Bullies

[Blkzilla]

My eclectic 14 son is being bullied at school and its getting pretty bad.

I know as parents we can talk to the principles at his school and whatnot but I think the only real way to deal with a bully is face to face. He hasnt told us of any physical bullying, just an assload of teasing and its really getting to him. My young man must stand up for himself.

I've told him that he's git to stand up for himself but his confidence is at an all time low. Do you guys have any suggestions on how to deal with these punks before he totally looses it?

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[Papa Dras]

subbed just to hear advice. I never had to deal with any bullying growing up and would help the guys that were getting bullied. I found that if even one person had the balls to be nice to the bullied and stand up for them, it makes a difference.

We are really heavy into teaching our daughter empathy, because I don't ever want to have to deal with hearing about this crap.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

Bullying is one of my biggest fears for my kids.

Our son has not been bullied that we know of.

He has been in MMA (bjj & muay thai) for the last 2.5 years.
My only fear for him is misuse of judgment and we drill that into him all of the time.
It has given him a comfort with his body.
Comfort that a normal kid does not have in a confrontational situation.

It has also given him confidence, something that was alien to him until the last year or so.
I think this is key to dealing with bullies.

It's a very hard subject to deal with, the psychological part more than the physical.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

subbed just to hear advice. I never had to deal with any bullying growing up and would help the guys that were getting bullied.

I did, one time that I remember, in 5th grade. I got in a lot of trouble at school and then got my @ss kicked by my dad. He was an SOB of a father but he had no patience for hearing about a kid of his picking on another kid. I respect that now and now know that he got picked on heavily as a kid.

I found that if even one person had the balls to be nice to the bullied and stand up for them, it makes a difference.

We are really heavy into teaching our daughter empathy, because I don't ever want to have to deal with hearing about this crap.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

The boy that was talking about bullying could be my son, it's very eery, luckily we have not had his problems.


This looks excellent.

[foxtrot762]

I did, one time that I remember, in 5th grade. I got in a lot of trouble at school and then got my @ss kicked by my dad. He was an SOB of a father but he had no patience for hearing about a kid of his picking on another kid. I respect that now and now know that he got picked on heavily as a kid.

I kinda see myself whooping my kids ass if I hear he's been picking on other kids. I got teased a lot in school and was afraid to branch out and make friends in high school and college because I was bullied in middle school. It sort of messed up my social life from that point on. Confidence is a huge factor to kids who are being bullied. When they're told they're stupid, weird, goofy or whatever for so long that they start to believe it, it can leave some pretty profound marks on them.
I feel for kids who are bullied or left out because they're "not cool enough" and I make it a point to talk to everyone regardless of how different they might be. Deep down, we're all people with feelings and really the only thing anyone wants is to be accepted for who they are.

Good luck with your son. If it comes to blows, in my personal opinion, I would say it's alright for him to punch someone in the nose if they hit him first. At least that's what I plan to teach my son. If he doesn't stand up for himself now, kids will walk all over him for the duration of his school career. I wish I'd had the guts to hit back when I was younger.

[Papa Dras]

I kinda see myself whooping my kids ass if I hear he's been picking on other kids. I got teased a lot in school and was afraid to branch out and make friends in high school and college because I was bullied in middle school. It sort of messed up my social life from that point on. Confidence is a huge factor to kids who are being bullied. When they're told they're stupid, weird, goofy or whatever for so long that they start to believe it, it can leave some pretty profound marks on them.
I feel for kids who are bullied or left out because they're "not cool enough" and I make it a point to talk to everyone regardless of how different they might be. Deep down, we're all people with feelings and really the only thing anyone wants is to be accepted for who they are.

That is really too bad. That pisses me off to hear that it carries over so long. I don't know what it was that made me stand up for other people getting bullied because I wasn't bigger or tougher, I just knew it sucked to see and I didn't care about getting in a fight over it. If I didn't do or say something, it would eat at me for weeks. This goes back to about 7th grade.

I took for granted that I just fit in all the groups there were. I honestly never realized that there were cliques because I just kind of floated between them depending on who I wanted to hang out with. Wanted to get high- hang with the stoners. Wanted to go to the party- hang with the football players, etc.

[smittyATL]

I was a year ahead in school, in the gifted programs, and from a lower socio-economic group than other kids in junior/high school and got a good bit of bullying directed my way.

I always found a fist-to-nose approach to be very effective in dealing with and resolving these types of issues.

[MeineFolks'wagen]

The bullying thing has been bothering me a lot lately, I think it's getting too much exposure as something "new" that's happening. I also think kids nowadays are being coddled too much because everyone is trying too damned hard to be politically correct about everything. This has been going on forever, it's not new.

When I grew up, I was overweight and I got picked on RELENTLESSLY, it was nonstop during the day. I got beat up, they would wait for me around corners and jump me, etc. This was back in the late 70's into the 80's. I sucked it up and dealt with it. I fought back when I could and when I couldn't, I got my butt whooped, cried about it, and then sucked it up and went about my life. Oh yeah, it sucked big time, don't get me wrong. I never said anything to anyone, I took care of my own problems.

Now, I'm not saying that nothing should be done about it. I'm not saying that the people involved should not be told on, reported to the school, etc. But I think it's being overplayed in the media lately. I get young kids trying to tell me now "it's different now, we've got Facebook and internet bullying". I tell them "so what?". Why in the hell would you friend someone on Facebook who is bullying you? Don't friend them or block them out. Don't set your profile to "public". Stay off the freaking computer and ignore it. Don't give your kids a mini super computer and photo lab to carry around in their pocket so that they can start taking pictures of each other and then texting them around to who knows who. Like someone said above, get them into an after school program of martial arts or something like that to help them focus or learn how to protect themselves.

All that said, my personal opinion on the matter is that the best way to help kids with this is to simply teach them to suck it up, acknowledge that it happened, and move on. I think we as a society are making our kids too freaking soft with all this touchy feely PC nonsense. We can't have competitions where a kid loses because it will hurt their self esteem, so everyone has to win something. We can't punish our kids for something, we have to put them in time out and/or council them. We can't acknowledge that one kid is better than another because it may hurt their feelings - it's a bunch of hooey I could still get paddled by the principal when I was growing up, maybe we just need to go back to the "SHUT UP AND STUDY" approach to things.

[Papa Dras]

I'm kind of sick and tired of the constant talk about how soft we are making kids. It's like everyone grew up in a military household and teach their kids to box all of a sudden. Somehow we became the toughest generation in recent memory. Give it a rest and realize that **** is different now. Kids can't get away from things like we used to. Everything is instant and in your face and it is next to impossible to ignore. I'd never want to be a kid now.

Of course there are going to be the hovering parents and the over protective parents, but it's their deal, and the kids will sort things out. Even if a kid is coddled at home, they are going to figure things out on their own in the company of all the other kids. I'd rather see a kid get coddled than treated like a pos or neglected, like a lot are as well.

[MeineFolks'wagen]

I'm kind of sick and tired of the constant talk about how soft we are making kids. It's like everyone grew up in a military household and teach their kids to box all of a sudden. Somehow we became the toughest generation in recent memory. Give it a rest and realize that **** is different now. Kids can't get away from things like we used to. Everything is instant and in your face and it is next to impossible to ignore. I'd never want to be a kid now.

Of course there are going to be the hovering parents and the over protective parents, but it's their deal, and the kids will sort things out. Even if a kid is coddled at home, they are going to figure things out on their own in the company of all the other kids. I'd rather see a kid get coddled than treated like a pos or neglected, like a lot are as well.

OK, so in the interest of open discussion, what is so different now that makes it so "Kids can't get away from things like we used to. Everything is instant and in your face and it is next to impossible to ignore. I'd never want to be a kid now."??

What did we do differently that allowed us to "get away" that kids can't do nowadays? If the only answer you are going to give is social media, there is a real easy solution to that - don't give your kids access to it. I pick up my daughters and I can't believe the number of 5-7 year olds walking out of the school with a phone stuck to their head, it's ridiculous.

All in the interest of open discussion mind you - I want to hear an argument for why kids have it so much harder today than say 20-30 years ago.

[Papa Dras]

It is exactly that- social media. Kids are connected in every way possible- fb, twitter, text, phone, etc. When we (I'm 37) were growing up, if someone wasn't a close friend, we didn't see or hear from other people in school over the weekends or after school during the week. There was a disconnect and no way for information, gossip, or other communication to spread. Now, it goes down to 4-5 year olds. Even in my daughter's preschool, they encourage them to bring their favorite electronic device once a month and half the 4-5 year olds bring in iPads and phones. It's fine that you don't give your kid this stuff, but it doesn't change anything when it is happening all around them. I don't agree with it at that age, but there is no escaping it.

Kids aren't any different than when we grew up, except that it is easier to be *******s and hide behind technology. Don't like someone- blast them online and let everyone read about it and watch it snowball. Things get out of control and hard to handle so much faster.

To just say kids are soft now because they have a harder time with bullying due to soft parents, tells me that some other parents are just out of the times. Coddling is annoying at times, but it isn't the cause of a kid getting bullied. As we all know, it's happened forever, and the idea of "tough love" has been around since then. So based on that- why were kids still getting bullied in our day?

[MeineFolks'wagen]

It is exactly that- social media. Kids are connected in every way possible- fb, twitter, text, phone, etc. When we (I'm 37) were growing up, if someone wasn't a close friend, we didn't see or hear from other people in school over the weekends or after school during the week. There was a disconnect and no way for information, gossip, or other communication to spread. Now, it goes down to 4-5 year olds. Even in my daughter's preschool, they encourage them to bring their favorite electronic device once a month and half the 4-5 year olds bring in iPads and phones. It's fine that you don't give your kid this stuff, but it doesn't change anything when it is happening all around them. I don't agree with it at that age, but there is no escaping it.

Kids aren't any different than when we grew up, except that it is easier to be *******s and hide behind technology. Don't like someone- blast them online and let everyone read about it and watch it snowball. Things get out of control and hard to handle so much faster.

To just say kids are soft now because they have a harder time with bullying due to soft parents, tells me that some other parents are just out of the times. Coddling is annoying at times, but it isn't the cause of a kid getting bullied. As we all know, it's happened forever, and the idea of "tough love" has been around since then. So based on that- why were kids still getting bullied in our day?

The answer to that is very simple - don't allow your kids access to social media. It's no different than keeping them away from pornography, R rated movies, etc. - you govern what they have access to. Granted, there are going to be limits to what you have control over, but you still act like a parent (in general mind you, not singling you out) and control it. There are filters on internet connectivity programs, use them. If the kids complain that they can't be on Facebook like everyone else, deal with it. You know the old saying if everyone else jumped off the roof, would you do it too? Just because Billy and Jenny are on Facebook doesn't mean your kids need to be on there (again I mean that in general terms, not singling you out).

Like I said, I see 5-7 year old kids at my daughters' school that come out and start playing with their phones, there is no need or excuse for it. My kids have both been asking for phones and you know what I tell them? No, you don't need it. You think they NEED a phone, you get a simple basic simple stupid phone that allows them to make calls and nothing else - no internet, no camera, etc.

Why does bullying happen? Because it's the "strong" preying on the "weak" and as you already said, it's been going on since day one and it will continue. But to go around crying about how it's worse today due to technology, I'm sorry, I won't get on board with that. If your kid is having a problem because of technology, you don't allow them access to it. They need to get on the 'net for homework or research, they get to do it. But no Myspace, no Facebook, or whatever site they are trying to use. Don't give them smart phones - they need a phone, they get a basic phone to make calls with. I don't see this technology problem/complaint/issue any differently than I do people complaining about kids having access to porn, bad movies, bad music, etc. - be a parent and govern your kids. You're not going to be able to control them getting beat up at school, but that's been going on forever too. But you can govern access to technology.

My opinion anyway - may differ from others

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

I'm kind of sick and tired of the constant talk about how soft we are making kids. It's like everyone grew up in a military household and teach their kids to box all of a sudden. Somehow we became the toughest generation in recent memory. Give it a rest and realize that **** is different now.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Especially the 2nd sentence.

[MotownSVT]

I have no idea what you are talking about. Especially the 2nd sentence.

I think he's basically saying that too many people are turning into the "When I was your age I walked to school barefoot in a foot of snow uphill both ways" people that they used to detest.

[Papa Dras]

Bingo.

[Papa Dras]

My opinion anyway - may differ from others

No worries, man. Talking with friends yesterday and one thing about parents is that we all know best.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

I think he's basically saying that too many people are turning into the "When I was your age I walked to school barefoot in a foot of snow uphill both ways" people that they used to detest.

Bingo.

Got it. Yeap, agreed.

[Tornado2dr]

I think he's basically saying that too many people are turning into the "When I was your age I walked to school barefoot in a foot of snow uphill both ways" people that they used to detest.

we didn't even have FEET! and only one foot of snow, I wish. I had to tunnel my way there.

[Diamond Dave]

He hasnt told us of any physical bullying, just an assload of teasing and its really getting to him. My young man must stand up for himself.

I've told him that he's git to stand up for himself but his confidence is at an all time low. Do you guys have any suggestions on how to deal with these punks before he totally looses it?

I wish you could teach people how to take pride in themselves and stand up or speak out. It's not that easy though.

You might first try to get a handle on the teasing and figure out where it stems from (let's say your son always wears the same shirt to school). Then work on ways to help your son put the spotlight on bullies; like making teasing the bullies back. It's only fun sport when you don't take any damage.

Also, find out what's holding your son back from addressing the issue. I'd be willing to bet that he's concerned that he will "get in trouble" from the teachers. I grew up knowing that my Dad was in my corner and would stand by my decisions (if I needed to punch a kid). That alone makes a big difference.

[Tornado2dr]

Also, find out what's holding your son back from addressing the issue. I'd be willing to bet that he's concerned that he will "get in trouble" from the teachers. I grew up knowing that my Dad was in my corner and would stand by my decisions (if I needed to punch a kid). That alone makes a big difference.

With two kids under school age, I am really concerned with being able to tell them this. Now with "zero tolerance" policies on physical contact, a mere push/shove/playground fight can turn into a life-altering expulsion event for child and parent.

Of course we all joke about the "good old days" regardless of the time in which you grew up, but there has been a SUBSTANTIAL shift in the way schools handle child on child violence in school in the past 20 years, due in no small part to assclowns who brought guns to school in order to stand up for themselves.

Many in my age bracket recall getting into fights at school, getting the 3rd degree from your teacher, being forced to shake hands with your dance partners, going home, getting the 3rd degree at home and maybe a sore butt, and then going back to school. Bruises and short lived scrapes faded, and everything was normal. Noone started to call the police/school board until you were in high school and knew better.

[Papa Dras]

I don't think you necessarily need to tell them that they can punch someone, but you can instill the confidence in them by letting you know you support them and that you are there for them. I make a point of letting my 4 yo know how tough I am and that nobody will ever hurt our family- so if she has to stand up for herself or her sister, we will be on her side. She gets a kick out of thinking I am the toughest and it already gives her confidence that she has her parents in her corner.

Like DD, my dad did the same thing for me. It's definitely why I never took **** from anyone, but I also never went looking for it. It's a confidence thing, but it started with knowing my parents had my back.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

I totally agree what you guys are saying. I can't tell my son to punch a kid in the nose if the kid continues to push him, even if my son gives him numerous fair warnings. The school is serious about this. This has been a major shift since when I was in school.

If it comes down to a real serious problem. I'd go to the school. Then the parents, I have no problem confronting POS parents.

My son's small, a nerd, and is not a normal kid by any measure, but he's also comfortable with himself. Some of that comes from his intelligence, some from the way we are raising him (like you guys are doing), and some of it comes from 2.5 years of muay thai and BJJ.
He's used to getting punched, kicked, and triangle choked; because of those things, he's not fearful of other kids. He also knows those skills are a last resort.

I'm not saying kids should be gladiators, but kids should be confident in themselves, take pride in what and who they are. It's not a natural thing for many kids. DD hit the nail on the head.

My daughter's a rock star, I'm sure she'll deal with some issues at some point, but being good at everything appears to be a ticket out of some of these issues. Not all kids have this on their side.

Such a tough subject.

[Diamond Dave]

I don't think you necessarily need to tell them that they can punch someone, but you can instill the confidence in them by letting you know you support them and that you are there for them.

correct, it's about not limiting their choices with a ceiling of "do everything, but don't touch someone if you have to defend yourself". The fact is, many bullies aren't threatening to fight, they are just making kids' lives miserable in little ways that the teacher never sees. If your son/daughter has the confidence to call their bluff, it can end the bullying (or better yet, teach them to step in when they see OTHER kids getting bullied).

I've also done more with my daughter (the 8yr old) to describe what makes bullies tick and what they DON't like; attention, ridicule, people laughing at them, and they sure as hell don't want to get punched.




As for the school, you're correct that it's a completely different environment today. Bottom line is that the school is afraid. Spread a liberal CYA email to everyone necessary in the escalated heirarchy and let them know what your attorney has advised. If you need to get your kid on the news channel saying he got suspended for punching a bully at school after you let everyone in the chain of command know about the situation, that should gather attention. Play for keeps.

My daughter's a rock star, I'm sure she'll deal with some issues at some point..

Dude, girls are incredibly mean. I think you're right to a degree about being involved, but freaking high school girls are on a completely different level.

[Tornado2dr]

Dude, girls are incredibly mean. I think you're right to a degree about being involved, but freaking high school girls are on a completely different level.

Have two, now. Not looking forward to this. Some girls just have pure evil inside them.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

I think you're right to a degree about being involved, but freaking high school girls are on a completely different level.

I'm not sure WTF you are even talking about in the first part.

Regardless of teen girls' mean spirit, not being engaged as a parent can be disastrous.

I never insinuated (but you may have inferred) that being involved fixes the situation, there are too many variables.

[Diamond Dave]

I'm not sure WTF you are even talking about in the first part.

Sorry it was so confusing to follow what you said.

You said:

If it comes down to a real serious problem. I'd go to the school. Then the parents, I have no problem confronting POS parents.

My daughter's a rock star, I'm sure she'll deal with some issues at some point, but being good at everything appears to be a ticket out of some of these issues.

Then I said:

Dude, girls are incredibly mean. I think you're right to a degree about being involved, but freaking high school girls are on a completely different level.

I covered 2 points here, 1) high school girls are mean 2) you said you'd be involved by going to the school when/if there were issues so I then said "I think you're right about being involved".

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

[Papa Dras]

You guys should threaten each other on Facebook and twitter.

[FlashRedGLS1.8T]

You guys should threaten each other on Facebook and twitter.

[Vision33r]

I think bullies are a necessity in society. The problem with today is that parents are way over protective of their kids and causing their children to react different to bullying.

I was 7 years old and this big tall bully in my class kept picking on me especially I was the only Asian kid in the class. One day he attacked me during recess outside and I simply got tired of him bothering me. So I rammed him in the face with my head and gave him a severe nose bleed. He never bothered me ever since. Of course, I did go to the principal's office and the dean did call my parents but they did say that since the other kid was a known bully I didn't get disciplined.

Today's bullying takes on a different form because we are so connected to internet connected devices and most parents just aren't savvy enough to watch what their kids are doing online. Their kids get bullied online and they simply don't know how to turn away from them and resort to doing stupid things they learned from watching other kids vent online such as suicide or using deadly force with a weapon.

[DTMTrini]

I was and always have been the 'skinny kid', underestimated and people initially think it's fun to try to pick on me. Back in the day that worked for them, now, they see otherwise.

I got bullied throughout elementary school, but my 'bullies' also protected me from kids from other classes. Junior Highschool came along and I toughened up...built up my health (always had a weak immune system throughout elementary years), built up my self-confidence, built up my strength [not for malicious reasons however]. By then I began to bully bullies. Then came highschool and I used to beat up people who would mess with my friends, most especially my female friends. I was well known in those days so my friends always pulled me into their drama. Now a days, I don't resort to violence but I let people know that i'm no push-over if they are showing signs of being idiots (especially at my job). Being bullied back in my day (early 90's) taught me to defend myself. My mom always wants to defend me, but I quickly learned that if I allow that to happen, then I won't get far. So I grew up, did my own thing and i'm glad I turned out the way I am.

Anyway, last thing I want is my kids to be bullied, but my lady and I already plan to introduce them to a fighting art, as I and my sister were. I would like my children to be able to know how to hold themselves down but they will absolutely know that mommy and daddy will always be their support if they need it.

[trbochrg]

So, Friday my son got bullied at School. He is 8 years old. His teacher (female) heard some kids fooling around in the boys bathroom and she asked him to go in and tell them that they need to come out (not sure why she asked a student, but she apologized and told us that it won't happen again). Anyways, when he told the other kids that they had to come out, one of them grabbed him by the neck and pushed him to the ground. The teacher heard more noise and sent the Principal in and he saw the other boy with his hands around my sons neck and holding him to the ground. Apparently this kid has been calling him names and telling him that he doesn't like him for some time but my son has never told us because he was afraid to get anyone in trouble.

Today, this same kid cuts in line in front of my son at recess. He tried standing up to him (which i am proud of him for) but the kid pushed him and then started kicking him….all in front of the Principal again. At least these two instances have occurred in front of the Principal so he knows something is going on, he also told my wife that other kids have had run ins with him as well. The other boy was sent home today for his actions.

My son told us that he doesn't want to go to school tomorrow, though he told us he isn't scared. I feel so bad for him.