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    Thread: Meet my red-headed stepchild!

    1. Member
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      05-22-2012 11:03 PM #376
      I thought the A/C wiring all went along the core to drivers side and behind the battery, but I'm not sure anymore. Can anyone confirm that my vacant plugs are A/C switches?

    2. Member scirocco*joe's Avatar
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      05-22-2012 11:40 PM #377
      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      I thought the A/C wiring all went along the core to drivers side and behind the battery, but I'm not sure anymore. Can anyone confirm that my vacant plugs are A/C switches?
      Having sold my 16V nearly 18 months ago, I am useless. Or wait, is that just what my wife calls me?

      In all seriousness, I found this picture from Tim when he was helping me diagnose an issue with an intermittent no-start.



      Not sure if that helps...
      1981 Scirocco
      2010 Sportwagen TDI

      Portland, OR

    3. Member
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      05-23-2012 07:52 AM #378
      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      I thought the A/C wiring all went along the core to drivers side and behind the battery, but I'm not sure anymore. Can anyone confirm that my vacant plugs are A/C switches?


      It's more an educated guess, really. But, I do recall them being on a separate circuit, for the fan/fan relay.

    4. Member
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      05-23-2012 08:38 AM #379
      Thanks for the effort guys, and Joe, everything on the engine harness is accounted for.

      I looked at it again, and this should help a LOT if someone could look under their hood:

      The two plugs both come out of the same harness that supplies the oil pressure sensors on the oil filter flange, and also the starter solenoid (two subharnesses that split over the bellhousing).

      The plugs are located right where these two sub-harnesses split to go their separate ways, over the bellhousing.

      I need a Mensch to follow each of the two sub-harnesses from the oil filter flange and the starter solenoid backwards to where they join, and the two white plugs should be right there in plain sight.

      My question is whether they mate to each other or whether they supply something I've deleted.

    5. Member 16VScirrocco88's Avatar
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      05-23-2012 10:29 AM #380
      I will take a look at my car tonight
      R135
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      88 Scirocco 2.0L 16V 2002 337 GTI

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      05-23-2012 06:24 PM #381
      They do not connect together. They connect to two more connectors, each having one lead going to the upshift indicator vacuum switch the other two going back into the loom. I can get colors if you need them.

    7. Member
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      05-23-2012 07:13 PM #382
      Thanks for that

      Color confirmation would be great.

    8. Member 8716vrocco's Avatar
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      05-23-2012 07:21 PM #383
      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      I do have two questions if one of you with a 16V could check under your hood:

      1) These two plugs above the gearbox escaped labelling:



      Each plug has two prongs. One plug has a red wire into one prong, and another red wire jumps to the other prong. The other plug has two prongs, each with a red and white wire. Do these plugs mate?
      Both of those connectors appear to be upshift light related. Consider yourself lucky I popped the hood, I am on a long break from this pile

      I snapped a quick and awful picture so you know what's up. Each connector has one wire each that goes to the vacuum sensor connector thats resting against the clutch cable, and the other sides loop around to the connector on the transmission. I'm sure most of this is stuff you deleted from the car. Hope this helps you out, the car is coming along nicely

      Let me know if need anything else, I have left everything in tact on my car so it would be good for reference.

      Project 16v Lysholm

      "I hope you go commando, otherwise your panties would always be in a bunch"

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      05-23-2012 07:50 PM #384
      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      Thanks for that

      Color confirmation would be great.
      OK first off it looks more red/white but mine could be bleached out, here we go.
      Green/yellow-green/yellow on reverse switch
      red/yellow-red/yellow on vacuum switch
      orange-orange/yellow on vacuum switch
      orange-orange on reverse switch
      So it appears that it is all for the upshift indicator.

    10. Member
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      05-23-2012 09:57 PM #385
      I'm enjoying your progress and this build immensely. I've always wanted to take on rebuild like this and I love your approach.

      Quote Originally Posted by scirocco*joe View Post
      Having sold my 16V nearly 18 months ago, I am useless. Or wait, is that just what my wife calls me?

      In all seriousness, I found this picture from Tim when he was helping me diagnose an issue with an intermittent no-start.



      Not sure if that helps...
      What you are facing right now and auto wiring in general is what scares me the most about a build. Something one should just go for? Or, is it smarter to take on smaller projects to learn and build up to a full restoration?
      Quote Originally Posted by Chmeeee View Post
      Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to look more like?

    11. Member
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      05-23-2012 10:02 PM #386
      THANK YOU! Armed with this information, a box of parts I found at the front door when we got home from a school field trip, and a sudden new zest for Life, I finished up the CIS and installed the battery, so here's where the engine bay is at:



      Now, the exhaust won't be here till tomorrow, but honestly: did you REALLY expect me to leave the ignition switch alone when I'm SO CLOSE?

      Of course not. So, a few attempts that timed out the CSV, and...

      ...IT RUNS!



      *Insert really loud engine sounds, as one might expect with an open downpipe*

      It idles and revs perfectly, and overall it's mostly good news:

      1) The accessory belt is rock steady throughout the RPM range, and not very tight at all

      2) The simplified radiator fan circuit cycles perfectly.

      3) With the instrument panel temporarily plugged in to bring the voltage regulator on line, the charging system reads 13.5 volts at the battery terminals.

      4) One lifter took a while to fill up and clicked at first, but now it's quiet.

      5) The oil stayed perfectly clear

      6) Coolant is perfectly clear, and no foam

      7) The exhaust paint smoked for a bit but looks great

      8) The shifter is spot on.

      There are some bugs to work out:

      1) The water pump developed a brisk leak at the shaft seal while sitting in the basement . New pump needed.

      2)The front water jacket, which I enjoyed installing immensely because I had the intake on already, is also leaking . I took a lot of time with it and still ufcked it up

      Overall I'm really happy, and mostly just relieved that the electrical system didn't suffer any apparent ill effects after being stripped down so much *phew*

      Thanks again the the plug indentifications
      Last edited by echassin; 05-23-2012 at 10:45 PM.

    12. Member scirocco*joe's Avatar
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      05-23-2012 10:56 PM #387
      Congrats, Eric! Glad to see you make so much progress.

      As far as the water pump goes, you had to have guessed that as soon as you said this:

      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      I'm using my pump anyways, but I was just curious.
      You knew you were eventually going to say this:

      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      The water pump developed a brisk leak at the shaft seal while sitting in the basement . New pump needed.


      That said, only a small number of problems considering the work you performed. I think you deserve a hearty pat on the back. And some cold ones.
      1981 Scirocco
      2010 Sportwagen TDI

      Portland, OR

    13. Member
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      05-23-2012 11:31 PM #388
      I can't wait to hear all the "told-you-so's" when the engine craps out .

      The radiator sprung a leak while I was doing those burnouts that first day, but I remember it wasn't the pump.

      So while I expect all of the old parts I'm using will need replacing sooner or later, I admit I didn't expect the pump to fail immediately on first start . That seems quite the coincidence.

      But now that I see the new pump was only $35 complete, I do feel like I was being stupid

      OTOH I'm already $3300 just to reach first engine start, buying everything that could possibly fail would make that number much worse.

      Plus I still need some big ticket items like wheels and tires, re-upholstery, and a dash. I have a lead on some used Eurosport springs, so I may start with that before shelling out for my preferred H&R/Bilsteins.

    14. Member TheTimob's Avatar
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      05-24-2012 08:25 AM #389
      You may be dealing with a totally rotted out cooling system like Becky's car had. I flushed the coolant, and then it started rejecting things. First the water pump. Then the radiator. The oil cooler three way hose. the heater valve. the heater core. It may have had a bunch of stop-leak in it. As much as we hate it - that sh!t works!

    15. Member scirocco*joe's Avatar
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      05-24-2012 09:36 AM #390
      Eh, don't worry. We just like to bust chops.

      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      OTOH I'm already $3300 just to reach first engine start, buying everything that could possibly fail would make that number much worse.
      As far as the $3,300, I sold my 16V for $3,100 and it didn't look nearly as clean or beautiful as yours. So in my mind, you are ahead of the game (especially since you KNOW the work was done right).
      1981 Scirocco
      2010 Sportwagen TDI

      Portland, OR

    16. Member
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      05-24-2012 11:23 AM #391
      Quote Originally Posted by scirocco*joe View Post
      Eh, don't worry. We just like to bust chops.



      As far as the $3,300, I sold my 16V for $3,100 and it didn't look nearly as clean or beautiful as yours. So in my mind, you are ahead of the game (especially since you KNOW the work was done right).
      I can dish it, so I better be able to take it

      I don't feel bad at all about money spent, my point was that if one wants to make a "new" car that won't need any work for 10 years, one would need to replace darn near everything, and the cost would be absurd for a hobby econobox.

      Tim, I was thinking along the same lines. I'll bet some debris that had been floating in the coolant harmlessly for years dried out or precipitated in the pump while it was sitting in the basement, and the minute I fired the engine, the shaft or the seal got gouged.

      Today I'm tidying a bit, weighing the delete pile, and installing some easy stuff like brake hoses and the K-bar. The pump is on order and I'll redo the water jacket when I redo the pump.

    17. Member Lord_Verminaard's Avatar
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      05-24-2012 12:12 PM #392
      I had that same isht happen on Laura's Golf build, I was on a shoestring budget, so I left out some minor items and did not replace everything. Sure enough, within the first year, I had replaced just about every part that I did not replace during the rebuild, and my nice clean engine had tons of oil, coolant, etc.. all over it. Lesson learned I suppose.

      Brendan
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    18. Member
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      05-24-2012 06:37 PM #393
      Replacing everything over a year's time feels better cuz you don't notice the nickles and dimes pissing away

      Today I weighed the delete pile: 131 pounds! Basically I can carry someone around and have no performance penalty, except all you beer sluggers on this forum, for you I'd have to remove the hood and hatch too

      I installed the new brake hoses that arrived yesterday:





      I primed and painted the metal fittings, and covered them with Cosmoline once installed, to try to keep them from rusting as bad as the originals.

      Then I cleaned up, painted, and installed the K-bar:



      I also pulled the wires up the C-pillar for the hatch:



      All that's left is the 12V+ to the license lights and to the defog element, the grounds I'll add later.

      Then Petra and I went out for our Thursday Sushi lunch, hoping the exhaust would be waiting for me when we got home.

      Sure enough:







      As always, fitment is adequate and the sound is stellar There was a hissing leak at the stump of the sniffer pipe (I had just cut it and flattened it), but a quick weld and all's well.

      The tach, speedo, fuel gauge, and charging light all work as they should.

      The oil warning was doing the 2000rpm+ buzzing/blinking thing until I grounded the white oil pressure switch (replacing it didn't work) Ideas?

      Edit: I was sweeping and I have an update on the finch that got stuck fluttering around the garage ceiling and crapped on the S1 (those of frail emotion please avert your eyes):



      I guess it never found the way out even though both garage doors were wide open . It must've got pooped out (pun indended) and died, which was disappointing to see.
      Last edited by echassin; 05-24-2012 at 08:05 PM.

    19. Member Mtl-Marc's Avatar
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      05-24-2012 07:56 PM #394
      Quote Originally Posted by echassin View Post
      Today I weighed the delete pile: 131 pounds! Basically I can carry someone around and have no performance penalty, except all you beer sluggers on this forum, for you I'd have to remove the hood and hatch too

      Remove the glass and chop the roof too.


      No wheels, is that a hover Scirocco?
      Quote Originally Posted by Mk1Madness
      Back when making your car faster and better handling was the big thing.
      Quote Originally Posted by Eistreiber
      Yeah, I prefer slow-cooked bacon; and bacon grease saved is great for frying other stuff, adds some good flavor to almost anything. Except maybe tofu, that stuff is beyond help.
      Quote Originally Posted by Tavarish
      The car's best safety feature includes ejecting you in the moment of impact and wishing you the best of luck.

    20. Member Michael Bee's Avatar
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      05-24-2012 08:54 PM #395
      This is coming along nicely! I just can't wait for the FS thread for the other red Scirocco you have!!

    21. Member
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      05-25-2012 05:11 PM #396
      Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bee View Post
      This is coming along nicely! I just can't wait for the FS thread for the other red Scirocco you have!!
      Thank you sir. And I'll give you and early bird special on the S1: one mmmmmmillion dollars *holds pinky to corner of mouth*

      I spent most of the day cleaning up, since the car has reached the milestone of having a running drivetrain. The tiptissery is now on the fire pit pile, and the general grunge has been removed from the garage and the basement and everything in them.

      I did get the antenna installed:



      I don't anticipate having a radio in this car, but:

      If I want a radio someday,
      I'd need an antenna,
      so I'd have to remove the rear of the headliner,
      so I'd have to remove the quarter glass,
      and the hatch seal,
      and who knows what else.

      So I put an antenna in now

      Oh and Blooper for the day:



      I was installing the steering column, but astute observers will note that it's not on the car, and the column itself is missing.

      See, the splines were a snug fit into the U joint. Now, if I'd had a screwdriver on me, I'd have spread the U joint a bit...

      ...but all I had was a hammer.

      So I hit the top of the column, and as I'm *whack* hitting, the splines are slowly engaging *smack*, and I'm recalling that I read somewhere *smash* that you shouldn't do that *pow*, but since I can't remember why *bang*, it can't be that important...

      ...except that now the column is 3" too short

      ...and won't extend because the strap the sets the length got caught in the telescoping part and it's totally jammed I have folks with bigger tools and bigger arms working on it, but we'll see how that works out...

      So I get the doofus award today

    22. Member
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      05-26-2012 09:03 PM #397
      Last night I got the tail lights and the license plate backing plate cleaned up and installed:



      I'm missing a bunch of bulbs but the brake lights and the reverse lights work, which is good because it means my wiring is so-far-so-good.

      I also got the front end halves torn down, not much to start with that's good:



      I'll think these rotors are good for one more resurfacing :



      This morning we got up early to spend the day with our 10 year old's friend at the drag strip. His Dad made him this mini dragster :





      He also fixed the steering column for me. The telescoping section is really snug, but to be sure that vibration wouldn't let it lengthen and bind the U-joints, it even has a nice strap rigged up to replace the one I broke, and the lower bearing is tweaked to work and slide like it should but not fall out .

      Installed:



      It feels really smooth . Next was the switch assembly, steering wheel and column covers:



      The wipers work but the washer doesn't. I also noticed the vents don't work well, so a couple of things to troubleshoot yet. I also have to get some bulbs to check turn signals, lighting, etc...
      Last edited by echassin; 05-30-2012 at 12:35 PM.

    23. Member Mean 'n Green86's Avatar
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      05-26-2012 09:30 PM #398
      Excellent work this has.been fun to watch
      VW's the older the better
      http://www.4everkustoms.com/ <=THE BEST
      BUY MY PARTS MKII MOSTLY
      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...7#post82154097

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      05-26-2012 10:02 PM #399
      my goodness, i love the scirocco forum!
      - Ben
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    25. 05-27-2012 06:20 AM #400



      Those wire colors look like Green w/ White Stripe
      Orange w/ ('I can't tell from here') &
      Brown as in Ground Wires.

      can you twist the thing around some more and snap a second picture to contrast/compare?

      (I think I have a PDF version of Scirocco MkII/16V schematics around somewheres...)

      Two thoughts come to mind; are the brown wires Zero ohms to Chassis Ground? (vs being brown ground wires that are switched ground wires.)

      Secondly; many early VWs like ours had test point junctions for the Bosch Certified Stations/Dealers, etc to plug tsting equiptment into the loom without disconnection stuff. Theres connectors cause a great deal of head scratching if you are trying to "find out were these loose wires go?"


      [EDIT] I see you fired it up and got the basics of a running engine so my post might be moot at this point.

      Still, It would be nice to be definitive in finding out what purposes those wires/connectors serve.

      (Oh, I just remembered- they are for the optional Flux Capacitor!. well- duh...)
      Last edited by TBerk; 05-27-2012 at 06:34 AM.

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