2006 VW GTI 2.0 Oil Consumption question

[06Vwgti]

Hey all,

I have a 06 GTI 2.0T with about 120K on it and I am using about 1.5 quarts every 1,000 miles. I was told that a quart every 900 miles is normal. Can anyone guide me to where to start looking where I am using it at. I am NOT dripping any oil but when accelerating hard I will notice smoke coming out the tailpipe. I appreciate everyone's help with this.

-06VWGTI (Tim)

[Apexxx]

Those engines do burn oil. Clogged PCV would be the first to eliminate. Go w/a HD 5w-40 like Rotella. You can try a piston soak, a mix of 2-3oz mixed light oils and solvent, poured into sparkplug holes, crank, sit overnight, crank... Do an intake Seafoam cleaning with the old oil in, right before draining it.

I use 2-cycle oil in my gas at 500:1 (3-4oz/10G). Use double for the first treatment. I actually mix some Techron in there too.

[06Vwgti]

Thank you very much for your help

[Apexxx]

You may want a catch-can.

Gauze air filters are a really bad idea. They let a lot of abrasive silicon into the engine, chewing up the rings. For the same reason, don't mess w/your paper filter more than necessary, 30k, not 10k.

Dirt is especially bad in a DI engine, where there is no fuel wash to clean the valves. I spray mine down every spring (TSI).

[06Vwgti]

You may want a catch-can.

Gauze air filters are a really bad idea. They let a lot of abrasive silicon into the engine, chewing up the rings. For the same reason, don't mess w/your paper filter more than necessary, 30k, not 10k.

Dirt is especially bad in a DI engine, where there is no fuel wash to clean the valves. I spray mine down every spring (TSI).

Thanks for your input!

[Apexxx]

fyi- the paper (and all) filters work better over time. That is, they filter progressively finer particles, which is exactly what you want. Even the process of changing filters introduces dirt into the intake, and it shows up on the next oil analysis as a shot of silicon, maybe tin and chromium from the rings.

This gives an idea...

http://widman.biz/English/Analysis/Cleaning.html







1000ppm of iron is no joke. I like to see under 20 as a rule.

It seems like I am getting off-topic, but the subject is "burning oil".

[Anony00GT]

Definitely check the PCV valve. The 2.0T's are notorious for PCV valve failure. Can cause lean codes and excessive oil consumption as well. Is your CEL on?

Also verify that the turbo is not worn, blowing oil right through the intercooler into the engine.

I use 2-cycle oil in my gas at 500:1 (3-4oz/10G). Use double for the first treatment. I actually mix some Techron in there too.

What is the benefit of this?

Oh, and just an FYI, I've removed many paper cartridge filters that have gone excessive mileage, and found them crumpled and literally TORN, that's right, gaping holes in them, so they're not filtering anything. Sometimes the filter literally crumbles upon removal. I've seen it on BMW, VAG, Land Rover (OK, that's BMW), Hyundai, and GM, so I believe that nobody with a paper cartridge filter is completely immune. I'd advocate changing them every oci just to prevent this, as a brand new filter has got to filter better than a filter with a huge hole in it. If the filters were fleece, I'd agree with you on that though, the fleece filters (Mercedes) tend to hold up very well over time.

[Apexxx]

Well, OE canister filters say 30,000km / 2 years right on the can.

As far as cartridges, they are easy to inspect, for sure. The wife's Astra has one. It's on it's 3rd oil change of 6 months, a year and a half. This Fall it'll come out, want to place bets on the condition?

No doubt you see failed cartridges, and no doubt there are shops which don't change the filter when customer comes in for a low-budget oil change w/a coupon. There's no reason to think of cartridges as worse than canisters in durability, but I'm open to ideas on that. Look at the Fram XG, the media is screened into place. I don't see that failing.

[gmikel]

Well, OE canister filters say 30,000km / 2 years right on the can.

As far as cartridges, they are easy to inspect, for sure. The wife's Astra has one. It's on it's 3rd oil change of 6 months, a year and a half. This Fall it'll come out, want to place bets on the condition?

No doubt you see failed cartridges, and no doubt there are shops which don't change the filter when customer comes in for a low-budget oil change w/a coupon. There's no reason to think of cartridges as worse than canisters in durability, but I'm open to ideas on that. Look at the Fram XG, the media is screened into place. I don't see that failing.

if you look at the square inches of filter medium on a cartridge vs. canister thier is no comparison, sorry. you'll have to supply the chart.

[Anony00GT]

Well, OE canister filters say 30,000km / 2 years right on the can.

As far as cartridges, they are easy to inspect, for sure. The wife's Astra has one. It's on it's 3rd oil change of 6 months, a year and a half. This Fall it'll come out, want to place bets on the condition?

No doubt you see failed cartridges, and no doubt there are shops which don't change the filter when customer comes in for a low-budget oil change w/a coupon. There's no reason to think of cartridges as worse than canisters in durability, but I'm open to ideas on that. Look at the Fram XG, the media is screened into place. I don't see that failing.

Where are you seeing that on the can, and what brands? I just checked two Mann filters for VW and neither one had a mileage stamp on the filter or the box...?

But 30,000km is more like 18k miles, which is just past the envelope for the longest OE-recommended oci, so I'll agree there anyway. There are a few cartridge filters out there with the paper media held in place by a screen as well (Mercedes comes to mind again, older models).

And yes, there are "those" shops out there, they're the type that give us all a bad name.

As far as durability of the canisters, I can't really comment because I've never personally bothered to cut open old filters, I've got better things to do with my time. What I will say is that I've never seen any ill effects from replacing the filter every oci, heck just look at how many cars are out there are at 200k+ miles running great and have had the filter (and oil) replaced every 3-5k miles. Remember, average Joe Customer just wants an oil change, and he expects the service to include filter replacement. He doesn't give a flying flip about the details of the filter, or the oil for that matter.

[Apexxx]

So, you say 3-5k for a filter, Audi says 18k.

[Anony00GT]

So, you say 3-5k for a filter, Audi says 18k.

Actually (I used a 2010 A4 2.0T as an example), Audi specifies to change the oil and filter at 5,000 miles, then every 10k miles thereafter, with a note that under severe conditions maintenance service (specifically oil, oil filter, and air filter) may require replacement more frequently than the indicated interval. Where are you getting 18k, what filter? Audi OE?

Let me ask you this: Have you any examples of engine failure that can be definitively linked to changing the oil and/or filter too often?

[Apexxx]

My 2010 VW 2.0 TSI specified 1st OC at 10k. No oil, no filter at 5k.

What does that "prove"?

Not a thing.

[Anony00GT]

I'm not disagreeing with you in principle.

You are correct, VW does not call for oil or filter on a 2010 Tiguan 2.0T until 10k miles. Audi does call for the first one at 5k on the same MY A4, and every 10k thereafter, look it up. I honestly can't tell you what the difference is though. Not that it really matters for the purposes of this discussion.

I had three questions, none of which you answered:

1. Have you ever seen an engine fail solely because oil and filter changes were performed too frequently (in any car)?

2. Where do you see 18k miles filter change interval on an Audi or VW? Please document the source specifically.

3. What is the benefit of running 2-stroke oil at 500:1 in a 2010 Tiguan (or any car)?


You've obviously got knowledge and at least some experience in this department. Please answer the questions at hand here. Kthx.

Oh, and to the OP: Have you verified the PCV valve yet?

[piston]

My 08 GTI consumed more oil during the summer/warmer months than the colder months.
VW actually states 1qt burned per 1K miles is normal in the GTI manual.
1.5 qts does seem kind of high but if you're not seeing any white smoke, it's probably the 2.0 FSI doing it's thing.... nom,nom,nom...oil.

[edyvw]

My 08 GTI consumed more oil during the summer/warmer months than the colder months.
VW actually states 1qt burned per 1K miles is normal in the GTI manual.
1.5 qts does seem kind of high but if you're not seeing any white smoke, it's probably the 2.0 FSI doing it's thing.... nom,nom,nom...oil.

That is NOT normal. That is just disclimer so you cannot sue them. They did same crap in EU and all auto magazines pointed to tht. Now they changed that policy.

[Apexxx]

1) Engines prone to valve and intake deposits are at risk from excessive oil changing due to the fact there are lighter fraction in new oil which burn off and produce excessive vapours. Wear rate is highest with fresh oil. (3MP Study)

2) 30,000km is/was the standard for Audi FSS using the 503.01 oil (German Syntec and iirc M1 0w-40). This system was never employed in USA.

3) 2-cycle oil preforms basic "top-oil" functions of ring seal/lubrication, deposit control (same additives as gas), corrosion protection against ethanol, friction reduction and fuel stabilizer. It's one of the most cost-effective products you can use in a normal engine, it very likely will reduce consumption in the FSI.