Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    Page 82 of 417 FirstFirst ... 327278798081828384858692132182 ... LastLast
    Results 2,026 to 2,050 of 10411

    Thread: The ONE & ONLY 2012 Politics/Election Thread

    1. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 09:46 AM #2026
      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      Zuk, my sister with a doctorate in English came to the same conclusion as myself. Perhaps you are the one that needs help, or you should refrain from posting convoluted nonsense you can't defend.
      Did she get it from the same institution that gave you a degree in history?

      If you don't understand what you read, you should refrain from pretending you did. When pretending you have understood something, you should refrain from making accusations indefensibility based on that pretense.

      That isn't "See spot run.", but I hope it is sufficiently clear.
      Last edited by zukiphile; 04-12-2012 at 09:56 AM.

    2. Senior Member A.Wilder's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 1st, 2003
      Location
      Raleigh, NC
      Posts
      23,824
      Vehicles
      Ferrari La Ferrari
      04-12-2012 09:56 AM #2027
      Zuk, you're wrong. It's okay, I still think of you the same.
      Quote Originally Posted by koidragon1980 View Post
      If Jesus is your pilot, then irony is your vehicle.

    3. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 10:01 AM #2028
      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      Did she get it from the same institution that gave you a degree in history?

      If you don't understand what you read, you should refrain from pretending you did. When pretending you have understood something, you should refrain from making accusations indefensibility based on that pretense.

      That isn't "See spot run.", but I hope it is sufficiently clear.
      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      Zuk, you're wrong.
      I am wrong that the post was sufficiently clear, that you should not pretend to understand material you do not understand, or that you and your sister received degree from the same institutions?

      Note what I just did. I asked you a question about your statement. I didn't suggest that whichever place handed degrees out to you should refund your tuition, or that you are inbred confederates, or that you omitted something you didn't, or that you wrote something you didn't.

      See how much better that works?
      Last edited by zukiphile; 04-12-2012 at 10:04 AM.

    4. Senior Member A.Wilder's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 1st, 2003
      Location
      Raleigh, NC
      Posts
      23,824
      Vehicles
      Ferrari La Ferrari
      04-12-2012 10:12 AM #2029
      It's funny how mad you get when you get called out on your BS

      Keep up the personal insults, it's making you look super cool, calm, and collected.
      Quote Originally Posted by koidragon1980 View Post
      If Jesus is your pilot, then irony is your vehicle.

    5. Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      14,727
      Vehicles
      2010 Mazda6 GT-I4
      04-12-2012 10:14 AM #2030
      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      Really? My experience doesn't indicate that. Popular music, films and video games are the low hanging fruit of the culture war because they have few defenders old enough to drive.



      I think there is a pretty good conservative argument in favor of some kind of SSM as a stabilising influence. The problem is that if the social construct for marriage rests on a view of duties beyond personal gratification and validation and toward an array of duties to make a family a more stabile atmosphere for children, the rationale becomes more difficult to extend.
      Oh they're absolutely low hanging fruit. I believe that's my point, that they're conveniently attacked and blamed for the hyperbolic 'downfall of western civilization', when really they're either red herrings or symptoms of another underlying factor.

      Another scapegoat I didn't emphasize was pornography. It has been around for millennia. Granted, it seems more accessible now with the internet, teens sending naked photos to each other, and the general visibility of it all in the information age. But, realistically, is easier access to pornography the cause of rising divorce rates and the decline of the family unit?

    6. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 10:14 AM #2031
      No answer then?

      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      It's funny how mad you get when you get called out on your BS
      #2015 isn't a cogent question because it assumes I asserted something I haven't.

      I make an offer to you: read and understand something, ask a cogent question, and get an answer.
      Last edited by zukiphile; 04-12-2012 at 10:17 AM.

    7. Senior Member A.Wilder's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 1st, 2003
      Location
      Raleigh, NC
      Posts
      23,824
      Vehicles
      Ferrari La Ferrari
      04-12-2012 10:18 AM #2032
      U mad

      I wasn't the only one who read and came to the same conclusion. Why the contempt and personal attacks against me and my sister? Your becoming a common e-thug-lawyer
      Quote Originally Posted by koidragon1980 View Post
      If Jesus is your pilot, then irony is your vehicle.

    8. Member
      Join Date
      May 7th, 2002
      Posts
      5,170
      Vehicles
      01 golf gls 1.8T
      04-12-2012 10:18 AM #2033
      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      1. I omitted nothing from your quote, and...
      of course, he's referring to the omitted section of your quote. but you knew that already.

      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      No, I didn't.
      pants on fire!

      do you wake up every day of your life with the purpose of being a champion obfuscator on an internet board? it's a bit tired, no? seems little more than a sorry form of mental masturbation for which you apparently never reach that happy ending. i suppose when your personal ideology mirrors the type of hypocrisy that spews from frothy's mouth it makes sense to mask your true thoughts with semantical confusion & little white lies, and no one does it better than you.

      of course according to you, sanctorum isn't a pious hypocrite who supports govt intrusion into the private lives of americans, or someone who wants to suppress womens's rights while subverting the first amendment mandate of church-state separation, he's just misunderstood.

    9. Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      14,727
      Vehicles
      2010 Mazda6 GT-I4
      04-12-2012 10:22 AM #2034
      Reading the rest of the thread since then, I should add that there is cogency to what Zuki wrote.

      If marriage is considered to have a stabilizing familial influence, there is a corresponding argument in favor of same sex marriage. That said, it hinges on there being a social expectation for standards of conduct in marriage: fidelity, honesty, etc. In an era where that presumption can be unrealistic even for heterosexual married couples due to high rates of promiscuity and divorce, however, there's no case for marriage as a stabilizing factor for heterosexuals in order to extend to SSM.

    10. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 10:31 AM #2035
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      Oh they're absolutely low hanging fruit. I believe that's my point, that they're conveniently attacked and blamed for the hyperbolic 'downfall of western civilization', when really they're either red herrings or symptoms of another underlying factor.
      I think the underlined is the primarily correct observation, though the ubiquity of the synptom can be a cause of acceptance. If you've ever seen the Disney channel, it is a vapid landscape with weird bits of vulgarity tossed in. I don't think Disney is a primary cause of degeneration of the culture, even as it strips any pedagogic value from folk stories immerses them in glitter, and wraps them in plastic for children and their inattentive parents, but presence of this sparkling refuse doesn't help either.

      Prison fashion doesn't cause social degradation, but it can signal an acceptance or admiration for behaviours that aren't productive, useful or even benign.

      That was essentially the old critique from National Review leveled against Heffner and Playboy. It wasn't the pictures that were problemmatic, but the expressed ethic that a fellow's sole purpose was to enjoy himself.

      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      Another scapegoat I didn't emphasize was pornography. It has been around for millennia. Granted, it seems more accessible now with the internet, teens sending naked photos to each other, and the general visibility of it all in the information age. But, realistically, is easier access to pornography the cause of rising divorce rates and the decline of the family unit?
      I doubt it. I would say that they are both symptoms with the ubiquity of pornography being the more trivial. To circle back to Santorum's critique, the more serious problem is a view of marriage primarily as a vehicle for serving one's own hedonic and trivial emotional needs, so that when things become difficult a couple are more likely to view the difficulty as a catastrophic failure rather than an obstacle to be overcome. Of course, if many of your friends are 30 and already divorced, that symptom can become a contributing cause as well.

    11. Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      14,727
      Vehicles
      2010 Mazda6 GT-I4
      04-12-2012 10:59 AM #2036
      Quote Originally Posted by zukiphile View Post
      I think the underlined is the primarily correct observation, though the ubiquity of the synptom can be a cause of acceptance. If you've ever seen the Disney channel, it is a vapid landscape with weird bits of vulgarity tossed in. I don't think Disney is a primary cause of degeneration of the culture, even as it strips any pedagogic value from folk stories immerses them in glitter, and wraps them in plastic for children and their inattentive parents, but presence of this sparkling refuse doesn't help either.

      Prison fashion doesn't cause social degradation, but it can signal an acceptance or admiration for behaviours that aren't productive, useful or even benign.

      That was essentially the old critique from National Review leveled against Heffner and Playboy. It wasn't the pictures that were problemmatic, but the expressed ethic that a fellow's sole purpose was to enjoy himself.



      I doubt it. I would say that they are both symptoms with the ubiquity of pornography being the more trivial. To circle back to Santorum's critique, the more serious problem is a view of marriage primarily as a vehicle for serving one's own hedonic and trivial emotional needs, so that when things become difficult a couple are more likely to view the difficulty as a catastrophic failure rather than an obstacle to be overcome. Of course, if many of your friends are 30 and already divorced, that symptom can become a contributing cause as well.
      I can definitely agree with the above.

      I think, on the one hand, despite seeing the last 5 weddings I've been to (other than my own) end in divorce already, I believe when you make that commitment, it shouldn't be a fleeting, temporary thing. Marriage 'should' be the firm, for-life commitment that the vows indicate. On the other hand, I do hate to see people continuing to live in misery simply because they made a mistake in marrying each other when they were ultimately incompatible.

      This causes me to question whether there should be the legal and economic benefits that are associated with marriage. In a sense, the government should be hands-off the issue altogether, ascribing some form of status that, rather than maintaining distinctions between common-law and formal marriage, gives parties in either situation the same legal and economic privileges and obligations. But then, if things were changed to that point, why encourage and incentivize that primarily social arrangement at all? Ultimately the freedom of conscience rests with the individual whether or not to formally marry in accordance with their religion, and whether or not to maintain that commitment, so incentivizing it through next-of-kin rights, married-filing-jointly benefits, and so on, distorts the individual's choice.

    12. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 11:23 AM #2037
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      I think, on the one hand, despite seeing the last 5 weddings I've been to (other than my own) end in divorce already, I believe when you make that commitment, it shouldn't be a fleeting, temporary thing. Marriage 'should' be the firm, for-life commitment that the vows indicate. On the other hand, I do hate to see people continuing to live in misery simply because they made a mistake in marrying each other when they were ultimately incompatible.
      I do a small amount of divorce work, which I very much dislike, when an existing client will not take "No, you should go see a specialist" for an answer.

      I don't know how many people are genuinely incompatible. If one is a miserable PITA, he will be a miserable PITA married, and whoever he is married to will not change that. Often a fellow is drawn to the pleasant distraction of a girlfriend, divorces his wife so he can marry his pleasant distraction, and turns his former girlfriend current wife into a burden from which he needs....pleasant distraction.

      I represented a girl, then in her mid 30s, who apparently lost a 100 pounds and had her eyes fixed. She was pretty and fit, energetic and smart. Her husband couldn't tolerate the improvements, I suspect from sort of insecurity, and told her they were done.

      People leave trails of personal wreckage because they have little self-insight and unrealistic ideas of what marriage is. However, I rarely meet people who just aren't happy to be around one another.

      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      This causes me to question whether there should be the legal and economic benefits that are associated with marriage. In a sense, the government should be hands-off the issue altogether, ascribing some form of status that, rather than maintaining distinctions between common-law and formal marriage, gives parties in either situation the same legal and economic privileges and obligations. But then, if things were changed to that point, why encourage and incentivize that primarily social arrangement at all? Ultimately the freedom of conscience rests with the individual whether or not to formally marry in accordance with their religion, and whether or not to maintain that commitment, so incentivizing it through next-of-kin rights, married-filing-jointly benefits, and so on, distorts the individual's choice.
      I think that's the point. There is the aristotelian idea that we can teach by re-enforcing correct behavior until it is internalised. A parent doesn't explain to a child the advantage of eating with silverware, but commands it until it becomes habit.

      Using child support as an example again, the state doesn't explain in its laws why we are better off if men suppor thier children, but it commands it and most men have an understanding that having a child will involve duties.

      Guys complain about the injustice of community property, but it does have the effect of forcing a reflective person to consider what he is doing before marrying.

      EDIT - Generally, when people discuss the "definition of marriage", they are discussing who can marry, but the laws noted above have the effect of defining the substance of marriage which is at least as important a part of the definition.
      Last edited by zukiphile; 04-12-2012 at 03:31 PM.

    13. Member
      Join Date
      Feb 5th, 2002
      Location
      Ohio
      Posts
      3,387
      Vehicles
      Wagon Queen Family Truckster (not the blue sport wagon)
      04-12-2012 11:30 AM #2038
      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      I wasn't the only one who read and came to the same conclusion. Why the contempt and personal attacks against me and my sister?
      I know, right?
      Since you've been nothing but cordial yourself.

      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      Zuk, my sister with a doctorate in English came to the same conclusion as myself. Perhaps you are the one that needs help, or you should refrain from posting convoluted nonsense you can't defend.
      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      I'm pretty sure lower taxes + higher government spending is the first play in traditional economics when faced with a tanking economy, at least iirc from one of my economics classes years ago. Zuk just likes to be a conservatroll, all hot air, little to no substance, criticizes other posters for short concise posts, whines about liberal posts, and worst of all is a total hypocrite about all of it.
      Quote Originally Posted by GruuvenNorth View Post
      ...and that's how the butthurt get their whiney ways.

    14. Banned zukiphile's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 28th, 2000
      Posts
      5,355
      04-12-2012 11:59 AM #2039
      That someone would construe a question about whether his sister had gotten a degree from the same institution he attended as "an attack" speaks to the esteem in which he holds his own education.

      We so rarely experience that kind of unanimity here.

    15. Senior Member A.Wilder's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 1st, 2003
      Location
      Raleigh, NC
      Posts
      23,824
      Vehicles
      Ferrari La Ferrari
      04-12-2012 06:35 PM #2040
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.FOH!! View Post
      I know, right?
      Since you've been nothing but cordial yourself.





      And he is a total hypocrite
      Quote Originally Posted by koidragon1980 View Post
      If Jesus is your pilot, then irony is your vehicle.

    16. Banned dubinsincuwereindiapers's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jan 16th, 2008
      Location
      InYourMom
      Posts
      13,394
      Vehicles
      Bugatti Veyron
      04-12-2012 08:19 PM #2041
      Quote Originally Posted by A.Wilder View Post
      And he is a total hypocrite
      Nice comeback

    17. Member pentaxshooter's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 3rd, 2009
      Location
      Charlotte, NC
      Posts
      3,324
      Vehicles
      2004.5 GLI
      04-12-2012 10:14 PM #2042
      This thread sucks. Had some fun today.





      Add me on FB and follow me on Instagram! | #TPG | #FLOSSfilthy | #V2LAB |

    18. Banned dubinsincuwereindiapers's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jan 16th, 2008
      Location
      InYourMom
      Posts
      13,394
      Vehicles
      Bugatti Veyron
      04-12-2012 10:18 PM #2043
      Quote Originally Posted by pentaxshooter View Post
      This thread sucks. Had some fun today.







      Quote Originally Posted by Randall173 View Post
      Good luck to the Mods on actually being able to keep control of this thread

      That being said I will be the first one to go on record and predict that Obama will not win the 2012 Election....
      God I hope you're right

    19. Senior Member VarianceVQ's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 26th, 2005
      Location
      Fancy, Connecticut
      Posts
      20,480
      Vehicles
      2010 Toyota Prius V, 1996 Nissan Pathfinder LE 4x4
      04-12-2012 10:30 PM #2044
      Santorum dropping out still doesn't mean Paul is going to come close to winning.

      Romney is all but confirmed to be the GOP nom. All you did was waste paint.
      Everybody's dying, bitch; let's get you some fruit.

    20. Member pentaxshooter's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 3rd, 2009
      Location
      Charlotte, NC
      Posts
      3,324
      Vehicles
      2004.5 GLI
      04-12-2012 10:38 PM #2045
      Quote Originally Posted by VarianceVQ View Post
      Santorum dropping out still doesn't mean Paul is going to come close to winning.

      Romney is all but confirmed to be the GOP nom. All you did was waste paint.
      It's not all about winning.
      Add me on FB and follow me on Instagram! | #TPG | #FLOSSfilthy | #V2LAB |

    21. Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      14,727
      Vehicles
      2010 Mazda6 GT-I4
      04-12-2012 10:57 PM #2046
      The funny thing is, I think candidate Obama was nearly as idealistically anti-war as Ron Paul is. Maybe he didn't share the urgency of closing Air Bases and Posts on foreign soil outside of active theaters, but he certainly opposed initial involvement in Iraq or any future, similar, effectively-unilateral wars.

      Obama is certainly a pragmatist, but I also think the responsibility of the mantle of Commander in Chief lends itself to encouraging discretion with regards to one's ideals of a smaller military.

      Regardless, I think if meaningful reduction in military spending and war involvement is a top issue for you, it's far more likely to get implemented under an Obama White House and Democratic Congress than under the only likely alternative, a Romney White House and Boehner/McConnell Congress.

    22. Member pentaxshooter's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 3rd, 2009
      Location
      Charlotte, NC
      Posts
      3,324
      Vehicles
      2004.5 GLI
      04-12-2012 11:09 PM #2047
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      The funny thing is, I think candidate Obama was nearly as idealistically anti-war as Ron Paul is. Maybe he didn't share the urgency of closing Air Bases and Posts on foreign soil outside of active theaters, but he certainly opposed initial involvement in Iraq or any future, similar, effectively-unilateral wars.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_internationalism
      Regardless, I think if meaningful reduction in military spending and war involvement is a top issue for you, it's far more likely to get implemented under an Obama White House and Democratic Congress than under the only likely alternative, a Romney White House and Boehner/McConnell Congress.
      It's just as unlikely with both. They both enjoy killing brown people.
      Add me on FB and follow me on Instagram! | #TPG | #FLOSSfilthy | #V2LAB |

    23. Senior Member VarianceVQ's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 26th, 2005
      Location
      Fancy, Connecticut
      Posts
      20,480
      Vehicles
      2010 Toyota Prius V, 1996 Nissan Pathfinder LE 4x4
      04-12-2012 11:16 PM #2048
      Quote Originally Posted by pentaxshooter View Post
      It's just as unlikely with both. They both enjoy killing brown people.
      The face of the RPR, everyone.
      Everybody's dying, bitch; let's get you some fruit.

    24. Member pentaxshooter's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 3rd, 2009
      Location
      Charlotte, NC
      Posts
      3,324
      Vehicles
      2004.5 GLI
      04-12-2012 11:17 PM #2049
      Quote Originally Posted by VarianceVQ View Post
      The face of the RPR, everyone.
      *non-american brown people.
      Add me on FB and follow me on Instagram! | #TPG | #FLOSSfilthy | #V2LAB |

    25. Banned Fritz27's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 8th, 2003
      Location
      Brickell
      Posts
      26,435
      Vehicles
      1986 Legs and/or 2014 Blue Non-MANual European Turbo Hatch
      04-12-2012 11:18 PM #2050
      Bin Laden was just a free market actor. He wasn't that bad of a guy, he didn't use the government, he did it all via his own funds. Individuals in the free market get results. Can you imagine the government bloat to pull off 9/11 or the USS Cole?

    Page 82 of 417 FirstFirst ... 327278798081828384858692132182 ... LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •