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    Thread: Near miss on motorcycle POV video.

    1. 07-01-2012 06:16 PM #71
      Quote Originally Posted by vastxpunk View Post
      Hey hey. I've made plenty of safe and legal passes in good ol' Pennsyltucky, over double yellow lines. Never caused an accident because of crossing them, and never been ticketed. We did have a pickup truck driver swerve at a group of us that were passing him on a very open stretch of back road. He made several attempts at blocking us from passing, but in the end we maneuvered around him and never saw him again.
      There is only one way to put this. The mods can smack me if they want. You are an idiot and should not have a driver license. You have never made a safe and legal pass on double yellow lines.

      Hopefully the next time the truck driver runs you off the road and beats your ass.

      AND

      § 3307. No-passing zones.
      (a) Establishment and marking.--The department and local authorities may
      determine those portions of any highway under their respective jurisdictions
      where overtaking and passing or driving on the left side of the roadway would
      be especially hazardous and shall by appropriate signs or markings on the
      roadway indicate the beginning and end of such zones and when the signs or
      markings are in place and clearly visible to an ordinarily observant person
      every driver of a vehicle shall obey the directions of the signs or markings.
      Signs shall be placed to indicate the beginning and end of each no-passing
      zone.


      You aren't even able to comprehend what this is saying. Sheesh.
      Last edited by pknopp; 07-01-2012 at 06:19 PM.

    2. 07-01-2012 06:24 PM #72
      Quote Originally Posted by silverA4quattro View Post
      vastxpunk, thanks for posting that additional info. Still seems kind of like a gray area between the actual law and manual.

      Personally double yellow = no passing under any circumstances, I guess that's what NY State drilled into my head. Granted, I've been behind people on a double yellow that annoyed me and it was clearly safe to pass and I just sat there getting annoyed, so jokes on me there.

      Seems to be an abundance of narrow, two lane two-way traffic roads in PA which I dislike. Particularly with people breaching the center lines all the time while they're busy texting.
      No, the law is not gray here. It is clear. Where the roads are marked as no passing (double yellow line) there is no passing. I rarely worry while out driving but the last few days has really got me thinking.

      We have those here that seem to think they can pass on double yellow lines and we had a situation here that made me really question driving.

      We had a storm through here that put the power out for nearly 48 hours (not all places are back online yet). All the stop lights were out. When they are out they become a 4 way stop. I couldn't believe than probably 60% of the people just plowed on ahead without even slowing down through the intersections.

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      07-01-2012 06:27 PM #73
      Quote Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
      And just for the record, I probably would have target fixated just like the guy in the video. I'm aware of my limitations.
      It's more than just "fixation" though. Sometimes the smartest thing to do is nothing. Just keep it together, remain predictable, and be ready to bail. This is my attitude when I'm on track. I've had some stupid **** happen in front of me and *never* have I made an evasive move out of panic. It's just not productive.
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      07-01-2012 06:31 PM #74
      Wow, at first I thought it was one of those crazy Russian dash cam videos

    5. 07-01-2012 06:53 PM #75
      I'm guessing the bike is now up for sale? lol

      I had a few close calls, and then sold the bike when I had one with my girlfriend on the back. Too many stupid drivers out there texting away.

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      07-01-2012 07:02 PM #76
      I don't know about you guys, but I would have just bunny hopped over the Civic.
      And I might have even done a trick while in the air- just to show how easy it was to do.
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    7. 07-01-2012 07:32 PM #77
      Driver is an idiot, but kudos to get on the shoulder and not kill the poor fella.

      You know that most idiots in that situation would have plowed right through him.

      All said and done, the driver of the car reacted better to the incident than the rider, regardless of who's at fault.

      And if you pass on a double yellow, you're an idiot, or simply brain dead.

    8. 07-01-2012 10:37 PM #78
      Quote Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
      There is only one way to put this. The mods can smack me if they want. You are an idiot and should not have a driver license. You have never made a safe and legal pass on double yellow lines.

      Hopefully the next time the truck driver runs you off the road and beats your ass.

      AND

      § 3307. No-passing zones.
      (a) Establishment and marking.--The department and local authorities may
      determine those portions of any highway under their respective jurisdictions
      where overtaking and passing or driving on the left side of the roadway would
      be especially hazardous and shall by appropriate signs or markings on the
      roadway indicate the beginning and end of such zones and when the signs or
      markings are in place and clearly visible to an ordinarily observant person
      every driver of a vehicle shall obey the directions of the signs or markings.
      Signs shall be placed to indicate the beginning and end of each no-passing
      zone.


      You aren't even able to comprehend what this is saying. Sheesh.
      Quoted regulation given above is completely irrelevant because it relates to some other jurisdiction. This incident happened in Ontario. Here is the relevant section of the Highway Traffic Act of Ontario:

      Driving to left of centre prohibited under certain conditions
      149. (1) No vehicle shall be driven or operated to the left of the centre of a roadway designed for one or more lines of traffic in each direction,
      (a) when approaching the crest of a grade or upon a curve in the roadway or within 30 metres of a bridge, viaduct or tunnel where the driver’s view is obstructed within that distance so as to create a potential hazard in the event another vehicle might approach from the opposite direction; or
      (b) when approaching within 30 metres of a level railway crossing. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 149 (1).
      Exception
      (2) Subsection (1) does not apply,
      (a) on a highway divided into clearly marked lanes where there are more such lanes for traffic in one direction than in the other direction;
      (b) to a road service vehicle where precautions are taken to eliminate the hazard; or
      (c) on a highway while it is designated for the use of one-way traffic. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 149 (2).

      Source: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/sta...es_90h08_e.htm

      In this particular situation the exceptions are not applicable. In the applicable s. 149(1), lane markings are not mentioned, only that one is not to drive left of the center of the road approaching the crest of a hill or within 30 metres of specified hazards. It is written this way to allow for gravel roads, paved roads without lane markings (Ontario has a lot of both), and roads with snow covering.

      The Civic driver was still in the wrong (obviously) because they were left of centre as they were going over a hill.

      Re-iterate for the benefit of the Americans: In Ontario. the center line markings ARE NOT the law. You are quite free to pass over dashed lines or solid lines or double solid lines as long as it is not approaching the crest of a hill or within 30 metres of any of the specified hazards.

      It should be noted that at normal traffic speeds the 30 metre distance given is nowhere near adequate, but there is another clause of s. 148:

      Passing vehicle going in same direction
      (8) No person in charge of a vehicle shall pass or attempt to pass another vehicle going in the same direction on a highway unless the roadway,
      (a) in front of and to the left of the vehicle to be passed is safely free from approaching traffic; and
      (b) to the left of the vehicle passing or attempting to pass is safely free from overtaking traffic. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (8).

      Clearly the Civic driver was in violation of this clause, also.

    9. 07-01-2012 10:55 PM #79
      Quote Originally Posted by GoFaster View Post
      Quoted regulation given above is completely irrelevant because it relates to some other jurisdiction. This incident happened in Ontario. Here is the relevant section of the Highway Traffic Act of Ontario:
      The person I quoted said that he was passing legally here in the states but if Ontario is O.K. with you passing in unsafe conditions any motorcyclists would be risking major injuries or death anytime they leave the house.

    10. 07-01-2012 11:04 PM #80
      Wow!

      I see lots of accidents at work, but that was pretty scary seeing almost happen like that gave me chills. Living in S. FL. I feel sorry for the riders down here because no one knows how to drive.

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      07-01-2012 11:08 PM #81
      "It's a near HIT!"

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      07-01-2012 11:09 PM #82
      Quote Originally Posted by GoFaster View Post
      Re-iterate for the benefit of the Americans: In Ontario. the center line markings ARE NOT the law. You are quite free to pass over dashed lines or solid lines or double solid lines as long as it is not approaching the crest of a hill or within 30 metres of any of the specified hazards.
      Kudos to you for knowing the actual law in Ontario. It amazes me how many people just don't know these details.

      I've even been approached at a gas station by someone I'd previously overtaken because they were going under the speed limit on a 2-lane road that had a solid yellow dividing line. I told him that the Ontario Highway Traffic Act has nothing in it about the meanings of specific lane markings... it's all just conventions and recommendations. He didn't believe me. I told him to have a nice day.

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      07-01-2012 11:12 PM #83
      Quote Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
      The person I quoted said that he was passing legally here in the states but if Ontario is O.K. with you passing in unsafe conditions any motorcyclists would be risking major injuries or death anytime they leave the house.
      The Ontario Highway Traffic Act is specific about the requirement of passing being done in safety. Actually, the sentences about that are directly preceding the ones GoFaster quoted (section 148).

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      07-01-2012 11:12 PM #84
      Quote Originally Posted by derekjl View Post
      "It's a near HIT!"

      Isn't he nearly alive?
      .
      .
      .
      .
      .
      .
      and I miss him.
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      07-01-2012 11:14 PM #85
      Just to toss a little kerosene on this fire, word has it the Honda driver was drunk and had made risky passes at high speed prior to this. Other motorists had already phoned them into the police for driving erratically.

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      07-01-2012 11:16 PM #86
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      It appears to me that the biker had sufficient time to move into the center in which case whatever the car would do it wouldn't likely hit him (such a move is based on principle of lane-splitting which is even easier to perform here in Ontario because of wide lanes). I am not putting blame on the biker but if he was more experienced/skilled/anticipating then the Civic wouldn't end up in a ditch possibly resulting in casualties.
      Quote Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post

      And just for the record, I probably would have target fixated just like the guy in the video. I'm aware of my limitations.
      How do you both assume that the motorcyclist wasn't actually attempting to evade the collision under the incorrect assumption that the other driver was moving back right? If I see somebody coming at me head on, I would never assume that they were going to go left, I would assume they were going right, AKA back where they belong. There was clearly no time in that video to change that decision once it was obviously wrong.
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      07-01-2012 11:18 PM #87
      Quote Originally Posted by Adam144 View Post
      Just to toss a little kerosene on this fire, word has it the Honda driver was drunk and had made risky passes at high speed prior to this. Other motorists had already phoned them into the police for driving erratically.
      Drunk driver swerves to miss motorcycle?
      Since when?
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      07-01-2012 11:39 PM #88
      Quote Originally Posted by BRealistic View Post
      Per the Youtube description:

      "Driving on a 2 lane highway, a couple 17 year olds overtake a car on a blind corner, across a double yellow and miss my bike by about 2 inches! Hope this kids loses his licence til he's at least 30."
      Ok, THAT makes a big difference. Thanks for clearing that up, as I didn't see the description. I wonder if the kid actually realizes just how close he came to taking lives.

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      07-02-2012 12:18 AM #89
      LOL @ the "riding is too dangerous" crowd.

      The only difference if the rider had been driving a car would be the fatalities. Two cars crashing head on like that would result in more dead people than a bike crashing into the car. In fact, if he had been driving a car, that "miss" would had been a hit, offset frontal crash, sending both cars spinning with the passenger on the Civic instantly dead, and maybe involving other cars. The rider/driver would probably die because the car that was being overtaken by the Civic would crash into the driver side of the could be car.

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      07-02-2012 12:21 AM #90
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      I disagree, the biker had enough time to veer off towards the center when he saw the oncoming car. He should have anticipated situation like this and planned appropriate response in advance instead of freezing like a deer staring at headlights. Of course it wasn't his fault but he could have handled it better.
      You are a... Can't find a word suitable for the kind of stupidity you've achieved.

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      07-02-2012 04:58 AM #91
      Seemed to happen as he was approaching a really gentle crest. When I was riding, I tried to watch far ahead for just such shenanigans. And I had numerous contact with overtakers in my lane and I just slowed and prepared to pull to the right if they didn't get back in their lane.

      I've watched this video several times, and either he is going 100 mph, resulting in no time to react, or the road is cresting a bit where he couldn't see the oncoming passer until it crested.

      How fast were the bikes going. They seem to be cooking in the video. Doesn't look like 60 mph to me but who knows?

      Edit: Upon further review, I don't think the rider was speeding or going all that fast. Definitely inadequate site distance due to hill crest. REALLY bad spot to pass.
      Last edited by jimbogxp; 07-02-2012 at 05:04 AM.

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      07-02-2012 05:28 AM #92
      Quote Originally Posted by McBanagon View Post
      At most I think I would have time to gasp and start closing the throttle. No time for anything else. No turn, no brake, no turtle head, nothing......
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      I disagree, the biker had enough time to veer off towards the center when he saw the oncoming car. He should have anticipated situation like this and planned appropriate response in advance instead of freezing like a deer staring at headlights. Of course it wasn't his fault but he could have handled it better.

      Not all of us have a sixth sense, Peter.

    23. 07-02-2012 05:54 AM #93
      I had the opposite happen to me, bike trying to overtake on a bend and was heading straight for me and me missed me by inches.

    24. 07-02-2012 09:35 AM #94
      Quote Originally Posted by Glopaticki View Post
      I had the opposite happen to me, bike trying to overtake on a bend and was heading straight for me and me missed me by inches.
      There is no shortage of idiotic operators of ANY type of vehicle and that includes motorcyclists. And I'm a rider.

      Just because someone else is an idiotic operator of doesn't mean EVERY operator of is an idiot.

      In a previous post, it had been mentioned that the teenage driver of the Civic in question had already been called in for erratic driving. It was also mentioned that this happened on Airport Road south of Wasaga Beach. This combination is not at all surprising; Wasaga Beach is a popular party destination and Airport Road has a lot of traffic going to and from Wasaga Beach on summer weekends with good weather. It's a pretty good road to stay away from in times like that.

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      07-02-2012 09:56 AM #95
      Quote Originally Posted by GoFaster View Post
      There is no shortage of idiotic operators of ANY type of vehicle and that includes motorcyclists. And I'm a rider.

      Just because someone else is an idiotic operator of doesn't mean EVERY operator of is an idiot.

      In a previous post, it had been mentioned that the teenage driver of the Civic in question had already been called in for erratic driving. It was also mentioned that this happened on Airport Road south of Wasaga Beach. This combination is not at all surprising; Wasaga Beach is a popular party destination and Airport Road has a lot of traffic going to and from Wasaga Beach on summer weekends with good weather. It's a pretty good road to stay away from in times like that.
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      07-02-2012 10:15 AM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by Chmeeee View Post
      How do you both assume that the motorcyclist wasn't actually attempting to evade the collision under the incorrect assumption that the other driver was moving back right? If I see somebody coming at me head on, I would never assume that they were going to go left, I would assume they were going right, AKA back where they belong...
      I can think of two main reasons why moving to the middle line would be acceptable as well:

      1) the driver just started overtaking so he wouldn't immediately go back into his lane thus giving enough time to slip by him in the middle line

      2) the driver wouldn't hit biker head-on in order to get back into his lane because he looks for an opening to pass which is away from other vehicles (including bikes)

      I am not a biker, any riding instructors can chime in perhaps ?
      Last edited by Wheelwright; 07-02-2012 at 10:44 AM.

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      07-02-2012 10:59 AM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by warren_s View Post
      The Ontario Highway Traffic Act is specific about the requirement of passing being done in safety. Actually, the sentences about that are directly preceding the ones GoFaster quoted (section 148).
      What it ultimately boils down to is "pass only when prudent."

      The problem is, the average drive has no concept of what is prudent, so they need all of those extra words in there.
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    28. 07-02-2012 11:55 AM #98
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      I can think of two main reasons why moving to the middle line would be acceptable as well:

      1) the driver just started overtaking so he wouldn't immediately go back into his lane thus giving enough time to slip by him in the middle line

      2) the driver wouldn't hit biker head-on in order to get back into his lane because he looks for an opening to pass which is away from other vehicles (including bikes)

      I am not a biker, any riding instructors can chime in perhaps ?
      There is no way that ordinarily you would make an assumption that the wrong-way driver would swerve to the shoulder rather than back into their normal lane. At least 99% of the time, when there is a car over the center line, they will swerve back into their own lane when they see that they shouldn't be in the lane that they're in. You are normally far better ahead by guessing that the driver will do what they normally do 99% of the time than what they could do 1% of the time.

      What this means is that the normal reaction upon seeing a car approaching you in the wrong lane up ahead, it is statistically better for you to aim for the right shoulder (thus moving further away from the oncoming traffic) than to go left TOWARDS the oncoming traffic and thus RELYING on the other driver to do the 1%-probability action rather than the 99%-probability action.

      It just so happens that in this particular case, the wrong-way driver actually did that 1% move and it was on video.

      I have never seen a driver do this (thank God). I cannot count the number of times that I've seen an oncoming car in the wrong lane and they've gone back into their own lane upon seeing oncoming traffic. Swerving towards that oncoming traffic under these circumstances is suicidal.

      From this point of view, the motorcyclist's reaction to move towards (but not onto) the shoulder was the statistically correct one (I see nothing wrong with what they did) but they lucked out that the car went even further onto the shoulder.

      Keep in mind also that on a road with a gravel shoulder like this, for a motorcycle on normal road tires travelling at highway speed, that gravel shoulder is a no-go zone.

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      07-02-2012 12:18 PM #99
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      I can think of two main reasons why moving to the middle line would be acceptable as well:

      1) the driver just started overtaking so he wouldn't immediately go back into his lane thus giving enough time to slip by him in the middle line

      2) the driver wouldn't hit biker head-on in order to get back into his lane because he looks for an opening to pass which is away from other vehicles (including bikes)
      Most of us only know what we ourselves are thinking, Charles.


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      07-04-2012 01:46 PM #100
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      Quote Originally Posted by MCTB View Post
      I think that it is raw enough that at 50% of potential, it would be terrifying enough to be fun. One of those 'you never see the tree that is going to kill you because you are sliding into it backwards' kind of cars.

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      07-04-2012 01:52 PM #101
      Ironically probaly safer to have been on a bike than on a car in that particular case. Car probably would have not have had as much space and tagged the oncomming car.

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      07-04-2012 01:53 PM #102
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      07-04-2012 02:08 PM #103
      Why would you ever try and overtake somebody like that... That makes no sense. I'm sure all the passengers in the car were screaming WHAT THE **** ARE YOU DOING well before they saw a ****ing pack of motorcycles in their line of travel.

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      07-04-2012 02:43 PM #104
      One thing that disturbs me is that no one else stopped, it appears. People obviously saw this happen
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      07-04-2012 03:58 PM #105
      Quote Originally Posted by Wheelwright View Post
      I disagree, the biker had enough time to veer off towards the center when he saw the oncoming car. He should have anticipated situation like this and planned appropriate response in advance instead of freezing like a deer staring at headlights. Of course it wasn't his fault but he could have handled it better.
      As an experienced motorcyclist, I can tell you with 100% assurance that he could not have done much better than what he did, and I can also tell you with 100% assurance that YOU could not have done any better. There was zero reaction time, even while watching the video knowing that something was about to happen, I didn't mentally evade the car in my mind. You are not that good of a driver/rider. Nobody is.

      I'm glad the car crashed.
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      I saw this in a movie about a bus that had to speed around the city, keeping its speed over fifty, and if its speed dropped, the bus would explode! I think it was called, "The Bus That Couldn't Slow Down."

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