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    VWVortex


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    Thread: Anyone else using CIS-e without the computer?

    1. Member flyinglizard's Avatar
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      05-01-2012 01:58 PM #1
      I swapped my 8V, A-2, Chumper to CIS- E, and have got it to work pretty well without wires. Has anyone else been down this road?
      I have the fuel flow at about 69gr/ ml. per injector @ 30 secs. Does that sound about right?
      In order to get an idle @ this rate, I notched the pancake plate.
      Last edited by flyinglizard; 05-01-2012 at 02:01 PM.
      The http://www.fwdracingguide.com/ Money back guarantee!, You can go 100$ faster with this 20$ guide
      Mike and Michael Ogren, Protech Racing,25 yrs of Racing VWs. mogren@tampabay.rr.com[/email], 352.428/8983
      ]

    2. Member chois's Avatar
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      05-03-2012 10:34 AM #2
      We have always just run it with a handful of wires to allow us to use the DPR for fuel enrichment up top. Remove knock box, trigger ignition module directly from hall, drop WOT feed to ground to force open loop, run CTS through a potentiometer to ground with a normally closed switch triggered open by gas pedal to tell the computer to give it more fuel under high load, and find the sweet spot for fueling the low load using the CO adjusting screw, then high load using the potentiometer on the dyno. (I know you know all this Mike, just putting it up here in case someone new is reading). If anyone wants to try this, there is an engine wiring diagram in the back of the A2 Bentley for the early CIS-E golf with no knock sensor that you can copy to get it running. Then look at what you really need and don't need and what you want to force to see something you control and modify the harness accordingly. I think we ended up with less than a dozen wires for the whole thing.

      We noticed that it could run "dumb" but never tuned it to do so correctly. At that point wouldn't you be better off to just go with CIS basic?
      Chris
      2007 GTI 16v, 4 door, 6sp (well really that one is Brandy's)
      2004.5 Passat Wagon 20v, 1.8t, 4mo, 5sp
      1986 GTI 8v road racer - DIYAutoTune.com

    3. Member flyinglizard's Avatar
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      05-03-2012 12:46 PM #3
      I have not gone that way ever. I just get the high end working, reading the plugs and adjust the bottom/idle enough to get on t track. I have not run any VW on the dyno this way. I am pretty ignorant of the system actually.
      Like I said. I balance the system to flow 65-70 gr fuel/per 30 sec, @ full up pancake. This figure is based on my CIS basic HP car that runs really well, no dyno. just goo d power without blowing the tops off of any pistons.
      I have a few pretty clean CIS E dist, but not many good basic setups. I race what I have. I had maybe 200# of FI stuff out back looking for a box that may work. No "basics: were clean enough to get running easliy.
      I am really happy with it now. I still need to check the control pressure, but the car pulls well to 6400 and keeps some color on the plugs.
      I got the idle mixture close by grinding the edge of the pancake, turning up the idle stop@ throttle plate, backing out idle air screw( gluing it stuck so that it wont fall out)

      This car was the roundy car with Digi removed for the Holley carb. Now it is Chumpy and I hope that it runs 14hrs @ Daytona.

      Questions; Did you remove the little brass screw and turn the tiny allen?( ECPR, DPR)
      The VW does not spend a lot of time at part throttle. It is WOT most of it's life.
      The http://www.fwdracingguide.com/ Money back guarantee!, You can go 100$ faster with this 20$ guide
      Mike and Michael Ogren, Protech Racing,25 yrs of Racing VWs. mogren@tampabay.rr.com[/email], 352.428/8983
      ]

    4. Member chois's Avatar
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      05-03-2012 04:24 PM #4
      Never got things "right enough" to start turning the little hidden screw. Before we got there, we found a solution to move to ecu control.

      A lot of this was done trying to figure out how to fuel things properly in a 4500-9000rpm band short stroke 1.5 application. Without the "2 stage" approach it was not acceptable. Even with, the bottom end was a bit boggy.

      Using the same approach on an IT type motor works fantastic, is reliable and super easy to dial-a-air/fuel ratio on the dyno. Then hard wire in an ammeter to measure the DPR current, note the mA that it likes most on the dyno, and zip tie it to the dash so you can see if something whacks out and it goes rich/lean in an event.
      Chris
      2007 GTI 16v, 4 door, 6sp (well really that one is Brandy's)
      2004.5 Passat Wagon 20v, 1.8t, 4mo, 5sp
      1986 GTI 8v road racer - DIYAutoTune.com

    5. Member flyinglizard's Avatar
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      05-13-2012 10:27 PM #5
      What are you using for reading the AF ratios??
      I am designing a dyno , and will need need some inputs. I need a stalk to plug up the pipe. and some sort of meter.
      TIA, MM
      The http://www.fwdracingguide.com/ Money back guarantee!, You can go 100$ faster with this 20$ guide
      Mike and Michael Ogren, Protech Racing,25 yrs of Racing VWs. mogren@tampabay.rr.com[/email], 352.428/8983
      ]

    6. Member chois's Avatar
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      05-13-2012 11:06 PM #6
      We have been using the innovate LM1
      Chris
      2007 GTI 16v, 4 door, 6sp (well really that one is Brandy's)
      2004.5 Passat Wagon 20v, 1.8t, 4mo, 5sp
      1986 GTI 8v road racer - DIYAutoTune.com

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