BRZ annihilated by French econobox

[Wheelwright]

[lojasmo]

Derp.

[S4cabriofox]

I think the Subaru is not the right choice if you're taking them to the track. They should've compared the FR-S.

And regardless, a 70hp advantage will always make a difference, weight being equal.

[Mazda 3s]

And I'd STILL take the BRZ

[Gran Turismo]

[driveareliablecar]

Subaru built its reputation on rear wheel drive vehicles.

[toucci]

Is that a slushbox in the BRZ?

[XiaoNio]

Is that a slushbox in the BRZ?

If that's the one that they drove back from Europe, then yes. Also... not surprised?

[B3sat16v]

Is that a slushbox in the BRZ?

It sorta looks like it does it..... I still do not think it would make a huge difference.

[c0mmon]

Subaru built its reputation on rear wheel drive vehicles.

huh?

[RogueTDI]

And I'd STILL take the BRZ

x2

So the car can be beaten by other cars. Not the point.

[unintended acceleration]

And I'd STILL take the BRZ

Are people claiming which one they would rather take actually drive either one?

Or is this just the talk out of your ass forum?

[cougar]

Are people claiming which one they would rather take actually drive either one?

Or is this just the talk out of your ass forum?

Aren't you (or whomever said they would) doing the same by saying you'd prefer the Renault?

[20aeman]

Aren't you (or whomever said they would) doing the same by saying you'd prefer the Renault?

The Renault is objectively superior. You can't make a subjective choice (aside from aesthetics) without driving both.

[unintended acceleration]

Aren't you (or whomever said they would) doing the same by saying you'd prefer the Renault?

I never said which would I would prefer because I have never driven the BRZ/Scion version yet. I might not drive it for a while as well because I own a similar, superior car already for 1/2 the price.

[Mazda 3s]

Are people claiming which one they would rather take actually drive either one?

Or is this just the talk out of your ass forum?

1) I live in the U.S. Last time I checked, we can't even buy a Renault so it's not even really worth discussing to me IMHO.
2) I drove a FWD hatch for 5 years; been there done that. I've never owned a RWD car, let alone a lightweight sports car that was designed from the ground up to be one.

Bottom line, there are a lot of butthurt people in here that can't seem to stay out of BRZ/FR-S/GT 86 threads despite the fact that they don't like the car and don't care about the car. I wonder why?

[unintended acceleration]

1) I live in the U.S. Last time I checked, we can't even buy a Renault so it's not even really worth discussing to me IMHO.
2) I drove a FWD hatch for 5 years; been there done that. I've never owned a RWD car, let alone a lightweight sports car that was designed from the ground up to be one.

Bottom line, there are a lot of butthurt people in here that can't seem to stay out of BRZ/FR-S/GT 86 threads despite the fact that they don't like the car and don't care about the car. I wonder why?

It certainly is worth discussing, and maybe its just me but I don't make any claims about cars I would rather have without driving them. There is a difference between discussing them based on surface level observation, and defiantly claiming which one you would rather have without ever even sitting in either one.

It just sounds silly.

I can never say I would own this one or that one in a nutshell. There are too many variables. Maybe its just me but some cars I connect with, and others I don't regardless of the drive wheels, although the # of FWD cars I have driven and liked is exactly 2.

I think people chime in regarding the BRZ because they are dissapointed it only has 200 HP. We are all spoiled with new cars having tons of power, and people want more. Some people don't see value in the intangibles that certain cars have. You can't measure a car based on lap times and 0 - 60 times. I think that is more of an acquired appreciation of cars.

Some cars are more than the sum of its parts or magazine numbers. Maybe the BRZ is, and maybe it isn't. I am sitting on the sidelines until I drive it.

Most will form conclusive opinions on either side of the fence without ever even seeing it in person yet. I guess that works with tons of cars. People hate on things with 0 first hand experience with it.

[Vision33r]

I think the entertainment value of the BRZ on the track is much more rewarding than some car with 100-200hp+ that can't even get the tail around without some early braking and quick hands.

If you need a 300hp+ monster just get the Mustang and skip the BRZ.

[unintended acceleration]

I think the entertainment value of the BRZ on the track is much more rewarding than some car with 100-200hp+ that can't even get the tail around without some early braking and quick hands.

If you need a 300hp+ monster just get the Mustang and skip the BRZ.

You didn't watch the video. The guys in the BRZ looked like they were bored to death.

[Rockmonky]

If you need a 300hp+ monster just get the Mustang and skip the BRZ.

yah.. but.. the mustang will start to fall apart in a year or so... squeaks, rattles, clunks.. those things are junk

[x_GTI_x]

BRZ is overrated as hell, im sick of hearing about it to be honest.


and you guys think mk4 fanbois are bad

[slimmy]

Highly strung NA 4-banger, an Auto no less vs FWD turbo.
The RS is around 10K more expensive (in AU anyway), has heaps more power, torque AND rubber - 235 on the RS vs 205 or 215 on the 86/BRZ depending on trim, no idea on make/model of tyre.

The test was a load of bollocks... the cars are not competitors. This just reeks of an attempt to be first guys out there with a comparison of some sort.

I like the fact Toyota and Subaru are releasing this car... I currently have both an MX-5 and a Megane RS250 (essentially the same car as the 265, sans reflash) so await the chance to drive the 86 with interest.

[unintended acceleration]

I'm test driving a brand new Bugatti Veyron on Monday. I put a deposit down on one already months ago.

You can't afford a new 328 let alone a Buggati.

[50fridge]

To be honest they should have waited for the BRZ STI to come out to do this comparison.

[Rockmonky]

i love the terrified look on the passenger's face in the first car he looked bored in the BRZ

hate the yellow seatbelts tho..

[koko12]

Thread title FAIL.

The Magane 265 is far from an econobox, and it is probably the best handling FWD vehicle currently in production. Think ITR like handling, but with and extra 100 hp and about 150 lb/ft of torque more. If there's an econobox in this test one could argue it is the BRZ.



I wished Infiniti or Nissan would bring this over here as their hot-hatch.


I was very surprised by the driver's assessment of the BRZ. He says you can't get the back to play, but in a timed track test why would you want that? Also we've seen various times this is not the case This review was the complete opposite of what every other review has been saying which leads me to call BS on it.

[mike02467]

First time I've heard the BR-Z has a poor weight distribution. And obviously the Renault is going to be faster, but it shouldn't be 5 seconds a lap faster. I think that driver is a n00b.

[Impeccable]

Thread title FAIL.

The Magane 265 is far from an econobox, and it is probably the best handling FWD vehicle currently in production. Think ITR like handling, but with and extra 100 hp and about 150 lb/ft of torque more. If there's an econobox in this test one could argue it is the BRZ.

I came in figuering it would be the renault ,Tiff loves it I think it whipped a 370z on fifth gear

[.LSinLV.]

Thread title FAIL.

The Magane 265 is far from an econobox, and it is probably the best handling FWD vehicle currently in production. Think ITR like handling, but with and extra 100 hp and about 150 lb/ft of torque more. If there's an econobox in this test one could argue it is the BRZ.



I wished Infiniti or Nissan would bring this over here as their hot-hatch.


I was very surprised by the driver's assessment of the BRZ. He says you can't get the back to play, but in a timed track test why would you want that? Also we've seen various times this is not the case This review was the complete opposite of what every other review has been saying which leads me to call BS on it.

dear God I hope not! I owned one Renault in my life and hope to nevAr see one on the shores of the USA again. I have NEVER, seriously, NEVER owned such a POS as that car. everything on it was poorly engineered, from the self eating CV boots, to the always failing paris-rhone starter, to the crapy designed shift linkage with plastic parts at ALL the stress points.

how renault stays in business is beyond me......seriously ugly cars, designed and built by retards.

[The Holy Molar]

What are we compensating for when we need to have the fastest car?

[RogueTDI]

Lol. I justed watched the video. When i got to the end, i LOL'd and said "oh, its EVO!" First of all, the passenger and driver were both pretty straight faced throughout both drives. 2nd, the track is fairly high speed, so its obvious that substantially more power is going to make a difference (about 6% difference in this case). Finally, this is the second evo review that seems to go out of its way to put down the car on fairly frivolous grounds. After the first, i pretty much wrote off evo as the magazine racers they now further appear to be. Their opinion is definitely in the minority, and i look forward to more respectable reviews. That said, its known that Subaru went for more understeer, so there may be some truth to some of the handling comments.

Bottom line, i dont drink the EVO koolaid, and dont find their critiques or their reviewers credible. I do look forward to track reviews from more respectable sources.

[dcmix5]

So, if I am reading the numbers right, the Mustang would have lost by 4 seconds, instead of 5, to the french econobox?

[HerrGolf]

The Megane is not the best car to compare with the BRZ; they have a very different appeal. I would also imagine that the Toyobaru has a much more conservatively tuned suspension. The Megane is a very focused car, as was the Type-R, and probably more difficult to live with on a daily basis, FWD hatchback layout notwithstanding. Testing the BRZ with an traditional torque-converter automatic also blunts throttle response and affects the ability to adjust the car's cornering using the accelerator. If there were some special edition BRZ with a similarly unforgiving suspension and a manual transmission to test, this comparison would be somewhat closer to sensible. This test is more to prove just how well balanced and sharply tuned the Renault is.

What's amazing to me that the Megane is such a capable platform and that Nissan has done nothing good with it, as demonstrated by the current Sentra. At the very least, they could have chassis tuning handled by Renault engineers and use Renault's suppliers for basic chassis components (shocks, springs). If Nissan can rely on them for their cheaper cars' basic architecture, there's no reason they can't entrust them with fine tuning and other aspects of development, especially considering that Renault makes cars in Mexico, and the Sentra itself is already built there.

[Fritz27]

I see that American public education has been put to good use. The BRZ/FRS is a more important topic than Global Warming, and income inequality anyway.

Get off of TCL and get to work solving those problems then.

[Wheelwright]

Hopefully Subaru will change the chassis calibration soon in response to this fiasco (assuming the basic platform is sound). Subaru must understand that people don't buy dedicated RWD sports cars to handle like 4WD. The company seemed pretty responsive to customer's concerns in the past with the WRX power hike etc: so I keep my fingers crossed.