Mobil 1 0w-40 or 5w-40

[gmikel]

It seems like a "dipstick" is telling you what oil to use!

He's a triple x rated ape.....he must be sexy!

just having fun he's been so many other things (all banned) in the past, he's just someone to annoy. good earl is good earl

[Apexxx]

[gmikel]

did they ever finish second in one of there infomercials? take everything from them with a grain of salt. after all aren't they the ones who claimed to have lifetime oil a while back, just change the filter they said.

[Apexxx]

I guess ASTM D-5800 and ASTM D-97 have no meaning to you.



http://www.astm.org/Standards/D5800.htm
Standard Test Method for Evaporation Loss of Lubricating Oils by the Noack Method

http://www.astm.org/Standards/D97.htm
Standard Test Method for Pour Point of Petroleum Products

The AMSoil chart is based on PUBLISHED specs from the respective companies.

Talk about flapping your jaw without the least bit of a clue about the subject!

Simply pathetic.

[gmikel]

I guess ASTM D-5800 and ASTM D-97 have no meaning to you.



http://www.astm.org/Standards/D5800.htm
Standard Test Method for Evaporation Loss of Lubricating Oils by the Noack Method

http://www.astm.org/Standards/D97.htm
Standard Test Method for Pour Point of Petroleum Products

The AMSoil chart is based on PUBLISHED specs from the respective companies.

Talk about flapping your jaw without the least bit of a clue about the subject!

Simply pathetic.

i stand by what i said. i simply don't cosider an amsoil chart nor you to be conclusive.

[Apexxx]

Pathetic troll, to be exact.

[gmikel]

Pathetic troll, to be exact.

nothing is as complicated as you'd like. amsoil charts are rubish if for no other reason than the source, sorry.

[meboice]

In fairly basic terms, why is a short oil change interval a bad idea? I understand that a component of a given oil might be more volatile when new...but at some level wouldn't that also indicate that the oil isn't all that great to begin with.

[Apexxx]

A good reason would be the longevity of the friction modifiers. They wear out.

Miles alone isn't a good metric. Typical trip length and climate could be cause for early drains. Some conditions, the engine never gets fully warmed up, disallowing the self-cleaning process that comes with extended drives.

[BsickPassat]

so... why aren't you using Amsoil 10w30 since it has superior NOACK Volatility (as well as Pour Point).

[Apexxx]

I'm using SynPower.

[meboice]

I've been using mobil 1 5W40 TDT based on two UOAs I paid for and a couple dozen that I read used in the same motor.

I used Redline a few times, but it's much harder to find. The car in question here is my wife's 2008 2.0 Passat. She drives about 3 miles to work every day...so the car never really escapes the warm-up cycle in winter. I on the other hand take delivery of a new TDi Golf in about two hours

[Apexxx]

That's the ideal situation to start w/a thinner oil. 30 weight is just a hair thinner at operating temp, but LOTS thinner at cold start.



1/2 as thick as M1 5w-40 in cold. M1 0w-40 is about the same as German Syntec 0w-30.

Chugging around on cool/warm oil, 5w-40 is WAY thick.



Take the 50-55C range, 5w-30 is 45 cSt, 5w-40 is twice as thick, 80+cSt. That's a serious drag on an engine which need only 9 to 10 cSt or less for proper lube at operating temp.

Graph your own oils...
http://www.widman.biz/English/Calculators/Graph.html

[meboice]

I thought I replied...but...so 5W40 TDT is too thick? I can see that in winter but why wouldn't the extra thickness be good for lubrication during hot summer months? I am also keenly aware that a direct injection motor can dilute oil fairly quickly...here I refer to the 2.0 gas motor.

[gmikel]

eperating temperature is pretty constant at 195 f year round as long as the cooling system workd as intended. vw's have an oil to water heat exchanger that is at operating temp year round. so unless you believe the oil in the pan is cooled significantly by outside air, the oil temp is fairly constant by season. if you still have the sound deadner on your car the air going by the oilpan passed throught the radiator first anyway. imo it's not a big issue

[gmikel]

that's what vw calls for. the 1.8t has forged pistons that have a relatively wide clearance and a poor rod/stroke ratio, the 5w-40 does make for a quieter engine because of those factors. you won't hurt it with a good 5w-30. between my 3 vw's i've got close to 400k miles, iv'e used total, fuchs, valvoline and mobile 502 oils in 0w/5w-40 and fuchs in 5w-30, don't see any change in consumption, cold start or gas mileage between them. use what works for you.

[Apexxx]

Yep. 5w-40 in summer and a lighter oil in winter, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 0w-30 as I mentioned. Most cars I service run 10w-30 in summer, 5w-40 is just to make the spec guys happy. Seriously, if you have consumption or elevated oil temps or serious mods, 5w-40 is the way to go, except in the circumstances I mentioned.

Short trips, arctic cold...a thin oil is a big plus. for more than one or two reasons. Just put a bottle of 5w-40 in the freezer next to 5w-30 and see how thick they get.

fwiw, 0w-30 was factory-fill in my new 2002 1.8t...

[gmikel]

Yep. 5w-40 in summer and a lighter oil, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 0w-30 as I mentioned.

Short trips, arctic cold...a thin oil is a big plus. Just put a bottle of 5w-40 in the freezer next to 5w-30 and see how thick they get.

fwiw, 0w-30 was factory-fill in my new 2002 1.8t...

my 02' gls 1.8t jetta called for 5w-40 and said 5w-30 was only to be used to top off or when 5w-40 was not available. guess we're on different planets. my 03 passat 1.8 says the same thing.

[Apexxx]

I'm on the planet where I don't need a manual to explain the obvious.

The manual wording is tied to CAFE standards, VoA's inclusive service scheme, the desire to extend intervals, apparent consumption rate-customer issues-damaged engines from low oil-warranty claims.

Sure, for 10k changes, a 5w-40 is more ideal where fuel dilution is an issue, also where customers drive w/o checking the oil for long periods...I already said I agree with the recommendation. I'm just showing how its not obligatory to run 5w-40...at all.


This is a recent visc chart from a modern European Porsche manual. In USA the mfg MUST specify in the manual the exact same oil that was used in the CAFE test. It'd be easy for VW to make the same recommendation as I did, 5w-30 in cold and 5w-40 in hot. They just can't or won't.

[BsickPassat]

I'm on the planet where I don't need a manual to explain the obvious.

The manual wording is tied to CAFE standards, VoA's inclusive service scheme, the desire to extend intervals, apparent consumption rate-customer issues-damaged engines from low oil-warranty claims.

Sure, for 10k changes, a 5w-40 is more ideal where fuel dilution is an issue, also where customers drive w/o checking the oil for long periods...I already said I agree with the recommendation. I'm just showing how its not obligatory to run 5w-40...at all.


This is a recent visc chart from a modern European Porsche manual. In USA the mfg MUST specify in the manual the exact same oil that was used in the CAFE test. It'd be easy for VW to make the same recommendation as I did, 5w-30 in cold and 5w-40 in hot. They just can't or won't.

The manual wording was based on the older VW502.00 standard... back to around the Euro 2 or Euro 3 emissions standards in Europe.

As the Euro emissions standards evolve, so do the oil specs.

BTW... my 02 Golf manual says the same thing as gmikel about oil multi-viscosities.

[meboice]

Sorry to ask so many questions...so M1 5W40 TDT should be fine in summer and perhaps M1 0W40 in winter?

[BsickPassat]

Sorry to ask so many questions...so M1 5W40 TDT should be fine in summer and perhaps M1 0W40 in winter?

TDT is fine year-round

likewise Shell Rotella T6 (which is what I use)

[gmikel]

The manual wording was based on the older VW502.00 standard... back to around the Euro 2 or Euro 3 emissions standards in Europe.

As the Euro emissions standards evolve, so do the oil specs.

BTW... my 02 Golf manual says the same thing as gmikel about oil multi-viscosities.

[gmikel]

TDT is fine year-round

likewise Shell Rotella T6 (which is what I use)

just used the rotella t6 on your recommendation.

[meboice]

Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?

[gmikel]

Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?

and reasonable

[BsickPassat]

Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?

yes... at wal-mart

[meboice]

Thanks!

...not that I am able to read a UOA fluently - I have to re-learn a lot of oil jargon every time I look at one, but is Rotella T6 a good detergent oil as well? M1 seems to be very good in this regard...but is getting very pricey...close to Redline

[Apexxx]

(5w-40) TDT is fine year-round

Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

Everyone's an expert.

[BsickPassat]

Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

Everyone's an expert.

Just keep believing in your own Kool Aid.

[gmikel]

Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

Everyone's an expert.

earlier in this thread you were pushing 10w-xx oils, now it's 0w-xx. you just like to think you're smarter than the rest. NOT!!!

[BsickPassat]

earlier in this thread you were pushing 10w-xx oils, now it's 0w-xx. you just like to think you're smarter than the rest. NOT!!!

...and Amsoil for its superior NOACK Volatility...

and...he's from the Scranton, PA area.... which rarely gets that cold in the winter time.... that he claims... and his excel chart with no proof, because it's more than likely selectively plagarized from another source...

[Apexxx]

Solid posting there guys!

Anyone who came away from reading my posts thinking I suggested 10w- oils for winter truly is a bonehead. At least it's still thinner than 5w-40.

[gmikel]

you weren't even born in 1961 sonny. i see that you service cars from your post. my guess was correct, you must be the night tech a walmart.

[Apexxx]

Haha, we're not open overnight.

Can't you get anything right?