'87 Scirocco dead after being in storage

[Hermansen]

I've been living abroad for about 18 months, and my Scirocco has been standing in my garage.
Unfortunatley, noone was aronud to start it ever so often, so it's just been sitting there.
The garage is not heated, but it is dry. And we do get some really cold winters.


Now I'm finally home, and when I went to try to start it, the battery had died.
Fair enough, I tried charging it. Didn't work. So yesterday I picked up a new battery.

Now the clock comes on, the lights on the dash lights up, but when I turn the key, nothing.
Not even a click.

Is it the starter that has rusted solid? Or what is the most likely thing that could have happened?
Where do I even start to search for faults?

I'm not the most technical guy, as this post probably makes horribly clear, but I really want it to run again. Any input is appreciated.

[ANSAracingb]

I would think that even if the starter motor was frozen, the solenoid will still make an audible "click" because it is receiving the signal from the ignition switch. That is, of course, if the solenoid is still good.

How is the condition of the wiring? It was in a garage, but mice like to live in garages...I'm thinking a worst case scenario would be that maybe some of the wiring had been chewed on while you were away?

[Eistreiber]

Possible 'frozen' solenoid; trying having someone turn the key to start while you tap on the side (top) of the starter housing, I recommend a 1/2" breaker bar or mebbe a baseball bat (seriously). Tap means 'tap firmly' NOT whack the bejeezus out of it... you just want to create a little shock to knock loose any corrosion.

Of course make sure your designated 'starter helper' person knows to check that car is in neutral, and clutch in.

Might help. It does sound started related at the moment.

If you do get it started; think about fuel, if you didn't put in a fuel stablizer 18 months ago that gas is old and bad. Drain or use it, but you want old fuel gone new fuel in very soon.

[red16vdub]

If you do get it started; think about fuel, if you didn't put in a fuel stablizer 18 months ago that gas is old and bad. Drain or use it, but you want old fuel gone new fuel in very soon.

There is no way that your fuel is bad after only 18 months. I find that very very hard to believe My rocco sat in my garage under similar conditions With a half of tank of fuel for about 4 or 5 years and Started right up the very first turn. I did however have noisy lifters until the motor reach normal operating temperatures, this continued for about 2--3 weeks and then of eventually just went away.

bajan 4g

[Eistreiber]

There is no way that your fuel is bad after only 18 months. I find that very very hard to believe My rocco sat in my garage under similar conditions With a half of tank of fuel for about 4 or 5 years and Started right up the very first turn. I did however have noisy lifters until the motor reach normal operating temperatures, this continued for about 2--3 weeks and then of eventually just went away.

bajan 4g

Hmm... perhaps some basic lessons in physics are in order. Are you familiar with these, or do you need some splainin'?

1] Expansion/ contraction by temperature.
2] Moisture content of air (sweat or gripe?).
3] Light fractions of distilled petroleum products (like gasoline) will evaporate.


In summary, the gas tank breathes in and out. Loses light fractions (thin stuff) out the vent and gains moisture. Over time, gas turns into syrup. Give it long enough and that'll gum up the pump.


Variables include brand and blend, region purchased, and so on... but if the gas in the tank is old (and without stabilizer) I'd suggest running down close to empty before refill (or drain it off and use the fuel in yer lawnmower if you fell like gambling. That's cheaper to rebuild). And then change the damn filter.

Instead of posting multiple , go learn something. Like... that lifter noise is an oil circuit issue, and has little or nothing to do with fuel (but can be prevented with additives like MMO).

I posted a preventative measure... like changing brake fluid, coolant, whatever. You ridicule.

Shall we dance? Test knowledge? Really?

And just to refocus... you got anything at all to say about the OP's post? Looks like starter issues to me. Fuel is secondary and later.

At this point it won't even crank... got anything? At all?

[red16vdub]

Hmm... perhaps some basic lessons in physics are in order. Are you familiar with these, or do you need some splainin'?

1] Expansion/ contraction by temperature.
2] Moisture content of air (sweat or gripe?).
3] Light fractions of distilled petroleum products (like gasoline) will evaporate.


In summary, the gas tank breathes in and out. Loses light fractions (thin stuff) out the vent and gains moisture. Over time, gas turns into syrup. Give it long enough and that'll gum up the pump.


Variables include brand and blend, region purchased, and so on... but if the gas in the tank is old (and without stabilizer) I'd suggest running down close to empty before refill (or drain it off and use the fuel in yer lawnmower if you fell like gambling. That's cheaper to rebuild). And then change the damn filter.

Instead of posting multiple , go learn something. Like... that lifter noise is an oil circuit issue, and has little or nothing to do with fuel (but can be prevented with additives like MMO).

I posted a preventative measure... like changing brake fluid, coolant, whatever. You ridicule.

Shall we dance? Test knowledge? Really?

And just to refocus... you got anything at all to say about the OP's post? Looks like starter issues to me. Fuel is secondary and later.

At this point it won't even crank... got anything? At all?

Actually I'm aware but still 18 months naaaah. This ain't the sixties

bajan 4g

[Chris16vRocco]

Actually I'm aware but still 18 months naaaah. This ain't the sixties

bajan 4g

The fuel has 10% ethanol in it now, which can cause it to not store as long as it would have without it.

[Eistreiber]

The fuel has 10% ethanol in it now, which can cause it to not store as long as it would have without it.

As they say in Boston... "Lotsa Garcia's". Something like that.

Old fluid are OLD, damnit. And deteriorate over time. Use up or flush out and replace, is what I was sayin'.

[Wesley Brown]

Get a test light and see if your getting power to the silenoid.
If so Tap the starter and listen for the relay , check all the conections going to the silenoid.
Look for corrosion on starter relay up north it happens epecialy sitting in a damp cold place.


Ethenol is bad and any gas older than a month will loose octane rating which is not goood for 16v engine .
Not to mention condensation build up and high corrosion rate on aluminium parts IE ,piston, heads water parts . I would drane the fuel add new gas with marvel myster oil 4 oz per 10 gallons and squirt a little Sea foam from auto zone on the t body after you get it started . Good luck keep us informed .

[red16vdub]

Get a test light and see if your getting power to the silenoid.
If so Tap the starter and listen for the relay , check all the conections going to the silenoid.
Look for corrosion on starter relay up north it happens epecialy sitting in a damp cold place.


Ethenol is bad and any gas older than a month will loose octane rating which is not goood for 16v engine .
Not to mention condensation build up and high corrosion rate on aluminium parts IE ,piston, heads water parts . I would drane the fuel add new gas with marvel myster oil 4 oz per 10 gallons and squirt a little Sea foam from auto zone on the t body after you get it started . Good luck keep us informed .

First off i Live in New England ok, last time i check that's up north. It sounds to me people comment on things that they truly don't have any first hand knowledge themselves. fuel is just one of the possibilities ok, So before getting carried away with some of these silly ass suggestions once again it's only 18 months. So before you have him draining / dropping his tank and adding this and that. Maybe suggest Starting with the electrical connections first. Iirc in his original post he said something about having charge or recharging the battery and still not have a click at the starter so how is that connected to fuel

bajan 4g

[Wesley Brown]

First off i Live in New England ok, last time i check that's up north. It sounds to me people comment on things that they truly don't have any first hand knowledge themselves. fuel is just one of the possibilities ok, So before getting carried away with some of these silly ass suggestions once again it's only 18 months. So before you have him draining / dropping his tank and adding this and that. Maybe suggest Starting with the electrical connections first. Iirc in his original post he said something about having charge or recharging the battery and still not have a click at the starter so how is that connected to fuel

bajan 4g

Fuel is just a precautionary action to help him have less problems down the road it has nothing to do with the starter even your smart enough to figure that out .

[halkyardo]

Fuel is just a precautionary action to help him have less problems down the road.

Seconded. It's not going to be fuel that's the problem, but we all know how finicky K-Jetronic is about dirty gas. Drain the gas anyway. And red16vdub and Wesley, take a chill pill. Being rude to each other isn't going to help anybody

If it were me, I'd check to see if you're getting power to the starter solenoid.

[red16vdub]

Seconded. It's not going to be fuel that's the problem, but we all know how finicky K-Jetronic is about dirty gas. Drain the gas anyway. And red16vdub and Wesley, take a chill pill. Being rude to each other isn't going to help anybody

If it were me, I'd check to see if you're getting power to the starter solenoid.

Ok old wise one lol
bajan 4g

[Eistreiber]

out of order, sorry...

And red16vdub and Wesley, take a chill pill. Being rude to each other isn't going to help anybody.

Actually I think I started that. Well... not "started", but I reacted. My bad. I try to actually read and comprehend when people post problems, and read through the thread to get the context and sequence of comments and suggestions made; it makes sense to me to so and I erroneously assume other people are as attentive.

If anybody's lost; I'll reiterate, 1] the current failure to start problem seems by description to be electrical in nature. I suggested a possible cause and possible fix. 2] I also mentioned that fuel (like other automotive fluids) deteriorates over time, and 18 months is gettin' old. If if was my car, I'd run down the starting problem and fix, then soon after use up as much old fuel as possible (drive laps around the gas station until it coughs) then refuel with fresh gas.

As a precautionary measure.

Drain the gas anyway.

I think use up/ burn off will do, as wroted above. IMHO. Same-same really, I think you're thinking drain by pulling a hose, I'm thinking drain via combustion; but either way works, the important thing is get that old bad sh*t out.

If it were me, I'd check to see if you're getting power to the starter solenoid.

Yeah... you could even try jump direct from B+ to starter, but I'd strongly suggest recruiting a mechanically skilled friend to guide/ assist. This is dangerous, a battery stores a lot of energy; if it's all unloaded at once very bad things happen, very quickly.
The simple check that halkyardo suggests can be done with a good multimeter, though. And safely. Start there.


That'll about do it; to OP please give us a status update, what have you tried and what have you learn. The more we know the better we can help you.

There was a comment made by someone I won't dignify by naming, "It sounds to me people comment on things that they truly don't have any first hand knowledge themselves."

OK... for the sake of credentials I present this; I've done all my own wrenching for 35 years, and quite a bit for other people. VW/ P/ A of course, also Fiat/ Lancia, Alfa, some funky British MG's and Triumphs (the ongoing joke; why do Brits drink warm beer? Because they have Lucas refrigerators), and of course the usual domestic and ricer stuff.
Since 2001 I've worked mostly way South or way North; at McMurdo Station Antarctica that was Fords and large yellow Heavy Equipment, at Thule Greenaland it was Case Quad-tracks, a Tucker Sno-cat, and a KassBohrer Pisten- Bully PB100.
I make stuff work at -40 degrees.

That's me, that's what I do. I know a little about maintenance, I think. But it's up to you to decide, of course.

[TBerk]

Aaaand what about dem Cowboys?

1) Put the car in gear (1st or 2nd is OK), take the parking brake off and rock the car back and forth just a little to wake up things dormant, engine wise.

(what?, it helps a little...)

2) W/ your trusty assistant in the driver's seat, have them put the gearbox
in neutral and put their left foot on the Clutch, holding it in.

3) Have assistant turn over Ign Switch to START position while you tape gently on the Solenoid. Gently but firmly tap tap tap a few times.

Now, we havent yet mentioned reconditioning the metal to metal battery cables, inc Alt, Starter, and Ground Straps.

Clean and shiny brite, light coating of something to keep out future oxidation, reclamp tight and try your new battery again.

That click, click means not enough Electrons are getting through the entire circuit; that means not only the Hot side but back around through Grounds as well.

[scotttu]

Happened to me before.

Mine was the wiring cluster-@#$% and jiggling it and verifying all connections fixed it.

I would check fuses too, just because.

Tap on the solenoid. I'm getting to that point because i rarely drive mine, first few drives I have to tap the solenoid or it just sits there and takes 6-10 seconds before it clicks on.

[sciroccohal]

First off i Live in New England ok, last time i check that's up north. It sounds to me people comment on things that they truly don't have any first hand knowledge themselves. fuel is just one of the possibilities ok, So before getting carried away with some of these silly ass suggestions once again it's only 18 months. So before you have him draining / dropping his tank and adding this and that. Maybe suggest Starting with the electrical connections first. Iirc in his original post he said something about having charge or recharging the battery and still not have a click at the starter so how is that connected to fuel

bajan 4g

You are completely wrong on the degradation of fuel issue here my boy. 18 months is WAY too long....put it in a lawnmower MAYBE.
1. Ethanol turns into acid VERY quickly
2. Ethanol is hydrophilic...loves water and will absorb it in virtually unlimited amounts.
3. So therefore WATER being heavier than gasoline will be the first thing you try to pump into your nice steel fuel distributor and into your steel fuel injectors....yuck!
4. Gasoline/water/acid create a galvanic corrosive tank/ fuel dizzy/ pump/ check valve/ fuel injector eating mess .
5.As well as eating the EPDM o-rings sprinkled liberally thru the system
6. OCTANE is defined as 'the resistance to detonation', high octane fuel is actually LESS explosive when comparing speed of flame fronts and ability to resist pre-detonation from carbon hot spots on cylinder tops etc.....after 18 months your octane rating ist KAPUT.

I suggest you give newbies good solid advice, not some dingleberry outta yer ass.

This poor gentlemens lack of starting is multi-various...he should also check the ign. switch due to NO solenoid noise whatsoever. A quick jumper to the starter solenoid may give him a clue.

Remember in the 60's we went to the moon and back multiple times...what have we done lately?
Facebook...yeah that's the ticket!

[Eistreiber]

Well... I think that pretty much covers the "fuel goes bad" issue.



Any progress with tracking down the "no crank" problem?