APR K04 New Install - Misfire Issues on 91 and 93 (stock file no misfire)

[CtNxFLeX]

Hi Everyone,

Kinda sad and disappointed and wanted to vent. Hopefully someone who is reading this may have had a similar issue and knows a resolution

I have a 2008 GLI 6MT FSI. I was running APR Stage 2+ with no issues.

I recently purchased a new APR K04 kit with Injectors and software + APR Intercooler. Had it installed by a local APR Dealer this past Saturday

Long story short, engine light came up while mechanic was testing this past Saturday. Mechanic thinks its the coilpacks. The car studders around 3,000+ RPMS when WOT. However, when in stock mode, no issues. Today, we changed to all new coilpacks, still having the same issues. Stock still drives fine. I had new NGK sparkplugs installed 500 miles ago.

Could it be the injectors?
If the problem can't be resolved, do you think I would be responsible for the labor in getting my K03? Would I be able to return the kit for full refund + labor? I don't want to get stuck with a new kit and lose out cause of this issue. What do you guys think?

[Aoshi]

I'm assuming your dealer will go through the common issues, such as bad coil packs, plugs, cam follower and intake cleaning..

There appears to be an issue with APR K04 kits... You can see the current thread on this where I've spent thousands and thousands of dollars chasing this issue.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-5500RPM-w-WOT

[CtNxFLeX]

Hi Aoshi,

Thanks for the link. I saw your thread before I even posted and that's when I started getting worried even more. Doesn't seem like it's going to be an easy fix and will cost more than I anticipated.

You think if they can't figure out the issue without costing me extra $, there is a chance I can get refunded back for the kit? I don't have extra $ to spend on this issue without a guarantee of solving the issue.

I'm worried of throwing Good Money after bad

[Aoshi]

they certainly should, especially if the work was done at a dealer.

[bacillus]

What intake are you using?

[CtNxFLeX]

EVOMs right now, but I read from another thread from an APR Representative that they prefer Stock MAF Housing so the Evoms isn't compatible with the K04? So tomorrow, we are going to give that a try to see if that resolves the issue

[Aoshi]

EVOMs right now, but I read from another thread from an APR Representative that they prefer Stock MAF Housing so the Evoms isn't compatible with the K04? So tomorrow, we are going to give that a try to see if that resolves the issue

Just an FYI - I ran the stock housing for 2+ months straight. It made no difference.

Can you post the full list of mods on your car?

[CtNxFLeX]

New APR K04 Kit
Stock, 91 and 93 software
New S3 Injectors
new APR IC
APR HPFP
Evoms Intake
BSH PCV Revamp
3" Downpipe
Stock Exhaust

I think that covers all my current engine mods...

[Aoshi]

New APR K04 Kit
Stock, 91 and 93 software
New S3 Injectors
new APR IC
APR HPFP
Evoms Intake
BSH PCV Revamp
3" Downpipe
Stock Exhaust

I think that covers all my current engine mods...

Nothing unusual in that.. pretty standard upgrades in that list.

I'm testing another tune tomorrow, I'll post the results in my thread. Hopefully that will prove or disprove the problem is software related.

[CtNxFLeX]

I was also wondering if it's the software, please do post your results.

Which software will you be trying? Uni, Revo, or Giac?

[Aoshi]

I was also wondering if it's the software, please do post your results.

Which software will you be trying? Uni, Revo, or Giac?

GIAC.

[Arin@APR]

Have you contacted tech support? 334 502 5181

[xtravbx]

Seeing another one of these threads is definitely steering me away from K04 w/ APR. Which sucks because I'm APR Stage 1, and don't want to deal with changing software - the initial cost sucks.

[TBomb]

Seeing another one of these threads is definitely steering me away from K04 w/ APR. Which sucks because I'm APR Stage 1, and don't want to deal with changing software - the initial cost sucks.

Meh. Two threads out of how many APR K04 kits going around out there...neither one of which have definitive proof that APR's software is to blame...there are many, many factors that could cause the misfires. I wouldn't let it steer me away from APR, but that's just my $.02

[xtravbx]

This is true - but the risk sucks. I'm interested to see aoshi's results.

[CtNxFLeX]

Hi Everyone,

Here is an update.

So, I decided to try putting back my stock CAI. It didn't make a difference, still having the misfire issue.

I'll call tech support tomorrow and see what they say. I'm hoping to drop off my car at the APR Dealer/Installer as well and see their findings

Felix

[bostonaudi1]

Hi Everyone,

Here is an update.

So, I decided to try putting back my stock CAI. It didn't make a difference, still having the misfire issue.

I'll call tech support tomorrow and see what they say. I'm hoping to drop off my car at the APR Dealer/Installer as well and see their findings

Felix

Suggestion - log groups 15 and 16 to see if one or multiple cylinders misfiring. If you have a single, and plugs and coil packs known to be OK, then you likely have a bad injector. Also if a single cylinder is misfiring try swapping the coil pack and plug on that cylinder to another to ensure they're OK. If the misfire stays on same cylinder that also indicates a bad injector. It's all too easy to introduce a piece of lint or spec of dirt into the fuel system while replacing injectors. It's also possible more than one injector got fouled during install.

[CtNxFLeX]

Thanks for the suggestion. I logged 15 and 16 and came up with the below

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2182438/Misf...15-016-xxx.CSV

It looks like cylinder 2 misfires a lot but 1 and 4 sometimes but very rare?

[Aoshi]

Thanks for the suggestion. I logged 15 and 16 and came up with the below

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2182438/Misf...15-016-xxx.CSV

It looks like cylinder 2 misfires a lot but 1 and 4 sometimes but very rare?

It would be so much better if you had of logged RPM and engine load with that, but still interesting to see it all around 2. Run it again tomorrow if you can, and see if it's the same results.

Thanks for keeping us updated!

[CtNxFLeX]

Hey Aoshi,

Were you able to try another tune?

Also, does the below help in the mean time?

000770 - Cylinder 2
P0302 - 001 - Misfire Detected
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 96524 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 19:42:49

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2922 /min
Load: 21.6 %
Speed: 79.0 km/h
Temperature: 50.0°C
Temperature: 18.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V

[Aoshi]

Hey Aoshi,

Were you able to try another tune?

Also, does the below help in the mean time?

000770 - Cylinder 2
P0302 - 001 - Misfire Detected
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 96524 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 19:42:49

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2922 /min
Load: 21.6 %
Speed: 79.0 km/h
Temperature: 50.0°C
Temperature: 18.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V

Check out my thread for updates - they're writing a file for my ECU, may be a few more days.

That info is marginally useful. It's much better if it's logged with the misfires as it happens.

Check out APR's site for a good logging strategy. Try doing the round 4 logs and posting that up.

http://www.goapr.com/support/datalogging.php

[A3Performance]

Hey Aoshi,

Were you able to try another tune?

Also, does the below help in the mean time?

000770 - Cylinder 2
P0302 - 001 - Misfire Detected
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 96524 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 19:42:49

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2922 /min
Load: 21.6 %
Speed: 79.0 km/h
Temperature: 50.0°C
Temperature: 18.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V

Only one cylinder is misfiring, move coil packs around and see if the misfire travels. If it doesn't, you may have a faulty injector.

[CtNxFLeX]

We've changed coilpacks around and it still says cylinder 2.

A side question. Having these misfires, could it cause engine damage? I'm worried me doing all these tests, i'm wearing out something which could cause more harm.

[Aoshi]

We've changed coilpacks around and it still says cylinder 2.

A side question. Having these misfires, could it cause engine damage? I'm worried me doing all these tests, i'm wearing out something which could cause more harm.

That's a question for your mechanic.

I'm curious about your car, since the misfires start at 3,000~ RPMs.. that's pretty much where you enter boost (positive pressure) on a K04... My problems are at 5,500~ RPMs, which is at peak boost.

[CtNxFLeX]

I have another question.

If the injector in cylinder has gone bad, why is it in stock mode, there is no misfiring? Shouldn't in stock mode, misfiring happen also?

[A3Performance]

I have another question.

If the injector in cylinder has gone bad, why is it in stock mode, there is no misfiring? Shouldn't in stock mode, misfiring happen also?

The injector in stock mode is flowing like a normal injector, possibly under the APR tune mode it's requiring a more aggressive injector cycle causing that one particular cylinder to misfire. It can also be due to a bad install as well keep that in mind. I would ask that shop to atleast pull the manifold and inspect cylinder #2 and quite possibly replace it.

[Aoshi]

The injector in stock mode is flowing like a normal injector, possibly under the APR tune mode it's requiring a more aggressive injector cycle causing that one particular cylinder to misfire. It can also be due to a bad install as well keep that in mind. I would ask that shop to atleast pull the manifold and inspect cylinder #2 and quite possibly replace it.

You need APR or your mechanic to suggest that, so the shop does it at no cost to you. After all, the car worked fine until you installed this kit.

Have you called tech support yet? You need to let them start the troubleshooting process.

[CtNxFLeX]

Hi Everyone,

Just a quick update. My dealer/mechanic confirmed it was a bad injector. APR should be sending one next week. It sucks with all these delays, but I'm hoping there should be no problems by next week and I'll be able to FINALLY enjoy my K04. I hope it doesn't disappoint with all this trouble.

I'll keep everyone posted!

[Aoshi]

Hi Everyone,

Just a quick update. My dealer/mechanic confirmed it was a bad injector. APR should be sending one next week. It sucks with all these delays, but I'm hoping there should be no problems by next week and I'll be able to FINALLY enjoy my K04. I hope it doesn't disappoint with all this trouble.

I'll keep everyone posted!

Great news!

[CtNxFLeX]

Here is another minor update that I got from the mechanic when I picked up the car.

He cleaned the tip of the bad injector and the car runs a it better.

Before when it was first installed, I would get misfires when I hit around 10 psi and would max till 20psi
Now, I get misfire between 15-20psi and max at 25psi. It's amazing to see my car now holding around 25psi while misfire. Can't wait to see what it's like when its fixed.

Also, asked the mechanic, could hurt the engine if it keeps on misfiring. I'll be putting my software back to stock until the new injector comes.

Aoshi, how's it going with your GIAC Software?

[bostonaudi1]

When working up front you are past the fuel filter so if anything gets in a fouled injector sometimes happens. Good to hear its resolved.

[ROH ECHT]

Can't speak for Aoshi, but loving GIAC. Over two years with no misfires or any other issues yet, fingers X'd. We're getting this misfire hunt down to an art now, right?

[Tutti57]

Don't know I you have a catless dp or not but running on a misfire can damage your converter.

[A3Performance]

Hi Everyone,

Just a quick update. My dealer/mechanic confirmed it was a bad injector. APR should be sending one next week. It sucks with all these delays, but I'm hoping there should be no problems by next week and I'll be able to FINALLY enjoy my K04. I hope it doesn't disappoint with all this trouble.

I'll keep everyone posted!

I'm glad it was confirmed and your on your way with getting a replacement injector. Keep us posted on how everything else goes.

[One Bad MKV]

updates bro? i right now i am running the same thing as u and i like