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    Thread: Has anyone fried a ecu on a 2012 2.0t .. apr

    1. Member GoLfUnV's Avatar
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      06-21-2012 05:26 PM #106
      Quote Originally Posted by electricme View Post
      Maybe if we make enough threads someone will actually come up with direct port chipping for the MKVI platform!
      Not going to happen, unless VW/Bosch(or who ever makes ECUs for VW) provide unlock codes fore every ECU out there.

    2. Junior Member Amarant9's Avatar
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      06-21-2012 11:16 PM #107
      I'm experiencing the same issues. Getting SAI and EVAP codes..Glad to see I'm not the only one.... WTH is going on here?! :/
      2010 MKVI GTI, Stage 1 APR tune and Stage 1 Carbonio CAI (soon).

    3. Member tstahlGTI's Avatar
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      06-22-2012 06:45 AM #108
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post

      Back at the dealer .. Epc light angry gti ... Grr



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      They have the structural integrity of origami, the reliability of a drunk on New Year's Eve, and they're based off of a '70s Fiat design but built under communist labor (You now, guys who know they can't be fired for any reason.)
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    4. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 03:03 AM #109
      Quote Originally Posted by Amarant9 View Post
      I'm experiencing the same issues. Getting SAI and EVAP codes..Glad to see I'm not the only one.... WTH is going on here?! :/
      You are going to want to speak with APR
      Quote Originally Posted by RFXCGTI View Post
      Same issue??
      No this time it went into limp mode. My tech said its throwing an open code for the some kinda fuel control. He is going to verify the harness isnt trashed and see if the ecu is working. Its either the ecu or the high pressure fuel pump. I'm hoping for a fuel pump. Ill be down 2 weeks if its an ecu. Sold my jetta 3 hours before the gti took a dump. I bought this the next day. At least I am not without a car. Sucks paying for something i cant drive though.
      Last edited by Pineapplegti !; 06-25-2012 at 03:06 AM.
      autocrats...

    5. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 05:07 PM #110
      Got the call from the dealer.. Its the ecu.. On hold with APR. btw APR your hold music sucks.
      autocrats...

    6. Member NathanDetroit's Avatar
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      06-25-2012 06:47 PM #111
      this is the kind of thread that seriously makes me question whether it's worth it to tune.

    7. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 06:57 PM #112
      Quote Originally Posted by NathanDetroit View Post
      this is the kind of thread that seriously makes me question whether it's worth it to tune.
      J757 the ground from the ecm to the control relay fuel pump high psi regulator is the code .. The problem isn't the tune . The problem is the weak tune vw gave us in the place.
      autocrats...

    8. Member NathanDetroit's Avatar
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      06-25-2012 07:55 PM #113
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post
      J757 the ground from the ecm to the control relay fuel pump high psi regulator is the code .. The problem isn't the tune . The problem is the weak tune vw gave us in the place.
      the tune itself may not be a problem, but you did experience another problem directly related to the ECU being pulled for the tune and apparently not handled properly. I agree it sucks that the vehicle isn't shipped with a better factory tune. Unfortunately if us owners want to unlock that potential, we need risk potentially voiding warranties and dealing with a host of potential problems.

    9. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 08:02 PM #114
      Quote Originally Posted by NathanDetroit View Post
      the tune itself may not be a problem, but you did experience another problem directly related to the ECU being pulled for the tune and apparently not handled properly. I agree it sucks that the vehicle isn't shipped with a better factory tune. Unfortunately if us owners want to unlock that potential, we need risk potentially voiding warranties and dealing with a host of potential problems.
      The first time it was tuned the "tuner" was very professional about it.. Funny white grounded suit..I just think the ecus are really fragile.
      autocrats...

    10. Member MN6845's Avatar
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      06-25-2012 08:10 PM #115
      It seem to be the 2012s are having the most problems, hope my car avoids these problems.

    11. 06-25-2012 09:01 PM #116
      Quote Originally Posted by MN6845 View Post
      It seem to be the 2012s are having the most problems, hope my car avoids these problems.
      Mine is a 2011 and I have had the cooling fans issue. The dealer swapped in a new ECU and I haven't had any problems since.

    12. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 09:15 PM #117
      Quote Originally Posted by RFXCGTI View Post
      Mine is a 2011 and I have had the cooling fans issue. The dealer swapped in a new ECU and I haven't had any problems since.
      Did you have a tune ?
      autocrats...

    13. 06-25-2012 09:23 PM #118
      I HAD a tune before they swapped out the ECU. I wish I could have sent my ECU to APR to find out exactly what went wrong, but I couldn't pass it up since the dealer covered it under warranty. I am waiting to see how other people with the problem like you make out before I get my tune back.

    14. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 09:26 PM #119
      Quote Originally Posted by RFXCGTI View Post
      I HAD a tune before they swapped out the ECU. I wish I could have sent my ECU to APR to find out exactly what went wrong, but I couldn't pass it up since the dealer covered it under warranty. I am waiting to see how other people with the problem like you make out before I get my tune back.
      Im surprised they were able to fix it without vwoa finding out you had a tune. Good show
      autocrats...

    15. Member dstackmasta27's Avatar
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      06-25-2012 11:03 PM #120
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post
      Im surprised they were able to fix it without vwoa finding out you had a tune. Good show
      I've heard from my service shop that it all depends on how the shop handles the problem. Most of the guys at the shop I go to are tuned (they may be a bit "slower" than I like to have work on my car), but they always try to help me out first.

      Sorry to hear your ride is back down
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      ||in queue for install: VWR springs, APR 2+ tune, HAWK HPS pads||

    16. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-25-2012 11:09 PM #121
      Quote Originally Posted by dstackmasta27 View Post
      I've heard from my service shop that it all depends on how the shop handles the problem. Most of the guys at the shop I go to are tuned (they may be a bit "slower" than I like to have work on my car), but they always try to help me out first.

      Sorry to hear your ride is back down
      It happened.. what can ya do. I have a personal friend who is my tech and the dealership is supermod friendly. The shop manager even has a tuned car. Its vwoa.. not the dealership being the party pooper. At the same time I understand their position. If you bought a laptop from bestbuy .. proceeded to open it up and f with it.. break it and try to return it because it broke lol. It wouldn't fly.
      autocrats...

    17. Member dstackmasta27's Avatar
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      06-25-2012 11:12 PM #122
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post
      It happened.. what can ya do. I have a personal friend who is my tech and the dealership is supermod friendly. The shop manager even has a tuned car. Its vwoa.. not the dealership being the party pooper. At the same time I understand their position. If you bought a laptop from bestbuy .. proceeded to open it up and f with it.. break it and try to return it because it broke lol. It wouldn't fly.
      No, but isn't that why people go to Wal Mart?
      2012 CSG Golf R - EVOMS Intake, 42DD Downpipe Street w/Res, Podi True Blue boost gauge, 42DD solid shift bushings, Euro dash cubby. *More goodies are in your future*

      ||in queue for install: VWR springs, APR 2+ tune, HAWK HPS pads||

    18. 06-26-2012 01:25 AM #123
      wow... this thread...

      The sheer number of 2012 APR tune failures is frightening. But we can't count them, because that thread got closed up tight.

      * edited to tone down my rudeness
      Last edited by epic designs; 06-26-2012 at 11:47 AM.

    19. Member dstackmasta27's Avatar
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      06-26-2012 11:24 AM #124


      this should be interesting...
      2012 CSG Golf R - EVOMS Intake, 42DD Downpipe Street w/Res, Podi True Blue boost gauge, 42DD solid shift bushings, Euro dash cubby. *More goodies are in your future*

      ||in queue for install: VWR springs, APR 2+ tune, HAWK HPS pads||

    20. 06-26-2012 12:39 PM #125
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post
      Im surprised they were able to fix it without vwoa finding out you had a tune. Good show
      Yea my dealer is pretty mod friendly as well. The guy that helped me out is friends with the owners of the shop I got my APR tune at. I don't know how he was able to get it covered through VWoA...

    21. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 12:41 PM #126
      Quote Originally Posted by epic designs View Post
      wow... this thread...

      The sheer number of 2012 APR tune failures is frightening. But we can't count them, because that thread got closed up tight.

      * edited to tone down my rudeness
      I never saw such a thread .. When was this ?
      autocrats...

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      06-26-2012 12:54 PM #127
      Has APR responded to anyone about these occurances? I know many of you are trying to shift blame away from APR but obviously the common theme here is the tune. It could very well be something changed on the 2012 that was subtle enough to cause failures with an APR tune... maybe they shifted manufacturing plants to China for the ECU--who knows!

    23. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 01:25 PM #128
      Quote Originally Posted by lilfleck View Post
      Has APR responded to anyone about these occurances? I know many of you are trying to shift blame away from APR but obviously the common theme here is the tune. It could very well be something changed on the 2012 that was subtle enough to cause failures with an APR tune... maybe they shifted manufacturing plants to China for the ECU--who knows!
      I'm not shifting the blame from anyone. APR is aware of what's going on due to them shelling out money to replace / fix ecus. There isnt much they can do . It's obvious the ecus are extremely fragile and the fact they have to be opened to be flashed is rolling the dice. It's a contingency they are willing to deal with. I am sure they have flashed a bunch with no issues. I do see some fine print coming in future apr flashes though . At this point they are doing right by me other than not overnighting one if their r8s to drive as a loaner while my gti is broke .
      autocrats...

    24. 06-26-2012 02:39 PM #129
      Quote Originally Posted by Pineapplegti ! View Post
      I never saw such a thread .. When was this ?
      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-from-a-tune**

      There's that, and I count at least 6 other threads talking about fried ecu's. In each of those threads are several "same thing happened to me" type posts. The poll was meant so the failures could be counted and the problem quantified. But it was closed before it could. How many people had failures, had their ECUs replaced under warranty, and didn't post anything about it? There is life outside of vwvortex...

      It seems the installers are taking blame and not the software itself. While I wouldn't rule the software out entirely, it is very unlikely for a flash to work fine for awhile, then all of a sudden fry an ECU. But to rule it out completely is naive. Just because the value in the box CAN be modified within a range of acceptable values, does not mean the hardware has been tested stable with the whole range of possible values. For instance, via software, you could change the frequency and period of a typical PWM output. By doing so, you could increase the average power through that circuit & pin beyond its design parameters. I'm not saying at all this is what is happening, I'm just saying, that you can't rule out software as a killer of hardware. The ECU has an integrated power supply, thermal management components, and all kinds of other supporting hardware that is only designed to operate within the limits of the factory programming. A simple error in programming could potentially make the ecu fail.

      Of course the installers may be at fault. But the question was raised already, shouldn't the tuner be training them and ensuring they are able to carry out the modifications to their specifications? Why should there be a quality difference with getting your flash from the tuner directly or from a dealer? If the dealer is not qualified to safely perform the modification, then why are they allowed to be a dealer?

      Just sayin'

    25. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 03:19 PM #130
      Ok I remember that thread.. I think I voted too lol . It's funny that Anthony himself locked it. It sounds like he had some unhappy vendors messaging him. Lol
      autocrats...

    26. Forum Sponsor Arin@APR's Avatar
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      06-26-2012 04:42 PM #131
      Speaking with tech support, they mentioned under 10 damaged ECUs they could remember from this entire year. That's an extremely low number given how many ECU's we chip a day. For example, ONLY counting 2012 ECUs, there were over 60 ECU chipped by us this past week at full retail price, outside of any specials, shows, etc, so it's not exactly the highest volume time of the year. If we count all of the ECUs that must be opened to be flashed, that number goes way up.

      APR, Other companies, or tuning in general simply does not cause the ECU to go bad. If it did, there's no way we could be in business today.

      Edit, the more I look at the numbers, there's simply no way there's any funny business going on. I started out by counting all of the 2012 ECUs flashed since January of this year and planned to go all the way to today but I gave up after that number surpassed 1,000 in 3 months. Now, that's only ECU's that are confirmed as a 2012 ECU, meaning the ECU part number changed on the 2012 model, and often times they don't as 2010, or 2011 part numbers will carry into the next model year. That's also only a 3 month snap shot, one being the shortest month in the year and not even our busiest time of the year, lol. Point being, there's no way APR software's burning up 2012 ECU's. If we were, then we'd probably be out of business by now if we had a million dollar ECU repair bill after only a couple months!
      Last edited by Arin@APR; 06-26-2012 at 05:14 PM.
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    27. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 05:00 PM #132
      Figured as much . Of course I'm one of the few... Just my luck .. Question Arin .. When you folks replace the ecu do you send the dealer one or go through the dealer that will be doing the pairing to the vehicle ?
      autocrats...

    28. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 05:07 PM #133
      This is the code it threw this time . Harness tested between ecu and relay .. No signal or ( ground) from the ecu . Kinda the same thing that happened before with my sai/evap.


      (J757 the ground from the ecm to the control relay fuel pump high psi regulator)
      autocrats...

    29. 06-26-2012 05:48 PM #134
      So, if we assume everyone with a problem brought the problem back to APR, and assume that your sales numbers are unbiased and truthful, then you're at a 1% failure rate. Not bad, not great. At least it's one data point. In my business we investigate any repeated failure (0.2% for your 1000 units). At 1% we would be freaking out and reaching out to all customers with at least an explanation of what is happening, why, and what to expect if/when it happens to them.
      Last edited by epic designs; 06-26-2012 at 05:51 PM.

    30. 06-26-2012 05:53 PM #135
      This thread demonstrates the danger of these forums.

      Before I bought my GTI I joined the forums and almost decided not to get one because of all the stories of problems with these cars.

      If Arin's number are right, 10 fried 2012 ECUs out of thousands and look at all the traffic and concern they have generated. We all get a skewed impression of real life on these forums.

      As has been said before, complaints get aired but satisfaction isn't news.

      It's just a good reminder that we all need to take a deep breath.

      If you've had a problem, this is a good place to get answers, advice and help. But remember, this isn't the real world.

    31. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 06:04 PM #136
      For what it's worth I didn't make this thread to bash APR.. I made it to inform others on my situation in case they are in the same boat . I think APR has handled the situation correctly so far with the exception of the first call I made to the. . That could of been a miscommunication of facts though .
      autocrats...

    32. Forum Sponsor Arin@APR's Avatar
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      06-26-2012 06:33 PM #137
      Quote Originally Posted by epic designs View Post
      So, if we assume everyone with a problem brought the problem back to APR, and assume that your sales numbers are unbiased and truthful, then you're at a 1% failure rate. Not bad, not great.
      No, that's completely wrong.

      I counted 1000+ 2012 ECU's in the first 3 months of 2012. That does not account for EVERY ecu that's opened so far this year. You're not counting some of the 2009's, 2010's & 2011's. There's nothing on here for April, May and June. If we count EVERY ECU, the number is FAR FAR FAR higher. I'm just going to say it.... FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR higher.

      There's also the obvious ECUS that are damaged when the case is opened. These are as clear as day. A chip is knocked off and the ECU is DOA but 99+% of the time it's fixable. It's a mistake. It can happen. When people first started opening ECU's it happened more often, but now, it's pretty rare.

      Also, we're not even removing ECU's from that list that are defective from the factory. This actually happened quite a bit and our dealer tech friends mentioned it happening on stock vehicles. Upon further inspection of failed ECU's with the same issue, we found part of the circuite board was not properly soldered, and it happened to be on the underside of the ECU, which is never touched during the chipping process. There's a laundry list of errors that can happen when those parts are bad. Most were actually EVAP codes. Go figger. : )

      All in all, no, this is not an APR issue. It never was, and never will be. That said, when something happens to one of our customers, we fix it. Why? Because we love you.
      Last edited by Arin@APR; 06-26-2012 at 06:35 PM.
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    33. Member Pineapplegti !'s Avatar
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      06-26-2012 11:26 PM #138
      autocrats...

    34. 06-27-2012 08:06 AM #139
      Why are we only worrying about 2012 models? I have a 2011 with similar issues which lucky for me, the dealer covered under warranty. Unlucky for me however, I lost my tune in the process . I really want to go back to a tune, and I would like to keep APR, especially since I've already paid for it! However, I am hesitant to do it because I do not want to run into the same problem, and I can guarantee you if it happens again, my dealer will not cover it this time...

      Arin, can you give me a recommendation here? I like the idea of sending my ECU directly to you guys at APR to cut out the mistakes the vendors could make during the install, but then I have to ship it back to you any time I have a problem leaving me without a car. If I go to a local vendor (BFI is mine here in Raleigh) at least I have local support, but they may have been the reason my ECU went bad with the first install....

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      06-27-2012 08:16 AM #140
      Quote Originally Posted by RFXCGTI View Post
      Why are we only worrying about 2012 models? I have a 2011 with similar issues which lucky for me, the dealer covered under warranty. Unlucky for me however, I lost my tune in the process . I really want to go back to a tune, and I would like to keep APR, especially since I've already paid for it! However, I am hesitant to do it because I do not want to run into the same problem, and I can guarantee you if it happens again, my dealer will not cover it this time...

      Arin, can you give me a recommendation here? I like the idea of sending my ECU directly to you guys at APR to cut out the mistakes the vendors could make during the install, but then I have to ship it back to you any time I have a problem leaving me without a car. If I go to a local vendor (BFI is mine here in Raleigh) at least I have local support, but they may have been the reason my ECU went bad with the first install....
      Try going to where you got the tune, with the receipt of the tune and the receipt of the warranty replacement. If they're in a good mood, maybe they'll do it for you since you already paid and have proof of it.

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