MKV .:R - Bilstein PSS10 & Nuespeed 25mm Rear Sway
First I would like to say that if the initial failed part was not touched by the owner...then the "pay to play" comments appear to have no validity. If the initial part that failed was not influenced by the modifications the owner made…then VW would be responsible if under warranty. A bolt backing out is crazy…that is wrong…VERY WRONG. If the correct type of bolt is being used in the application it was designed for and is installed properly it should NEVER back out. Two exceptions... unless specifically designed to do so or something is wrong. I have the feeling the flywheel bolts are not designed to back out...so I am going to go with something is wrong...final answer. Something has caused this and that is what the dealership needs to identify. The failure of other parts and/or systems after the bolt backed out is secondary at this point. Those failures were caused by the bolt. I would hate for anyone to pay $9k and have the same problem later due to the real problem not being resolved.
So if we are getting the complete story from the owner...I would think VW and the VW dealership needs to resolve the issue.
It appears to me that the owner attempted to get this issue resolved. He went to the dealer and also spoke with the manufacture for the software upgrade. I am not really sure what other measures could have been taken that would have yielded different results. The dealership is responsible for diagnostics of the car, no? So if the issue was not diagnosed properly by the very entity who exist to do just that...makes me think the dealer is at fault (just my opinion).
Hopefully this will be resolved in a manner where VW and the owner will be happy.
VW service is just terrible, and the fact I hear stuff from my neighbors who own VW's and suffer the same issues similar to Beta and others on the Tex is ridiculous, these people are not even close to the modification market and still getting the shaft.
VW would only be liable through negligence or through malice.
Not sure if that's the case here, but from this rather lengthy Google search it seems that they have a bit of a problem with their dual mass flywheels.
There's even numerous YouTube videos of failing/failed flywheels on DSG and manual tranny cars.
Even if VW doesn't consider it a recall-worthy problem, it's hard to believe VW mechanics don't know about it and aren't aware of the symptoms.
No 3,222, tornado red, Borla cat back, Haldex sport controller, S2T paddles, Velocity Sport CAI
Fact : 7 out of 10 flywheel bolts sheared of after a dealer checked the car and claimed everything was normal.
VW's biggest roadblock to success and atgaining #1 in the world is it's mostly shiity dealer network.....
My dealer is exceptional, however, far from the norm for most people.
I am a former Service manger and shopowner and treating customers well is th key to success.
I have dealt with Shawn and he is a true enthusiast and VW lover, maybe not after this though.....
He maintains his car exceptionally ell and deeply cares about keeping it pristine.......
In my 50 years of fabricating, building cars from scratch, (Street Rods & racecars), none of the mods to Shawn's car would cause a defect like flywheel bolts back out and then shear off.
It's a defect plain and simple - VW like other Mfrs don't want to spend the $$ or even admit it's their fault because with todays propensity to sue it would leave then exposed for every issue that ever happens.
Some of you morons took an accusatory tone towards Shawn, as if he could cause defective flywheels bolts, without them ever being touched.
When ignorant of the facts and apparently mechanical problems it's best to just not comment until you know the situation fully.
I personally think VW bears some responsibility here and it would be a great public relations move to assist Shawn, their actions could solidify their customer's loyalty and do them world of good.
My family bought a 1957 VW Kombi new as our first VW, We presently have 5 in the family and in 55 years our experience has been almost always positive, not a bad record.
I have VCDS
Old Geezer addicted to cars, bikes, racing and my Grandkids and The Dragon
oldracer = used to race 911's and many other cars for 25 years, owned a race/fabrication shop for 11 years
UM Combo tune, PSS Michelins, garage queen at his point
I don't think anyone said any such thing (at least I didn't).Originally Posted by oldracer
What I did say, based on what I've read in the different threads so far (summed up for the reading-comprehension impaired):
1) Car has issues.
2) Car is taken to dealer, dealer can't find anything wrong
3) Beta notices the issue is still to some extent there even after blessing from dealer, doesn't take it to other mechanic/dealer/etc for a second opinion for whatever reason
4) Hell breaks loose during trip
I am not saying Beta did anything wrong or bad to his car. What I am saying is that from VW's perspective, he has a out-of-warranty car with modifications that (they could claim) could/would hinder the diagnostic process.
I am *NOT* saying the mods did cause any issues or were the cause for the issue.
I AM saying that a dealer will use this as an excuse for why they couldn't properly diagnose any issues, if needed.
We were asked go and like/comment on the post on VW's FB page.Originally Posted by oldracer
Using this standard, why should anyone like/comment on the FB wall-post?
Maybe the dealer should get some of the blame for not performing a more thorough check, sure, specially if they were negligent in doing a thorough check in any way. Maybe Beta should have taken the car to another dealer or a mechanic to have it checked again, since the problem was still there.Originally Posted by oldracer
Yes, maybe it would be good PR, but I don't think VW bears any responsibility. They haven't done anything wrong as far as I can tell from what I've read.
It's a crappy situation, and I do hope it works out for Beta, but you can't expect a manufacturer to accept responsibility for products that are out-of-warranty or services that aren't provided directly by them.
Reminds me of when the DSG mechatronic issue came up. Some people walked into their dealer and got a new mech no issue. Some walked in and were told everything was as normal, go away.
I'm learning not to trust VW. I should check my flywheel bolts.
How is it that you come to the conclusion that the manufacture is not responsible given what has been posted. Again, bolts are meant to secure things...that being the case if a blolt backs out due to no fault of the owner why would the owner or dealership be at fault.
I believe the dealer should have done a better inspection but if the bolt backed out...the dealer nor the owner would have anything to do with that. The warranty on this would be tricky in my eyes...because a bolt backing out should never happen. So based on the warranty stand point they can deny it but a bolt backing out...manufacture issue if you ask me. Either design or installation at factory...I do not think its design but more and more threads are showing up about flywheel issues.
Just my thoughts...
Bumper-to-Bumper - 48k/4yr
Drivetrain - 60k/5yr
DSG - 100k/10yr
Beta unfortunately is somewhere north of 83k miles (as he mentioned in his other thread), hence the drivetrain warranty no longer applies.
Outside of warranty, if things break (for whatever reason), I'd imagine we're pretty much on our own (unless I'm mistaken on how warranties work).
I agree with you saying the dealer should have done a better inspection, which maybe could have prevented all of this.I believe the dealer should have done a better inspection but if the bolt backed out...the dealer nor the owner would have anything to do with that. The warranty on this would be tricky in my eyes...because a bolt backing out should never happen. So based on the warranty stand point they can deny it but a bolt backing out...manufacture issue if you ask me. Either design or installation at factory...I do not think its design but more and more threads are showing up about flywheel issues.
Just my thoughts...
But like I said above, the car is ~20k miles over the warranty on the drivetrain. At what point would we agree that mechanical parts can start to fail? 100k miles? 200k? Never?
When is a manufacturer no longer 'on the hook' when things break?
What happened to Beta sucks, and I hope his issue gets resolved soon, but I don't think it's fair to demand or expect VW to 'fix' this (like some of the comments on FB seem to be asking), when as far as I can tell have done nothing wrong.
After being approached by 3 individuals on this forum and now finding this...I'm going to do my best to get this KNOWN by the dealership network and possibly addressed. Read on, sounds like a similar situation as mine.