2000 miles in a Yaris: fuel economy notes and "40 MPG"

[adrew]

I drove 2000 miles from DFW to coastal Georgia and back for the holidays and have to admit that I am rather impressed with the Yaris. It is comfortable, relatively quiet at speed, rides well, has seats that are comfortable after 10 hours and surprisingly impressive 3rd gear 60-90 MPH passing power for banzai runs up the right lane past packs of tailgating SUVs and minivans camped out in the left lane.

With all the talk about people not getting the 40 MPG claimed by the current crop of economy cars, I thought I would do some experiments relating to speed and road types in my 29/36 MPG-rated Yaris. On the way over we were in a time crunch for an event so we drove from DFW to north Georgia on I-20 in one straight shot (13 hours). I was doing 80-85 (80 = 3500 RPM) the whole way and generally driving spiritedly to make time. In these conditions the car returned 34-35 MPG per tank.

We took back roads from north Georgia to coastal Georgia with an average speed of 65-70 MPH and a much more relaxed driving demeanor and the car returned an average of 38 for that tank, including two weeks of driving slowly around a coastal resort area.

We were in no hurry to get back to Texas, so we took US Hwy 82 and US 80 all the way from the coast to Vicksburg, Mississippi. It was an enjoyable, relaxing ride with lots to look at and low average speeds of 60 MPH. I did some mild hypermiling in the hillier areas and the car just ate it up: it returned two tanks just over 40 MPG. On some of the slower stretches with an average speed of 55 MPH the ScanGauge was reporting average MPG of 44 MPG after a couple hundred miles before the speeds picked up a little toward the end of the tank, dropping the average.

So, in conclusion, it seems pretty feasible to meet and exceed these mileage figures with some careful driving. I just think that most people are a bit unrealistic and disappointed when they don't get the 40 MPG figures when doing 80-90 MPH on their daily commutes.

TL;DR -- In a 29/36 rated Yaris:
80-85 MPH = 34-35 MPG
65-70 MPH = 38 MPG
55-60 MPH = 40 MPG

Hatchbacks taking over coastal Georgia (my old Si, my cousin's Protege5, previous-gen Forester in the other garage)

[dasfinc]

Speed makes all the difference, I can kiss 30mpg on the highway in my 06 Mustang GT if I keep it under 65mph, and it plummets pretty quickly doing just 10mph more.

[Newbie16ver]

People are to blame for not being able to reach gas mileage figures, not the cars. I don’t think many people realize how their s#hity driving habits kill their fuel economy. My personal favorites include:

- Jackrabbit starts towards a red light a 100 yards away
- Accelerating to above the speed limit and then breaking when they suddenly realize they are speeding
- Riding the break on the downhill and then relentlessly gassing it on the uphill

It might just be that they don’t have a basic understanding of physics.

[czykvw]

I dont think ive ever heard anything bad about a yaris!
This is a car I secretly want.

[absoluteczech]

nice, but i would go bananas driving 60mph

[Krazee]

All fine and dandy, but I'd be more interested in your cousin's Protege5

I almost bought a supposedly mint, 1owner, 96k example in Vivid Yellow
I never went to go see it, to see if it is in fact mint.

After selling my G8, I have become infinitely more interested in fun-to-drive, high-MPG cars.

[czykvw]

All fine and dandy, but I'd be more interested in your cousin's Protege5

I almost bought a supposedly mint, 1owner, 96k example in Vivid Yellow
I never went to go see it, to see if it is in fact mint.

After selling my G8, I have become infinitely more interested in fun-to-drive, high-MPG cars.

Yes the yaris is a high mpg car, but is it fun to drive!?
(serious question!)

[SAV912]

Yes the yaris is a high mpg car, but is it fun to drive!?
(serious question!)

Stock, the Honda Fit and Mazda2 are better fun to drive cars out of the box. But not by much. And equip a Yaris with TRD bits like I have (22mm sway, struts and 1.7" drop springs) and there really isn't much of a contest.



I enjoy the hell out of mine. It's been to autocross, New York, on coils (hated it), on 4 different sets of wheels, has been my learning car for swapping things out between other similar types of cars...the list goes on.

Drew, I wish I would've known you were gonna be over here in JawJaw. I would've bought you a beer. I agree with you on most every point except the seats. I think the seats are terrible. Otherwise, spot on for your other points and glad you're enjoying the new ride so far.

[2.0T_Convert]

People are to blame for not being able to reach gas mileage figures, not the cars. I don’t think many people realize how their s#hity driving habits kill their fuel economy. My personal favorites include:

- Jackrabbit starts towards a red light a 100 yards away
- Accelerating to above the speed limit and then breaking when they suddenly realize they are speeding
- Riding the break on the downhill and then relentlessly gassing it on the uphill

It might just be that they don’t have a basic understanding of physics.

Not to be the debbie downer but if I can beat EPA with a car driving like that then I would be pretty pissed if another car I bought couldn't manage the same.

And please I have no intention of being "that guy" who sloooowllly accelerate from light to light with plenty of coasting while everyone else curses and rushes around

[Air and water do mix]

I agree with you on most every point except the seats. I think the seats are terrible. Otherwise, spot on for your other points and glad you're enjoying the new ride so far.

My wife likes the seats in the Fit and I can hardly stand them. They're fine for short trips, but on long hauls I have to pull out my wallet and I still get tired within about 30 minutes of driving.

Our asses look nothing alike though, which is good! We're all shaped differently. (It's not just x and y chromosomes changing that, either.)

[Air and water do mix]

And please I have no intention of being "that guy" who sloooowllly accelerate from light to light with plenty of coasting while everyone else curses and rushes around

There certainly is a happy medium, though. I don't nail the throttle every time I take off, but I accelerate more quickly than most. I also maintain more speed in curves/turns than most. That's more fun and saves fuel. It does cost more in tires, but I think it's a good tradeoff.

I absolutely do not hypermile, however.

[2.0T_Convert]

There certainly is a happy medium, though. I don't nail the throttle every time I take off, but I accelerate more quickly than most. I also maintain more speed in curves/turns than most. That's more fun and saves fuel. It does cost more in tires, but I think it's a good tradeoff.

I absolutely do not hypermile, however.

Tried that once... I hit almost 70 MPG in another hybrid trailing a truck but that was one boring trip.

I've even read over at hypermiler sights that rapid acceleration is more efficient in some cases overall than sloooowlly easing up and missing that green light in the distance

[Lwize]

Most cars can meet or exceed the EPA Highway figure -- they could even before the 2008 revision.

The fact that the Yaris can is really nothing newsworthy.

[Air and water do mix]

I've even read over at hypermiler sights that rapid acceleration is more efficient in some cases overall than sloooowlly easing up and missing that green light in the distance

Absolutely. It's more so with a non-hybrid, as you can't recapture a percentage of the energy like the hybrid can. Unlike some believe, you don't get better mileage in a hybrid by using the brakes more to capture energy, though!

[GTRaavv]

People are to blame for not being able to reach gas mileage figures, not the cars. I don’t think many people realize how their s#hity driving habits kill their fuel economy. My personal favorites include:

- Jackrabbit starts towards a red light a 100 yards away
- Accelerating to above the speed limit and then breaking when they suddenly realize they are speeding
- Riding the break on the downhill and then relentlessly gassing it on the uphill

It might just be that they don’t have a basic understanding of physics.

While I agree with the general premise that driving habits effect mpgs, I think it is obvious that certain cars are far more forgiving in returning mpgs when pushed hard. A Yaris returns almost its EPA highway number when going 85 mph whereas other cars wouldn't come close. So while we shouldn't reward poor drivers for driving poorly, I also think that car companies shouldn't be completely blameless when companies like Toyota are able to achieve a very small mpg variance.

[zukiphile]

Yes the yaris is a high mpg car, but is it fun to drive!?
(serious question!)

I've read, but have no first hand experience, that Toyota have fastideously removed any vestige of fun from Yaris handling so that it feels like a shrunken camry.

I sat in one of the new ones, but the dealer had no manual transmissions and said he had no manual transmissioned three-doors slated for delivery. That's a shame; I see them around town and think they are a perfectly tidy size without too much engine.

[someguy123]

5-speed manual? No way you'll see those numbers with the 4-speed auto.

[2.0T_Convert]

Most cars can meet or exceed the EPA Highway figure -- they could even before the 2008 revision.

The fact that the Yaris can is really nothing newsworthy.

Hyundai

[Bixmen]

I dont think ive ever heard anything bad about a yaris!
This is a car I secretly want.

We had one for a rental once. three door. There were two of us, it barely held our suitcase. (granted it was a big 40lbs+ roller bag) It has an annoying roof mounted rear center belt that kept getting in the way, until we unbelted it. it was cramped for two, it rode like a tin can, and was completely gutless at highway speeds. we average about 34 mpg for a week of driving around lake Ontario. Mostly freeway driving, but plenty of stop and go/city driving. it was like driving an economy car from 10 years ago, except it had SEVEN cupholders!

2 years later, we took our Volvo V70 almost on the same route (MN to Maine via 401 in Canada and back). there were 2 of us, plus a 1 year old. the volvo was stacked to the gills for a weeks worth of stuff for the 2 of us + all the baby gear. we put on 3000 miles in 9 days, and averaged 29 MPG. While riding in silent insane comfort. Granted we only got 4 cup holders, we made do.

[JettaBoyJettaGirl]

Pretty much in the same hood with my 1500cc, 5 speed auto Fit or 42 MPG at 65 to 70 MPH

[adrew]

Drew, I wish I would've known you were gonna be over here in JawJaw. I would've bought you a beer. I agree with you on most every point except the seats. I think the seats are terrible. Otherwise, spot on for your other points and glad you're enjoying the new ride so far.

Thanks -- I grew up on St. Simons (family is all still there) and went to Georgia Southern (graduated in '02 and '04).

Is that your car in the picture above? If so, what wheels are those? I would like to stay with OEM wheels but am not finding too many 4-lug Toyota wheels. I hate the Bridgestone RE92 tires it came with and am thinking about doing a wheel/tire upgrade when these wear out.

Re: the seats -- I guess I am small enough and close enough to the average Japanese guy in stature (5' 10", 145 lbs) that the seats are fine for me. I was much less comfortable on long trips in our Sonata, since the seats were soft and pillowy (no support) and had a bottom cushion that was too short.

[iamnotemo]

Subaru also used the RE92 and they are in fact garbage. I've never been so happy to pay for new tires in my life.

[Lwize]

Hyundai

I said "most", popcorn meister...

[adrew]

5-speed manual? No way you'll see those numbers with the 4-speed auto.

Yes. I had a loaner with an automatic once and it was absolutely awful. I don't mind a good automatic but the Yaris one is programmed poorly and really pretty ornery. The stick is light, precise, has good ratios and is a pleasure to use.

We had one for a rental once. three door. There were two of us, it barely held our suitcase. (granted it was a big 40lbs+ roller bag)

Well, obviously, if you left the seat up -- it's a hatchback, fold the seat down! There were two of us on this trip and we brought three big roller bags (~40 lbs each), a cooler, lots of gifts, a big camera bag, a couple big sacks of food, a case of Texas beer, blah blah blah. It was fine and nothing was above the window line.

When we go camping or something like that with the boy we just fold down the big half of the seat and put all the stuff on that side next to him. If we need something larger for a weekend we just rent the Home Depot truck for a couple hours or get a rental car for $40.

It has an annoying roof mounted rear center belt that kept getting in the way, until we unbelted it.

Mine's never been down, and I wouldn't put three people in the back except in a pinch.

it was cramped for two, it rode like a tin can, and was completely gutless at highway speeds. we average about 34 mpg for a week of driving around lake Ontario. Mostly freeway driving, but plenty of stop and go/city driving. it was like driving an economy car from 10 years ago, except it had SEVEN cupholders!

Automatic, correct? The automatic is gutless at higher speeds since it won't downshift. But the 5-speed will do 90 in 3rd and over 100 in 4th. It has good pickup on the highway at 80 in 5th since it is spinning at 3500 RPM and right in the middle of the powerband. It will even accelerate up rather steep grades in 5th and can pass on two-lane roads without downshifting. With a downshift (or two) either is effortless.

And I don't know where the other two cupholders went -- mine only has five!

2 years later, we took our Volvo V70 almost on the same route (MN to Maine via 401 in Canada and back). there were 2 of us, plus a 1 year old. the volvo was stacked to the gills for a weeks worth of stuff for the 2 of us + all the baby gear. we put on 3000 miles in 9 days, and averaged 29 MPG. While riding in silent insane comfort. Granted we only got 4 cup holders, we made do.

It does okay on the highway (much better than expected), but that is not its forte. The real beauty of the car is in the day-to-day slogging around the city and suburbs. Our old Sonata got low 20s in city but in the Yaris I have never averaged below 33 MPG per tank in mixed driving except when it was breaking in. It usually gets 36-37 combined over a whole tank.

Today I drove it down to Burleson (25 miles there and back) and the ScanGuage was reporting 41.3 for the tank when I got home this afternoon. That included quite a bit of stop-and-go traffic and lots of lights. A car like your Volvo or our old Sonata would struggle to hit 20 MPG in those conditions.

This is kind of a transition car / budget saver car to free up some cash flow each month while my better half is in school. We've saving over $200/month in gas/car payment/insurance/maintenance compared to our previous '07 Sonata.

[2.0T_Convert]

I said "most", popcorn meister...

I misjudged you Lwize-sama.

[SAV912]

My wife likes the seats in the Fit and I can hardly stand them. They're fine for short trips, but on long hauls I have to pull out my wallet and I still get tired within about 30 minutes of driving.

Our asses look nothing alike though, which is good! We're all shaped differently. (It's not just x and y chromosomes changing that, either.)

I can't sit in my car with my wallet in my pocket for any amount of time. There is no lumbar support to speak of and the cushion is pretty hard and the seat has no height adjustment at all. The bolsters in a Town & Country minivan look at the bolsters in my car and laugh hysterically at how much more muscular the bolsters in the minivan are. I hate them most because they are like sitting in a chair. If they were lower or the pedals were angled further away so you stepped into them rather than on them, I'd probably be able to find a more comfortable position.

I'm not tall either. Only 5'6" and 140 lbs.

Thanks -- I grew up on St. Simons (family is all still there) and went to Georgia Southern (graduated in '02 and '04).

Is that your car in the picture above? If so, what wheels are those? I would like to stay with OEM wheels but am not finding too many 4-lug Toyota wheels. I hate the Bridgestone RE92 tires it came with and am thinking about doing a wheel/tire upgrade when these wear out.

Right now I'm on 16" Rota RBs but those pictured above are Yaris TS rims from Europe. They're 17" and I got rid of them mostly because they are extremely easy to curb. And the ride was pretty harsh on 17s AND Megan Coilovers. Either the 17s or the coils would be tolerable, I'm sure. I will say to avoid the TRD 18s. They might look fantastic but 18s of any style rim are just too big to maintain any sort of sanity while on the freeway, and the sidewalls will be thin enough to blister if you hit a pothole of significant size. A fellow YW member here in Savannah bent two 18s a week apart while they were repaving I-95. A ride to Tennessee and back on a set of 18s had me full of knowledge on what tar mine the asphalt that made up I-24 came from. It was that harsh.

Some great OEM wheels can be found on the MR-S which bolt right up. Also, Honda Fit Sport, NA and NB Miata, and Mini Cooper/Cooper S wheels all fit without modification.

And I don't know where the other two cupholders went -- mine only has five!

There are two up front by the AC vents, one in each door pocket, one at the back of the center console where the handbrake is, and two more in the pockets below the rear speakers. The ones below the rear speakers are just molded in and sometimes people can miss them.

If you're ever out this way again, PM me or something and we can go grab lunch. St. Simon's is only about 35-40 minutes away.

[Brett92]

Thanks -- I grew up on St. Simons (family is all still there) and went to Georgia Southern (graduated in '02 and '04).

Cool, I've never heard you mention that. My wife graduated in 06.


About your mileage, that's pretty good. My wife has beat her EPA highway rating by as much as 4 mpg on her 2010 Camry. I've never hit 40 mpg in 2011 Elantra, but then again I've never done a full highway trip. I remember one time I drove from Augusta to Asheville, and my mpg gauge read 43.4 mpg when arriving, but then once I started hitting the mountains my mileage dropped quick. My gauge is always 2 mph high, so I trust I was getting at least 41 mpg. This was on back roads going 55-60 mph, no AC, NOT using cruise control, but otherwise pretty normal driving -NON-hypermiling.

Toyotas and Hondas seem to hit their mileage numbers more easily than other brands IMO, well except for maybe the Civic Hybrid. I here's there's multiple class action lawsuits against Honda for the mileage numbers. Although, wouldn't the EPA be the one to blame for inaccurate FE numbers (provided the testing was done properly)?

[Corbic]

People are to blame for not being able to reach gas mileage figures, not the cars. I don’t think many people realize how their s#hity driving habits kill their fuel economy. My personal favorites include:

- Jackrabbit starts towards a red light a 100 yards away
- Accelerating to above the speed limit and then breaking when they suddenly realize they are speeding
- Riding the break on the downhill and then relentlessly gassing it on the uphill

It might just be that they don’t have a basic understanding of physics.

Maybe cars need to be designed around peoples driving habits.

[tjl]

I've read, but have no first hand experience, that Toyota have fastideously removed any vestige of fun from Yaris handling so that it feels like a shrunken camry.

I had a Yaris as a rental. While it was not boaty or anything like that, it really let you know that it did not like to drive fast around cloverleaf on-ramps. Overall, it was designed more for comfort than sportiness.

[tjl]

Although, wouldn't the EPA be the one to blame for inaccurate FE numbers (provided the testing was done properly)?

The EPA test cycles are exactly specified and well known to the car companies; it is certainly possible that they can be gamed, especially in cars with automatic transmissions. The acceleration and braking rates were set so that late 1970s cars were capable of them. And weight is in 250 pound increments, so if the car is just light enough to make the upper end of the next lower weight bracket, it gets the full benefit of being "250 pounds lighter" (now you know why some cars don't come with spare tires from the factory).

[Bixmen]

Well, obviously, if you left the seat up -- it's a hatchback, fold the seat down!

We did fold the seat down, but If I recall, the rear seat doesn't fold flat, so we had to squeeze our suitcase in the rear hatch, then fanangle it into place. The suitcase still fit cockeye'd due to the not fold flat seat. we had to take the belt down otherwise, that cuts the room in half, and creates an annoying line in the mirror.

Automatic, correct?

Yeah it was. I know the automatic was really the Achilles's heal of the car. but it was a rental, and unfortunately, the way most of them are probably sold in the US.

And I don't know where the other two cupholders went -- mine only has five!

working from memory here, but 2 in each door, two for the back seat, one in the center console, and 2 pull outs in the dash?

[Kar98]

Tried that once... I hit almost 70 MPG in another hybrid trailing a truck but that was one boring trip.

I've even read over at hypermiler sights that rapid acceleration is more efficient in some cases overall than sloooowlly easing up and missing that green light in the distance

I keep saying that. Keep it in motion, accelerate firmly and shift fast and early. You're still getting great mileage and you're not a nuisance. Although here in rural east Texas they're driving as if they were hyper miling, except they're just slow-witted.

[Dave Zero]

We bought our in 2007 for $10,777 "president's day sale"

Today the car is worth $9,279

My last payment is next month. The car has never broken. Delivers 40 mpg freeway, just under 30 on average around town.

At this point, the clutch feels looser than it did. The sports shoe style fabric on the top of the door cars is getting a bit shiny and worn. All the knobs and wear surfaces are holding up very well. The front bumper's paint is thin and chips.

Hope these prices hold until we trade it in on the Scion FT-86.

We saw a new Yaris the other night and all I have to say is that it is much larger than the old model. Size and price creep has killed off one of the last super-cheap hatches.

[Air-over-water]

nice, but i would go bananas driving 60mph

What is sad about needing to go 60mph is that you would be 15-20 mph under the speed limit, at least around here.

[Dave Zero]

I've read, but have no first hand experience, that Toyota have fastideously removed any vestige of fun from Yaris handling so that it feels like a shrunken camry.

I sat in one of the new ones, but the dealer had no manual transmissions and said he had no manual transmissioned three-doors slated for delivery. That's a shame; I see them around town and think they are a perfectly tidy size without too much engine.

It doesn't feel like a shrunken camry, it feels like a light 90's hatch with really terrible front suspension. That being said, some wider tires help. It's kind of fun to toss around, the tail will rotates a bit too much actually. Not much suspension in the back, feels like it is really just dragging those two wheels around. I like the shifter a lot, it is smooth. The steering is relatively quick and the steeering wheel isn't too big. It's actually not too bad to drive, it's tossable and it has pretty good turn in once we added the wider tires. The seats and seating position are the worst of any car I've owned. That would probably be the next upgrade we would do if we were going to keep it. I've driven Camry's and Malibus and Impalas and all sorts of those cars and this far more engaging, it's a light little city runabout.

If you really want a fun hatch buy a base model mini.