Why You Shouldn't Trust Any Early Tesla Model S Reviews [jalopnik]

[cougar]

http://jalopnik.com/5918341/why-you-...odel-s-reviews

It's possible the Tesla Model S is a great car that lives up to all of its promises. You won't find that out by reading reviews from the early drives of the car, which we've learned — and the company has basically confirmed — Tesla has limited to 10 minutes per outlet.

This means none of these outlets will be able to test the most important aspect of an electric car: its battery performance. What kind of outlet would agree to such ridiculous terms? A ton of them, of course.

So who's got the popcorn?

[Egz]

I only drive my electric car 10 minuntes at a time.
And for those 10 minutes or less, I'm free from the wall outlet.

[aethelwulf]

While obviously ridiculous, if the magazine has a choice between 10 minutes of seat time and no minutes of seat time, what do you expect them to pick?

[WhatBlueVW]

So who's got the popcorn?

Yay, Jalopnik... and journalism so yellow that it leaves grease stains on your computer monitor...

[JalopnikMatt]

Yay, Jalopnik... and journalism so yellow that it leaves grease stains on your computer monitor...

If being "yellow" is telling the truth other outlets refuse to acknowledge then we're ****ing big bird.

[deucestudios]

If being "yellow" is telling the truth other outlets refuse to acknowledge then we're ****ing big bird.

Snuffulupugus is gonna be pissed when he finds out.

[WhatBlueVW]

If being "yellow" is telling the truth other outlets refuse to acknowledge then we're ****ing big bird.

First looks are usually 10-20 minutes in a car. That's about how long Chris Harris had with the FT-86 when he made that video TCL went gaga over.

It's also how much seat time most any initial rollout gives you. That's why most of these reviews are called first looks. Dinging Tesla for it seems a bit... ummm... targeted, shall we say?

[edit:] Also of note is that most small boutique car manufacturers ONLY have these kinds of events. Let me know the next time you guys get a loaner Lotus, McLaren, or Fisker. Heck, let me know if you guys ever get a loaner Ferrari.

[seadoo2006]

Elon Musk is going down in a flaming ball of glory with this company ... Holy Christ, when will the pyramid scam end? They should just hire this guy to distract everyone while they literally BURN piles of cash over in California ...

[JalopnikMatt]

First looks are usually 10-20 minutes in a car. That's about how long Chris Harris had with the FT-86 when he made that video TCL went gaga over.

It's also how much seat time most any initial rollout gives you. That's why most of these reviews are called first looks. Dinging Tesla for it seems a bit... ummm... targeted, shall we say?

There's a difference. That was a car designed for weekend track days driven on a track (also, they were already giving people full drives at that point as I remember).

This is an electric car that you're not allowed to test the most important feature of: range/battery performance.

[GahannaKid]

Yay, Jalopnik... and journalism so yellow that it leaves grease stains on your computer monitor...

Let us assume for a moment that Jalopnik is telling the truth here. Lets also assume they're pissed they didn't get an early preview of the Model S. I'd say we can safely conclude two things from that:

1. If Jalopnik is yellow journalism then so are the ones that accepted this 10 minute bribe
2. The truth of the matter lies somewhere in the middle and any smart reader will be able to form their own conclusions

Don't let your blind "it's cool to hate Jalopnik" spite get in the way of the truth.

Heck, let me know if you guys ever get a loaner Ferrari.

I'm sure if they hired Chris Harris they'd be put on the short list.

[WhatBlueVW]

This is an electric car that you're not allowed to test the most important feature of: range/battery performance.

That's like saying the most important feature of a Hyundai in the early 00's was the 100k warranties and so Hyundais should have been loaning these cars for 100k miles.

The battery range is something for Consumer reports and between the maker of the car and the customers (and their respective lawyers). What the consumers really want is an assurance from the company that yes the battery will provide the range specified and if the car is any fun, comfortable, interesting, etc. to own.

We are talking car journalism, not consumer advocacy. When was the last time car magazines did investigative journalism?

[Numbersix]

C'mon, Matt. "You shouldn't trust the reviews"? Isn't that a bit hyperbolic? You really need to read that article with an impartial eye. It comes across as you whining that Tesla won't let you take one of the (very few) completed cars out for a typical press thrashing.

The reality is, they'll sell these without handing them over for typical press fleet abuse. So why would they?

The owners I've talked with about their Roadsters (and in the Seattle area, there are many) are very happy with their cars thus far. I wouldn't be surprised if most of the initial purchasers for the Model S are current Roadster owners.

[Swallow Doretti]

First looks are usually 10-20 minutes in a car. That's about how long Chris Harris had with the FT-86 when he made that video TCL went gaga over.

It's also how much seat time most any initial rollout gives you. That's why most of these reviews are called first looks. Dinging Tesla for it seems a bit... ummm... targeted, shall we say?

[edit:] Also of note is that most small boutique car manufacturers ONLY have these kinds of events. Let me know the next time you guys get a loaner Lotus, McLaren, or Fisker. Heck, let me know if you guys ever get a loaner Ferrari.

Um...what?

You know I was the PR guy on-site for the Elise and Exige roll-outs, right? In each case, we invited a select set of journalists down to Georgia (Elise) and Alabama (Exige) for a full-day of driving the vehicle. In the case of the Elise, that meant drivers paired off in twos splitting time while thrashing the cars around the North Georgia Mountains, then back to HQ. In the case of the Exige, we had them out to Talledega. Were these invites limited? Yes, absolutely--we didn't have cars or budget like a major OEM to do multiple waves with more than 26 media. But those media who attended certainly drove the snot out of those cars. And then several of those went into national press fleets for longer-term loans. Obviously, it took forever for a small outlet to get the keys because they were so few and in such demand, but eventually, most every outlet got seat time behind an Elise and an Exige if they wanted it.

Furthermore, my former boss on those events is now running the show over at Fisker, and I know for a fact that the journos were brought in for a nearly identical program at the Karma launch, because I was actually talking with an analyst friend who was in attendance while he was there about a related EV project on which I'm currently working.

So, in short...yeah, no, that's just not how it works.

[cougar]

That's like saying the most important feature of a Hyundai in the early 00's was the 100k warranties and so Hyundais should have been loaning these cars for 100k miles.

Really? You think those two things are at all comparable?

[Swallow Doretti]

That's like saying the most important feature of a Hyundai in the early 00's was the 100k warranties and so Hyundais should have been loaning these cars for 100k miles.

The battery range is something for Consumer reports and between the maker of the car and the customers (and their respective lawyers). What the consumers really want is an assurance from the company that yes the battery will provide the range specified and if the car is any fun, comfortable, interesting, etc. to own.

We are talking car journalism, not consumer advocacy. When was the last time car magazines did investigative journalism?

Not even. The car is a full EV--really, all the matters is range. If the car can't cross the 150 miles per charge barrier (and they're rated much, much higher) then there's a serious question about what the hell Tesla is delivering. The company really does nothing unique except for three things:

• Creating an EV with a significantly greater range than competitors
• Laying claim through patents to a supposedly very advanced battery management system (developed by a third-party, I might add)
• Having an advanced vertical integration process that's interesting, but probably not as relevant as what Hyundai does for its vehicles from a "other manufacturers are gonna copy that sh!t" perspective

Range anxiety has been the fundamental issue with every EV. None of them are coming close in the real-world to their EPAe estimates.

[WhatBlueVW]

So, in short...yeah, no, that's just not how it works.

So will you back up with certainty that that's how all of the industry works? Because I recall a few articles that noted limited seat time for their first look articles.

Sorry about my mistake on Lotus and Fisker, btw.

[WhatBlueVW]

Range anxiety has been the fundamental issue with every EV. None of them are coming close in the real-world to their EPAe estimates.

I am not seeing very much in the way of complaints from current Tesla owners.

[Swallow Doretti]

So will you back up with certainty that that's how all of the industry works? Because I recall a few articles that noted limited seat time for their first look articles.

Other than Ferrari, yes. The only times you see these kind of limited, 10-minute drives is with pre-production vehicles, and even then, there's usually a little more seat time than that. For example, last November Chevrolet let a select group of buff books drive a couple of pre-production Malibus around GM's proving grounds to get a sense of the vehicle. They limited the drives to the buff books with the understanding that those publications would specifically call out the limited drive time--and the fact that these were short previews designed to whet the appetite for the longer drives coming later.

In addition, usually those kinds of drives are either limited to local media (e.g., Chevy inviting out Ann Arbor based buffs, or when Hyundai gives Inside Line quick peeks to new vehicles in LA), or are held in conjunction with some other full launch program.

[Hostile]

If being "yellow" is telling the truth other outlets refuse to acknowledge then we're ****ing big bird.

LOL

[WhatBlueVW]

In addition, usually those kinds of drives are either limited to local media (e.g., Chevy inviting out Ann Arbor based buffs, or when Hyundai gives Inside Line quick peeks to new vehicles in LA), or are held in conjunction with some other full launch program.

Okay, then I will stay my mouth and watch the details of this rollout with a wary eye. We were actually considering the model S as a fourth car a few years down the line btw. So I will be watching with interest.

[SSLByron]

I only drive my electric car 10 minuntes at a time.
And for those 10 minutes or less, I'm free from the wall outlet.

I... this... I don't even know what to say.

Beautiful.

[SSLByron]

So will you back up with certainty that that's how all of the industry works? Because I recall a few articles that noted limited seat time for their first look articles.

Sorry about my mistake on Lotus and Fisker, btw.

I've attended a handful of short-lead events. The least seat time I've gotten in a car was measured in hours.

[curvedinfinity]

If being "yellow" is telling the truth other outlets refuse to acknowledge then we're ****ing big bird.

I love this so much.

Tesla is not going to be competitive with the Model S since they've been beat to market in the 4 dr space by a bunch of other companies. Also, my hunch is their quality control is abysmal compared to the big companies. They'd need double or triple the capital to even stand a chance.

[Ross1013]

I've attended a handful of short-lead events. The least seat time I've gotten in a car was measured in hours.

Same here.

[WhatBlueVW]

I've attended a handful of short-lead events. The least seat time I've gotten in a car was measured in hours.

You can deplete the battery pack in hours. That would pretty much limit the number of people they could invite to 3 or 4.

[Aonarch]

[Mike!]

Kudos to Jalopnik for once for their honesty on bringing this to light. That said, I still can't stand the site.

Or maybe they only gave Jalopnik 10 minutes and the rest longer?

[SSLByron]

You can deplete the battery pack in hours. That would pretty much limit the number of people they could invite to 3 or 4.

True in this case, but my point was that Brian's analysis of the typical "first drive" is accurate. 10 minutes is essentially unheard of.

[JalopnikMatt]

As far as I know they gave us 0 minutes.

[PsyberVW]

You can deplete the battery pack in hours. That would pretty much limit the number of people they could invite to 3 or 4.

Sounds more like basic math to me.

You have 1 car, 20 journalists. If they all want a chance to drive it on the same day, they will have to take shorter drives...

I don't understand the "warning" being issued, since probably very few of those writers put the "range" stake in the ground. They wrote about handling, comfort, quality, dynamics... and then mentioned the factory purported range.

How different is that from any other review, where a journalist writes about the things they got to experience, and then mentioned the rest of the details off the brochure? Does every journalist have to test that 160mph limiter in order to make their review "truthful"? Would not testing that somehow disqualify their review of the seats, sat/nav, chassis feel, etc?

[curvedinfinity]

As far as I know they gave us 0 minutes.

Could be this be less of a case of "Big Yellow Bird" and instead of "Butthurt Grouch"?

[JalopnikMatt]

Could be this be less of a case of "Big Yellow Bird" and instead of "Butthurt Grouch"?

Hah! As anyone who reads Jalopnik should know, we refuse to play their game and thus had no expectation of being invited. This isn't a retribution thing, this is merely us teling the truth.

[deucestudios]

I love this so much.

Tesla is not going to be competitive with the Model S since they've been beat to market in the 4 dr space by a bunch of other companies. Also, my hunch is their quality control is abysmal compared to the big companies. They'd need double or triple the capital to even stand a chance.

Do me a favor, and remind me what other 4 door EV sedans out right now acutally look good?

[HASSELHOF]

Hah! As anyone who reads Jalopnik should know, we refuse to play their game and thus had no expectation of being invited. This isn't a retribution thing, this is merely us teling the truth.

Yeah you're so punk rock.

As stated, how in the **** would you expect every journalist invited on a given day, to be given more then the time the stated on an electric car?

Tesla: "hold on guys!! The anti-establishment Jalopnik is here. We just have to charge these batteries for 8-10 hours so they can have adequate time in the car. Just have some of the supplied Capri-Sun and talk amongst yourselves.


Yellow journalism is right. Get a grip, you aren't special.

[SSLByron]

Sounds more like basic math to me.

You have 1 car, 20 journalists. If they all want a chance to drive it on the same day, they will have to take shorter drives...

I don't understand the "warning" being issued, since probably very few of those writers put the "range" stake in the ground. They wrote about handling, comfort, quality, dynamics... and then mentioned the factory purported range.

How different is that from any other review, where a journalist writes about the things they got to experience, and then mentioned the rest of the details off the brochure? Does every journalist have to test that 160mph limiter in order to make their review "truthful"? Would not testing that somehow disqualify their review of the seats, sat/nav, chassis feel, etc?

I dutifully pegged the top-speed limiter in the Chrysler 200 Cabrio on a short lead, and I wasn't the only one. The engineers got a kick out of that.