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    Thread: Mobil 1 0w-40 or 5w-40

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      04-23-2012 09:20 AM #51
      that's what vw calls for. the 1.8t has forged pistons that have a relatively wide clearance and a poor rod/stroke ratio, the 5w-40 does make for a quieter engine because of those factors. you won't hurt it with a good 5w-30. between my 3 vw's i've got close to 400k miles, iv'e used total, fuchs, valvoline and mobile 502 oils in 0w/5w-40 and fuchs in 5w-30, don't see any change in consumption, cold start or gas mileage between them. use what works for you.

    2. 04-23-2012 01:23 PM #52
      Yep. 5w-40 in summer and a lighter oil in winter, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 0w-30 as I mentioned. Most cars I service run 10w-30 in summer, 5w-40 is just to make the spec guys happy. Seriously, if you have consumption or elevated oil temps or serious mods, 5w-40 is the way to go, except in the circumstances I mentioned.

      Short trips, arctic cold...a thin oil is a big plus. for more than one or two reasons. Just put a bottle of 5w-40 in the freezer next to 5w-30 and see how thick they get.

      fwiw, 0w-30 was factory-fill in my new 2002 1.8t...

      Last edited by Apexxx; 04-23-2012 at 02:05 PM.

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      04-23-2012 01:55 PM #53
      Quote Originally Posted by Apexxx View Post
      Yep. 5w-40 in summer and a lighter oil, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 0w-30 as I mentioned.

      Short trips, arctic cold...a thin oil is a big plus. Just put a bottle of 5w-40 in the freezer next to 5w-30 and see how thick they get.

      fwiw, 0w-30 was factory-fill in my new 2002 1.8t...

      my 02' gls 1.8t jetta called for 5w-40 and said 5w-30 was only to be used to top off or when 5w-40 was not available. guess we're on different planets. my 03 passat 1.8 says the same thing.

    4. 04-23-2012 02:17 PM #54
      I'm on the planet where I don't need a manual to explain the obvious.

      The manual wording is tied to CAFE standards, VoA's inclusive service scheme, the desire to extend intervals, apparent consumption rate-customer issues-damaged engines from low oil-warranty claims.

      Sure, for 10k changes, a 5w-40 is more ideal where fuel dilution is an issue, also where customers drive w/o checking the oil for long periods...I already said I agree with the recommendation. I'm just showing how its not obligatory to run 5w-40...at all.


      This is a recent visc chart from a modern European Porsche manual. In USA the mfg MUST specify in the manual the exact same oil that was used in the CAFE test. It'd be easy for VW to make the same recommendation as I did, 5w-30 in cold and 5w-40 in hot. They just can't or won't.


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      04-23-2012 02:54 PM #55
      Quote Originally Posted by Apexxx View Post
      I'm on the planet where I don't need a manual to explain the obvious.

      The manual wording is tied to CAFE standards, VoA's inclusive service scheme, the desire to extend intervals, apparent consumption rate-customer issues-damaged engines from low oil-warranty claims.

      Sure, for 10k changes, a 5w-40 is more ideal where fuel dilution is an issue, also where customers drive w/o checking the oil for long periods...I already said I agree with the recommendation. I'm just showing how its not obligatory to run 5w-40...at all.


      This is a recent visc chart from a modern European Porsche manual. In USA the mfg MUST specify in the manual the exact same oil that was used in the CAFE test. It'd be easy for VW to make the same recommendation as I did, 5w-30 in cold and 5w-40 in hot. They just can't or won't.

      The manual wording was based on the older VW502.00 standard... back to around the Euro 2 or Euro 3 emissions standards in Europe.

      As the Euro emissions standards evolve, so do the oil specs.

      BTW... my 02 Golf manual says the same thing as gmikel about oil multi-viscosities.
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      04-23-2012 03:34 PM #56
      Sorry to ask so many questions...so M1 5W40 TDT should be fine in summer and perhaps M1 0W40 in winter?

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      04-23-2012 03:37 PM #57
      Quote Originally Posted by meboice View Post
      Sorry to ask so many questions...so M1 5W40 TDT should be fine in summer and perhaps M1 0W40 in winter?
      TDT is fine year-round

      likewise Shell Rotella T6 (which is what I use)
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      04-23-2012 03:45 PM #58
      Quote Originally Posted by BsickPassat View Post
      The manual wording was based on the older VW502.00 standard... back to around the Euro 2 or Euro 3 emissions standards in Europe.

      As the Euro emissions standards evolve, so do the oil specs.

      BTW... my 02 Golf manual says the same thing as gmikel about oil multi-viscosities.

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      04-23-2012 03:47 PM #59
      Quote Originally Posted by BsickPassat View Post
      TDT is fine year-round

      likewise Shell Rotella T6 (which is what I use)
      just used the rotella t6 on your recommendation.

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      04-23-2012 05:16 PM #60
      Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?

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      04-23-2012 05:36 PM #61
      Quote Originally Posted by meboice View Post
      Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?
      and reasonable

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      04-23-2012 10:50 PM #62
      Quote Originally Posted by meboice View Post
      Is Shell Rotella T6 easy to find?
      yes... at wal-mart
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      04-24-2012 08:26 AM #63
      Thanks!

      ...not that I am able to read a UOA fluently - I have to re-learn a lot of oil jargon every time I look at one, but is Rotella T6 a good detergent oil as well? M1 seems to be very good in this regard...but is getting very pricey...close to Redline
      Last edited by meboice; 04-24-2012 at 08:29 AM.

    14. 04-24-2012 06:05 PM #64
      Quote Originally Posted by BsickPassat View Post
      (5w-40) TDT is fine year-round
      Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

      It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

      Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

      TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

      It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

      Everyone's an expert.

      Last edited by Apexxx; 04-24-2012 at 06:16 PM.

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      04-24-2012 08:01 PM #65
      Quote Originally Posted by Apexxx View Post
      Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

      It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

      Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

      TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

      It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

      Everyone's an expert.


      Just keep believing in your own Kool Aid.
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      04-24-2012 08:10 PM #66
      Quote Originally Posted by Apexxx View Post
      Not really, that's why 0w- oils were invented. It may be partly the reason all the new VW spec oils are 5w-30. MPG is also a factor.

      It's gets to -10f here in winter, -23c. At that temp TDT is about 12,000cSt, Edge 5w-30 is more like 3000cSt.

      Tell that to your valvetrain and turbo oiling systems, how 12,000cSt is a smart choice when the engine needs only 10cSt running viscosity. Mega-thick oil also does wonders for your MPG during the first 10 miles of warm-up.

      TDT and Rotella are not highly friction-modified either, goodbye highway mpg.

      It's like sucking a milkshake thru a straw.

      Everyone's an expert.

      earlier in this thread you were pushing 10w-xx oils, now it's 0w-xx. you just like to think you're smarter than the rest. NOT!!!

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      04-24-2012 08:22 PM #67
      Quote Originally Posted by gmikel View Post
      earlier in this thread you were pushing 10w-xx oils, now it's 0w-xx. you just like to think you're smarter than the rest. NOT!!!
      ...and Amsoil for its superior NOACK Volatility...

      and...he's from the Scranton, PA area.... which rarely gets that cold in the winter time.... that he claims... and his excel chart with no proof, because it's more than likely selectively plagarized from another source...
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    18. 04-24-2012 09:29 PM #68
      Solid posting there guys!

      Anyone who came away from reading my posts thinking I suggested 10w- oils for winter truly is a bonehead. At least it's still thinner than 5w-40.

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      04-25-2012 06:29 AM #69
      you weren't even born in 1961 sonny. i see that you service cars from your post. my guess was correct, you must be the night tech a walmart.

    20. 04-25-2012 08:19 AM #70
      Haha, we're not open overnight.

      Can't you get anything right?

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      04-25-2012 12:15 PM #71
      ...a 10W40 is heavier than a 5W40? Although my question is general, I cannot help but think that the thickness of one similar grade oil isn't necessarily the same as another...?

    22. 04-25-2012 12:38 PM #72
      Quote Originally Posted by Broke Status View Post
      Best oil I have seen for the 2.0t that had little oil consumptions and came out clean every 5000 KM was Lubro Moly... http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volks.../Engine/513/12 FOR FSI and http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volks.../Engine/513/13 FOR TSI take your pick by far one of the best oils out there and test proven in extreme hot and cold weather to have little oil consumption at my shop.
      I second LM, but any 502 oil will work. You can get it at NAPA here in Michigan, but it goes by the name Liqui-Moly. But I caution that there are several types of LM, but only one is fully synthetic. They also changed the fully synthetic to 0w-40 (from 5w-40). When I first purchased my 08 WE, I used M1 0w-40. I found I was using about 1/2 quart per 5000 miles. LM cut that down to about 1/4 quart per 5000 miles.

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      04-25-2012 02:09 PM #73
      Quote Originally Posted by Apexxx View Post
      Haha, we're not open overnight.

      Can't you get anything right?
      so you work 3 to 11 so what

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      04-25-2012 03:56 PM #74
      I've been using M1 5W40 TDT for 5 years and I change the oil approximately every 3,000 miles. I've never had to top off the oil...Though I find that this car is rare in this regard. ...but, 3,000 miles doesn't really give the oil a chance to burn-off. We were very careful about engine break-in too.

      Quote Originally Posted by cmosentine View Post
      I second LM, but any 502 oil will work. You can get it at NAPA here in Michigan, but it goes by the name Liqui-Moly. But I caution that there are several types of LM, but only one is fully synthetic. They also changed the fully synthetic to 0w-40 (from 5w-40). When I first purchased my 08 WE, I used M1 0w-40. I found I was using about 1/2 quart per 5000 miles. LM cut that down to about 1/4 quart per 5000 miles.

    25. 04-26-2012 02:06 PM #75
      Quote Originally Posted by meboice View Post
      ...a 10W40 is heavier than a 5W40? Although my question is general, I cannot help but think that the thickness of one similar grade oil isn't necessarily the same as another...?
      Depends on the temp. At operating temp they are the same. This temp is where the visc is measured for the labeled grade, in this case a 40 weight, the visc at +100c is a range from 12.5cSt to near 15cSt. The W-rating is simply a cold cranking test at progressively colder temps (-20f, -25f, etc) and is separately determined.

      http://www.widman.biz/English/Calculators/Graph.html

      A 5w-40 is thinner at all temps below +100c than a 10w-40 or 15w-40. That doesn't mean a 5w-40 is thinner than a 10w-30 though. Every visc and every product needs to be analyzed specifically to compare their viscs.



      As you can see, 5w-40 isn't drastically better than a 10w-40 in cold, esp when compared to a 5w-30.

      Last edited by Apexxx; 04-26-2012 at 02:12 PM.

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