Very well explained thank you
With that said, pushing power gradually over time and monitoring all the vitals, I finally turned two of mine into bananas at around 360 AWTQ spiking really early. So in reality they are much stronger than most believed but that is a loaded statement because that's assuming a good tune with good AFR, knock and heat management. Most knuckle heads bending or snapping rods out there are doing it because of something screwy in the tune that would have the same effect on upgraded rods. Obviously everyone find it simple to just put the blame on the OEM rods but in reality they can take quite a bit of torque (with everything else in check) before they show their weakness. My feeling is that most DD stock frames turbo/hybrids will not push enough torque to hurt them as long as everything else is kosher.
This is what finally happened to mine with a good tune around 360 AWTQ right after switching to E85. Most people will never push enough boost, run enough timing to destroy those unless there is another variable that put extra stress on them. Please use that info wisely!
I swear that you’ve peeked under the hood of my build with this list Since mine is going to be just a daily driver, I’m sticking with a FMIC for now and see how it goes. Water/Meth injection will be minimized just to keep in simple. Otherwise, it’s nearly the same list, just add a 2.1L into the mix.
My philosophy is somewhat the same as yours. I asked myself “How much time do I spend above 5K on the street?” “Where do I want my power?” And the most important question: “What build is going to be the most fun to drive?” I think we sometimes suck the joy out of driving one of these great cars by doggedly pursuing “big numbers”. Balance and reliability should be part of the equation also.
My best test will be how does the car react to my input and does it meet my idea of how my sports car should perform.
My only concern at this time is will the F23 fall off too quickly due to the extra 20% effective volume of the new engine….let’s find out.
Last edited by Atomic Ed; 04-25-2012 at 02:09 PM.
Audi TT 2001 ROADSTER FWD
BILSTEIN PSS9, DEFCON competition kit, NEUSPEED f/r adjustable anti sway bar, APR stage 1 ecu, APR stage 1 clutch, INJEN cold air intake race series, intake manifold spacer, light weight pulleys, FORGE hybrid DV/BOV, FORGE relocation kit, SPYDER led smoked taillights, smoked side markers
A lot of this information is good, but not relevant to the OP. His car is a base TT180 model with the K03 turbo. So he simply needs an upgraded transversal-fitment manifold, which that XS Power company sells. The one they sent was for longitudinal-engine fitment, like a Passat or A4.
Two companies with similar K04 Performance Turbo Exhaust cast manifold :
JBS : 350 BP excl.. VAT = 565.999 USD
Cost : 499,00 EUR incl. 19% VAT = 534.481 USD excl shipping
Last edited by ModsTTand; 04-26-2012 at 01:25 AM.
Interesting find. Looks like HG-Motorsport is using the same casting company as JBS.
Sorry we hijacked your thread, but as both Doug and I stated, XS-Power sent you the wrong manifold.
I just wanted to give you the benefit of my research and knowledge on the use of these types of manifolds. The question I should have asked is how long do you want the manifold to last?
It's almost impossible to build a tubular manifold at this price that is going to last a long while. As with any manufacturing process, some of these manifolds will last a lot longer than the average, and some won't last at all. I even question the quality of the steel. I'm sure it's technically 321 stainless, but it can't be a low carbon stainless. You can't buy quality 321 tubing for that price, even in China.
Our cars seem to put a lot of strain on the exhaust manifolds, so through a lot of heat cycles, tubular manifolds, on the average, fail quicker. Cast manifolds still have a wide range of materials and casting quality issues, but seem to hold up better, again, on the average.
I've popped the flange welds on my 42DD downpipe twice now and finally had a heavier duty flange made to cope with the stress of bigger eliminator turbo. (My new F23 turbo is much lighter and shouldn't be a problem.)
The XS-power manifold may be just the ticket for you, if you are looking to just play with it as a hobby. As for long term reliability, you might want to re-consider.
just to spice things up for Our beloved K04 crowd:
Last edited by ModsTTand; 04-27-2012 at 01:37 AM.
JBS's unit has not even been on the market for that long and allready it is ripped off. How people think this is ok baffles me daily . Screw ingenuity....I am going to start copying everyone's ****.
This industry has officially seen the last of days.
Its my fault not mentioning this : WWW.HG-motorsport.de offered their product before JBS finished R&D/release their product ,maybe its shared development!
HPA is not a clone-company of HGP !
Revo Started by Cloning APR ECU Maps!
Branding costs,Cloning/replicating is cheap, Research&Developing is something even better.
my Advice to OP : please before ordering any part consider picking one : price/durability?
Last edited by ModsTTand; 04-28-2012 at 09:45 AM.
I can tell you JBS did the hard lift on the deveopment of this product. I was in contact with them as far back as Feb. 2010 on this product. I worked with them to make sure the ATP 2871 eliminator would fit and clear the new design. Even then, JBS design work goes farther back into the 2009 time period.
But, it's possible that this is a licensed agreement between the two companies. Maybe JBS needed a partner to cover the cost of the initial setup and minimum first run volume. Or maybe it is a knock off and the legal battle will begin. Unless JBS wants to bring the issue to the public's attention, we'll never really know for sure.
But I still tip to JBS for taking the business risk for putting out a high quality item like this and gambling on such a narrow market. Money sent, product received.
In the end this sucks and I guess some of just have to "deal with it".
JBS for sure was the first company to make that manifold. I know this first hand...
Most 225/180 guys look at it this way ....
High flow K04 manifold ($500) + K04 hybrid ( $1000) + Software ( $600) = approx $2000. They are allready half way there to a decent turbo kit based on a billet compressor wheel turbocharger that isn't modeled off a 15+ year old CHRA.
of course feedback / input is always welcome.
That's still cheaper then going BT and could be an intermediate step. Also if my ko4 would blow I would more than likely go in that direction.
I think it's unfortunate that the majority of the aftermarket turbo stuff for our cars is for BT applications. It's pretty obvious that there is a market for a small/Ko4 set up. The more we discuss it, the more I think people understand that day to day lag free turbos can be perfect for a daily. Aw hell, I'm doing it. That $2000 for a turbo setup might be 1/2 way to lots of power, but it's spot on for "just right" in my book. When I hit my goal of a daily driver with 300hp/300tq, all will be right with the world
It's too bad 034 has discontinued work on this mani. It does explain why they have gone radio silent on the issue after many attempts to get the straight scoop out of them. However, they did put one on their Silverlight project (see Eurotuner magazine, search for Project Silverlight) and stated they were going to put out a kit using the K04 manifold and an ATP 2871 eliminator. (Yes or no??)
Here is what is so frustrating about all of this. If a product doesn't work out, then manufacturers/retailers should just say so. Most customers would respect a company a lot more if they would just buck up and say it doesn't work or it’s just not economically feasible, so we're dropping it. It's the waiting with no answer that kills customer relations.
Yeah, there are a few that would bitch, but for the most part, honesty will win most customers over in the long run, even if they don’t like the initial message. Doug's business model is a great example of this.
Sorry OP, the need and the development a decent manifold for the 225 transverse has been an issue for a long time in the community. Your post has brought this to the surface.
Last edited by Atomic Ed; 04-29-2012 at 12:52 PM.
Sam -- I know my hopes for seeing a return of that manifold are slim. Your explanation of why makes sense. But I can also relate to the frustrating history of that 034: it got tripped up by an easy-to-remedy specification error. And for a niche product like that to survive, it couldn't stumble out of the gate like it did.
Anyway, I'm just putting it out there (as a guy who sells a competing product): that manifold has a place in the market. Keep an eye out as spartiati and I soon begin to Maestro tune a stock motor using that thing. You'll see.
By the way Sam, at least you made a decision and stated it, thanks.
The decision to move forward to develop a quality manifold is even tougher now (or maybe easier, depending on how you look at it) with the JBS on the market.
We discussed it before, better casting material and thicker walls would do the trick on the 034 manifold. Sand casting in itself is not a bad thing if done right.