Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
    Results 26 to 50 of 59

    Thread: KESSY Antenna Issues

    1. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      07-13-2012 07:56 PM #26
      I managed to pull the R138 antenna this evening. There's not much to it and I measured 7.8 ohms across the two terminals. For the life of me I can't find the thread where someone measured the resistance of several of the antennas.

      For anyone interested, the part number is 3D0 909 141E. List price is about $60.

      Cheers,
      Steven

    2. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-14-2012 05:19 AM #27
      Quote Originally Posted by Paximus View Post
      Thanks Willem... I open the door, get in the car, car is now awake and screen shows weak AM station frequency, turn up volume, hear weak station. Switch on the ignition using the key (first time I ever did that!), steering wheel extends, etc, radio interference appears from the car systems but the AM signal stays the same. Turn the key off and radio goes off too.
      Hi Chris,

      I think this is a valuable thread about the antenna's and aerials of the Phaeton. There is a lot of supporting information in this particular SSP (self study program/guide):
      Self Study Program 273: Convenience & Safety Electronics, Including KESSY antenna & AM/FM/GSM/Satnav/GPS antenna locations and a lot more

      The AM/FM etc. antenna's seem to be referred to as "aerials", perhaps to distinguish them from the short-range antenna's for access and start purposes.

      As far as our experiment with the AM reception is concerned, I tried again last evening, but had my VCDS connected all the time. There was no difference in reception quality then, it was just good, except when I entered measuring blocks, which introduced some ticking interference.
      With VCDS disconnected, the aerial amp seems to function only when the ignition is on (steering wheel popped out).
      I also noticed that the screen may be lit (welcome screen etc.) while the ignition is off, and reception is still bad then. I conclude that the aerial amps are only powered when the ignition is on.

      Since you live in England, you may be able to try to receive "Heusweiler" in Germany, near Saarbrücken. With 400 kW, it is one of the strongest stations in Europe. When I tune in at 1422 kHz, it is inaudible when the ignition is off, but comes to live when ignition is switched on (I use the keyless button, btw). Quite good SNR, with a faint Mexican dog.

      If your aerial amp and connections are OK, its reception in the UK should be similar as here in NL.

      The aerial assemblies in the back of the car, are described in the SSP above. There are several versions, depending on type and presence of a TV tuner etc. They have splitters, to provide connections for various consumers, like phone, satnav, FM/AM etc.
      At the side of the Infotainment control system, there are two coax connectors at the back.
      It looks like your problem is related to a non-functional amplifier in the aerial assembly. A new project, perhaps?

      Willem
      Last edited by WillemBal; 07-14-2012 at 05:45 AM.

    3. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-14-2012 05:35 AM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by StevenFT View Post
      I managed to pull the R138 antenna this evening. There's not much to it and I measured 7.8 ohms across the two terminals. For the life of me I can't find the thread where someone measured the resistance of several of the antennas.
      For anyone interested, the part number is 3D0 909 141E. List price is about $60.
      It is better to leave it out then. Such a low resistance pulls too much power, possibly resulting in power failure to the other antenna's and in the end, toasting the MOSFETS.
      I think that when you leave it out until you get a new one, most of the keyless functions are back to normal, despite a persisting DTC of the R138 antenna.

      Willem

    4. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      07-15-2012 06:49 AM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by WillemBal View Post
      It is better to leave it out then. Such a low resistance pulls too much power, possibly resulting in power failure to the other antenna's and in the end, toasting the MOSFETS.
      I think that when you leave it out until you get a new one, most of the keyless functions are back to normal, despite a persisting DTC of the R138 antenna.

      Willem
      Willem,

      I think you have earned the title of "King Kessy"!

      Best,
      Steven

    5. Member EnglishPhaeton's Avatar
      Join Date
      Dec 6th, 2010
      Location
      Harrogate, UK
      Posts
      866
      Vehicles
      Black 2006 Phaeton V10 TDi, Black 2005 V10 TDi LWB, Laser Blue Golf 2.0 GT TDi
      07-15-2012 08:35 AM #30
      Quote Originally Posted by Expoman View Post
      Willem,

      I think you have earned the title of "King Kessy"!

      Best,
      Steven
      Steven,

      I see Willem, (combined with Harry, and increasingly, Chris) as a kind of Euro version of our "Goliath-al" mentor Michael.

      Stu

      (shame he's Dutch)!!! Just joking Willem
      Member of Le Club 2P

    6. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-16-2012 05:54 AM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by Expoman View Post
      Willem,
      I think you have earned the title of "King Kessy"!
      Best,
      Steven
      I am deeply touched....

      Quote Originally Posted by EnglishPhaeton View Post
      Steven,

      I see Willem, (combined with Harry, and increasingly, Chris) as a kind of Euro version of our "Goliath-al" mentor Michael.
      Stu

      (shame he's Dutch)!!! Just joking Willem
      God save the Euro!

    7. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      07-16-2012 10:00 AM #32
      Quote Originally Posted by EnglishPhaeton View Post
      Steven,

      I see Willem, (combined with Harry, and increasingly, Chris) as a kind of Euro version of our "Goliath-al" mentor Michael.

      Stu

      (shame he's Dutch)!!! Just joking Willem
      Stu,

      I entirely agree, Chris has very much emerged onto the scene over the recent months with some very technical answers. In all fairness Stu, you shouldn't hide your light under a bushel either......

      Best,
      Steven

    8. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      07-16-2012 10:02 AM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by WillemBal View Post
      I am deeply touched....



      God save the Euro!
      Willem,

      It is more and more beginning to appear that God is going to be required to save the Euro!

      It's a shame we don't have a crown for you, possibly made out of Solder wire, that would be fitting!

      Have a good summer,

      Best,
      Steven

    9. Moderator Paximus's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 26th, 2011
      Location
      Dorset, UK
      Posts
      3,010
      Vehicles
      2005 Phaeton V10 swb 4-seat, Jeep Commander Hemi, Ssangyong Korando
      07-16-2012 10:52 AM #34
      Learning to speak Phaeton from such fine confréres as you is far more rewarding than all the work on my screen...

      CB

    10. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-16-2012 06:48 PM #35
      Quote Originally Posted by Expoman View Post
      Willem,
      It is more and more beginning to appear that God is going to be required to save the Euro!
      It's a shame we don't have a crown for you, possibly made out of Solder wire, that would be fitting!
      Have a good summer,
      Best,
      Steven
      I know a country with a national hymn which can, with a slight modification, well be used for many purposes, among which topping off the above ceremony:




    11. Moderator Paximus's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 26th, 2011
      Location
      Dorset, UK
      Posts
      3,010
      Vehicles
      2005 Phaeton V10 swb 4-seat, Jeep Commander Hemi, Ssangyong Korando
      07-17-2012 05:24 AM #36
      Well, the last but one King William we had was Dutch, so if there's a vacancy we'll let you know!

    12. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      07-17-2012 06:04 AM #37
      Quote Originally Posted by WillemBal View Post
      I know a country with a national hymn which can, with a slight modification, well be used for many purposes, among which topping off the above ceremony:



      A fine addition to the ceremonial process!

      Long live the King............

    13. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      07-20-2012 09:24 PM #38
      An update:
      I received the new antenna and measured the same resistance on the new one as the old.

      I checked the continuity of the two wires going from the KESSY to the R138 antenna. Both wires checked ok. It took me awhile to figure out the numbering of the pins on the T81k connector. I'll give VW the benefit of the doubt that they did put them in right place and the system they used made sense to them.

      As I had some spare MOSFETs left over, I had a real electronics guy have a go at replacing them. I checked everything I could find on the board that looked like a fusible resistor. All were ok.

      I put everything back together with the new antenna and got the same result...open circuit on the R138 antenna. I checked for DC voltage at the antenna connector and didn't get anything significant.

      It looks at though if I want this thing to work I need a new KESSY.

      Steven

    14. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-21-2012 04:22 AM #39
      OK, don't start calling me "Mr. messy Kessy" now.
      I think there is a fix for this situation. From what I understand of your description of the fault is that everything works after you have cleared the fault. Then, after some driving the Kessy seizes to function with again a 00183 Antenna fault when you scan with VCDS. Clearing that one makes the Kessy functional again, for another limited time period.

      It appears that this issue is experienced by Touareg Kessy adventurers as well. One forum member noticed that the R138 antenna fault "disables" the keyless functions. To quote his observation:

      "I found that disconnecting the front antenna in the center console stops code R138 from showing. R138 seems to be the "disabling" code."

      So the fix is simple. Disconnect R138 antenna and the DTC should not appear again, at least not while driving. Your other antenna's take over full functionality, as the range between your key and any antenna in the car is only very small.

      The DTC then will only be generated when you make a scan, not while driving. So if you see this fault after you have made a scan, then simply clear the faults, do not re-scan, close controller and VCDS, which will give you full functionality of your keyless functions.


      If you want to read more about this, see this post

      Willem

    15. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      07-31-2012 03:44 PM #40
      Well, after contacting the nearest Phaeton qualified dealer I decided to take one more go at the KESSY as unhooking the R138 antenna didn't solve the problem.

      I double checked the six "usual suspect" resistors. All were still ok. Using the Access/Start control module wiring diagram which details the connections to the controller, I measured the resistance across several of the antenna connection pins. The R138 antenna connects at pins 25 and 28. I measured approximately 10k ohms. I also measured the R137 pins (44 and 45) to be less than one ohm. The same measurement for R139 on pins (26 and 27).

      Something is definitely different in the circuitry for the R138. I've been trying to follow the traces on the board but it's tedious to say the least without a diagram of the internals of the controller. I'm planning on spending some more time with it tonight.

      Perhaps this is Quixotic in nature. When I approached my wife about having the dealer replace it, she asked "is it really worth that much money to be able to open the doors without using the key?"

      I checked with a rebuilder of automotive electronics modules and they could do it for about half the cost of the dealer, however; the available information about them didn't inspire confidence. Ideally I'd buy the module from my VW parts source, install it myself in the dealer parking lot and have them program it thus saving the labor for the install. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't go for that seeing as how they didn't install the thing themselves (and would have to push the car into a bay).

      Cheers,
      Steven

    16. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      07-31-2012 06:15 PM #41
      Quote Originally Posted by StevenFT View Post
      ....Using the Access/Start control module wiring diagram which details the connections to the controller, I measured the resistance across several of the antenna connection pins. The R138 antenna connects at pins 25 and 28. I measured approximately 10k ohms. I also measured the R137 pins (44 and 45) to be less than one ohm. The same measurement for R139 on pins (26 and 27).
      Something is definitely different in the circuitry for the R138.....
      Hi Steven,

      Something is puzzling in your observations. The first time you measured R138, it was 8 ohms and now it is 10k? I'm not sure whether you measured on the antenna terminals (Kessy disconnected) or on the corresponding pins of the Kessy.
      It is necessary to reverse the polarity of your test pins on every component you are testing, to see if this makes any difference. Diodes in the circuit can cause different readings when the polarity is reversed, so it is very likely that you DO see different ohm readings, depending on polarity of the ohm meter.
      And is your DMM equipped with a diode test setting? The test voltage is then cranked up a bit, and the reading then is in Volts. This is easier to identify diodes in a circuit and to test them. Reversing the polarity will give a different reading as well, at least when diodes are in the circuit.

      It will be interesting to see what differences you see between the access antenna's.

      Willem

    17. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      07-31-2012 07:25 PM #42
      Willem,
      Sorry for the confusion...it made sense in my head but less so when written out. I measured the R138 antenna itself to be approximately 8 ohms.

      Measuring the resistance of the the two terminals (pins 25 and 28) on the KESSY itself yielded a value of approximately 10k ohms. For comparison, I measured the resistance across the appropriate pins for antennas that do not generate fault codes and found it to be less than 1 ohm.

      I did not try reversing polarity nor did I try the diode setting. That'll be on the docket for tonight.

      As always, I'm most appreciate of your insight.

      Best,
      Steven

    18. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      08-02-2012 09:46 AM #43
      Steven,

      Every post I read in your quest to sort your KESSY makes the money I shelled out to replace mine seem less painful!!!

      Good luck, I hope it gets resolved soon,

      All best,
      Steven

    19. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      08-02-2012 12:43 PM #44
      Steven,
      I'm glad something productive is coming from my series of posts. In the process, I have learned a bit about electronics so I imagine I can count that as productive as well.

      I think I'm at the point where I break down and replace the darn thing. The combination of cost and time involved getting the car to a Phaeton-trained dealer have been my motivation to keep pushing on. If one or the other had been less, I'd have had it in to the shop a week or two ago.

      I've spent some time with my electronics guy during the past two days going through the board component by component trying to pinpoint a failure. I've found that the resistors are generally ok but there are half a dozen diodes that are suspect. When reverse-biased, they show approximately 1 volt.

      Cheers,
      Steven

    20. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      08-03-2012 11:06 AM #45
      Quote Originally Posted by StevenFT View Post
      Steven,

      I think I'm at the point where I break down and replace the darn thing. The combination of cost and time involved getting the car to a Phaeton-trained dealer have been my motivation to keep pushing on. If one or the other had been less, I'd have had it in to the shop a week or two ago.

      I've spent some time with my electronics guy during the past two days going through the board component by component trying to pinpoint a failure. I've found that the resistors are generally ok but there are half a dozen diodes that are suspect. When reverse-biased, they show approximately 1 volt.

      Cheers,
      Steven
      Hi Steven,

      I guess much depends upon how enjoyable you find this deductive process - I wouldn't - and I am a duffer when it comes to electrics so it was never on the cards for me to attempt.

      Of course if I had been driving through the Netherlands in the kingdom of King Kessy..........

      I'm sure his highness will offer his thoughts on the reverse biased values shortly.

      KBO as Churchill used to say...

      All best,
      Steven

    21. Member
      Join Date
      Jan 26th, 2012
      Location
      Harrisonburg, VA
      Posts
      129
      Vehicles
      2005 VW Phaeton V8
      08-03-2012 12:32 PM #46
      Quote Originally Posted by Expoman View Post
      I'm sure his highness will offer his thoughts on the reverse biased values shortly.
      I'm sure his highness beats his head against his desk whenever he sees another one of my posts!

    22. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      08-05-2012 06:21 PM #47
      Stephen,

      Bite the bullet and go to your dealer to have it fixed!

    23. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2011
      Location
      France
      Posts
      368
      Vehicles
      2004 V10 TDI Phaeton, 2010 Mercedes 350CLS
      08-07-2012 02:33 AM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by WillemBal View Post
      Stephen,

      Bite the bullet and go to your dealer to have it fixed!
      Blimey Willem,

      I hope Steven hasn't decided to "end it all" after his final hope has disappeared!

      Let's just hope he is not a Yorkshireman - the thought of laying out all that brass..............

      All best,
      Steven

    24. Moderator Paximus's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 26th, 2011
      Location
      Dorset, UK
      Posts
      3,010
      Vehicles
      2005 Phaeton V10 swb 4-seat, Jeep Commander Hemi, Ssangyong Korando
      08-07-2012 05:12 AM #49
      "KESSY" lists at £338.40 + tax, which is not trivial but still a lot less than some controllers. I guess most of the costs are the labour for hooking up to VW HQ to reprogram the security keys [edit - I mean the embedded coding keys in the controllers, as well as the physical door keys].

      Chris
      Last edited by Paximus; 08-07-2012 at 06:52 AM.

    25. Member WillemBal's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 20th, 2010
      Location
      Putten, Netherlands
      Posts
      747
      Vehicles
      Phaeton 04W12, Crystal Grey & Extended Leather, '03AudiA4 1.8T, '51 BMW R25
      08-13-2012 05:48 PM #50
      Quote Originally Posted by Expoman View Post
      Blimey Willem,
      I hope Steven hasn't decided to "end it all" after his final hope has disappeared!
      Let's just hope he is not a Yorkshireman - the thought of laying out all that brass..............
      All best,
      Steven
      Steven,
      I think that Stephen realizes that there is not so much hope left. The only hope I can see, which is the reason to recommend to go to the dealer, is that the dealer finds another cause, previously overlooked. Perhaps some other component is defective, and there is some hope that the Guided Fault Finding function of the dealer’s VAS system points into the direction of the real cause of the problem. It sure is not impossible that the KESSY has some other defects and that it DOES need replacement. But I don’t think that much brass can be saved by buying the KESSY somewhere else, because there is some risk that the dealer will refuse to program it. Or charge double because of the “extra work”, in other words, a Yorkshireman surcharge.
      Perhaps the most important reason to ask the dealer to handle it, is that what originally started as a fun job, appears to have turned into a nuisance. Then the answer to this question:
      I'm planning on spending some more time with it tonight….
      When I approached my wife about having the dealer replace it, she asked "is it really worth that much money to be able to open the doors without using the key?"
      is more easy to answer. Let there will be hope again.
      Willem

    Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •