatar
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      11-23-2011 02:03 PM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by Sales@IE View Post

      We will also give you updates on other 2.5 projects not necessarily for the engine dyno, anyone guess what we are working on here?
      OOO valve cover? What do I win?

      Quote Originally Posted by Sales@IE View Post
      ... You will have to understand however that some of these products take literally seasons to develop from idea to shelf part- hell we have some that the development time is over a year...
      Sweet, the cool stuff starts coming out when I start being able to afford them

      BTW: Edit your Sig, you might have left an open [] somewhere, the link by the word Performance is a little screwy. Also, might want to make your email addy clickable too.
      United Motorsport Software|AWE-Tuning Cat-Back Exhaust|LNT Intake|Koni Yellows w/ H&R Sports|Neuspeed 25mm RSB|NLS Short Shifter w/ 42dd Bushings & VMS Shift bracket bushings|BFI Torque Mount Insert|Lead foot

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      11-23-2011 03:27 PM #4
      Sub'd!!! I excited to begin filling my bay with everything IE.

    5. Member TylerO28's Avatar
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      11-23-2011 04:44 PM #5
      Looks like delrin! That's a valve cover to say the least!

      Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
      god i love my car. it may not be fast, but it's crazy fun!



      C2 stage 2 TURBO!!! ACHTUNG!!! 2.5liter 5cylinder contents under pressure!!!

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      11-23-2011 06:11 PM #6
      "Ivory" color ABS Rapid prototype...

      Here's how it's done.



      We principally print castings and other stuff with high tooling costs with it, or if we get in a bind and something is difficult to measure, etc... However the 2.5L valve cover seal was so intricate that we ended up printing the end sections to check fit before signing the prints over to manufacture.
      Last edited by pete@integrated; 11-23-2011 at 06:15 PM.
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    7. Member zevion's Avatar
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      11-24-2011 04:43 AM #7
      Looks like a Stratasys machine. Company located locally. Fun stuff.

    8. Member BlackRabbit2point5's Avatar
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      2007 C2 turbo rabbit
      11-24-2011 12:53 PM #8
      let me know how much of a pain it is to get the cam phasing synced on the AEM EMS, I've heard its best to calibrate off the trailing edge of the windows when dealing with Haltech but I've heard about issues with the 4 window cam rotor in AEM EMS. I'm currently doing tons of SEM research and leaning toward Haltech despite having training on the AEM and wholesale pricing access
      -2007 Rabbit 2.5::: Denvers: smoked clear sides: Textured GTI rear lower: Magnaflow exhaust: Techtonics High Flow Cat: Podi Boost Guage: VEI Dual Display Gauge Oil Pressure/ AFR: C2 Stg 2 turbo: Turbo XS MBC: Forge 007 DV : o2j swap: Quaife LSD: Southbend Stg 3 clutch, single mass flywheel
      On deck::AEM w/m kit:: BSH mounts

    9. Member BlackRabbit2point5's Avatar
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      2007 C2 turbo rabbit
      11-24-2011 12:56 PM #9
      if you do get the AEM EMS working nicely with cam phasing control shoot us a base map price because I'd totally run it in a heartbeat since I've had my hands in it a little and really like working with it
      -2007 Rabbit 2.5::: Denvers: smoked clear sides: Textured GTI rear lower: Magnaflow exhaust: Techtonics High Flow Cat: Podi Boost Guage: VEI Dual Display Gauge Oil Pressure/ AFR: C2 Stg 2 turbo: Turbo XS MBC: Forge 007 DV : o2j swap: Quaife LSD: Southbend Stg 3 clutch, single mass flywheel
      On deck::AEM w/m kit:: BSH mounts

    10. Banner Advertiser pete@integrated's Avatar
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      11-24-2011 01:05 PM #10
      The box we are going to use is the new AEM ECU- not their old "EMS". We are just actually signing up to be an AEM WD right now because of this awesome new ecu. It can handle anything you throw at it- cam timing (qaud), dual drive by wire, even direct injection.

      Being direct with them we will work with them to figure it out and more then likely have a package available with harness & basemaps. Between the engine dyno, tons of datalogging and a 'scope, we have the resources to get it done.

      To be honest, while I will work on the cam control, I'm not too worried about it, due to certain future developments in the pipeline that will drastically reduce valve to piston clearance and greatly limit the VVT travel you can use anyways. To be totally honest we were looking at making inserts to limit the VVT travel for those reasons, but comp cams has a patent pending that is going to force us into an either locked, or software only solution- which is a little scary to say the least.

      Pete
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    11. Member TylerO28's Avatar
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      11-24-2011 11:48 PM #11
      Oh man now we're talking! So are we going to dump the whole vvt system down? And is there a head spacer in the works? I'm thinking that may be my next build arena.and the new sri's being released with a nice turbo file!

      However stand alone with direct wired harness that were pre made sounds VERY appealing, may be a little too costly at the present time for myself though...but I still would like the option in the future

      Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
      god i love my car. it may not be fast, but it's crazy fun!



      C2 stage 2 TURBO!!! ACHTUNG!!! 2.5liter 5cylinder contents under pressure!!!


    12. Member kevin splits's Avatar
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      11-26-2011 04:44 PM #13
      Just weld your baffling in on those valve covers
      "The Vile Bunch" ll v2lab ll eemilitiatv ll Stay Orange.
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    13. Member kevin splits's Avatar
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      11-26-2011 04:48 PM #14


      How much are these? I want one Start printing random sh*t and giving you guys surprise packages of "things" ROFL
      "The Vile Bunch" ll v2lab ll eemilitiatv ll Stay Orange.
      2008 Mkv-sold; 2003 yellow SRT-4-sold; 2009 G8 GT-sold; 1991 Talon TSI- fully built, HTA3582@30psi 600+awhp(900+awhp rebuild in progress)

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      11-26-2011 09:08 PM #15
      Sub'd.

    15. Member H3LVTCA's Avatar
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      11-27-2011 02:15 AM #16
      In!
      Quote Originally Posted by TrillyPop View Post
      The 2.5L forum is full of high hopes and huge disappointment.
      MKV Rabbit Dyno Thread
      MKIII Cabrio Build Thread

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      11-27-2011 10:24 AM #17
      SUB'D

    17. Member BlackRabbit2point5's Avatar
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      11-27-2011 01:19 PM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by TylerO28 View Post
      Oh man now we're talking! So are we going to dump the whole vvt system down? And is there a head spacer in the works? I'm thinking that may be my next build arena.and the new sri's being released with a nice turbo file!

      However stand alone with direct wired harness that were pre made sounds VERY appealing, may be a little too costly at the present time for myself though...but I still would like the option in the future

      Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
      Yeah we don't wanna totally dump the VVT cuz that will increase turbo lag. But yeah Tyler the other local 2.5T to you is owned by someone trained in AEM EMS, figuring the new system won't be too horrible to figure out especially if we have a base map. I'd be down to share my knowledge with you
      -2007 Rabbit 2.5::: Denvers: smoked clear sides: Textured GTI rear lower: Magnaflow exhaust: Techtonics High Flow Cat: Podi Boost Guage: VEI Dual Display Gauge Oil Pressure/ AFR: C2 Stg 2 turbo: Turbo XS MBC: Forge 007 DV : o2j swap: Quaife LSD: Southbend Stg 3 clutch, single mass flywheel
      On deck::AEM w/m kit:: BSH mounts

    18. Member TylerO28's Avatar
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      11-27-2011 05:58 PM #19
      This is good news! So is this new aem setup pretty official? I know they make nice products, but with this can we even use it to run water/meth injection? Stage injectors for a dual fuel rail?

      Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
      god i love my car. it may not be fast, but it's crazy fun!



      C2 stage 2 TURBO!!! ACHTUNG!!! 2.5liter 5cylinder contents under pressure!!!

    19. Member BlackRabbit2point5's Avatar
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      11-28-2011 01:34 AM #20
      Yes you can, and if you start out with an aem meth kit control can be slaved to the ecm or at least it was that way with ems. You'd also get boost by gear and antilag strategies. I'm assuming aux outs for fan control of extra fans such as on intercooler. Also fully computerized nitrous control. Not to mention you aren't trying to trick a stock computer into playing nice with stuff vw didn't intend for it to deal with. You can tune off any map or maf sensor you have a calibration for as well.

      Sent from my HTC Evo 4G Shift using Tapatalk
      -2007 Rabbit 2.5::: Denvers: smoked clear sides: Textured GTI rear lower: Magnaflow exhaust: Techtonics High Flow Cat: Podi Boost Guage: VEI Dual Display Gauge Oil Pressure/ AFR: C2 Stg 2 turbo: Turbo XS MBC: Forge 007 DV : o2j swap: Quaife LSD: Southbend Stg 3 clutch, single mass flywheel
      On deck::AEM w/m kit:: BSH mounts

    20. Banner Advertiser pete@integrated's Avatar
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      11-28-2011 02:36 PM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by kevin FaKiN spLits View Post
      Just weld your baffling in on those valve covers
      That was the plan

      Quote Originally Posted by kevin FaKiN spLits View Post


      How much are these? I want one Start printing random sh*t and giving you guys surprise packages of "things" ROFL
      The machines aren't *terribly* expensive, but the material also adds up quickly. Your typical cost to print is roughly $6.50 per cubic inch of material volume. When we print intake manifolds that gets expensive *quick*.

      That said, if you have ideas, our ears / minds are always open, and we certainly have the means to develop just about anything.
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      11-30-2011 04:26 PM #22

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      12-01-2011 03:06 PM #23
      I want to follow this thread.
      Quote Originally Posted by VikingVR6GTI View Post
      Yep, that was my first thought too. A nice set does not automatically make a chick attractive. Especially when that "chick" is a dude.

    23. Banner Advertiser Sales@IE's Avatar
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      1.8T High power engine dyno.
      12-02-2011 11:22 PM #24
      Still engineering our engine mount bracket and then we need to get the 1.8T engine off the dyno before we have any big updates. So we started getting the motor ready with a few of our shiny billet accessories.

      Tearing everything off:




      And the new stuff goes on:




      Injectors seated into one of our billett rails:




      Fuel rail installed in its new home:


      Bigger update coming soon!
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      12-03-2011 01:46 PM #25
      that rail is sexy... any chance of getting it in an anodized black
      -2007 Rabbit 2.5::: Denvers: smoked clear sides: Textured GTI rear lower: Magnaflow exhaust: Techtonics High Flow Cat: Podi Boost Guage: VEI Dual Display Gauge Oil Pressure/ AFR: C2 Stg 2 turbo: Turbo XS MBC: Forge 007 DV : o2j swap: Quaife LSD: Southbend Stg 3 clutch, single mass flywheel
      On deck::AEM w/m kit:: BSH mounts

    25. 12-03-2011 04:54 PM #26
      It's funny because at first i was like, "Why would they do it in red that would just looks stupid."

      Then i was like, "Ohhhh, now i get it."

    26. Member TylerO28's Avatar
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      12-03-2011 06:03 PM #27
      Hmmm? Would those cam seals in picture number 1 be able to be manufactured triple o ring sealed?

      I know the Honda guys have issues with them. Are the 2.5 seals plastic? I've not noticed mine!

      The second picture is all too familiar due to my recent flywheel/clutch upgrade! I can honestly say I don't want to have to do that again for a long time!
      god i love my car. it may not be fast, but it's crazy fun!



      C2 stage 2 TURBO!!! ACHTUNG!!! 2.5liter 5cylinder contents under pressure!!!

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      12-04-2011 03:44 AM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by TylerO28 View Post
      Hmmm? Would those cam seals in picture number 1 be able to be manufactured triple o ring sealed?

      I know the Honda guys have issues with them. Are the 2.5 seals plastic? I've not noticed mine!

      The second picture is all too familiar due to my recent flywheel/clutch upgrade! I can honestly say I don't want to have to do that again for a long time!


      The 2.5L / fsi / mk5 cam seals are already on our agenda- because billet ones will look awesome. The head is thin enough there IIRC a double O ring is all that is possible. The OE seal is metal / natural butyl rubber- which is not good for extended periods of high temp.

      Our agenda is just way (*#(*$#('d with lots of parts backing up both machines...

      -Pete
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    28. Member zevion's Avatar
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      12-04-2011 03:48 AM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by pete@integrated View Post
      Our agenda is just way (*#(*$#('d with lots of parts backing up both machines...
      Time for a new machine.

    29. Member kevin splits's Avatar
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      12-04-2011 12:28 PM #30
      Quote Originally Posted by zevion View Post
      Time for a new machine.
      Or two or three Ears perked for billet seals
      "The Vile Bunch" ll v2lab ll eemilitiatv ll Stay Orange.
      2008 Mkv-sold; 2003 yellow SRT-4-sold; 2009 G8 GT-sold; 1991 Talon TSI- fully built, HTA3582@30psi 600+awhp(900+awhp rebuild in progress)

    30. Banner Advertiser pete@integrated's Avatar
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      12-05-2011 11:53 AM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by kevin FaKiN spLits View Post
      Or two or three Ears perked for billet seals


      Something like that

      Que'd for production now.
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    31. Member tay272's Avatar
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      12-05-2011 05:18 PM #32
      [QUOTE=Sales@IE;74758663]Tearing everything off:
      \

      So the cam seals are what keeps the cams sealed in place on the ends? Thats what the 2 black circles are on the side of the head in this picture, correct? That pic you put up looks pretty sweet. If they would replace those 2 black pieces and keep things internaly safer, Im deffinately gonna pick up a pair at some point. Keep the good stuff coming guys .
      http://s529.photobucket.com/albums/d...abbit%20build/
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    32. Member kevin splits's Avatar
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      12-05-2011 05:38 PM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by pete@integrated View Post


      Something like that

      Que'd for production now.
      "The Vile Bunch" ll v2lab ll eemilitiatv ll Stay Orange.
      2008 Mkv-sold; 2003 yellow SRT-4-sold; 2009 G8 GT-sold; 1991 Talon TSI- fully built, HTA3582@30psi 600+awhp(900+awhp rebuild in progress)

    33. Member TylerO28's Avatar
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      12-05-2011 06:44 PM #34
      Exactly what I was thinking! Nice! Do these require pulling the cams? Or just the valve cover? Ooh buddy all of this red billet stuff is gonna be incredible under my hood
      god i love my car. it may not be fast, but it's crazy fun!



      C2 stage 2 TURBO!!! ACHTUNG!!! 2.5liter 5cylinder contents under pressure!!!

    34. Banner Advertiser pete@integrated's Avatar
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      12-05-2011 06:51 PM #35
      They are trapped by the cam tray, so they would require the cams to be at least partially removed, but the chain would not have to come off and the motor would not have to be re-timed.

      If you guys are ok with a little more expense I can see if there is room to make some sort of 2 piece setup... I bet you would need ninja fingers to assemble it in there though with the cam tray still on.

      I mostly figured people could pop them in when they are installing a set of.... oh wait top secret.

      Whatever you guys want
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