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    View Poll Results: Which entry level 2 door RWD sports coupe do you prefer?

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    • Scion FR-S/Subaru BR-Z

      176 76.52%
    • Hyundai Genesis Coupe 2.0T

      54 23.48%
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    Thread: 2013 Genesis Coupe 2.0t vs. Scion FR-S/Subaru BR-Z

    1. Member Omnilith's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 06:15 PM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by muffintop View Post
      The stereo in the FRS looks like it's easy to swap for an aftermarket head unit.
      Minor adjustment.

    2. Member Khyron's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 06:21 PM #37




      Still unknown if Scion's going to come standard with the new Pioneer bespoke version. Subaru will have above or another pioneer touchscreen nav.

      I want the army version personally.

    3. Member 2.0T_Convert's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 06:28 PM #38
      Genesis because at this point a nice interior and some getupandgo from a stop is what I want.
      Sent from my tablet while sipping weak drinks over fancy brunch with a view

    4. 02-23-2012 06:28 PM #39
      Rather have the Scion FR-S/Subaru BR-Z if it were ~2500lbs. Would love it if it were Miata NA weight.

      But it appears the US version is rather portly, so would wait till someone figures how to make decent bhp out of its engine.

    5. 02-23-2012 06:33 PM #40
      Quote Originally Posted by muffintop View Post
      The stereo in the FRS looks like it's straight out of an army vehicle.
      Its Pioneer and they are freaking awesome.

    6. Member TM87's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 06:56 PM #41
      The way i see it 98% of TCL, will buy Toyobaru as seen as they hit the market.
      "Your pants too tight,your wheels too bright"

    7. 02-23-2012 07:01 PM #42
      The Hyundai does nothing for me personally... I'd rather have a Mustang :p. The BR-Z being smaller and more nimble has more of a unique appeal.
      Bowtie wearing, tattooed, Mustang driver

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      02-23-2012 07:11 PM #43
      The Genesis Coupe will probably show it's tail-lights to the Scion/Subaru more often than not...

      I voted for the Scion/Subaru still, both are not lookers IMO but the Scion/Subaru looks better than the Genesis Coupe. Always been a Toyota fanboy(have had two mr2 turbos and would love an MK4 Supra). For the price, I would rather have a second hand 370z over either though(and it looks A LOT better).

    9. Member Robstr's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 07:29 PM #44
      The Toyobaru is so much smaller than the GC in weight and size and, actually, better power:weight plus the smaller wheels/tires and no dick-window. And the GC refresh looks like it has two faces like: over :|
      Cars shouldn't have two faces.
      All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others.

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      02-23-2012 08:51 PM #45
      Funny, I was so hellbent on the FR-S I even inquired about putting down a deposit at the local Scion dealership. Kyron's photo put the size into perspective, if it's my only car, I want to be comfortable when sitting on the 405. At 6'1 with 36'' leg, I find the current GC comfy and the Rspec package is a great deal, VERY sporty. I killed myself dd'ing an NB Miata for a year and won't do that to my spine again. 2.0t R spec with a 6 speed for me.

    11. Member adrew's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 08:58 PM #46
      Scion, with Toyota badges in place of the Scion ones
      Improving the signal-to-noise ratio • Come make some hard cider

    12. Member Gran Turismo's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 09:06 PM #47
      Quote Originally Posted by Robstr View Post
      And the GC refresh looks like it has two faces like: over :|
      Cars shouldn't have two faces.
      Now I can't unsee and with that new GC looks even more repulsive to me.

    13. Member Khyron's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 09:12 PM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by NailsInOurBacks View Post
      Funny, I was so hellbent on the FR-S I even inquired about putting down a deposit at the local Scion dealership. Kyron's photo put the size into perspective, if it's my only car, I want to be comfortable when sitting on the 405. At 6'1 with 36'' leg, I find the current GC comfy and the Rspec package is a great deal, VERY sporty. I killed myself dd'ing an NB Miata for a year and won't do that to my spine again. 2.0t R spec with a 6 speed for me.
      I'm 5'7" with 30 inseam, so you can see how the GC/Mustang seems a bit too large. That said, there's apparently 6'4" 250lb guys fitting and still having helmet room - just makes the backseat completely unusable though.

      Prev GC my head hit the glass when sitting in the backseat, so take that into consideration as well. Both backseats are short distance/kids only.

    14. 02-23-2012 10:19 PM #49
      Quote Originally Posted by Robstr View Post
      The Toyobaru is so much smaller than the GC in weight and size and, actually, better power:weight plus the smaller wheels/tires and no dick-window. And the GC refresh looks like it has two faces like: over :|
      Cars shouldn't have two faces.
      Actually, it's the other way around. Power to weight for the Genesis is around 12:1; the FR-S is at least 13:1

    15. Member Corrado1900T's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 10:19 PM #50
      Quote Originally Posted by mariok2006 View Post
      FYI, the Toyobaru will be available with a Torsen LSD or mechanical LSD and will be much easier on consumables.

      Just out of curiosity, does Hyundai support warranty claims from track abuse?
      Doesn't matter if they don't know it was on the track. Their warranty is far better than most, if not all other brands. If the warranty is good it doesn't matter how many times they have to replace the differential.

    16. Member BLK9GEN's Avatar
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      02-23-2012 11:34 PM #51
      Quote Originally Posted by joe97 View Post
      Actually, it's the other way around. Power to weight for the Genesis is around 12:1; the FR-S is at least 13:1
      Additionally, the torque difference is HUGE:

      GC: 275 lb-ft @ 2000 rpm
      BRZ/FRS: 151 lb-ft @ 6600 rpm
      Last edited by BLK9GEN; 02-23-2012 at 11:37 PM.

    17. Swallow Doretti
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      02-24-2012 12:08 AM #52
      Quote Originally Posted by jwaters943 View Post
      If I could only afford to have one car: Genesis

      It's just more practical and likely more comfortable for tall guys like me. I also MUCH prefer the interior (minus the silly center stack gauges).

      If we are talking about a second car and not a DD, I'd probably pick the Scion, but it would depend on the price.
      My reasoning as well, with one difference: if it was a second car, I'd chose the same car I would have chosen before the FR-S:


    18. Member SCIROCCO SPEED's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 12:12 AM #53
      Quote Originally Posted by jwaters943 View Post
      Additionally, the torque difference is HUGE:

      GC: 275 lb-ft @ 2000 rpm
      BRZ/FRS: 151 lb-ft @ 6600 rpm
      I'm just curious, where did you find these numbers? I don't follow Hyundai at all, but just found out a friend bought a 2.0T R-Spec so this peaked my interest.

      I found 210hp and 223tq here...http://www.hyundaiusa.com/genesis-co...fications.aspx
      Engineers do it better.

    19. Member Gran Turismo's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 12:14 AM #54
      Quote Originally Posted by SCIROCCO SPEED View Post
      I'm just curious, where did you find these numbers? I don't follow Hyundai at all, but just found out a friend bought a 2.0T R-Spec so this peaked my interest.

      I found 210hp and 223tq here...http://www.hyundaiusa.com/genesis-co...fications.aspx
      2013 models get a boost in horsepower and torque.

    20. Member SCIROCCO SPEED's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 12:16 AM #55
      ah, very nice. Do you know if they use the same turbo and other hardware? or is it just tuned a little hotter?
      Engineers do it better.

    21. Member bmann's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 12:41 AM #56
      I may be in a minority but I think the GC looks pretty good. But still, I would pick the FR-S/BR-Z because lightcar.
      Do not be persecuted by the pompous fedora, balanced by the equilibrium, fortified by the
      government's inability to eradicate, or foreshadow—taken from the Hebrew word: foreskin

    22. 02-24-2012 05:11 AM #57
      Quote Originally Posted by SCIROCCO SPEED View Post
      ah, very nice. Do you know if they use the same turbo and other hardware? or is it just tuned a little hotter?
      The basic engine is more or less carried over from the pre-refreshed version but it now has a larger intercooler and new twin scroll designs.

    23. Member greatfox's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 12:23 PM #58
      Quote Originally Posted by joe97 View Post
      The basic engine is more or less carried over from the pre-refreshed version but it now has a larger intercooler and new twin scroll designs.
      The previous engine was called Theta and the new engine (along with the 2.4 in the sonata) is called the Theta II. Take that for what it's worth.
      Quote Originally Posted by iamnotemo View Post
      ...I am jealous of your shift knob. That is a shape I love.
      Quote Originally Posted by elementpb View Post
      your mom sounds like my kind of lady. is she single and/or discrete?
      I have RWD, finally!!!!!!

    24. Member l88m22vette's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 01:53 PM #59
      BRZ, with a built turbo engine. /thread
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      Quote Originally Posted by jackboots View Post
      Torque is how many crubs and briks you can sled into. Horsepower is how fast you can sled into them, multiplied by how load your cam knock is.

    25. 02-24-2012 02:12 PM #60
      Genesis Coupe, because I drive on roads not tracks. The lack of torque would be really annoying on a daily driver.

    26. Member bmann's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 02:25 PM #61
      Quote Originally Posted by bora-brazil View Post
      Genesis Coupe, because I drive on roads not tracks. The lack of torque would be really annoying on a daily driver.
      Not sure if serious.
      Do not be persecuted by the pompous fedora, balanced by the equilibrium, fortified by the
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    27. Member greatfox's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 02:34 PM #62
      Quote Originally Posted by bmann View Post
      Not sure if serious.
      let's not let this thread devolve into another OMG NO TORKS!!! poo-flinging contest. It's already been covered. If he finds 151 lbs-ft. to be inadequate, it's his prerogative to express that here.

      For the record, I daily drive a car with 110 lbs-ft. of torque and it's absolutely fine
      Quote Originally Posted by iamnotemo View Post
      ...I am jealous of your shift knob. That is a shape I love.
      Quote Originally Posted by elementpb View Post
      your mom sounds like my kind of lady. is she single and/or discrete?
      I have RWD, finally!!!!!!

    28. Member BLK9GEN's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:25 PM #63
      Quote Originally Posted by greatfox View Post
      let's not let this thread devolve into another OMG NO TORKS!!! poo-flinging contest. It's already been covered. If he finds 151 lbs-ft. to be inadequate, it's his prerogative to express that here.

      For the record, I daily drive a car with 110 lbs-ft. of torque and it's absolutely fine
      Here's the rub, at least with me. There is NO doubt that a car with low hp/torque can be a lot of fun. It can even be very "sporty", as I'm sure the Toyobaru is (based on the early reviews), but it cannot IMO be a true "sports car". Maybe my definition is flawed, but good steering, a well-sorted transmission, and a playful RWD chassis only go so far. In my experience, the vast majority of people who want "sports cars" want something with some real grunt under the hood. Unless the Boxer 4 is terribly underrated, 151 lb-ft of torque is pretty pathetic in any car that claims to be a sports car in 2013. If the NA-model really does weigh 100-200 lbs. more than it's JDM counterpart, I have little doubt that it will get raped in a stoplight war against a V6 RAV4, let alone most/all of the coupes in it's estimated price range. That's just.....sad.

      /rant

      And yes, I know speed isn't everything, but will most buyers in this segment be about to look past it? I have my doubts.

    29. Member Chris_V's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:27 PM #64
      Quote Originally Posted by greatfox View Post
      let's not let this thread devolve into another OMG NO TORKS!!! poo-flinging contest. It's already been covered. If he finds 151 lbs-ft. to be inadequate, it's his prerogative to express that here.
      And it's our perogative to remind him he's full of ****.

      For the record, I daily drive a car with 110 lbs-ft. of torque and it's absolutely fine
      Many peopel have and lived to tell the tale.

      Anyone remember this car? 200 hp, 150 lb ft of torque, 2800 lbs?



      Even now it will pass a ot of cars. Uphill. Rapidly.



      Same for this 150 hp, 2700 lb car. Both of the above had the same torque as the BRZ and still have no problem getting out of their own way. In fact, the BRZ seems to be almost identical to those two in layout and mission. The 944 was only a half inch longer than the BRZ, as was the RX7. All three have similar wheelbases, as well. The fact that they are so similar in all respects is amazing, actually.

      If TRD is working on a supercharger kit for the car, then it may end up much like the FD RX7 or the 944 turbo in size and capability. But even the standard one's hp and torque should be more than adequate for street speeds and track shenanigans.
      I love cars, but the problem is they are like schroedinger's hobby. They're always in a quantum superstate of being both awesome and a huge waste of time and money... until observation momentarily forces them into one state or another.

    30. Member Chris_V's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:29 PM #65
      Quote Originally Posted by jwaters943 View Post
      Here's the rub, at least with me. There is NO doubt that a car with low hp/torque can be a lot of fun. It can even be very "sporty", as I'm sure the Toyobaru is (based on the early reviews), but it cannot IMO be a true "sports car". Maybe my definition is flawed,
      See my post above. True sports cars have been made IDENTICAL to the FR-S/BRZ in layout, size and power. MOST pure sports car over the years have had less power. Like the original RX7, the MGB, the Fiat 124 Spider, the Alfa Duetto, etc. Power isn't the defining hallmark of a true sports car. Never was, never will be.
      I love cars, but the problem is they are like schroedinger's hobby. They're always in a quantum superstate of being both awesome and a huge waste of time and money... until observation momentarily forces them into one state or another.

    31. Member BLK9GEN's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:39 PM #66
      Quote Originally Posted by Chris_V View Post
      See my post above. True sports cars have been made IDENTICAL to the FR-S/BRZ in layout, size and power. MOST pure sports car over the years have had less power. Like the original RX7, the MGB, the Fiat 124 Spider, the Alfa Duetto, etc. Power isn't the defining hallmark of a true sports car. Never was, never will be.
      Yes, but this is a 2013 MY car. Comparing it to cars of the past is a weak defense IMO. New sports car buyers expect new sports car power.

      For the record, I'm not trying to trash the Scion/Subaru. It looks like a great car in it's own right.

    32. 02-24-2012 03:40 PM #67
      Subaru BR-Z. I prefer small and light. Genesis coupe is as big as a Mustang.

    33. Member Chris_V's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:42 PM #68
      Quote Originally Posted by jwaters943 View Post
      Yes, but this is a 2013 MY car. Comparing it to cars of the past is a weak defense IMO. New sports car buyers expect new sports car power.
      Doesnt' mean it's not a sports car.

      Though to be accurate, it's a small GT. Same with the 944 and RX7, due to none of them being 2 seat convertibles.
      I love cars, but the problem is they are like schroedinger's hobby. They're always in a quantum superstate of being both awesome and a huge waste of time and money... until observation momentarily forces them into one state or another.

    34. Member BLK9GEN's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:50 PM #69
      Quote Originally Posted by Jesse View Post
      Genesis coupe is as big as a Mustang.
      It's smaller in every dimension, most notably length, but there is no denying that its closer to the Mustang than the BR-Z in terms of size.

      Just FYI....

      Hyundai GC: (L) 182.3" (W) 73.4" (H) 54.5" (Base curb weight) 3362 lbs.
      Ford Mustang: (L) 188.1" (W) 73.9" (H) 55.1" (Base curb weight) 3453 lbs.

    35. Senior Member AZGolf's Avatar
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      02-24-2012 03:51 PM #70
      Quote Originally Posted by jwaters943 View Post
      Maybe my definition is flawed, but good steering, a well-sorted transmission, and a playful RWD chassis only go so far. In my experience, the vast majority of people who want "sports cars" want something with some real grunt under the hood. Unless the Boxer 4 is terribly underrated, 151 lb-ft of torque is pretty pathetic in any car that claims to be a sports car in 2013.
      Actually a sports car is a convertible.

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