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    Thread: Obama's proposed budget calls for upping plug-in vehicle tax credit to $10,000

    1. Member lojasmo's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:01 AM #76
      Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Reagan View Post
      Yep. Be damned how much electricity is wasted charging these glorified RC cars. And of course nuclear power is out of the question
      And yet the first approval for a new nuclear power plant in what...40 years just went through. Under the OBAMA admin, no less.

      Hoocoodanode?

    2. Member bpodlesnik's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:06 AM #77
      What happens when you get stuck in traffic for a couple hours on your 40 mile commute?

    3. Member 200HP4dr's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:10 AM #78
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      What happens when you get stuck in traffic for a couple hours on your 40 mile commute?
      Well, if you're truly stuck, meaning sitting still, you roll down your windows. Just like you'd do in a gas powered car and shut it off.

      Chris
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    4. Member bpodlesnik's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:23 AM #79
      Quote Originally Posted by lojasmo View Post
      And yet the first approval for a new nuclear power plant in what...40 years just went through. Under the OBAMA admin, no less.

      Hoocoodanode?
      Yeah but the 2147 mile long Keystone Pipeline, which would have created thousands of jobs, and would have enabled natural gas, and oil being supplied right here in the US, which would significantly reduce our dependancy on foreign oil, he did not approve of.

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      02-16-2012 08:25 AM #80
      I think people are making this into what they want so they can make it political, but in reality just making themselves look like idiots.

      The current $7500 credit doesn't come out of your pocket ever. If I buy an EV and I only pay 6K a year in taxes I can only get 6K in credit, you don't pay that other 1500 bucks so you didn't put a dime into it.

      I hope anyone who has a problem with this has 0 with holdings on their W4 and doesn't claim any deductions on their taxes like mortgage interest or you are just doing the same thing an EV buyer does and that is lower what they pay.

    6. Member bpodlesnik's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:26 AM #81
      Quote Originally Posted by 200HP4dr View Post
      Well, if you're truly stuck, meaning sitting still, you roll down your windows. Just like you'd do in a gas powered car and shut it off.

      Chris
      Will you still turn your car off when you're stuck in traffic, and its 95 degrees outside?

    7. Member xdre's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:27 AM #82
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      Yeah but the 2147 mile long Keystone Pipeline, which would have created thousands of jobs, and would have enabled natural gas, and oil being supplied right here in the US, which would significantly reduce our dependancy on foreign oil, he did not approve of.
      Try getting your facts from elsewhere besides Big Oil's mouthpieces.

    8. Member bpodlesnik's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:31 AM #83
      Quote Originally Posted by xdre View Post
      Try getting your facts from elsewhere besides Big Oil's mouthpieces.
      What is unfactual about what I stated?

    9. Geriatric Member Turbio!'s Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:33 AM #84
      It really never fails to amaze me how many people will rage, rage against the dying of light....long after dark has fallen and everybody else is rocking flashlights.
      IPRO Meat-Director and High Minister of Terror-Grilling

      Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Man View Post
      The Terror Grill: Part restaurant, part amusement attraction, part gladiator arena, all profit.
      ARE YOU NOT SATIATED?!?!?!

    10. Geriatric Member Turbio!'s Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:38 AM #85
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      Yeah but the 2147 mile long Keystone Pipeline, which would have created thousands of jobs, and would have enabled natural gas, and oil being supplied right here in the US, which would significantly reduce our dependancy on foreign oil, he did not approve of.
      ...mostly because a rushed, and artificial deadline for a decision, Feb. 21st, was imposed by Boehner et al. as part of the payroll tax extension passed December 22nd.

      “This announcement is not a judgment on the merits of the pipeline, but the arbitrary nature of a deadline that prevented the State Department from gathering the information necessary to approve the project and protect the American people,” the president said in a statement.
      Political gamesmanship, nothing more. Never imagine for a second that the president or his party are not going to let Keystone get built.
      IPRO Meat-Director and High Minister of Terror-Grilling

      Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Man View Post
      The Terror Grill: Part restaurant, part amusement attraction, part gladiator arena, all profit.
      ARE YOU NOT SATIATED?!?!?!

    11. Member Sledge's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:44 AM #86
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      Okay, well you can go hug your tree, crawl back into bed and keep worrying about all of Earth's oil and gas running out, and your future of an electric car actually hitting a reasonable price to purchase and maintain. Meanwhile, I'm going to keep driving my car that runs on gas, and revving my exhaust fumes into the atmosphere, and going about my life, because I don't give a rats a$$ of a electric car future. Kapeesh?
      "The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views...which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering."
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    12. Member bpodlesnik's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:47 AM #87
      Quote Originally Posted by Turbio! View Post
      ...mostly because a rushed, and artificial deadline for a decision, Feb. 21st, was imposed by Boehner et al. as part of the payroll tax extension passed December 22nd.



      Political gamesmanship, nothing more. Never imagine for a second that the president or his party are not going to let Keystone get built.
      I think think that is a sorry a$$ excuse, and politicians on both sides should have done more solving and less bickering. And I do think that the president and his party won't let it be built because I think he is trying to push the electric future to hard and to fast. But I'll think what I want and everyone else can think what they want, and we can go our seperate ways. Addio.

    13. Geriatric Member Turbio!'s Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:51 AM #88
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      I think think that is a sorry a$$ excuse, and politicians on both sides should have done more solving and less bickering.:
      Well, then, tell Boehner to set reasonable deadlines instead of forcing a decision he might not like. That was his gamble, and he lost big.

      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      And I do think that the president and his party won't let it be built because I think he is trying to push the electric future to hard and to fast. But I'll think what I want and everyone else can think what they want, and we can go our seperate ways. Addio.
      Obama doesn't give a rat's ass about the environment. Your assumptions are way off base.
      IPRO Meat-Director and High Minister of Terror-Grilling

      Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Man View Post
      The Terror Grill: Part restaurant, part amusement attraction, part gladiator arena, all profit.
      ARE YOU NOT SATIATED?!?!?!

    14. Member Sledge's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:54 AM #89
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      I think think that is a sorry a$$ excuse
      Good to know you think public safety is an "excuse".

      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      and politicians on both sides should have done more solving and less bickering.
      And such a clear understanding of current DC politics too.

      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      And I do think that the president and his party won't let it be built because I think he is trying to push the electric future to hard and to fast.


      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      But I'll think what I want and everyone else can think what they want, and we can go our seperate ways. Addio.
      "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."
      -Philip K. Dick
      "The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views...which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering."
      - Doctor Who (Fourth Doctor) "Face of Evil"

    15. 02-16-2012 08:54 AM #90
      Until we have cars that can mimic gas cars range 250+ mile range, mimic their price structure and can charge in the time it takes to fill up at a gas station, electric cars will only be a boutique item to the average american.

    16. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 08:58 AM #91
      Quote Originally Posted by randyvr6 View Post
      Personally, I don't think the taxpayers of this country should be responsible for paying for other people's cars.
      You seem to have no problem paying for other people's gas today.

      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      There is enough gas and oil in the world to last thousands of years, even with everything going on. And what does last forever? And how do you think you get the electricity to power the electric car? Does it magically appear? Do you have some gerbil spin a wheel to create it all?
      Source please. Everything credible says you're wrong. How about sticking to subjects you are educated about?

      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      Yeah but the 2147 mile long Keystone Pipeline, which would have created thousands of jobs, and would have enabled natural gas, and oil being supplied right here in the US, which would significantly reduce our dependancy on foreign oil, he did not approve of.
      Wrong again. Most of that oil will be exported. (Why do you think it's going to the Gulf coast?)

      Again, see above.
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    17. Member rbloedow's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:00 AM #92
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      I think think that is a sorry a$$ excuse, and politicians on both sides should have done more solving and less bickering. And I do think that the president and his party won't let it be built because I think he is trying to push the electric future to hard and to fast. But I'll think what I want and everyone else can think what they want, and we can go our seperate ways. Addio.
      Good god, are you really this disconnected from reality? Your rhetoric is the exact kind of crap that is preventing anything from being done in Washington. You project your worse fears on people you consider your opposition.

      It's easier to blame Obama and call him an environut than it is to accept that republican posturing is what is holding this whole process up. The only thing he is asking is for the process to not be rushed. You have nothing but creatively created opinion to support what you're saying, which is totally unsupported by the facts at hand.
      Last edited by rbloedow; 02-16-2012 at 09:02 AM.

    18. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:00 AM #93
      Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Reagan View Post
      Why not provide a tax credit to those who need it; instead of the upper middle class Dems who buy these cars to impress their friends with their "environmental consciousness"?

      Another classic case of the Dem's pandering to their environmental extremist base on the taxpayers dime.
      How, exactly, do you think a continuous supply of oil is guaranteed to us today?

      Let me guess, you think it's nearly a free marketplace, and would be better if it was all the more unregulated?
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    19. Member xdre's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:03 AM #94
      Quote Originally Posted by bpodlesnik View Post
      What is unfactual about what I stated?
      How about the fact that such a pipeline will only create hundreds of jobs, not thousands, and most such jobs will be temporary only? You really think it takes thousands of people to maintain a pipeline once it's constructed?

    20. Member curvedinfinity's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:15 AM #95
      Yeah guys, the Volt's cruising range is 350 miles.

      The reason we need this subsidy is so electric cars reach critical mass faster than the market demands. Critical mass means economy of scale naturally reduces price to affordable levels so it is adopted by the mainstream. The reason why the subsidy should be now is because economy of scale could reduce electric car price by $5-10k if electric cars were bought at the same volumes as mainstream cars. So the subsidy should be there until economy of scale kicks in and the cars can compete using their natural value proposition.

    21. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:19 AM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by curvedinfinity View Post
      Yeah guys, the Volt's cruising range is 350 miles.

      The reason we need this subsidy is so electric cars reach critical mass faster than the market demands. Critical mass means economy of scale naturally reduces price to affordable levels so it is adopted by the mainstream. The reason why the subsidy should be now is because economy of scale could reduce electric car price by $5-10k if electric cars were bought at the same volumes as mainstream cars. So the subsidy should be there until economy of scale kicks in and the cars can compete using their natural value proposition.
      Gah! Too many der big words and idears.

      Obamacare! Liberals! Freedom!

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    22. Geriatric Member Turbio!'s Avatar
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      02-16-2012 09:20 AM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by xdre View Post
      How about the fact that such a pipeline will only create hundreds of jobs, not thousands, and most such jobs will be temporary only? You really think it takes thousands of people to maintain a pipeline once it's constructed?
      Speaking as somebody who's been involved with pipeline projects....this. It'll create about as many jobs as a few Recovery Act projects. It's a construction project. They don't last forever and when it's done, they don't need much input.
      IPRO Meat-Director and High Minister of Terror-Grilling

      Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Man View Post
      The Terror Grill: Part restaurant, part amusement attraction, part gladiator arena, all profit.
      ARE YOU NOT SATIATED?!?!?!

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      02-16-2012 09:28 AM #98
      Quote Originally Posted by curvedinfinity View Post
      Yeah guys, the Volt's cruising range is 350 miles.

      The reason we need this subsidy is so electric cars reach critical mass faster than the market demands. Critical mass means economy of scale naturally reduces price to affordable levels so it is adopted by the mainstream. The reason why the subsidy should be now is because economy of scale could reduce electric car price by $5-10k if electric cars were bought at the same volumes as mainstream cars. So the subsidy should be there until economy of scale kicks in and the cars can compete using their natural value proposition.

      I agree with your reasons why this is good but using the term subsidy just makes people think negatively of it. It isn't a subsidy you are getting ONLY your own money back, not someone elses.

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      02-16-2012 09:34 AM #99
      I really like EVs (especially the LEAF).

      I think a better approach would be investing in research/development in EV technology, as well as pushing to mainstream bio-based alternative fuels (such as algae/biodiesel/CNG), as opposed to directly trying to get consumers to buy current EV products that are *almost* ready for 'mainstream use'.

      Perhaps allowing more diesels to be built/imported into US would be a easy start into lessening dependence on petroleum.


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      02-16-2012 09:42 AM #100
      Quote Originally Posted by chris@revotechnik View Post
      I agree with your reasons why this is good but using the term subsidy just makes people think negatively of it. It isn't a subsidy you are getting ONLY your own money back, not someone elses.
      So when you get "your money" back that doesn't go into paying your taxes, who is left to make up for your shortfall?

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