BMW Official Says No Manual Transmission for Next M5

[Mazda 3s]

MALAGA, Spain — Stick shift-loving M owners should prepare for bad news, because BMW will only engineer the next M5 or M6 with double-clutch transmissions.

M's head of engineering, Albert Biermann, admitted this week that there were no plans to fit three pedals in the next-generation M6 and M5 because the order rate was too low to justify the added work.

"Last year, maybe 15-20 percent of our M5s in the U.S. were manuals and maybe this year it will be 15 percent. It's declining," Biermann warned.

"The trouble is that nobody wants it in Europe or anywhere else, so this will be the last time we do it, even for the hard-core U.S. buyers."

The M5's six-speed manual transmission has been heavily reworked from its 5 Series origins and sells alongside the seven-speed double-clutch unit as a no-cost option in the U.S. The gearbox will also be a no-cost option on the upcoming M6 Coupe and Convertible. BMW does not offer it for sale on any other continent.

"We just can't justify it anymore. It's a no-cost option, but it's been very difficult to do.

"Theoretically the stick is cheaper, but it's very low volumes and we have to strengthen everything in the gearbox and find space for the shifter and another pedal, so it doesn't work out cheaper."

It's not all bad news, though, with Biermann promising that at least one hard-core M tradition will remain into the foreseeable future.

"The M3 needs to have a stick shift. It will always have a stick shift," he insisted.

http://www.insideline.com/bmw/m5/bmw...r-next-m5.html

[someguy123]

No manual transmission, no care!

[Brendan@bwalkauto]

This doesn't upset me at all, even though I was upset when BMW first said the E60 would be SMG only. M-DCT has gotten so good, and isn't clunky around town like SMGIII was, so it's fine. At that performance level, who cares.

Although, saying the M3 will always have a stick is like saying "We didn't call the 850CSi an M8 because it's too heavy; M-Cars need to be light" or the funny "We'll never go with forced induction on an M car."

Things change. Life goes on, and I'm usually one to whine at BMW for changing their core principals.

[EKaru]

This F10 M5 isn't even for sale yet in the US... That news pertains to something which won't be available for at least another 6+ years

[Inspector Detector]

[Sir UNBANNED_GERBIL M.B.]

This doesn't upset me at all, even though I was upset when BMW first said the E60 would be SMG only.

The manual E60 M5 was so much better to drive. My buddy had the SMG and it was turrible for regular driving. Absolutely dreadful around town.

[x1000rpms]

Yesterday, on Jeopardy, they had a category called "Celebrity Tweets." The contestants had to ask Alex which celebrity tweeted the quote he had read.

Today BMW stops offering Manual on its M5.





On the bright side, they aren't offering the SMG on the m5 either and that gear box was ultimate failure.

[Hawk]

And all engine noise will be synthesized through the speakers. I like where BMW is headed.

[EKaru]

I wonder if the engine sounds better with the optional B&O sound system..

[4th Branch]

You think most of these idiot thieves will figure out how to operate the SMG/DCT system as well?

I have the SMG in my E60 M5 and love it. I don't think I'll be going back to a manual ever again. Different strokes for different folks

[Sir UNBANNED_GERBIL M.B.]

I wonder if the engine sounds better with the optional B&O sound system..

[qjetta2004]

BMW has sold out.....

However the ordinary BMW models will continue to have manual transmissions, correct?

It just goes to show that the only folks that can really afford TRUE sports sedans anymore are "posers".

[InternetMeme]

BMW has sold out.....

However the ordinary BMW models will continue to have manual transmissions, correct?

It just goes to show that the only folks that can really afford TRUE sports sedans anymore are "posers".

Originally irrelevant post is now relevant to me

[SleeperPrelude]

It just goes to show that the only folks that can really afford TRUE sports sedans anymore are "posers".

You'd be surprised/disgusted at how many M-cars are bought simply because they're the most expensive or "fanciest" version of whatever -series BMW.

Or, maybe not.

[RobMarkToo]

Where I come from CARS SHIFT THEMSELVES!

/Luxury

[Fritz27]

I remember when the E9X M3 came out they said they were done with the M-DCT and would instead focus on traditional automatics. The people that run M are full of feces.

[qjetta2004]

But the other question I posed still stands. Will the ordinary line up of BMW cars still offer a proper manual transmission for years to come?

[muffintop]

People are so lazy it's incredible.

[enigmatic enthusiast]

I would expect the next M5 to be hybridized. So one could easily imagine the lack of a manual option.

[CBJ]

Wow this is a turn for the TCL. The Euros could care less for the manual yet the TCL is up in arms.

Are we not Euro? [We are DEVO].

[chiphead]

Who cares? The next M5 will be pushing 5000lbs.

[6cylVWguy]

"We just can't justify it anymore. It's a no-cost option, but it's been very difficult to do.

I mean is it really that hard to actually make it a cost option? If you're buying an M5 and you want a manual, which it sounds like people, at least in the US do, then charging $1500-$2000 for the apparant luxury of a clutch pedal doesn't seem like a big deal. And I would think a 15% take rate is pretty good, personally.

[InternetMeme]

Who cares? The next M5 will be pushing 5000lbs.

By 5,000 lbs you mean 4,288 lb. Which is 30lbs heavier than the CTS-V.

[Volvo_D]

as long as they keep adding different sized SUVs and make M varients out of everything in their lineup, thats cool.

[6cylVWguy]

By 5,000 lbs you mean 4,288 lb. Which is 30lbs heavier than the CTS-V.

How do you know what the next M5 will weigh when the current one was just released?

[InternetMeme]

How do you know what the next M5 will weigh when the current one was just released?

I thought he was referring to the next M5 as being the M5 that isn't even in the US yet. That would be the next M5. If he's referring to the next next M5 then his post makes sense. But BMW has been doing the opposite, lowering the weight of it's current gen M-class vehicles.

[dmorrow]

With the Audi S4 and S5 for Europe not getting a manual, and many high end performance cars, I can see this as being a trend that will quickly move to other models. They build what they want to sell and people either buy it or don't. If enough don't care for the manual then I can see why they don't either. Fewer options, especially complex, expensive ones, makes the overall manufacturing, stocking program much simpler.

I drive a DSG for my daily and a manual for my fun car. If a dual clutch is available I don't see myself buying a manual for my daily in the future. I enjoy the manual on the right roads but for traffic light to traffic light driving or in heavy traffic I will pass.

[Time for a GTI]

I do not approve

[mesuky22]

This doesn't upset me at all, even though I was upset when BMW first said the E60 would be SMG only. M-DCT has gotten so good, and isn't clunky around town like SMGIII was, so it's fine. At that performance level, who cares.

Although, saying the M3 will always have a stick is like saying "We didn't call the 850CSi an M8 because it's too heavy; M-Cars need to be light" or the funny "We'll never go with forced induction on an M car."

Things change. Life goes on, and I'm usually one to whine at BMW for changing their core principals.

I agree, the M-DCT is amazing when compared to the old SMG.

[aufmitterspeil]

Well, as long as the M3 will always have a stick option it's not that bad IMO. The current 5 is just too big. That E28 in the picture is way nice, though.

[Avus]

BMW M division say yes to auto, SUV, AWD but no for manual.... I am looking forward they will say yes for FWD in the near future.

[Max Rebo]

I don't get this statement:

Theoretically the stick is cheaper, but it's very low volumes and we have to strengthen everything in the gearbox and find space for the shifter and another pedal, so it doesn't work out cheaper.

They could find the space in an M3 for a manual gearbox, shifter, and clutch pedal, but they can't for the M5? Does not compute.
Wouldn't the gearbox have to be similarly strong whether in a manual or automatic?

[GrundleJumper]

Manual going the way of the dodo.

[chiphead]

8,800 total US e60 m5 sales * .15 = 1320 manuals approx.

Maybe it's not worth their trouble to keep those 1320 people satisfied? I wonder what % Panameras are manuals?

http://blog.caranddriver.com/the-con...ree-cylinders/

"I’ve just driven the impressive Porsche Panamera Turbo S, and had the chance to speak with a few sources about future plans for Porsche’s big, four-door sedan. It will remain on a rear-wheel-drive platform; a derivative off Audi’s modular-longitudinal front-wheel-drive platform is out of the question. A more likely scenario will see a big Audi moving onto the next Panamera platform, which will also be used for future Bentley models, and could provide the basis for a four-door Lamborghini in the spirit of the Estoque concept car.

The next Panamera likely will lose the manual transmission currently offered on the naturally aspirated, rear-wheel-drive V-6 and V-8 models. While the U.S. is a “classic manual-gearbox market,” the take rate for the manual Panamera has been low—probably too low to justify a successor. The next Panamera will also receive electric power steering—for efficiency reasons."

[6cylVWguy]

I thought he was referring to the next M5 as being the M5 that isn't even in the US yet.

I don't believe this is true, as you can configure the newly released M5 with a manual transmission on the BMW USA website. I'll be at a local BMW dealer later today, so I'll have to be on the look out for one.