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    Thread: Suspension spec thread

    1. Member
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      01-10-2012 08:24 PM #51
      Quote Originally Posted by TeamZleep View Post
      I dunno... It seems so odd to me that people don't realize it... I mean look at a picture of the R32 rear suspension and a regular MKV IRS... Almost the same thing. Maybe try calling them back and explaining it...?
      Thanks.

      I might try that. The guy was going on about how the AWD makes the fitment impossible versus FWD. He said that after he supposedly checked with the VW expert on staff Didn't make any sense based on what I had read here (re: same IRS), but I figured these guys are the suspension experts I'll see what he gets back to me with. He was going to look into various options and shoot me an email. Disappointing to be sure.

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      01-10-2012 09:31 PM #52
      Quote Originally Posted by TeamZleep View Post
      Disappointing for sure man... I'd almost buy them anyways. The fronts are the same exact McPherson design and the rear shocks are the same length and mount in the same spot. Rear springs sit in the same cups in the same control arm in the rear...

      I mean tell him you know a guy who has had an R32 coilover kit on his FWD MKV and has had FWD MKV stuff on an R32 chassis... Laugh at how stumped he is..
      Took your advice and called back. Spoke to another guy (Beau) who quickly confirmed that they would fit and said that weight differences are really a spring issue much more than a damper issue. He had no concerns that they would work well for the R32 application.

    3. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      01-10-2012 10:05 PM #53
      lol, nice. Ohlins just went back to the top of my list again.
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

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      01-10-2012 10:48 PM #54
      Quote Originally Posted by TeamZleep View Post
      Maybe... but maybe there's hope for us. I'm seriously considering this... My stock springs are perfect and would do the job well.


      Likewise. I like my stock springs and ride height for NYC roads and winters. For reasons that I didn't fully understand, sales guy #2 was more concerned about unsprung weight differences rather than sprung weight differences in regards to the GTI vs R32 application. But when I mentioned what I was doing to shed unsprung weight--he thought the Ohlins would offer a fantastic combination of compliance and control. Plus, he thinks such a set up could be very trackable given their adjustability. I'm going to sleep on it, but I think I'm sold.

    5. Member JRutter's Avatar
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      01-11-2012 12:33 AM #55
      [QUOTE=ryeboy;75318289]Took your advice and called back. Spoke to another guy (Beau) who quickly confirmed that they would fit and said that weight differences are really a spring issue much more than a damper issue. He had no concerns that they would work well for the R32 application.
      A VR6 AWD w/ lots of goodies

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      01-11-2012 10:43 AM #56
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Can you get info on what the spring rates are for FWD 2.0 vs AWD 3.2? That would be great info for this thread (and for me!).
      Yes. For some reason that information seems hard to come by. Vorshlag has an offer to measure any OEM or after market spring rates free of charge (and post it on their growing database). It would be great if someone who has removed the OEM springs could send them in for testing. They return them to the owner, but those who have already done aftermarket suspensions are probably those least motivated to go to the trouble.


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      01-11-2012 10:49 AM #57
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Can you get info on what the spring rates are for FWD 2.0 vs AWD 3.2? That would be great info for this thread (and for me!).
      Forgot that the GTI spring rates are posted (but not the R32):

      2006 VW GTI (MarkV), OEM Front Spring 4.5 12.75 156 314 493 673 Marked with 2 red dots, 2 white dots

      Approximate Rate 156 158 179 180 155-180 #/in variable rate


      2006 VW GTI (MarkV), OEM Rear Spring 4.1 13 188 375 559 744 Marked with 3 yellow dots, 1 blue dot

      Approximate Rate 188 187 184 185 185 #/in straight rate

    8. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      01-11-2012 01:53 PM #58
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Can you get info on what the spring rates are for FWD 2.0 vs AWD 3.2? That would be great info for this thread (and for me!).
      This was one of the main reasons for the thread and it's still unanswered, LOL @ us and the entire MkV R community here. I'm not doing suspension anytime soon so I'll be of no use for a while but when I do, I plan on going to Swift and have them measure my springs to make me some custom ones to go w/ Ohlins. Only thing is the OE springs are about 5 years old now and they will be even older when I do it...
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

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      01-11-2012 02:30 PM #59
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Can you get info on what the spring rates are for FWD 2.0 vs AWD 3.2? That would be great info for this thread (and for me!).
      MkIV R32 spring rates are discussed here:

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4076329

      Short version 275 F and 345-380 R

    10. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      01-11-2012 02:35 PM #60
      Quote Originally Posted by ryeboy View Post
      MkIV R32 spring rates are discussed here:

      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4076329

      Short version 275 F and 345-380 R
      Interesting...although I doubt the MkV has the same rates. If so, it looks like most the aftermarket kits we have info on have lower rates than stock
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

    11. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      01-11-2012 02:55 PM #61
      Quote Originally Posted by TeamZleep View Post
      That's usually the biggest problem with aftermarket kits, IMO.
      Strange...it's not an issue at all on most aftermarket kits for my S4 and all the info is available for every reasonable option for that car I guess the only positive explanation for this is that our stock suspension is really that good from the factory but I think anyone who really drives it will agree that the rates are too low and the overall suspension is too bouncy.
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

    12. Member Mr_Peach's Avatar
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      02-11-2012 11:50 AM #62
      Dumb Q:

      What's the typical 'wear out' path for OEM?

      I'm sitting at about 80K (and of course 4.5 years) and assuming that my OEM dampers might be getting tired.

      If I got new dampers (Ohlins, for sake of argument), are my stock OEM springs still good to go? I mean, ignoring any desire for stiffer / linear / lower, do springs wear out at the same rate as dampers? Differently?
      "If the car feels like it's on rails, you are probably driving too slowly." - Ross Bentley, Ultimate Speed Secrets

    13. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      02-11-2012 12:01 PM #63
      I don't know if there is a formula for how long spings last in comparison to dampers but from what I've seen, springs seem to give out before dampers and in either case, they will sag and lose effectiveness over time. I would always change the two together and really look into a company like Swift to make some custom springs. They can make them to oe spec (if anyone can ever figure out what that is) if you don't want to change too much and still get a better reacting spring.
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

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      02-11-2012 12:13 PM #64
      Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Peach View Post
      Dumb Q:

      What's the typical 'wear out' path for OEM?

      I'm sitting at about 80K (and of course 4.5 years) and assuming that my OEM dampers might be getting tired.

      If I got new dampers (Ohlins, for sake of argument), are my stock OEM springs still good to go? I mean, ignoring any desire for stiffer / linear / lower, do springs wear out at the same rate as dampers? Differently?
      Good question, Mr. P. I'm no suspension expert, but my guess is that springs may settle a bit over time (that is the case for me) but that they otherwise retain their primary capabilities. When I purchased my Ohlins, Beau at Performance Shock talked me out of staying with stock springs--arguing that it would be a waste paired with such a capable damper. Jeff at Ohlins USA confirmed this (I was worried about changing spring rates without revalving--Jeff told me not to worry). Both suggested looking at linear springs with a somewhat higher rates. Two solutions seem to be out there: Tom at H2Sports and Ground Control (talk to Donovan) make conversion kits that allow linear race springs to be used on Ohlins dampers for our vehicles. Tom's kit looks really well thought out but pricier. I will receive the GC kit and springs next week and I'll report back. I'm going to give Eibachs (450 lb front and 350 rear) at stock ride height a try.

    15. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      02-11-2012 12:32 PM #65
      Quote Originally Posted by ryeboy View Post
      Good question, Mr. P. I'm no suspension expert, but my guess is that springs may settle a bit over time (that is the case for me) but that they otherwise retain their primary capabilities. When I purchased my Ohlins, Beau at Performance Shock talked me out of staying with stock springs--arguing that it would be a waste paired with such a capable damper. Jeff at Ohlins USA confirmed this (I was worried about changing spring rates without revalving--Jeff told me not to worry). Both suggested looking at linear springs with a somewhat higher rates. Two solutions seem to be out there: Tom at H2Sports and Ground Control (talk to Donovan) make conversion kits that allow linear race springs to be used on Ohlins dampers for our vehicles. Tom's kit looks really well thought out but pricier. I will receive the GC kit and springs next week and I'll report back. I'm going to give Eibachs (450 lb front and 350 rear) at stock ride height a try.
      Nice info...looking forward to hearing your impressions when you get this done since I'm probably going with a very similar route. Are you trying to go a bit lower too or stay at stock height?
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

    16. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      03-02-2012 02:09 PM #66
      Just an interesting observation...I still have received NO information about most the coilover setups for the MkV R32 after several months of trying to provide this information for everyone.

      I recently found that the coilovers I was waiting to be ready for my B5 S4 have just been released:


      There is no group buy asking people to pay up, there is no "hype" at all about them...just there for people who happened to notice they are finally available. I emailed PSI with some questions and I got an immediate response with details about spring rates and anything else I asked about. That is the way companies should operate and that is standard for most quality products for anything I buy. It is very strange to me why so many people here don't seem to care about the basic info that should come with the products you buy and it's even more puzzling why it's so hard to get the info for products on this car even if you do care.
      Just sayin'
      I can't wait to get these things on my S4!
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

    17. Member JRutter's Avatar
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      03-06-2012 10:00 AM #67
      Bump to keep the quest alive.
      A VR6 AWD w/ lots of goodies

    18. 03-13-2012 03:00 PM #68
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Bump to keep the quest alive.
      Bump from me too, as I need more info on the compression/rebound settings for my KW V3 coilovers.

      But damn! I bought my V3's about 4 years ago. Those sweet Club Sports with camber plates weren't out back then. Hell, NO camber plates at all, were around then, argh!!!!

    19. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      03-13-2012 03:11 PM #69
      Quote Originally Posted by JRutter View Post
      Bump to keep the quest alive.
      Quote Originally Posted by Harry_Krishna View Post
      Bump from me too, as I need more info on the compression/rebound settings for my KW V3 coilovers.

      But damn! I bought my V3's about 4 years ago. Those sweet Club Sports with camber plates weren't out back then. Hell, NO camber plates at all, were around then, argh!!!!
      Thanks! Let's get more info!...I hope some vendors who read this can chime in with whatever they know since it should help their business as well as everyone interested in suspension upgrades. I can only think of one good reason why they wouldn't disclose this information and it's not a good one but I know KW and other companies listed here are known for quality products that are well thought out so comeon!
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

    20. 03-13-2012 03:24 PM #70
      Quote Originally Posted by Slave IV View Post
      ...I hope some vendors who read this can chime in with whatever they know since it should help their business as well as everyone interested in suspension upgrades...
      Agreed...when I receive the KW info, I will post it...

    21. Member Slave IV's Avatar
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      03-13-2012 03:26 PM #71
      Quote Originally Posted by VAD@HPA View Post
      Agreed...when I receive the KW info, I will post it...
      If your gas cap light comes on even if you think you tightened the cap, try pulling on the cap as you tighten it. Worked for me.
      Help us with suspension specs!
      Vag Evolution: MkI Rabbit -> MkII 16v GTI -> B5 S4/MkV .:R32

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      03-23-2012 05:17 PM #72
      When I purchased my Ohlins, Beau at Performance Shock talked me out of staying with stock springs--arguing that it would be a waste paired with such a capable damper. Jeff at Ohlins USA confirmed this (I was worried about changing spring rates without revalving--Jeff told me not to worry). Both suggested looking at linear springs with a somewhat higher rates. Two solutions seem to be out there: Tom at H2Sports and Ground Control (talk to Donovan) make conversion kits that allow linear race springs to be used on Ohlins dampers for our vehicles. Tom's kit looks really well thought out but pricier. I will receive the GC kit and springs next week and I'll report back. I'm going to give Eibachs (450 lb front and 350 rear) at stock ride height a try.
      Hey Jay, so if I understand correctly - you did not do an Ohlins coil over kit, but just bought Ohlins shocks and are pairing those with Eibach springs - but this requires a special adapter since you are getting constant rate springs?

      I'm interested in a spring upgrade and would also like to stay stock height and was thinking about the same for spring weights. I just got Koni FSD shocks last summer and am pretty happy with those. I am undecided as to constant or progressive rate springs though - as I want to remain more street set up focused then track and drive hard on (what can be) bumpy back roads, so I want some initial compliance / don't want my springs to beat me up too much. If I were to go constant rate though, any idea if I would need some sort of adaptor like you are talking about? H2Sports site is apparently down for maintenance, but I'll check out ground control and give Eibach a call to ask, but just wondered what infos / thoughts you might have. Thanks!

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      03-23-2012 10:51 PM #73
      Oh - I guess you are talking about this:

      http://www.ground-control-store.com/...p/II=717/CA=65

      This MKV GTI kit fits, yeah? And the Eibach springs are included it looks like - nice!

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      03-24-2012 12:01 AM #74
      Quote Originally Posted by motrrrpsycho View Post
      Oh - I guess you are talking about this:

      http://www.ground-control-store.com/...p/II=717/CA=65

      This MKV GTI kit fits, yeah? And the Eibach springs are included it looks like - nice!
      Yep. That's the one. Here is what it looks like installed on the Ohlins.

      [IMG][/IMG]

      You remove the spring perch and the sleeve slides into place and then it works pretty much like any other coilover. The GC kit is reasonably solid, but there is some tweaking needed. For example, I needed to wrap the strut body with about 2 layers of 3M electrical tape to make the sleeve fit snuggly. I'm a bit stuck right now b/c the upper strut bearing adaptor is 0.75 mm too small to fit over the stock strut bearing. I'm waiting for a replacement. To their credit, GC has been extremely responsive.

      Some questions to those more wise than me in suspension matters:

      I'm still a bit leery about the spring length. GC recommended a 7" spring at 450 lb/in for the front and 350 lb/in for the rear. For the purposes of the photo of the front strut, I've got the lower spring perch at its max height. But with ~2200 lbs of front weight sitting on 900 lbs of springs--should I expect a compression of 2.44 in? This would leave me with about 1.8 inches of suspension travel. That doesn't seem like much, but then again, I don't know what the stock suspension travel is either. Comments?

      At the highest setting, there is also no spring precompression. This seems like it would limit the ability of the suspension to "droop" or extend to maintain tire contact to about 2.5 in as well. The OEM springs are highly compressed under the strut bearing even before being loaded by chassis weight. I imagine this would increase the ability of the inner tire to maintain road contact during a turn or to extend to maintain road contact during a dip in the road surface. Am I thinking about this correctly?

      What about front versus rear spring rates? Some seem to think the rear should be sprung more highly than the front. Whereas some kits seem to maintain a similar ratio to what I have (e.g., clubsports). Any insights into this?

    25. Member Ryan E.'s Avatar
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      03-24-2012 10:53 AM #75
      7" inch sounds about right, I believe that's what my KW's are at. I hear for 450lb and higher you want 7" or shorter, any longer and the ride height would be effected. How long is the rear?

      I think that's a good rate, from what I've read these dampers can handle 30% more than stock. I'm not sure what stock is, but it looks like you have Ohlins blessing to run some decent rates. Al Walker and others had issues running too crazy of a rear rate: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...1#post67411426

      I would go no higher than 450 in the rear, my 400's feel pretty stiff already. I could see a range of 450-550max up front.

      When you say there's no spring compression at the highest setting, is that when they're on the car? You should check with your GC guy on that, it's seems that you would want some preload.

      Overall they look very nice
      Rigi Cola.


      "The VR6 was an orchestra of well-tuned cylindrical delights." - jalopnik.com

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